MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: MU_Beav on September 26, 2012, 09:53:13 AM
-
Jim Ganzer @theIWB
Marquette fans - 6'2 PG John Dawson from Clovis, NM has verbally committed to Marquette and Buzz Williams #mubb
-
Welcome JD!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChLQpDg0F1Y
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d68aDPwtiq8
This is his Dad or someone's account... Lot of little videos.
http://www.youtube.com/user/mrdddawson?feature=watch
-
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/recruiting/player-John-Dawson-128976
http://scouthoops.scout.com/a.z?s=75&p=8&c=1&nid=6263581
Not highly ranked recruit, but I guess the staff knows.
-
3 stars from Rivals, unranked on Scout. Baylor, Idaho State, NM, Wyoming interested.
-
Just to clarify, 2013 PG....John Dawson, 3 star on Rivals.
Welcome!
-
http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/player/_/id/162866/john-dawson
like usual, i'll defer/give benefit of doubt to buzz, but... yeesh...
-
I remember from previous thread Arizona St. offered after seeing him this summer. 6'4 with good handle and athleticism, seems like a solid addition. Marquette seems to struggle getting high end talent when playing time isn't guaranteed.
-
Good pick-up. has some size, not highly recruited but those are the best kids that Buzz loves. If the kid wants to work hard, he will have the opportunity to play as a freshman as MU
now has 3 points, throw the ball up and see what happens!
-
http://future150.com/hs/basketball-profiles/john-dawson-pg-2013
"Dawson has elite court vision and the ability to make all his teammates better. He can score on a 3 levels. He loves getting out in transition where he is pretty much unstoppable when attacking the rim. He has excellent ball handling skills and can knock down the open 3-point shot with consistency. His length and athleticism and being 6'4" is what sets him apart from other point guards in the class."
Sounds like exactly the type of player Buzz likes. And look on a map to find Clovis and you see why he might be under the radar.
(Wonder if he is the son of an Air Force parent....)
-
He's 6'1" or 6'2" or 6'4"--take your pick.
-
Welcome! Bring a jacket!
-
So a 3-star w/upside?
That's code for "unfortunatley, due to his homesickness, he decided to look for other opportunities closer to home. We will miss him as part of the program" come, what...August, 2013?
-
http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/player/_/id/162866/john-dawson
like usual, i'll defer/give benefit of doubt to buzz, but... yeesh...
Not up on all recruiting but how many scouts are going to New Mexico to evaluate talent? Or do all the rankings come from summer ball? Can't imagine he has the same opportunity for summer ball as someone from southern cal or east coast.
-
So a 3-star w/upside?
That's code for "unfortunatley, due to his homesickness, he decided to look for other opportunities closer to home. We will miss him as part of the program" come, what...August, 2013?
Oh no he dihint...
-
Sorry...couldn't resist that one.
But...there's usually one that has this happen. A fact of life.
-
Congrats John welcome to the family
-
So in 2013, Duane Wilson will probably be starting PG as freshman with Dawson being the backup. Unless Blue shifts over at times. Even though the kid is not a highly ranked recruit, at least this position should/could be in good hands for some years. Hopefully he is one of those diamonds in the rough having come from New Mexico, not a real hotbed for AAU ball. Can never tell......
The recruiting game starts in 2014 with Looney and 2015 with Stone. Those are the big boys.
-
So in 2013, Duane Wilson will probably be starting PG as freshman with Dawson being the backup. Unless Blue shifts over at times. Even though the kid is not a highly ranked recruit, at least this position should/could be in good hands for some years. Hopefully he is one of those diamonds in the rough having come from New Mexico, not a real hotbed for AAU ball. Can never tell......
The recruiting game starts in 2014 with Looney and 2015 with Stone. Those are the big boys.
What about the other Wilson?
-
He's 6'1" or 6'2" or 6'4"--take your pick.
I pick 6'4"!
I trust in Buzz and expect Dawson to be a contributor while at MU. Perhaps Duane and Dawson will team up to be a bigger, better version of the Acker-Cubillan backcourt tandem.
-
What about the other Wilson?
Jeez, I forgot about him......... Just goes to show since Derrick Wilson did not really show an offensive skill level to score. No clue how it pans out.
-
What about the other Wilson?
Yeah, I find it really strange that we so easily write off a guy who will have been a back up point for two years in this program. I have a feeling that Duane and Dawson will be playing off the ball when they get here, or will be backing up the point.
-
He looks 6-1 in the YouTube videos. Perhaps the upside is that he has sprouted recently. (wishful thinking).
-
http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/player/_/id/162866/john-dawson
like usual, i'll defer/give benefit of doubt to buzz, but... yeesh...
I'm not going to say whether or not you should defer to Buzz, but if you're going to come on here and tell everyone that you're going to, you might want to leave it at that.
-
So a 3-star w/upside?
That's code for "unfortunatley, due to his homesickness, he decided to look for other opportunities closer to home. We will miss him as part of the program" come, what...August, 2013?
Or code for "under-recruited by other programs, Buzz found another player off the radar." He could just as easily be Davante Gardner or Todd Mayo as he could TJ Taylor or Yous Mbao.
-
John Dawson, 6′-3″, 2013, PG, BYC Elite/Clovis (NM) – With his team knocking off a talented Colorado Miners team in the first round of tournament play, Dawson did it all. He is a consummate point guard, with a good handle. He knocked down free throws and created points both off the dribble and on a jump shot. It is easy to see why he drew interest from onlookers like Wyoming and Idaho State, and one figures that numerous other regional mid-majors will get in the mix for his services.
http://hoopniks.com/best-buy-mile-high-classic-saturday-recap
http://nmpreps.rivals.com/barrier_noentry.asp?ReturnTo=&sid=&script=content.asp&cid=1365743&fid=&tid=&mid=&rid=
-
Anyone hear anything about his D? A good defender with solid court vision is a good addition.
-
Travis Diener wasn't highly recruited either. That worked out ok i'd say.
-
....and now 6'3".
-
Meh.
-
http://future150.com/hs/basketball-profiles/john-dawson-pg-2013
"Dawson has elite court vision and the ability to make all his teammates better. He can score on a 3 levels. He loves getting out in transition where he is pretty much unstoppable when attacking the rim. He has excellent ball handling skills and can knock down the open 3-point shot with consistency. His length and athleticism and being 6'4" is what sets him apart from other point guards in the class."
Sounds like exactly the type of player Buzz likes. And look on a map to find Clovis and you see why he might be under the radar.
(Wonder if he is the son of an Air Force parent....)
Four Star, number 84 nationally, 21st rated point guard, similar to Bronson Koenig in style and ranking - hope they know something ESPN, Scout and Rivals don't.
-
Travis Diener wasn't highly recruited either. That worked out ok i'd say.
Diener was a Top 50 recruit in his class.
-
John Dawson, 6′-3″, 2013, PG, BYC Elite/Clovis (NM) – With his team knocking off a talented Colorado Miners team in the first round of tournament play, Dawson did it all. He is a consummate point guard, with a good handle. He knocked down free throws and created points both off the dribble and on a jump shot. It is easy to see why he drew interest from onlookers like Wyoming and Idaho State, and one figures that numerous other regional mid-majors will get in the mix for his services.
http://hoopniks.com/best-buy-mile-high-classic-saturday-recap
http://nmpreps.rivals.com/barrier_noentry.asp?ReturnTo=&sid=&script=content.asp&cid=1365743&fid=&tid=&mid=&rid=
Regional mid-majors? That's a glowing recommendation.
-
Keep in mind where he is from. Clovis, NM is in the middle of nowhere. On the one hand, he may not have had experience against top level competition. OTOH, he very well could be a diamond in the rough. None of us are really in a position to know.
-
Regional mid-majors? That's a glowing recommendation.
