MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: Not A Serious Person on August 17, 2021, 02:18:49 PM
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Winners and losers of men's college basketball's 2021-22 transfer season
Jeff Borzello
ESPN Staff Writer
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/insider/story/_/id/32033382/winners-losers-men-college-basketball-2021-22-transfer-season
Under losers
Marquette Golden Eagles:
I really like the additions of Maryland transfer Darryl Morsell, the Big Ten Defensive Player of the Year, and George Mason transfer Tyler Kolek, a promising scorer -- but Shaka Smart lost all five starters from last season, including four to the portal. Koby McEwen (Weber State), Theo John (Duke) and Jamal Cain (Oakland) left early in the offseason, but it was the departure of Dawson Garcia to North Carolina in July that was crushing.
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The only thing that is certain is change.
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This kind of turnover is to be expected in the current environment.
Imagine if Garcia and Carton both left and Wojo did not have replacements in the pipeline.
This next season is going to be an adventure.
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Winners and losers of men's college basketball's 2021-22 transfer season
Jeff Borzello
ESPN Staff Writer
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/insider/story/_/id/32033382/winners-losers-men-college-basketball-2021-22-transfer-season
Under losers
Marquette Golden Eagles:
I really like the additions of Maryland transfer Darryl Morsell, the Big Ten Defensive Player of the Year, and George Mason transfer Tyler Kolek, a promising scorer -- but Shaka Smart lost all five starters from last season, including four to the portal. Koby McEwen (Weber State), Theo John (Duke) and Jamal Cain (Oakland) left early in the offseason, but it was the departure of Dawson Garcia to North Carolina in July that was crushing.
How due wee no Shaka didant encourage sum of deez dudes ta seek greener pastures elsewear, hey?
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Makes you wonder how much attention Borzello paid to us last year
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I prefer the totality of our New Roster ,and New Coach, over our old Roster and Old Coach.
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The only thing that is certain is change.
By the way, here is the number 1 winner. He too blew out all the starters but reloaded.
Texas Longhorns:
The clear victor from the transfer window, Chris Beard is bringing in six of the top 30 transfers in ESPN's transfer rankings -- including three of the top five. Minnesota's Marcus Carr was arguably the best transfer all spring, while Timmy Allen was a first-team All-Pac-12 selection at Utah and Tre Mitchell was one of the more dominant big men nationally at UMass. Christian Bishop (Creighton) and Dylan Disu (Vanderbilt) were productive high-major players and Devin Askew (Kentucky) was a five-star recruit just 12 months ago.
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Seems like there's really no (or very little) context or analysis by Borzello here. Dawson is a big loss and arguing otherwise is silly. But I'll make the trade of OMax, Ellis, and Joplin (or Itejere) for Cain, John and McEwen all day, every day when you're looking at what's best for the program long-term.
He also didn't mention Kuath.
Edit: Although, are the freshman who were released from their LOIs not officially considered transfers?
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Lifetime as a head coach, Shaka's teams over a dozen seasons ranked, on average, 35th in KPom Adj. D. If you exclude his first two years as a new head coach at VCU, the average defensive rank is 25.
T-Rank has MU D at 84th via their prognostication tool. I am betting that Shaka and "his guys" will beat that projection by quite a bit. Call me crazy.
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Aside from Garcia, most Scoopers had zero problem with the others transferring. Some said that if Theo or Cain wanted to return, one or both might be useful in a transition year -- just as Elliott will be -- but few mourned their departures.
When Marquette hired Shaka, the assumption by many here was that he'd be able to rebuild extremely quickly because he'd be a pied piper to high-level recruits, and perhaps would even be able to keep Garcia and DJ. And thanks to all that, we'd be rolling right out of the gate.
Instead, it's Shaka's replacement at Texas who has scored big this offseason.
The main defense of Shaka seems to be that we're better off with him than we would have been had Wojo be retained. Well, yeah! That would have been true of pretty much every serious candidate for the job.
Wojo is ancient history and doesn't matter one iota now. The question is if Shaka will be better than his current coaching peers, especially those in the Big East. I am optimistic, and I'll be rooting like hell for it ... but obviously none of us can know yet if he will be.
We Are Marquette!
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While I can't argue we were on the short end on transfers, I'm all on on Shaka's rebuild. I'm excited to see where he takes us. MU Rah Rah!
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DJ Carton has been erased even quicker then most suspected.
