Let's be honest

[mu-rara]

Unfortunately, the opposite is true as well, as in, defending MU with very few facts.

Did I defend? .....I don't think I did.  I am not defending, but I am not disparaging either.

[mu-rara]

A.  Very few facts have come out, but the ones that have have looked horrible for Marquette.
B.  Buzz and his staff have every opportunity in the world to spout their own opinion and to give us their side of the story.  The fact that they haven't can only lead one to believe the worse scenartio instead of the better one.

No they don't.  He is not a signed recruit anymore.  They can't comment.

[Ari Gold]

Does everybody understand that only the 200 or so die-hard, message board MU fans care about this or have ever heard of DJ Newbill? I hope Buzz does.

Go get 'em Buzzard!! PRN's got your sweaty back on this one!!

+1
Buzz is going to take MU far, can't worry about a few minor bumps

[3Mer]

We do know some things.  We know that DJ signed a NLI.  We know that that action implies that a spot is available for him on the MU basketball team.  We know that he's no longer welcome to exercise that NLI and become a member of the MU basketball team.  That's enough for me to know that I am at the very least disappointed by the situation.

It amazes me that people can look at the above and think nothing of it.  It amazes me that they can justify it in the name of better basketball or that Buzz is just trying to keep his job.  It amazes me that the defenders are willing to crucify the kid and call him names because he allegedly didn't write an essay or because he didn't follow up with Buzz enough or he should have known better, etc.

Amen, brother.

[Pakuni]

A.  Very few facts have come out, but the ones that have have looked horrible for Marquette.
B.  Buzz and his staff have every opportunity in the world to spout their own opinion and to give us their side of the story.  The fact that they haven't can only lead one to believe the worse scenartio instead of the better one.

A. Which facts? Specifically, please.
Here are some facts you may consider.
1. Marquette staff has said, repeatedly, for weeks that a member of the incoming class would not be coming to campus, and that person knew.
2. DJ Newbill did not complete his application requirements.
3. DJ Newbill was not on campus or signed up to participate in the pro-am.

Everything else we know comes down to he said/she said. Newbill's people say this was a surprise. Marquette's says it wasn't. I - unlike some here - won't claim to know which side is being more honest. However, the known facts tend to support Marquette's version.
If a kid is a surefire commitment, and has been for some five months (verbally) and two months (in writing), then why hasn't he applied?
If a kid is a surefire commitment, why isn't he participating in the pro am with all the other incoming freshmen? If your answer is "because nobody told him about it," why would the staff not inform a surefire commitment?
If he was a surefire commitment, why would the coaching staff be publicly stating that a recruit wasn't coming ... even after Mbao trasnferred?

Maybe there's another explanation to those questions (I'd be happy if you gave it a crack), but for now it seems to favor MU's account.

B. Yes, Buzz could say anything he wants about the situation. So long as he doesn't mind being hit with NCAA violations. Which would surely be a fireable offense, in your mind.

[KipsBayEagle]

A. Which facts? Specifically, please.
Here are some facts you may consider.
1. Marquette staff has said, repeatedly, for weeks that a member of the incoming class would not be coming to campus, and that person knew.
2. DJ Newbill did not complete his application requirements.
3. DJ Newbill was not on campus or signed up to participate in the pro-am.

Everything else we know comes down to he said/she said. Newbill's people say this was a surprise. Marquette's says it wasn't. I - unlike some here - won't claim to know which side is being more honest. However, the known facts tend to support Marquette's version.
If a kid is a surefire commitment, and has been for some five months (verbally) and two months (in writing), then why hasn't he applied?
If a kid is a surefire commitment, why isn't he participating in the pro am with all the other incoming freshmen? If your answer is "because nobody told him about it," why would the staff not inform a surefire commitment?
If he was a surefire commitment, why would the coaching staff be publicly stating that a recruit wasn't coming ... even after Mbao trasnferred?

Maybe there's another explanation to those questions (I'd be happy if you gave it a crack), but for now it seems to favor MU's account.

B. Yes, Buzz could say anything he wants about the situation. So long as he doesn't mind being hit with NCAA violations. Which would surely be a fireable offense, in your mind.