Didn't that McDermott guy turn out to be a much better college player at Creighton than Harrison Barnes at UNC?
-
Not up on all recruiting but how many scouts are going to New Mexico to evaluate talent? Or do all the rankings come from summer ball? Can't imagine he has the same opportunity for summer ball as someone from southern cal or east coast.
If Jabari Parker lived in Clovis, NM scouts and coaches would do everything short of buying a second home in New Mexico to evaluate and recruit him.
Recall that Alaska is a hell of a lot more remote than New Mexico, yet Mario Chalmers and Carlos Boozer got plenty of attention from the big boys.
We can hope that Buzz is correct in guessing that there is a lot of upside potential in Dawson--but its simply not reasonable to think that the only reason why Kansas, UNC, Duke, etc. missed on him was becuase they couldn't find their way to New Mexico.
-
How did Jimmy Butler turn out, it is all about the individual, he wants to play in high ranking conference, I am sure he will be your typical freshman, has size,
-
If Jabari Parker lived in Clovis, NM scouts and coaches would do everything short of buying a second home in New Mexico to evaluate and recruit him.
Maybe, maybe not. Wade was one of the best players in college his entire career and developed into one of the best players in the world. He got missed by the big boys in Chicago. Some guys get missed, no matter their talent or location. Is Dawson one of those? No clue. But I do think Buzz has a better shot at spotting those types than anyone on this board.
-
“I need to keep working on my game daily as I feel I am a good leader on the floor and need to work on playing without the ball. I workout twice a day, six days a week and on Sunday I go to church”, said Dawson.
http://www.areacodesbasketball.com/2012/05/21/john-dawson-aka-new-mexicos-finest/
Sounds like a Buzz player to me. Hard work, underrecruited, big work ethic and a strong leadership trait. Perfect guy to give a chip on the shoulder and see what happens when his glass is knocked over.
-
If Jabari Parker lived in Clovis, NM scouts and coaches would do everything short of buying a second home in New Mexico to evaluate and recruit him.
Recall that Alaska is a hell of a lot more remote than New Mexico, yet Mario Chalmers and Carlos Boozer got plenty of attention from the big boys.
We can hope that Buzz is correct in guessing that there is a lot of upside potential in Dawson--but its simply not reasonable to think that the only reason why Kansas, UNC, Duke, etc. missed on him was becuase they couldn't find their way to New Mexico.
Does every recruit that MU brings in need to be recruited by Kansas, UNC and Duke? Teams need role players too. Considering Buzz brought in no-name recruits like Butler, DJO, Crowder and Gardner, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
-
What's his GPA?
-
Does every recruit that MU brings in need to be recruited by Kansas, UNC and Duke? Teams need role players too. Considering Buzz brought in no-name recruits like Butler, DJO, Crowder and Gardner, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
+1 Its about what happens when they are here. Not who they think they are.
-
I saw Dawson some this summer.. I think he was at both the Best Buy Mile High Classic in April (Lakewood/Denver, CO) and the Best Buy Summer Classic in the Twin Cities in July.
He had it going in April... was quite impressive and a guy that looked like he could attract some HM interest, although at that time there wasn't much at that interest level.
Very good passing and was pulling up off the dribble and draining shots.. feeling it.
-
Happy to have him but also have to wonder a bit. This was another spontaneous commit that comes really out of the blue. I couldn't find anywhere where our name was even associated with him on any of the major boards (Rivals, Scout, ESPN). I'm worried that it might be another situation where Buzz offered him because of the rumor that he was a "rising star" and the kid leapt at the offer because it was better than anything he had on the table and wanted to grab the scholly before anyone else did. Frankly, we haven't had the best of luck with that scenario in the past (see Roseboro, Newbill, Reggie Smith, TJ Taylor). Yeah, he's a 3-star on one site but significantly less than that on other sites and comes from one of the weakest basketball states in the country. With Duane & Derrick Wilson already in the fold, this guy projects as a back-up point at best. That's a tough gig for an 18 year old coming all the way from sunny New Mexico to subzero Milwaukee with no friends or family nearby for support. I have to raise the obvious question here - would it have been better to hold the scholly open in hopes of a PF or C that we could develop into a starter, or use it on someone who will likely be a bench guy his entire career? Having said that, I hope my fears prove unfounded things work out well for everyone!
-
you ever been to New Mexico? I think he will be plenty happy being in Milwaukee
-
Is he kin to Brandon Dawson, a former target? That cat's not too bad.
-
Happy to have him but also have to wonder a bit. This was another spontaneous commit that comes really out of the blue. I couldn't find anywhere where our name was even associated with him on any of the major boards (Rivals, Scout, ESPN). I'm worried that it might be another situation where Buzz offered him because of the rumor that he was a "rising star" and the kid leapt at the offer because it was better than anything he had on the table and wanted to grab the scholly before anyone else did. Frankly, we haven't had the best of luck with that scenario in the past (see Roseboro, Newbill, Reggie Smith, TJ Taylor). Yeah, he's a 3-star on one site but significantly less than that on other sites and comes from one of the weakest basketball states in the country. With Duane & Derrick Wilson already in the fold, this guy projects as a back-up point at best. That's a tough gig for an 18 year old coming all the way from sunny New Mexico to subzero Milwaukee with no friends or family nearby for support. I have to raise the obvious question here - would it have been better to hold the scholly open in hopes of a PF or C that we could develop into a starter, or use it on someone who will likely be a bench guy his entire career? Having said that, I hope my fears prove unfounded things work out well for everyone!
Buzz isn't going to offer a player a scholarship based on a rumor nor is he going to make an offer to a player who he doesn't think can be a positive contributor to the program.
-
Happy to have him but also have to wonder a bit. This was another spontaneous commit that comes really out of the blue. I couldn't find anywhere where our name was even associated with him on any of the major boards (Rivals, Scout, ESPN). I'm worried that it might be another situation where Buzz offered him because of the rumor that he was a "rising star" and the kid leapt at the offer because it was better than anything he had on the table and wanted to grab the scholly before anyone else did. Frankly, we haven't had the best of luck with that scenario in the past (see Roseboro, Newbill, Reggie Smith, TJ Taylor). Yeah, he's a 3-star on one site but significantly less than that on other sites and comes from one of the weakest basketball states in the country. With Duane & Derrick Wilson already in the fold, this guy projects as a back-up point at best. That's a tough gig for an 18 year old coming all the way from sunny New Mexico to subzero Milwaukee with no friends or family nearby for support. I have to raise the obvious question here - would it have been better to hold the scholly open in hopes of a PF or C that we could develop into a starter, or use it on someone who will likely be a bench guy his entire career? Having said that, I hope my fears prove unfounded things work out well for everyone!
Let the kid lace up the shoes and show what he has before delegating him to the bench. See what he has against the others coming in next year. You can never tell.
-
you ever been to New Mexico? I think he will be plenty happy being in Milwaukee
Yeah, I have. I would definitely take Sante Fe over Milwaukee in a heartbeat.
-
Buzz isn't going to offer a player a scholarship based on a rumor nor is he going to make an offer to a player who he doesn't think can be a positive contributor to the program.
But he has offered players sight unseen, and based on very little examination (see: Roseboro, Bret).
None of us know anything about Dawson, nor do we know what Buzz knows/doesn't know about him. We'll just have to see how it plays out.
-
MU was most definitely at tourneys where Dawson was this summer.
Is he kin to Brandon Dawson, a former target? That cat's not too bad.
You liar! There wasn't a former target named Brandon Dawson. BrandEn... or, as some call him, "B.J.".
-
So a 3-star w/upside?
That's code for: 50% chance that, due to his homesickness, he'll decide to look for other opportunities closer to home.
Is how i'd phrase it.
-
But he has offered players sight unseen, and based on very little examination (see: Roseboro, Bret).