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It all depends on W & Ls. All will be wonderful in Blue & Gold land with many Ws and few Ls.
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Somehow we think it is a given we would keep Garcia and lead the transfer pool.
The reality is that what happened with us in the summer is normal. While I was disappointed we did not keep Garcia, I cannot say I am surprised he or DJ left. I was a bit surprised Theo went to Duke but maybe they see something in him we didn't! Just hope he can keep his mind on the game and not on social protesting.
Actually, all things considered, to keep who we did and to get strong transfers, which we did, was impressive. If Shaka can do well next year, I'm not worried.
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Just hope he can keep his mind on the game and not on social protesting.
Are you suggesting that Theo's on court performance was effected by his participating in peaceful protests?
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Are you suggesting that Theo's on court performance was effected by his participating in peaceful protests?
He needs to shut up and dribble in Durham, aina?
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Just hope he can keep his mind on the game and not on social protesting.
Just hope he can keep his body in one piece. His knees looked about done by the end of last season.
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After a 50 burger in a title clinching game, plus two other 40+ point games in NBA Finals games, imagine what Giannis could do if he wasn't so worried about protesting with the BLM movement.
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I prefer the totality of our New Roster ,and New Coach, over our old Roster and Old Coach.
It may take 10-12 games or so of watching what the new guys bring to the table in terms of skills and talent, but I'm pretty sure I will be agreeing with you wholeheartedly.
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DJ Carton has been erased even quicker then most suspected.
I'm not sure I understand what you're saying here.
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Somehow we think it is a given we would keep Garcia and lead the transfer pool.
The reality is that what happened with us in the summer is normal. While I was disappointed we did not keep Garcia, I cannot say I am surprised he or DJ left. I was a bit surprised Theo went to Duke but maybe they see something in him we didn't! Just hope he can keep his mind on the game and not on social protesting.
Actually, all things considered, to keep who we did and to get strong transfers, which we did, was impressive. If Shaka can do well next year, I'm not worried.
proudly displaying your oldness and whiteness I see. Jesus.
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Somehow we think it is a given we would keep Garcia and lead the transfer pool.
The reality is that what happened with us in the summer is normal. While I was disappointed we did not keep Garcia, I cannot say I am surprised he or DJ left. I was a bit surprised Theo went to Duke but maybe they see something in him we didn't! Just hope he can keep his mind on the game and not on social protesting.
Actually, all things considered, to keep who we did and to get strong transfers, which we did, was impressive. If Shaka can do well next year, I'm not worried.
Was this your mindset on Ali and Kareem?
What about Jay Cutler, Cole Beasley and Jon Feliciano?
Just curious
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Wojo indicated during the season that the seniors would not be returning. Their transfers are not on Shaka.
Losing Garcia and Aidoo really hurts. I do not blame Shaka for either of those losses. players do not have to play for a new coach.
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Are you suggesting that Theo's on court performance was effected by his participating in peaceful protests?
I'd say it was in the UConn game - the whole team was affected.
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“They do my thing when they're playing and they can do their thing when they're not. I may not agree with Goose on Vietnam or with everything the blacks say on campus, but at least it's occurred to me that they could be right and I could be wrong.”
Imagine if those who worship at the alter of Al, actually thought like he did.
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Lens
I do not care one bit what the guys do, stand for or how they behave off the court (within reason). I care about winning basketball games and the other stuff is really not my business. That said, a little more winning always helps win over fans. My Dad was 100% against Goose's stance on Vietnam, yet he liked him as a person and loved him as player. I might not agree with every guys off court decisions, but I am more interested in seeing top notch, winning basketball. So, this Al guy follows, and lives, the words of Al.
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Lens
I do not care one bit what the guys do, stand for or how they behave off the court (within reason). I care about winning basketball games and the other stuff is really not my business. That said, a little more winning always helps win over fans. My Dad was 100% against Goose's stance on Vietnam, yet he liked him as a person and loved him as player. I might not agree with every guys decisions off court decisions, but I am more interested in seeing top notch, winning basketball. So, this Al guy follows, and lives, the words of Al.
Amen. I bet your Dad probably listened to different music than Goose too. No reason we have to walk hand in hand with athlete's we cheer for. I'm just always amazed that fans who can post 1000s of opinions on a message board get upset when players voice their own opinions on their social media, etc.
IMO...Theo wants to wear all black, fine. Theo goes for crazy blocks vs. sure box outs...now that's an issue.