A1 is a fact, but is false since DJ Newbill clearly did not know about this.
A2 is not a fact, merely heresay that has been mentioned on message boards.
A3 has nothing to do with anything.
B is accurate, that is my mistake.

[ATL MU Warrior]

I feel so much better about the poor judgment/actions of our coach since you've pointed out that only 14 people outside Wisconsin know about it!  Doing something wrong only matters when 50+ people know about it of course.

and you KNOW what we did is so wrong exactly how???  Oh you don't.

[mu_hilltopper]

Did I defend? .....I don't think I did.  I am not defending, but I am not disparaging either.

I believe so, yes.

Fortunately, you get to spout your opinion.  Buzz and the staff do not have the same opportunity.

You are disparaging Marquette having very few facts.  Surely you learned that was wrong in one, or hopefully, many of your classes at MU.

From those two lines, you are certainly defending MU, Buzz.  Suggesting the other poster was "disparaging" clearly indicates that you believe he's wrong in doing so.   


Just sayin.

[MerrittsMustache]

A1 is a fact, but is false since DJ Newbill clearly did not know about this.
A2 is not a fact, merely heresay that has been mentioned on message boards.
A3 has nothing to do with anything.
B is accurate, that is my mistake.

How can A1 be a fact and be false?

[Pakuni]

A1 is a fact, but is false since DJ Newbill clearly did not know about this.
A2 is not a fact, merely heresay that has been mentioned on message boards.
A3 has nothing to do with anything.
B is accurate, that is my mistake.

A1. How could you possibly know what DJ Newbill knows and does not know? Fact is, his advisor, Phillycoach, knew that Marquette coaches were saying this, and even commented on it here several times. Do you think it likely DJ's advisor chose not to share this information with him?

A2. An absolute fact, confirmed by both DJ and his advisor.

A3. Of course it's relevant. MU made sure all its incoming players were aware and/or participating in the pro am. All except one. If, up until this week, DJ was a surefire commitment, then why would they make an exception with him?

[KipsBayEagle]

A1. How could you possibly know what DJ Newbill knows and does not know? Fact is, his advisor, Phillycoach, knew that Marquette coaches were saying this, and even commented on it here several times. Do you think it likely DJ's advisor chose not to share this information with him?

A2. An absolute fact, confirmed by both DJ and his advisor.

A3. Of course it's relevant. MU made sure all its incoming players were aware and/or participating in the pro am. All except one. If, up until this week, DJ was a surefire commitment, then why would they make an exception with him?

Where did his advisor confirm this?

[Pakuni]

Where did his advisor confirm this?

Laws said Newbill never sent the school an official application, and also did not prepare a required essay. Laws said Newbill did complete the app, but did not forward it because he had yet to finish the essay, and had not been given a deadline.

http://www.philly.com/dailynews/sports/high_school/20100701_Newbill_cut_loose_by_Marquette.html#ixzz0sXtGiOfk

[KipsBayEagle]

Laws said Newbill never sent the school an official application, and also did not prepare a required essay. Laws said Newbill did complete the app, but did not forward it because he had yet to finish the essay, and had not been given a deadline.

http://www.philly.com/dailynews/sports/high_school/20100701_Newbill_cut_loose_by_Marquette.html#ixzz0sXtGiOfk

I stand corrected

[buckchuckler]

Holier than thou, my a$$.

I paid enough tuition to the Jesuits to know the basic difference between right and wrong.

I didn't know paying tuition got you that.  Huh, that's kind of weird actually.  And that you know the difference now, but didn't until you had finished college is a little alarming.

[MUSF]

I didn't know paying tuition got you that.  Huh, that's kind of weird actually.  And that you know the difference now, but didn't until you had finished college is a little alarming.

It also seems that since Jesuits provide Buzz Williams a paycheck, 3Mer would have to question the very foundation of that knowledge he gained at MU.

Man, 3Mer's world must be really upside down right now.

[TJ]

and you KNOW what we did is so wrong exactly how???  Oh you don't.

I'm not the one who said it doesn't matter as long as only 13 people know about it.  My sarcastic response was an attempt to refute that.

I know that we did something that at the very least disappoints me.  I explained it clearly in a post above.