None of us know anything about Dawson, nor do we know what Buzz knows/doesn't know about him. We'll just have to see how it plays out.
Buzz offered Butler without seeing him play and he offered Jae after seeing him play only one game, and in that one played limited minutes and had negligible impact due to fouls. Buzz thinks this kid can contribute and the kid wants to play for Buzz. That is all I know but it is enough to make me not want to trash the kid. Personally, I try not to do that until the kid has been at MU a couple of years and shown little improvement and/or a poor attitude.
-
But he has offered players sight unseen, and based on very little examination (see: Roseboro, Bret).
None of us know anything about Dawson, nor do we know what Buzz knows/doesn't know about him. We'll just have to see how it plays out.
Very early on, at a position of great need that has been a major problem for us, Buzz offered a guy said to be a rising star by scouts and his assistant Aki Collins. Doubt he'd take such a gamble at a position as well stocked as point guard.
-
Yeah, I have. I would definitely take Sante Fe over Milwaukee in a heartbeat.
Sante Fe and Taos (and even Albuquerque to a lesser extent) are beautiful places.
The rest of New Mexico is comprised entirely of sand and rocks (and abandoned nuclear testing sites) and has few redeeming qualities.
If he was from Sante Fe you would have a point.
-
Does every recruit that MU brings in need to be recruited by Kansas, UNC and Duke? Teams need role players too. Considering Buzz brought in no-name recruits like Butler, DJO, Crowder and Gardner, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Butler had an offer from Kentucky.
DJO was being recruited by the likes of Kansas (thank goodness for Buzz's JUCO connections on that one).
Crowder was a JUCO All American.
Gardner was an all-state player from an athlete-rich part of the country who had offers/interest from other Big East programs.
Not exactly a bunch of no-names.
That said, obviously you're correct that every team needs role players. But no coach goes out and recruits a kid hoping he'll be a role player or pitching him on the idea of being a role player. Buzz obviously thinks Dawson can play. Of course, he thought that of Mbao, Roseboro and McMorrow, too. Sometimes you're right, sometimes you're not (and this goes for every coach, not just Buzz).
We'll find out.
-
Buzz offered Butler without seeing him play and he offered Jae after seeing him play only one game, and in that one play limited minutes and have negligible impact due to fouls. Buzz thinks this kid can contribute and the kid wants to play for Buzz. That is all I know but it is enough to make me not want to trash the kid. Personally, I try not to do that until the kid has been at MU a couple of years and shown little improvement and/or a poor attitude.
Who's trashing the kid?
-
So a 3-star w/upside?
That's code for "unfortunatley, due to his homesickness, he decided to look for other opportunities closer to home. We will miss him as part of the program" come, what...August, 2013?
That did not happen with Gardner. Not everyone leaves.
-
He looks 6-1 in the YouTube videos. Perhaps the upside is that he has sprouted recently. (wishful thinking).
Some of the videos were from his sophomore year. Besides that unless you know the heights of the players he is playing against how can you say from a video what his height is. All I know is as a sophomore he had no trouble dunking the ball. He also looks like he has good quickness.
-
Sante Fe and Taos (and even Albuquerque to a lesser extent) are beautiful places.
The rest of New Mexico is comprised entirely of sand and rocks (and abandoned nuclear testing sites) and has few redeeming qualities.
If he was from Sante Fe you would have a point.
I've heard Greater Albuquerque has some of the purest meth around.
-
http://future150.com/hs/basketball-profiles/john-dawson-pg-2013
"Dawson has elite court vision and the ability to make all his teammates better. He can score on a 3 levels. He loves getting out in transition where he is pretty much unstoppable when attacking the rim. He has excellent ball handling skills and can knock down the open 3-point shot with consistency. His length and athleticism and being 6'4" is what sets him apart from other point guards in the class."
Sounds like exactly the type of player Buzz likes. And look on a map to find Clovis and you see why he might be under the radar.
(Wonder if he is the son of an Air Force parent....)
I f you scroll all the way down they have a catagory called similar point guards. First one listed is Bronsen Koenig.
-
Sante Fe and Taos (and even Albuquerque to a lesser extent) are beautiful places.
The rest of New Mexico is comprised entirely of sand and rocks (and abandoned nuclear testing sites) and has few redeeming qualities.
If he was from Sante Fe you would have a point.
New Mexico is like every state. Has some beautiful places—and some not so beautiful places.
-
But he has offered players sight unseen, and based on very little examination (see: Roseboro, Bret).
None of us know anything about Dawson, nor do we know what Buzz knows/doesn't know about him. We'll just have to see how it plays out.
That was on the recommendation of an assistant coach that is no longer here.
-
It seems Brad Autry made a connection with the family, if it works fine, if it does not so be it. Buzz recruited a few top 100 kids has that worked out like Erik Williams and even Juan
Anderson. Not every kid will make it, but with 3 highly rated kids coming in, you can take a 3 star, and in 2 years under the guidance of Todd Smith and the coaching, it might
be a great pick-up. Buzz tried higher ranked kids, they probably all looked at the roster and saw no real playing time. Kids want to play, I am sure Buzz promised him an opportunity
to start which I would tell every kid coming in, then it is up to the kid to work hard and show he deserves PT time. Patterson obviously was not interested.
-
After watching the future150 video, I see a complete package PG. In that video, the only thing I didn't see was the straight ahead, open court breakaway speed of a DJO/Vander/Jerel/Mayo, but I did see a long PG who is always under control and always seeing the floor. Yeah, it is a highlight video, but the kid looks like he has the tools.
-
Welcome to MU John. I like your court vision and offensive attacking ability. Have a great senior year!!!
-
After watching the future150 video, I see a complete package PG. In that video, the only thing I didn't see was the straight ahead, open court breakaway speed of a DJO/Vander/Jerel/Mayo, but I did see a long PG who is always under control and always seeing the floor. Yeah, it is a highlight video, but the kid looks like he has the tools.
Reminded me a little bit of Sam Cassell, not over the top speed, but very much in control. Looks like he needs a little time with Todd Smith. Shot looks good.
-
Reminded me a little bit of Sam Cassell, not over the top speed, but very much in control. Looks like he needs a little time with Todd Smith. Shot looks good.
Funny you should mention Sam...he was from New Mexico as well...near Roswell....
-
Always thought there was a chance Sam was an alien.
-
Funny you should mention Sam...he was from New Mexico as well...near Roswell....
Coincidence?? I think not.
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-t8XU4SqANDE/Tyl3Lc3wbAI/AAAAAAAAAFU/qGYhzJetPp8/s1600/cassell.jpg)
-
I've heard Greater Albuquerque has some of the purest meth around.
Don't worry, this wasn't missed by everyone.
-
I chuckled as well
-
Does every recruit that MU brings in need to be recruited by Kansas, UNC and Duke? Teams need role players too. Considering Buzz brought in no-name recruits like Butler, DJO, Crowder and Gardner, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
My comment was directed at those who think that Dawson was somehow "missed" by Kansas, UNC and Duke becuase he's from Clovis NM.
BTW, Butler, DJO and Crowder were not no-name recruits--Crowder was national JUCO player of the year. Butler and DJO were all-Americans--DJO first team.
-
Maybe, maybe not. Wade was one of the best players in college his entire career and developed into one of the best players in the world. He got missed by the big boys in Chicago. Some guys get missed, no matter their talent or location. Is Dawson one of those? No clue. But I do think Buzz has a better shot at spotting those types than anyone on this board.
I believe the big issue with Wade was that the BCS schools couldn't take him because he was a Prop 48 kid.
Regarding Dawson - he looks smooth and solidly athletic. Time will tell...but it wasn't long ago we were almost happy getting 3 star players....even when we had lots of available PT to sell. Expectations have definitely risen as to what we should be capable of signing. Interesting to note that Tony Benford is a New Mexico native - surprising to see that North Texas wasn't involved..