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Lens
I do not care one bit what the guys do, stand for or how they behave off the court (within reason). I care about winning basketball games and the other stuff is really not my business. That said, a little more winning always helps win over fans. My Dad was 100% against Goose's stance on Vietnam, yet he liked him as a person and loved him as player. I might not agree with every guys off court decisions, but I am more interested in seeing top notch, winning basketball. So, this Al guy follows, and lives, the words of Al.
Wouldn't following it be more "I'm not in agreement with their take but I could be wrong" than just leaving it at "i don't agree with their take"?
Seems the former is more what Al meant the later is what the world and scoop (not particularly you) are doing.
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I'd say it was in the UConn game - the whole team was affected.
Proof of that?
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In: Shaka
Out: Wojo
Big win
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proudly displaying your oldness and whiteness I see. Jesus.
Seems you have issues with oddness and whiteness. Glad you have such an open mind.
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I'm thinking we all might be pleasantly surprised with this team and coaching staff. Hopefully we'll see improvement throughout the year. Better at New Years Day than early November. Then better in March than January.... Improvement as they all learn to play together. Basketball is still a team game and we might wind up with a better TEAM than we've had in a while.
Tournament teams aren't selected on Nov. 15........
Hopeful and watching...
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Seems you have issues with oddness and whiteness. Glad you have such an open mind.
Nothing wrong with being odd, in fact, I think it's a requirement to post on the board.
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proudly displaying your oldness and whiteness I see. Jesus.
Brother ATL:
If being mature and having the experience of both a strong education and considerable real world experience is a crime, I plead guilty.
I firmly believe the UConn game was lost before tip-off. Our guys' heads were on the Kenosha County DA's decision. They weren't in the game and they weren't prepared to play. That's being neither old or white. It's being observative. We blew a 43-25 lead in the second half and lost by 11. Maturity in a profession means you recognize there is a time and place for everything, including protesting.
Maybe the coaching was poor and didn't refocus the players. Maybe the players didn't want to be coached. Heck, I don't know what went on in the locker room, but the proof is in the result and the result stunk. The public pronouncements that night spoke for themselves.
I will say what I have said many times before in this forum and elsewhere. Athletes have a right as American Citizens protected by the Constitution of the United States of America to peacefully protest and express their views about the issues of the day. If they do it, as Theo did, in the immediate aftermath of the George Floyd murder in a public place on their own time, God love 'em, go for it. Ditto for Jay Cutler, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar etc. If their fame brings their issues to the forefront and it's done outside the confines of their job, OK, that's fine.
What you do not have Constitutional protection on is using your employer's business and good name to advocate your position. You run the risk of diminishing your employer's goodwill and, ultimately cash flow. Most employers do not permit officers and managers to use the company's name, facilities or trademarks for political or even many charitable causes. It requires careful vetting. Unless, it seems, you are an athlete. When an athlete does otherwise, be it a basketball player, football player or whatever, you run the risk of alienating people and losing support.
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I firmly believe the UConn game was lost before tip-off. Our guys' heads were on the Kenosha County DA's decision. They weren't in the game and they weren't prepared to play. That's being neither old or white. It's being observative.
The game was lost before tip-off and we weren't prepared to play? We were winning by 18 in the second half (which you acknowledge). Did the Kenosha County DA's decision not impact them until the they were 25 minutes into the game?
Maturity in a profession means you recognize there is a time and place for everything, including protesting.
Maybe the coaching was poor and didn't refocus the players. Maybe the players didn't want to be coached. Heck, I don't know what went on in the locker room, but the proof is in the result and the result stunk. The public pronouncements that night spoke for themselves.
I will say what I have said many times before in this forum and elsewhere. Athletes have a right as American Citizens protected by the Constitution of the United States of America to peacefully protest and express their views about the issues of the day. If they do it, as Theo did, in the immediate aftermath of the George Floyd murder in a public place on their own time, God love 'em, go for it. Ditto for Jay Cutler, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar etc. If their fame brings their issues to the forefront and it's done outside the confines of their job, OK, that's fine.
What you do not have Constitutional protection on is using your employer's business and good name to advocate your position. You run the risk of diminishing your employer's goodwill and, ultimately cash flow. Most employers do not permit officers and managers to use the company's name, facilities or trademarks for political or even many charitable causes. It requires careful vetting. Unless, it seems, you are an athlete. When an athlete does otherwise, be it a basketball player, football player or whatever, you run the risk of alienating people and losing support.