[ATWizJr]

Yeah, let's be honest.... if Buzz had passed on Wilson, criticism.  Since he took Wilson,  criticism.

A lot of people are taking this opportunity to post their "holier than thou" crap for their own personal aggrandizement.  Enough already!  We hear you and we know that you just are better than everyone else and that you just care more.

[TJ]

Yeah, let's be honest.... if Buzz had passed on Wilson, criticism.  Since he took Wilson,  criticism.

A lot of people are taking this opportunity to post their "holier than thou" crap for their own personal aggrandizement.  Enough already!  We hear you and we know that you just are better than everyone else and that you just care more.

If Buzz had passed on Wilson, in all likelyhood no one would have known.

[ATWizJr]

If Buzz had passed on Wilson, in all likelyhood no one would have known.

Doubtful. That news wouldn't have lasted one 24 hour news cycle.

[StillAWarrior]

Yeah, let's be honest.... if Buzz had passed on Wilson, criticism.  Since he took Wilson,  criticism.

A lot of people are taking this opportunity to post their "holier than thou" crap for their own personal aggrandizement.  Enough already!  We hear you and we know that you just are better than everyone else and that you just care more.

I can play this game too...

A lot of people are taking this opportunity to post their "I'm a bigger fan than you are" crap for their own personal aggrandizement.  Enough already!  We hear you and we know that you are just a bigger fan than everyone else and you just love the team more.


Reasonable minds can reach different conclusions.  Just because someone supports Buzz doesn't mean he's an unprincipled prick.  Just because someone doesn't like what happened here doesn't mean he hates Buzz and isn't a real MU fan.  I'm not going to tell everyone to stop posting because this makes for entertaining reading.  But, in the words of Rodney King, "can't we all get along?"

[Pakuni]

If Buzz had passed on Wilson, in all likelyhood no one would have known.

It made the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel the first time he passed on Wilson.

[3Mer]

It also seems that since Jesuits provide Buzz Williams a paycheck, 3Mer would have to question the very foundation of that knowledge he gained at MU.

Man, 3Mer's world must be really upside down right now.

I'll confess I must not have paid enough tuition to understand what the F your point is.  Are you saying Fr. Wilde sanctioned Buzz's decision to $crew this kid over?  After all the bad press generated by Fr. Wilde rescinding MU's job offer to Professor O'Brien, do you really think he's shrugging off all the Philadelphia media coverage?

As far as the "holier than thou cr@p," for some posters (and apparently a significant %), pride in our basketball program has always been about more than wins/losses.  Treating high school recruits as commodities rather than students and potential alumni bothers the $hit out of me.

[TJ]

It made the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel the first time he passed on Wilson.

I stand corrected.  I just didn't think that a transfer would go blabbing about who didn't want him.

Also, I don't really think Buzz would have gotten too much criticism for passing on him with the reason that he's already got a full roster.  It would have been unfortunate and disappointing, but understandable.  When you don't have a spot you can't take another scholarship on.

[Pakuni]

I stand corrected.  I just didn't think that a transfer would go blabbing about who didn't want him.

Also, I don't really think Buzz would have gotten too much criticism for passing on him with the reason that he's already got a full roster.  It would have been unfortunate and disappointing, but understandable.  When you don't have a spot you can't take another scholarship on.

I agree. It might have been mentioned, but I don't suspect Buzz would have been ripped over it.
If there were any criticism, it would be along the lines of "Why did Buzz give a scholie to (player x ... likely Newbill would have been the most likely mention) when Wilson could have been there for the taking?"

[ATWizJr]

I can play this game too...

A lot of people are taking this opportunity to post their "I'm a bigger fan than you are" crap for their own personal aggrandizement.  Enough already!  We hear you and we know that you are just a bigger fan than everyone else and you just love the team more.


Reasonable minds can reach different conclusions.  Just because someone supports Buzz doesn't mean he's an unprincipled prick.  Just because someone doesn't like what happened here doesn't mean he hates Buzz and isn't a real MU fan.  I'm not going to tell everyone to stop posting because this makes for entertaining reading.  But, in the words of Rodney King, "can't we all get along?"

Well,if you've read of my posts you will know that I have suggested that people wait for the facts before ripping anyone.  No self aggrandizement involved, however, I've got your game right here.