-
Funny you should mention Sam...he was from New Mexico as well...near Roswell....
That I did not know, but good coincidence.
-
BTW, Butler, DJO and Crowder were not no-name recruits--Crowder was national JUCO player of the year. Butler and DJO were all-Americans--DJO first team.
Quick, name 5 McDonald's All-Americans from this past season.
Now, name any JUCO player of the year or JUCO All-American other than the MU guys mentioned above.
-
Do the questions and skepticism expressed here sound eerily familiar to the Durley thread last year?
I hope I'm wrong
-
Do the questions and skepticism expressed here sound eerily familiar to the Durley thread last year?
I hope I'm wrong
I think much of that will hinge on Dawson's senior year. Let's not forget that Durley could barely get off the bench as a senior, which undoubtedly hurt his chances here. I have a feeling Dawson will continue to shine, as he has been trending upward in the past few months (Durley's injury and lack of PT had him trending in the opposite direction).
We've been on the kid for awhile, even if he hasn't been a regular Scoop topic before the past couple weeks. Compared to Wilson and Burton, he's a bit more of a longshot, but if you look at Buzz's track record over the past two recruiting classes, he's had good success with two and three star kids. Mayo and Gardner have both been highly successful, while Derrick Wilson earned some PT as well. Only Reggie Smith didn't end up having a role here, though I think it's hard to put that on Buzz as the kid looked like he could play a bit but simply wasn't patient enough to wait for more regular PT.
-
Only Reggie Smith didn't end up having a role here, though I think it's hard to put that on Buzz as the kid looked like he could play a bit but simply wasn't patient enough to wait for more regular PT.
Which is why signing a 3-star may not be the worst thing to happen to Buzz. If he continues to grow as a player, he could be a great veteran presence off the bench his junior and senior year. If he was a top 100 kid, he might not have been as patient and left before then.
-
Which is why signing a 3-star may not be the worst thing to happen to Buzz. If he continues to grow as a player, he could be a great veteran presence off the bench his junior and senior year. If he was a top 100 kid, he might not have been as patient and left before then.
This actually spawns an interesting conversation.
As a coach, you definitely want the most talent you can get. You can figure out how to make them fit later.
However, there is something to the theory "the most talent you can KEEP." It doesn't really do a lot of good to bring in top 100 guys who ride the bench for 2 years and then transfer. Jones, Williams, did that.
-
Do the questions and skepticism expressed here sound eerily familiar to the Durley thread last year?
I hope I'm wrong
It's that history that have led to people's reservations about the kid. It's unfair on him...completely. But not unfair when looking at the program.
Glad he's coming. Hope he pans out great as a player and a person...like all kids. I do like his upside, but, there aren't many guys who MU signs that I get done reading their by-lines that I say I don't like their upside.
-
Do the questions and skepticism expressed here sound eerily familiar to the Durley thread last year?
I hope I'm wrong
Seriously? Durley didn't even play in high school. Dawson averaged 18 10 & 7 and is rated as a 3 star by rivals.
-
This actually spawns an interesting conversation.
As a coach, you definitely want the most talent you can get. You can figure out how to make them fit later.
However, there is something to the theory "the most talent you can KEEP." It doesn't really do a lot of good to bring in top 100 guys who ride the bench for 2 years and then transfer. Jones, Williams, did that.
Except I doubt any kid is going to want to come to MU - or most schools - under the premise of sitting for a couple of years and then becoming "a veteran presence off the bench." The only player I cant think of who's fit that description in the past 10-15 years is Joe Fulce, and his long and winding road to MU + injuries didn't leave him many options.
Most kids, I suspect, would rather play significant minutes at Sam Houston State or Florida Gulf Coast than ride the pines at MU. And there's nothing wrong with that.
Which is why I think most coaches would rather constantly replenish the program with the best players possible, knowing some won't pan out along the way or eventually will transfer out because they're unhappy with playing opportunities.
So, I guess what I'm saying is that I'd be surprised if Buzz views Dawson as nothing more than a "solid veteran presence off the bench" in a few years, and I'd be even more surprised if Dawson views himself that way. And if that role ultimately seems likely for him, a transfer should not be unexpected.
-
Seriously? Durley didn't even play in high school. Dawson averaged 18 10 & 7 and is rated as a 3 star by rivals.
Believe it or not, Durley was a three star by Rivals also. Do not ask me how, but he was......
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/recruiting/player-Aaron-Durley-107284
-
Do the questions and skepticism expressed here sound eerily familiar to the Durley thread last year?
I hope I'm wrong
Dawson, unlike Durley, was a major contributor for his team.
"As a junior this season, the 6'4", 190-pound point guard averaged roughly 18 points, nine assists, six rebounds and three steals for Clovis while leading them to a District 4-5A tournament championship and the Class 5A State Semi-Finals. For his efforts, he was chosen as a 2012 5A All-State First Team selection by the New Mexico High School Coaches Association (http://future150.com/hs/basketball-news/new-mexico-pg-john-dawson-thriving-in-the-desert)."
-
This actually spawns an interesting conversation.
As a coach, you definitely want the most talent you can get. You can figure out how to make them fit later.
However, there is something to the theory "the most talent you can KEEP." It doesn't really do a lot of good to bring in top 100 guys who ride the bench for 2 years and then transfer. Jones, Williams, did that.
That was Mike Deane's philosophy with Krunti Hester's recruitment.
-
Except I doubt any kid is going to want to come to MU - or most schools - under the premise of sitting for a couple of years and then becoming "a veteran presence off the bench." The only player I cant think of who's fit that description in the past 10-15 years is Joe Fulce, and his long and winding road to MU + injuries didn't leave him many options.
Most kids, I suspect, would rather play significant minutes at Sam Houston State or Florida Gulf Coast than ride the pines at MU. And there's nothing wrong with that.
Which is why I think most coaches would rather constantly replenish the program with the best players possible, knowing some won't pan out along the way or eventually will transfer out because they're unhappy with playing opportunities.
So, I guess what I'm saying is that I'd be surprised if Buzz views Dawson as nothing more than a "solid veteran presence off the bench" in a few years, and I'd be even more surprised if Dawson views himself that way. And if that role ultimately seems likely for him, a transfer should not be unexpected.
You're probably right re: current HS seniors.
However, I can think of a lot of guys who were role players for the majority of their MU career. Mo Acker, Cooby, Fulce, Burke, Fitz, John Harris, etc.
Now, these guys all played a lot as upper classmen, but as frosh. and sophs (and transfers), they were role players for most of their career.
With this said, I don't know if you want to try to recruit less talented players so you can stuff them on the bench for a couple of years... but constant transfers might not be the best either.
-
You're probably right re: current HS seniors.
However, I can think of a lot of guys who were role players for the majority of their MU career. Mo Acker, Cooby, Fulce, Burke, Fitz, John Harris, etc.
Now, these guys all played a lot as upper classmen, but as frosh. and sophs (and transfers), they were role players for most of their career.
With this said, I don't know if you want to try to recruit less talented players so you can stuff them on the bench for a couple of years... but constant transfers might not be the best either.
My first thought was Cubillan but didn't realize he played 20 min per as a Frosh including a 20 point outburst against Pitt while shooting 40+ from 3. What was he rated coming in?
-
I think it's a question of honesty. I fully believe Buzz is the kind if coach that will tell someone like Dawson (or Mayo, or Gardner, or Mbao, or Durley) that if he comes in he will have a chance to compete. It won't be easy. It will require hard work. But if you can play, you'll play. Smith and Wilson got starting opportunities as freshmen. Mayo and Blue played significant roles as freshmen. But it's not guaranteed. You have to work on it and deliver, because highly rated recruits like Mellow and Juan or unsung recruits like Mbao won't be handed minutes just because they made it through boot camp.