The constitution also protects a company's right to protest whenever they hell they want. The UConn game protest was sanctioned by Marquette. These weren't players going rogue, this was a company choosing to honor its Jesuit mission but making a public stand against what they perceived to be an injustice.
Your argument is only valid if Marquette didn't want the players to protest. They supported it 100%.
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Guess it depends. How do you define “lose” or “lost?”
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Tyler Polley probably pro-LEO too.
Adding to the Giannis point, JTA probably had his best NBA season last year.
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Brother ATL:
If being mature and having the experience of both a strong education and considerable real world experience is a crime, I plead guilty.
I firmly believe the UConn game was lost before tip-off. Our guys' heads were on the Kenosha County DA's decision. They weren't in the game and they weren't prepared to play. That's being neither old or white. It's being observative. We blew a 43-25 lead in the second half and lost by 11. Maturity in a profession means you recognize there is a time and place for everything, including protesting.
Maybe the coaching was poor and didn't refocus the players. Maybe the players didn't want to be coached. Heck, I don't know what went on in the locker room, but the proof is in the result and the result stunk. The public pronouncements that night spoke for themselves.
I will say what I have said many times before in this forum and elsewhere. Athletes have a right as American Citizens protected by the Constitution of the United States of America to peacefully protest and express their views about the issues of the day. If they do it, as Theo did, in the immediate aftermath of the George Floyd murder in a public place on their own time, God love 'em, go for it. Ditto for Jay Cutler, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar etc. If their fame brings their issues to the forefront and it's done outside the confines of their job, OK, that's fine.
What you do not have Constitutional protection on is using your employer's business and good name to advocate your position. You run the risk of diminishing your employer's goodwill and, ultimately cash flow. Most employers do not permit officers and managers to use the company's name, facilities or trademarks for political or even many charitable causes. It requires careful vetting. Unless, it seems, you are an athlete. When an athlete does otherwise, be it a basketball player, football player or whatever, you run the risk of alienating people and losing support.
(https://i.redd.it/c4999vhunvn31.jpg)
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Brother ATL:
If being mature and having the experience of both a strong education and considerable real world experience is a crime, I plead guilty.
I firmly believe the UConn game was lost before tip-off. Our guys' heads were on the Kenosha County DA's decision. They weren't in the game and they weren't prepared to play. That's being neither old or white. It's being observative. We blew a 43-25 lead in the second half and lost by 11. Maturity in a profession means you recognize there is a time and place for everything, including protesting.
Maybe the coaching was poor and didn't refocus the players. Maybe the players didn't want to be coached. Heck, I don't know what went on in the locker room, but the proof is in the result and the result stunk. The public pronouncements that night spoke for themselves.
I will say what I have said many times before in this forum and elsewhere. Athletes have a right as American Citizens protected by the Constitution of the United States of America to peacefully protest and express their views about the issues of the day. If they do it, as Theo did, in the immediate aftermath of the George Floyd murder in a public place on their own time, God love 'em, go for it. Ditto for Jay Cutler, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar etc. If their fame brings their issues to the forefront and it's done outside the confines of their job, OK, that's fine.
What you do not have Constitutional protection on is using your employer's business and good name to advocate your position. You run the risk of diminishing your employer's goodwill and, ultimately cash flow. Most employers do not permit officers and managers to use the company's name, facilities or trademarks for political or even many charitable causes. It requires careful vetting. Unless, it seems, you are an athlete. When an athlete does otherwise, be it a basketball player, football player or whatever, you run the risk of alienating people and losing support.
The first part of this is just completely nonsensical. The game we were winning by nearly 20 points was lost before it started? Ok
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I firmly believe the UConn game was lost before tip-off. Our guys' heads were on the Kenosha County DA's decision. They weren't in the game and they weren't prepared to play. That's being neither old or white. It's being observative. We blew a 43-25 lead
So wait ... you're claiming the game was lost before tip-off ... and our guys' heads were so messed up that they took an 18-point lead in what might have been the best 25 minutes of basketball the team played all season? What?
I don't know what went on in the locker room, but the proof is in the result
Marquette went into the locker room with a 31-23 halftime lead and promptly built it up to 43-25. So yes, it certainly looks like whatever happened in the locker room messed our guys up ... because they only outscored UConn 12-2 after coming out of the locker room.
If this is the case you're presenting for how the protests cost Marquette the game, it's probably the worst case ever laid out.