Some guys want that chance, some want guarantees. If Dawson is willing to put in the work, I'm happy to see him fight for his opportunity.
-
Quick, name 5 McDonald's All-Americans from this past season.
Now, name any JUCO player of the year or JUCO All-American other than the MU guys mentioned above.
So your point is that any player who is not a McDonald's AA is by definition a no-name?
-
There has to be some lure to being on a D-1 program that is on ESPN every game with legit tourney runs. I know a lot of high school kids that were either D-1 or bust. They had no desire playing D-3 or at some small school where half the students don't even know they have a basketball school.
Then again I guess those spots can be filled by walk-ons who push it in practice.
-
First off, welcome to the MU family.
Second, who will play SG if he and Duane ever end up in the same lineup, him or Duane?
-
It seems Brad Autry made a connection with the family, if it works fine, if it does not so be it. Buzz recruited a few top 100 kids has that worked out like Erik Williams and even Juan
Anderson. Not every kid will make it, but with 3 highly rated kids coming in, you can take a 3 star, and in 2 years under the guidance of Todd Smith and the coaching, it might
be a great pick-up. Buzz tried higher ranked kids, they probably all looked at the roster and saw no real playing time. Kids want to play, I am sure Buzz promised him an opportunity
to start which I would tell every kid coming in, then it is up to the kid to work hard and show he deserves PT time. Patterson obviously was not interested.
How do we know Patterson was not interested. Buzz may view Dawson as the better player. Patterson was not a top 100 player.
-
Didn't think he was any good, Hope I'M wrong.Nice size and good shot for a PG.
Here's hoping, " Down the Hatch"
-
Guess Buzz is starting a trend of recruiting players who's names end with "son."
Jamil Wilson
Derrick Wilson
Juan Anderson
Jamal Ferguson
Garrett Swanson
Duane Wilson
Deonte Burton (ends in "ton" but I'm counting it)
John Dawson
-
How do we know Patterson was not interested. Buzz may view Dawson as the better player. Patterson was not a top 100 player.
Only time will tell about who is better, I know one thing, could Patterson even make the grade at MU? Crean was oversigned so he found a way to
get rid of him, so maybe he could not even get into MU.
-
Guess Buzz is starting a trend of recruiting players who's names end with "son."
Jamil Wilson
Derrick Wilson
Juan Anderson
Jamal Ferguson
Garrett Swanson
Duane Wilson
Deonte Burton (ends in "ton" but I'm counting it)
John Dawson
Yeah. We sure wore out the Jamil, Jamail, Jamal, etc. the last few years.
-
The Durley comparisons are ridiculous. Dawson was an all-state player who almost single handedly lead his HS team deep into the tournament last year. He might be the best player in the state of New Mexico next year. Yeah, I know...New Mexico...but the guy plays.
-
Yeah. We sure wore out the Jamil, Jamail, Jamal, etc. the last few years.
It's less fun to talk about since Jamail left. Well, now we have Jameel I guess.
-
He's 6'1" or 6'2" or 6'4"--take your pick.
I'm torn between picking 6'4" or waiting until someone else says he's 6'5". ;)
-
Is that with or without shoes on?
-
I'm torn between picking 6'4" or waiting until someone else says he's 6'5". ;)
I saw a report that he has grown to 6'8 since his commitment.
-
Is this board turning into some weird kind of frat, hazing kids you know little about? Check this link out and give the young man a chance.
http://future150.com/hs/basketball-news/new-mexico-pg-john-dawson-thriving-in-the-desert
-
Is this board turning into some weird kind of frat, hazing kids you know little about? Check this link out and give the young man a chance.
They are ignorant because they treat recruiting rankings like the Bible, and then go on to tout Mayo and Gardner as the second coming, but don't understand the irony.
-
Is that with or without shoes on?
with.
-
So your point is that any player who is not a McDonald's AA is by definition a no-name?
No. My point is that there are very, very few big name players or even somewhat-known players who are playing JUCO basketball. No one heard about Jimmy Butler committing to MU and thought, "Yes! Marquette finally brought in a player with the skills to be an NBA 1st Round pick!"
A player doesn't need to be highly-touted in order to have a great college career.
-
Dawsons Dad said his son had 37 scholly offers from D-1 programs and commited to MU site unseen. Quite the story!
-
One of the things I suppose a coach looks for are those one or two skills a player can bring to the table and blend them with the talent he has. Only the top schools get 5-star kids regularly. So let's speculate that Buzz likes JD's offensive skill set to go along with D. Wilson's 'stopper' capabilities. (Just an example; no idea if that's actually true.)
Somewhere along the line I read something about a replacement for TJ. This makes perfect sense especially in that context.
-
Dawsons Dad said his son had 37 scholly offers from D-1 programs and commited to MU site unseen. Quite the story!
Which site? You mean MUSCOOP.com, gomarquette.com, marquette.edu or a different one?
-
Brew City has a great story on how the recruitment went down.
-
Brew City has a great story on how the recruitment went down.
.....and we have another listed height! Brew City article says, "6'5" ". ;D
http://www.brewcityball.com/forums/content.php?413-John-Dawson-commits-to-Marquette
-
He'll be 6'8" by the morning.
-
38,000 is s small town?
-
http://future150.com/hs/basketball-profiles/john-dawson-pg-2013
"Sounds like exactly the type of player Buzz likes. And look on a map to find Clovis and you see why he might be under the radar.
Under the radar is putting it mildly. I had a client in Clovis and to get there, you fly to Albuquerque and drive 4.5 hours east, mostly on two lane roads -- except for maybe the first 45 minutes. The Air Force Base has been on reserve since the last BRAC decisions a few years ago. The big employer in town other than DOD is the BNSF railroad.
Place is best known for the nearby discovery of Clovis Man. Supposedly a 10,000+ year old fossil that was believed for a long time to be the remnants of the first human settlement in North America. Now debunked as older fossils have been found. Otherwise, there's good Mexican food and an OK hotel that primarily serves BNSF crews and military visitors.
Hopefully we'll find out today's Clovis Man is a top-level basketball player.
-
Hopefully we'll find out today's Clovis Man is a top-level basketball player.
Jim Nantz everybody.
-
My comment was directed at those who think that Dawson was somehow "missed" by Kansas, UNC and Duke becuase he's from Clovis NM.
I don't think he was "missed" by those guys, but you might be surprised by the number of US citizens that genuinely think New Mexico is OUTSIDE of the USA. Read some of NM Magazine's "One of our 50 is missing" stories...it happens quite a bit to people that live there. http://www.nmmagazine.com/one-of-our-50-is-missing/
-
I'm torn between picking 6'4" or waiting until someone else says he's 6'5". ;)
Like Jae, we'll probably never really know until he's measured at the NBA draft camp 8-)
-
looks a bit like Nick Van Excell (spelling?) on the MU scout page photo. lets see if he plays that way.
-
I rather have an improving 3 star than a 4 star that has peaked. All the great players at MU have been the ones that continued to improve in their college careers. Almost all of the flameouts were players that did not improve.
-
he's 6'3 and still growing ..... i'm his dad and will tell you that he truly had 37 offers with high majors still calling even though he chose MU. he didnt just grab the opportunity because he felt it was a one time deal, but because he trusted GOD for his path and was strongly recruited by buzz and brad and who flew out to our home 3 times this month alone and showed him great love from a great program!!! .... just recd 13 calls yesterday from BCS schools that want him to not sign with MU in NOV so that they can get on board. JohnJohn is EXCITED to be a part of the MU family and so are we!!! .... long way from home ..... lots and lots of hard work .... and is excited to get even better!!! .... i truly believe MU is and will be blessed by his talent .... i'm excited!!!
-
he's 6'3 and still growing ..... i'm his dad and will tell you that he truly had 37 offers with high majors still calling even though he chose MU. he didnt just grab the opportunity because he felt it was a one time deal, but because he trusted GOD for his path and was strongly recruited by buzz and brad and who flew out to our home 3 times this month alone and showed him great love from a great program!!! .... just recd 13 calls yesterday from BCS schools that want him to not sign with MU in NOV so that they can get on board. JohnJohn is EXCITED to be a part of the MU family and so are we!!! .... long way from home ..... lots and lots of hard work .... and is excited to get even better!!! .... i truly believe MU is and will be blessed by his talent .... i'm excited!!!
Welcome to the MU family.
-
also ..... buzz and the MU staff have watched several games from this past year including the state playoffs where his high school team knocked off the number one team in the state. johnjohn knows it wont be a cake walk at MU and that there are no gimmees
-
If Jabari Parker lived in Clovis, NM scouts and coaches would do everything short of buying a second home in New Mexico to evaluate and recruit him.
Recall that Alaska is a hell of a lot more remote than New Mexico, yet Mario Chalmers and Carlos Boozer got plenty of attention from the big boys.
We can hope that Buzz is correct in guessing that there is a lot of upside potential in Dawson--but its simply not reasonable to think that the only reason why Kansas, UNC, Duke, etc. missed on him was becuase they couldn't find their way to New Mexico.
Was it that "Kansas, UNC, Duke, etc." couldn't find their way to New Mexico or that they didn't need to find their way to New Mexico because they filled their needs from the normal sources. Nobody's claiming the kid is a top 20 guy who every big name school would go for no matter where he was from. That's why you bringing up Jabari Parker is not a valid comparison.
-
he's 6'3 and still growing ..... i'm his dad and will tell you that he truly had 37 offers with high majors still calling even though he chose MU. he didnt just grab the opportunity because he felt it was a one time deal, but because he trusted GOD for his path and was strongly recruited by buzz and brad and who flew out to our home 3 times this month alone and showed him great love from a great program!!! .... just recd 13 calls yesterday from BCS schools that want him to not sign with MU in NOV so that they can get on board. JohnJohn is EXCITED to be a part of the MU family and so are we!!! .... long way from home ..... lots and lots of hard work .... and is excited to get even better!!! .... i truly believe MU is and will be blessed by his talent .... i'm excited!!!
Good to hear! I am looking forward to watching him.
-
REMOVED (Just in case)
-
Guys, remember NCAA rules about contact with unsiged recruits and their family. A message to any parent who has a son or daughter playing college sports -- remember there are crazy posters out there. You will alway find dumb comments and some comments that are just over the top. There will be trolls from other schools posing as Marquette fans. Marquette is fortunate to have three active indepdent fan message board sites. The Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel coverage is weak at best for some reason. Maquette's Sports Information Office and the student newspaper do a great job online.
FYI, I saw a video with Rev Dawson giving a message of faith. I enjoyued the message and needed it yesterday.
-
he's 6'3 and still growing ..... i'm his dad and will tell you that he truly had 37 offers with high majors still calling even though he chose MU. he didnt just grab the opportunity because he felt it was a one time deal, but because he trusted GOD for his path and was strongly recruited by buzz and brad and who flew out to our home 3 times this month alone and showed him great love from a great program!!! .... just recd 13 calls yesterday from BCS schools that want him to not sign with MU in NOV so that they can get on board. JohnJohn is EXCITED to be a part of the MU family and so are we!!! .... long way from home ..... lots and lots of hard work .... and is excited to get even better!!! .... i truly believe MU is and will be blessed by his talent .... i'm excited!!!
First off, Congratulations to you as a parent! Not many kids get D-1 offers, and to get some is a great testament to the hard work you and your son have put into him becoming an elite basketball player and person! Secondly, as a fan of MU I'm biased, but can tell you Buzz Williams is as good of coach, developer of talent, and mentor to young men as you could ever hope to find. I have no doubt your son will maximize his talent as a basketball player, and maximize his potential as a person under Buzz.
Lastly, this board and any message board at any school, can at times be critical of players, coaches, etc. - I'd imagine it is hard not to take that personally when a parent has to read such criticisms about their son - but please realize 99.5% of this message board and other boards have never played D-1 baseketball, and are just hardcore fans who sometimes forget the players we criticize are only 18-22 years old...and are doing their best. We LOVE our basketball team at MU, and are very passionate about it - sometimes that can result in criticism - but most of the time in praise and love.
Welcome to the MU family and we look forward to seeing your son in a Marquette uniform!
-
But he has offered players sight unseen, and based on very little examination (see: Roseboro, Bret).
None of us know anything about Dawson, nor do we know what Buzz knows/doesn't know about him. We'll just have to see how it plays out.
Who has a bigger network of coaching buddies that he stays in frequent contact with then Buzz? It's always very risky to bet against what Buzz knows.
-
Yeah, I have. I would definitely take Sante Fe over Milwaukee in a heartbeat.
Are you 18?
-
Was it that "Kansas, UNC, Duke, etc." couldn't find their way to New Mexico or that they didn't need to find their way to New Mexico because they filled their needs from the normal sources. Nobody's claiming the kid is a top 20 guy who every big name school would go for no matter where he was from. That's why you bringing up Jabari Parker is not a valid comparison.
I think his point - and it's a fair one - is that if a player is good enough, he's not going to fall through the cracks or slip "under the radar." There's way too many opportunities for kids today to be seen for that.
If Dawson, as his father reports, had 37 D-I scholarship offers, that kind of proves the point. He comes from a middle of nowhere town in a largely ignored state (no offense, New Mexico), and yet 37 programs were able to find, scout and evaluate him well enough they they offered a scholarship.
And I doubt Coach K and Bill Self - who've gone as far as Alaska to recruit kids - are going to ignore anyone from anywhere if they think the kid can help them win games.
-
I saw a report that he has grown to 6'8 since his commitment.
So, he's still shorter than Magic Johnson?
-
Jimmy Butler fell through the cracks. He was a qualifier out of high school but had no D-1 offers. Mississippi State came closest to offering.
Basketball became his life, and Butler showed a lot of promise. The summer before his senior year in high school, he was attracting attention as a potential star in Tomball -- but not from the usual suspects. Division I coaches had yet to make contact, but a ninth-grader named Jordan Leslie was scouting him.
Courtesy Michelle Lambert
Soon after Jordan Leslie (left) challenged him to an impromptu 3-point contest, Jimmy Butler became a part of his family.
Leslie was from Tomball, too, and was following Butler closely. At the end of a summer league game he approached Butler and challenged him to a 3-point-shooting contest. Butler was taken aback by the brashness of the kid. He agreed to the contest. Leslie was an athlete too, an up-and-coming hoops and football star.
After the game, the two became fast friends. Leslie began inviting Butler to his house to play video games and to stay the night. Butler's life would never be the same.
Leslie's mother, Michelle Lambert, paused at first. She had four kids of her own from her first husband, who had died. Her new husband had brought three children of his own with him. Money was tight. The word around Tomball was that Jimmy was trouble. Her new husband finally told the kids that Jimmy could stay, but only for one or two nights at a time. But each night when Butler would come to stay, a different kid would say, "Tonight's my night to have Jimmy stay." After a few months, the Lamberts gave in, and Michelle told him he could stay for good.
Butler needed a family, and Lambert was offering hers.
But not before she set some ground rules. For the first time in his life he'd have a curfew. He had to attend class and improve his academic performance. He'd have chores around the house. Most importantly, Michelle told him, he had to be a role model.
"I told him my kids looked up to him," Lambert said. "He had to stay out of trouble. Work hard in school. He had to set an example. And you know what? Jimmy did it. Anything I asked him to do, he did it without asking questions."