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The game plan was working beautifully. Wojo wanted to stop their star and it was working. McEwen landed on their stars wrist and took him out of the game when we were up 16. I thought the game was over. Apparently, the players did too. I think we would of won the game, if the star did not get hurt.
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The game plan was working beautifully. Wojo wanted to stop their star and it was working. McEwen landed on their stars wrist and took him out of the game when we were up 16. I thought the game was over. Apparently, the players did too. I think we would of won the game, if the star did not get hurt.
I think this was part of it. The other thing I recall is that one of their bigs got into foul trouble, forcing Hurley to put Tyler Polley in....who promptly set fire to the Fiserv. I think there were two things that should have helped Marquette (UConn's injured star and foul trouble) that inadvertently helped UConn. No excuse for losing that game.
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The game plan was working beautifully. Wojo wanted to stop their star and it was working. McEwen landed on their stars wrist and took him out of the game when we were up 16. I thought the game was over. Apparently, the players did too. I think we would of won the game, if the star did not get hurt.
No way. What happened is that during the first TV timeout of the second half, with us up 18, Theo said: "How 'bout that Kenosha County D.A.'s decision? I know we're playing great, but it's time to stop thinking about basketball entirely and think about that bad decision."
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So wait ... you're claiming the game was lost before tip-off ... and our guys' heads were so messed up that they took an 18-point lead in what might have been the best 25 minutes of basketball the team played all season? What?
Marquette went into the locker room with a 31-23 halftime lead and promptly built it up to 43-25. So yes, it certainly looks like whatever happened in the locker room messed our guys up ... because they only outscored UConn 12-2 after coming out of the locker room.
If this is the case you're presenting for how the protests cost Marquette the game, it's probably the worst case ever laid out.
We should have known something was wrong when we actually came out of halftime strong.
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Bad off seasons?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/32056189/ncaa-penalizes-texas-men-basketball-coach-buzz-williams-violations%3fplatform=amp
Look for Buzz to quit on A&M soon
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Bad off seasons?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/32056189/ncaa-penalizes-texas-men-basketball-coach-buzz-williams-violations%3fplatform=amp
Look for Buzz to quit on A&M soon
Hahaha I can see his interviews now "you know I did an analysis and no school from the SEC is going to make a final four let alone win a championship"
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Bad off seasons?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/32056189/ncaa-penalizes-texas-men-basketball-coach-buzz-williams-violations%3fplatform=amp
Look for Buzz to quit on A&M soon
It's difficult to take over a struggling program and quickly make it an NCAA tourney team. It took Buzz 3 years at VaTech ... and after 2 seasons at TAMU he has nothing to show for it except a .500 record, probation and suspension.
And most (not all but most) of us think Buzz is a pretty darn good coach.
I'm hopeful that Shaka can get it done sooner at Marquette, but I'm also realistic.
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Thanks - we are all now dumber now for have read this.
[ quote author=dgies9156 link=topic=62149.msg1367308#msg1367308 date=1629433984]
Brother ATL:
If being mature and having the experience of both a strong education and considerable real world experience is a crime, I plead guilty.
I firmly believe the UConn game was lost before tip-off. Our guys' heads were on the Kenosha County DA's decision. They weren't in the game and they weren't prepared to play. That's being neither old or white. It's being observative. We blew a 43-25 lead in the second half and lost by 11. Maturity in a profession means you recognize there is a time and place for everything, including protesting.
Maybe the coaching was poor and didn't refocus the players. Maybe the players didn't want to be coached. Heck, I don't know what went on in the locker room, but the proof is in the result and the result stunk. The public pronouncements that night spoke for themselves.
I will say what I have said many times before in this forum and elsewhere. Athletes have a right as American Citizens protected by the Constitution of the United States of America to peacefully protest and express their views about the issues of the day. If they do it, as Theo did, in the immediate aftermath of the George Floyd murder in a public place on their own time, God love 'em, go for it. Ditto for Jay Cutler, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar etc. If their fame brings their issues to the forefront and it's done outside the confines of their job, OK, that's fine.
What you do not have Constitutional protection on is using your employer's business and good name to advocate your position. You run the risk of diminishing your employer's goodwill and, ultimately cash flow. Most employers do not permit officers and managers to use the company's name, facilities or trademarks for political or even many charitable causes. It requires careful vetting. Unless, it seems, you are an athlete. When an athlete does otherwise, be it a basketball player, football player or whatever, you run the risk of alienating people and losing support.
[/quote]