"They accepted me into their family," Butler said. "And it wasn't because of basketball. She was just very loving. She just did stuff like that. I couldn't believe it."
With some family support for the first time, Butler became a star for the Tomball High School Cougars. As a team captain his senior season, he averaged 19.9 points and 8.7 rebounds per game and was named to the all-district first team.
But it wasn't enough to draw the attention from colleges he had hoped. Scouting services didn't rank him. He didn't play AAU ball, which hurt his chances of being seen. He had an outside shot at playing at Mississippi State, but didn't get a scholarship offer. With nowhere to go again, Butler took the only route he could and enrolled at nearby Tyler Junior College.
-
Jimmy Butler fell through the cracks. He was a qualifier out of high school but had no D-1 offers. Mississippi State came closest to offering.
Jimmy didn't play AAU ball.
-
I think his point - and it's a fair one - is that if a player is good enough, he's not going to fall through the cracks or slip "under the radar." There's way too many opportunities for kids today to be seen for that.
If Dawson, as his father reports, had 37 D-I scholarship offers, that kind of proves the point. He comes from a middle of nowhere town in a largely ignored state (no offense, New Mexico), and yet 37 programs were able to find, scout and evaluate him well enough they they offered a scholarship.
And I doubt Coach K and Bill Self - who've gone as far as Alaska to recruit kids - are going to ignore anyone from anywhere if they think the kid can help them win games.
I think what John Dawson's recruitment shows is that all schools have a list of recruits that they prioritize, and that Dawson wasn't unknown, but he wasn't a top priority for any high major school. Although, its clear that many mid-majors (like Creighton) where there from the start. In MU's case, Buzz was looking to Kendrick Nunn, Kameron Williams, and then when they didn't work out, EC Matthews. All of whom MU missed on. It's not that a Coach K or a Bill Self didn't think that John Dawson wouldn't help them win games, its that they thought they were in on someone else (with a higher ranking) that was even more likely to help them do so. Boozer and Chambers were from Alaska, but they were also high on the recruiting services top 100 lists, so they were a higher priority. If John Dawson was so well known to all the high major programs, why did 13 call him after he committed to MU to ask him to hold off on signing in November, so they could have a chance to consider offering him?
Rankings and high major interest in a player do tend to track each other, less because schools follow rankings, as much as scouting services have a talent for discovering who the high major schools are showing the most interest in. The important thing in a case like John Dawson's is that projecting what a player will do in Division I is still much more an art than a science, and Dawson has as much chance as anyone outside the top 40 or so ranked guys to have an impact as anyone else who is getting the type of attention that he is now getting. I'm not even stating that Dawson can't have a impact as big as a top 40 player, I'm only saying that a top 40 guy would be more likely to have that kind of impact.
I guess what I'm really trying to say, is there is a lot of grey area between being known to everyone, and falling through the cracks. While Dawson clearly didn't fall through the cracks, I believe that he may have suffered from some degree of lack of exposure due to his being from Clovis, New Mexico, and I'm not sure that he might not end of being better than all of the guys that MU missed on.
-
On a side note, just looked up Jordan Leslie, Jimmy's basketball challenger and adoptive brother. He's now a sophomore wide receiver for UTEP and their second leading receiver so far this season with 19 catches for 287 yards and 2 TDs.
http://www.utepathletics.com/sports/m-footbl/utep-m-footbl-body.html
-
I've never seen a board that eats its own like this one does.....
:o
-
Otto Porter didn't play AAU ball either and he was still a top 100 guy..
The point is it's still possible for guys like Crowder and Butler to fall through the cracks. Obviously if you play AAU ball it's easier to get noticed but mistakes still do happen.
-
Otto Porter didn't play AAU ball either and he was still a top 100 guy..
Not until late in the process though. He was a relatively unknown throughout most of his HS career.
-
Are you 18?
And that would matter, why?
-
Who has a bigger network of coaching buddies that he stays in frequent contact with then Buzz? It's always very risky to bet against what Buzz knows.
Please re-read the sentence. I'm not suggesting Buzz has a lack of knowledge of Dawson. I'm suggesting none of us know what Buzz knows. So all of the talk in this thread about what Buzz sees in the kid - i.e. that he'll eventually be a "presence off the bench" or that Buzz likes his offensive skill set - is mere speculation.
-
Otto Porter didn't play AAU ball either and he was still a top 100 guy..
The point is it's still possible for guys like Crowder and Butler to fall through the cracks. Obviously if you play AAU ball it's easier to get noticed but mistakes still do happen.
Crowder didn't fall through the cracks.
He simply wasn't that good of a high school player. Don't confuse being a late bloomer with being overlooked.
-
Mr. Dawson, if you are who you say you are, welcome to the MU family. Please understand that this, like many other message boards, has a give and take that may seem hurtful at times. But for the most part, we are happy to have your son at MU and look forward to watching him grow.
-
Please re-read the sentence. I'm not suggesting Buzz has a lack of knowledge of Dawson. I'm suggesting none of us know what Buzz knows. So all of the talk in this thread about what Buzz sees in the kid - i.e. that he'll eventually be a "presence off the bench" or that Buzz likes his offensive skill set - is mere speculation.
Awkward phrasing on my part, I was trying to reinforce what you said, as in "and Buzz obviously knows a lot."
-
Welcome to the Marquette family, JohnJohn!
I look forward to the effort, growth, and energy you will bring to ths program! :D
-
Great to Have John on board!! I love the fact the he understand how much hard work is ahead of him.
-
Ratings only tell you so much, and their accuracy is not always spot-on. I think even Al was on record as saying he didn't want ALL his recruits to be stars - he recognized that complementary players were an asset.
And just because this kid doesn't have a 4 or 5 star rating doesn't mean he can't be a star. From what I've read, I think it's more important that he seems to have a good head on his shoulders and has solid values and a supportive family. I'd rather have a talented kid with the right attitude than a somewhat more talented kid with a bad attitude. John sounds like he's not afraid of hard work or a challenge. I hope he gets to MU, works his butt off and has a great career - then some of the posts in this thread will make for entertaining reading in a few years.
-
Maybe, maybe not. Wade was one of the best players in college his entire career and developed into one of the best players in the world. He got missed by the big boys in Chicago. Some guys get missed, no matter their talent or location. Is Dawson one of those? No clue. But I do think Buzz has a better shot at spotting those types than anyone on this board.
Wade was a stud and everyone knew it. He was also a partial qualifier and the "big boys" in the big conferences couldn't bring in partial qualifiers. Had he had his grades in order all of the "big boys" (OK, most instead of all) would have been in on him.
Just sayin...
-
I meant to say that I second this in every way.
Welcome to your son. He sounds like a fine young man.
Bob
First off, Congratulations to you as a parent! Not many kids get D-1 offers, and to get some is a great testament to the hard work you and your son have put into him becoming an elite basketball player and person! Secondly, as a fan of MU I'm biased, but can tell you Buzz Williams is as good of coach, developer of talent, and mentor to young men as you could ever hope to find. I have no doubt your son will maximize his talent as a basketball player, and maximize his potential as a person under Buzz.
Lastly, this board and any message board at any school, can at times be critical of players, coaches, etc. - I'd imagine it is hard not to take that personally when a parent has to read such criticisms about their son - but please realize 99.5% of this message board and other boards have never played D-1 baseketball, and are just hardcore fans who sometimes forget the players we criticize are only 18-22 years old...and are doing their best. We LOVE our basketball team at MU, and are very passionate about it - sometimes that can result in criticism - but most of the time in praise and love.
Welcome to the MU family and we look forward to seeing your son in a Marquette uniform!
-
Wade was a stud and everyone knew it. He was also a partial qualifier and the "big boys" in the big conferences couldn't bring in partial qualifiers. Had he had his grades in order all of the "big boys" (OK, most instead of all) would have been in on him.
Just sayin...
Perhaps... What's your definition of "big boys?" If your talking UNC, Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, etc., I doubt it. If your thinking of Illinois, Purdue, etc, maybe.
Yes, teams were scare off of Wade due to his partial qualifier status, but he was also very much a late-bloomer. In his final AAU season, he was his team's 6th man. There's a reason why he didn't make most top 100 list.
It really wasn't until his senior season, that things started to click. He had a monster season at Richards and that when his notoriety really began to soar. If his grades were in order, he would have been a hot spring signing commodity, but I doubt that would have translated into a scholarship offer from a traditional power.
-
he's 6'3 and still growing ..... i'm his dad and will tell you that he truly had 37 offers with high majors still calling even though he chose MU. he didnt just grab the opportunity because he felt it was a one time deal, but because he trusted GOD for his path and was strongly recruited by buzz and brad and who flew out to our home 3 times this month alone and showed him great love from a great program!!! .... just recd 13 calls yesterday from BCS schools that want him to not sign with MU in NOV so that they can get on board. JohnJohn is EXCITED to be a part of the MU family and so are we!!! .... long way from home ..... lots and lots of hard work .... and is excited to get even better!!! .... i truly believe MU is and will be blessed by his talent .... i'm excited!!!
Let your son lace them up with the others and do his thing. See how he does against Big East level talent, has access to the best basketball facilities and wish him all the best. Welcome....
-
Hopefully Dawson will have a successful career at MU. Nunn, by waiting to long, didn't want to be at MU. Turned into a prima-donna.. Sounds like Dawson wants to be here. Which means, he will give us the best he has. Now lets get Joe Embiid, if Buzz is still going for him.
Sounds like it's Illinois, DePaul and MU.
-
Dawson was described as a pass first guard, who can shoot and is athletic. If so should be great in open court.
-
he's 6'3 and still growing ..... I'm his dad and will tell you that he truly had 37 offers with high majors still calling even though he chose MU. he didn't just grab the opportunity because he felt it was a one time deal, but because he trusted GOD for his path and was strongly recruited by buzz and brad and who flew out to our home 3 times this month alone and showed him great love from a great program!!! .... just recd 13 calls yesterday from BCS schools that want him to not sign with MU in NOV so that they can get on board. JohnJohn is EXCITED to be a part of the MU family and so are we!!! .... long way from home ..... lots and lots of hard work .... and is excited to get even better!!! .... i truly believe MU is and will be blessed by his talent .... i'm excited!!!
Sir, glad your son is now part of the MU family. Get excited for great basketball and a great education experience for your son.
-
WoW!
What a thrill to hear of a family so excited to become part of the MU family
Welcome to a great tradition
-
he's 6'3 and still growing ..... i'm his dad and will tell you that he truly had 37 offers with high majors still calling even though he chose MU.
First, congratulations. I'm happy to see John added to the MU family, and am glad at your excitement. Second, and I intend no disrespect (and am actually hoping to save you and yours future disrespect) I really feel it would be better for you and your family to avoid posting on this site. As valuable as the insider info you can offer may be to us, when recruits and their families post here, it never ends well. While many will welcome you with open arms today, I can't promise the same warm reception when things aren't going as well.
For the most part, I think MU is a warm, caring community that will be a great environment to help your son go from being a boy to a man. But this website is full of the most diehard fans, the people that live and die with every basket, and unfortunately that level of fanaticism can lead to some unnecessary and hurtful vitriol at times. That isn't any good for your son or the rest of your family.
Again, warmest welcome to Marquette, but be careful with these types of sites. They aren't always as happy as they initially appear.
-
My first instinct is to always "trust Buzz." Dawson's dad comments (assuming it is indeed him) makes me feel a lot better about this signing. The insight he gave suggests he is a much more highly thought of recruit that the (often inaccurate) rating services. Congrats to Buzz/Brad and the Dawsons.
And let me second Brew's comment. In the long run you would be best serve to leave this board to the anonymous fanatics that traffic it. Some of the comments here can be cruel and hurtful for those directly involved, especially as Brew suggests, when things do not go as planned. And that happens to everyone at times.
Hopefully you will be able to measure the comments here appropriately and not let it change your opinion of the program, Buzz, Brad or the larger MU community.
Welcome
-
Yeah, I have. I would definitely take Sante Fe over Milwaukee in a heartbeat.
Are you 18?
And that would matter, why?
When I was 18 bright lights, big city was were it was at, now I'd definitely go for beautiful New Mexico scenery, too. John Dawson is closer to 18.
-
When I was 18 bright lights, big city was were its at, now I'd definitely go for beautiful New Mexico scenery, too. John Dawson is closer to 18.
If you want bright lights, big city, you ain't coming to Milwaukee. Look, I think Milwaukee is a great little town, but it comes up a wee bit short in the glamour department. New York...Los Angeles...Miami...Chicago...Milwaukee?
-
If you want bright lights, big city, you ain't coming to Milwaukee. Look, I think Milwaukee is a great little town, but it comes up a wee bit short in the glamour department. New York...Los Angeles...Miami...Chicago...Milwaukee?
Marie Claire begs to differ.
-
If you want bright lights, big city, you ain't coming to Milwaukee. Look, I think Milwaukee is a great little town, but it comes up a wee bit short in the glamour department. New York...Los Angeles...Miami...Chicago...Milwaukee?
London
Paris
MILWAUKEE!
-
If you want bright lights, big city, you ain't coming to Milwaukee. Look, I think Milwaukee is a great little town, but it comes up a wee bit short in the glamour department. New York...Los Angeles...Miami...Chicago...Milwaukee?
You have to put it in perspective. When you're from a town of 40K with the nearest interstate hours away, a metropolitan population of over 1M with Chicago, Madison, an Green Bay all within 2 hours, that's a pretty big city. And the lights at a top-25 school in the Big East certainly shine a lot brighter than they do in Clovis.
It's not NYC, LA, or Chicago, but it's a lot closer to those than where he's from.
-
If you want bright lights, big city, you ain't coming to Milwaukee. Look, I think Milwaukee is a great little town, but it comes up a wee bit short in the glamour department. New York...Los Angeles...Miami...Chicago...Milwaukee?
Bears fan?
-
London
Paris
MILWAUKEE!
Pittsburgh
Syracuse
Morgantown
Providence
Storrs
South Bend
Edited the order for you
-
If you want bright lights, big city, you ain't coming to Milwaukee. Look, I think Milwaukee is a great little town, but it comes up a wee bit short in the glamour department. New York...Los Angeles...Miami...Chicago...Milwaukee?
All depends on where you are from, my man.
If you are from NYC, Milwaukee looks like a farm.
If you are from a farm, Milwaukee looks like NYC.
Perspective.
-
All depends on where you are from, my man.
If you are from NYC, you're likely an ahole.
If you are from a farm, Milwaukee looks like NYC.
Perspective.
Fixed.
-
he's 6'3 and still growing ..... i'm his dad and will tell you that he truly had 37 offers with high majors still calling even though he chose MU. he didnt just grab the opportunity because he felt it was a one time deal, but because he trusted GOD for his path and was strongly recruited by buzz and brad and who flew out to our home 3 times this month alone and showed him great love from a great program!!! .... just recd 13 calls yesterday from BCS schools that want him to not sign with MU in NOV so that they can get on board. JohnJohn is EXCITED to be a part of the MU family and so are we!!! .... long way from home ..... lots and lots of hard work .... and is excited to get even better!!! .... i truly believe MU is and will be blessed by his talent .... i'm excited!!!
MU was a long way from home for me too! Although Clovis is probably further. He'll love it, be on a national championship team in 2014 and get a great education.
What more can you ask for?????
Tell him to bring his long underwear and a good pair of waterproof boots! You'll need it in January and February!