MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: jesmu84 on April 03, 2024, 05:14:24 PM
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https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/chef-jose-andres-says-israel-targeted-his-aid-workers-systematically-car-by-car-2024-04-03/
Jeez
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They triple tapped them too. Pretty blatantly intentional. They won’t change their behavior if they face “stern talking to” from our Gov
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https://x.com/nathanjrobinson/status/1775665579375915176?s=46&t=G2FhP_F2kWewaBOpvRv5lg
israel has killed more aid workers in the gaza strip than have died in all of the countries in the rest of the world combined in any of the last 30 years
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As I predicted, Israel completely overreacted without a coherent plan, and is now stuck in Gaza, losing support daily both internally and externally.
So Iran got what they wanted. Good job Bibi!
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Someone suggested viewing Israel's actions through the lens exclusively of the cadre in power trying to do what it thought most likely to maintain its hold on power. For much of the "war" in Gaza, it seemed to be working. There are increasing calls for elections though, so there's a real possibility that this might be a turning point.
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Someone suggested viewing Israel's actions through the lens exclusively of the cadre in power trying to do what it thought most likely to maintain its hold on power. For much of the "war" in Gaza, it seemed to be working. There are increasing calls for elections though, so there's a real possibility that this might be a turning point.
Yep exactly. They were hands off on Gaza and were getting hammered by the right wingers in their country because of their weak stance. This is a predictable overreaction to their perceived weakness, and I'm not sure it's going to save their jobs.
Selfish play by the current Israel leadership, trading lives for a few more years on the job.
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Yep exactly. They were hands off on Gaza and were getting hammered by the right wingers in their country because of their weak stance. This is a predictable overreaction to their perceived weakness, and I'm not sure it's going to save their jobs.
Selfish play by the current Israel leadership, trading lives for a few more years on the job.
"Hands off"
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6f/Timeline_of_Palestinians_killed_in_the_occupied_Palestinian_territory_and_Israel_in_the_context_of_the_occupation_and_conflict._United_Nations_data.png/350px-Timeline_of_Palestinians_killed_in_the_occupied_Palestinian_territory_and_Israel_in_the_context_of_the_occupation_and_conflict._United_Nations_data.png)
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"Hands off"
They live next to Hamas, a terrorist organization, and the PLO, a terrorist organization and there are like 150-200 deaths per year since 2015. Yes, they have been relatively, historically, hands off with terrorist organizations at their doorsteps. Netanyahu has been weak on Gaza according to the right wing in Israel which should be his base.
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Bibi's response.
"Give me more weapons and give them to me now."
https://www.mediaite.com/politics/netanyahu-demands-u-s-send-weapons-to-israel-more-quickly-give-us-the-tools-faster/
I believe the word is chutzpah.
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They live next to Hamas, a terrorist organization, and the PLO, a terrorist organization and there are like 150-200 deaths per year since 2015. Yes, they have been relatively, historically, hands off with terrorist organizations at their doorsteps. Netanyahu has been weak on Gaza according to the right wing in Israel which should be his base.
Bibi straight up encouraged Hamas and allowed them to be funded. Weak is probably not what I would use. Cynically propped up for years to deflect and distract from personal domestic failings, yes. Either way it’s “if it moves, shoot it” now.
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As more and more aid groups decide to abandon providing aid due to threat of killing by the IDF, it is clear the US government is complicit in genocide/ethnic cleansing.
Disgusting.
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As more and more aid groups decide to abandon providing aid due to threat of killing by the IDF, it is clear the US government is complicit in genocide/ethnic cleansing.
Disgusting.
Truly unfortunate for many of the well meaning and clean organizations that Hamas has its claws in so many other aid groups/the aid pipeline.
Does the IDF have an overly itchy trigger finger when it comes to suspected targets? Yes, absolutely. Did they attack this convoy solely cause "screw Gazans, we're killing anyone who helps them?" Dont be naive.
The sad fact of this whole situation is neither side is going to stop. Hamas isn't going to release the remaining hostages, they aren't going to withdraw from Gaza. Israel isn't going to stop pushing forward until they have eradicated Hamas. Unfortunately for Israel, most people who have any remaining interest in the war have chosen to forget that Hamas is still involved and that its an ongoing conflict. War is horrific. Even more so when its taking place in and around a civilian population.
This is no more disgusting than any number of events that are going on around the world, it just has more media coverage.
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Eh. Our support of Israel as an ally makes this a little different, and Israel is making that increasingly difficult.
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Eh. Our support of Israel as an ally makes this a little different, and Israel is making that increasingly difficult.
Without question. And Israel's relentless aggression and pig headedness from Bibi is making very understandable why they are losing favor and support internationally.
I just object when people make it some cut and dried thing like the US is funding a rebel group in some 3rd world country whose express purpose is to zero out a particular religious group or rival tribe and they can simply choose to no longer support/ally with that country any more.
I'm actually fine with the US not sending any more weapons. I think if this is the direction Israel wants to continue on, they should figure it out themselves. That being said, I'm not gonna agree with people who want to continue framing this as a directionless campaign of meaningless killing as opposed to the actuality of it being a military campaign, albeit a heavy handed one. Context matters.
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Don't disagree at all.
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Without question. And Israel's relentless aggression and pig headedness from Bibi is making very understandable why they are losing favor and support internationally.
I just object when people make it some cut and dried thing like the US is funding a rebel group in some 3rd world country whose express purpose is to zero out a particular religious group or rival tribe and they can simply choose to no longer support/ally with that country any more.
I'm actually fine with the US not sending any more weapons. I think if this is the direction Israel wants to continue on, they should figure it out themselves. That being said, I'm not gonna agree with people who want to continue framing this as a directionless campaign of meaningless killing as opposed to the actuality of it being a military campaign, albeit a heavy handed one. Context matters.
What's the direction of this military campaign of meaningful killing?
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Without question. And Israel's relentless aggression and pig headedness from Bibi is making very understandable why they are losing favor and support internationally.
I just object when people make it some cut and dried thing like the US is funding a rebel group in some 3rd world country whose express purpose is to zero out a particular religious group or rival tribe and they can simply choose to no longer support/ally with that country any more.
I'm actually fine with the US not sending any more weapons. I think if this is the direction Israel wants to continue on, they should figure it out themselves. That being said, I'm not gonna agree with people who want to continue framing this as a directionless campaign of meaningless killing as opposed to the actuality of it being a military campaign, albeit a heavy handed one. Context matters.
Context does matter, I agree. And within that context I would argue the below is pretty cut and dry. Even if we stop sending weapons, we still send quite a bit of money over and the majority of Americans do not want their tax dollars funding civilian slaughter.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/03/israel-gaza-ai-database-hamas-airstrikes
"“You don’t want to waste expensive bombs on unimportant people – it’s very expensive for the country and there’s a shortage [of those bombs],” one intelligence officer said. Another said the principal question they were faced with was whether the “collateral damage” to civilians allowed for an attack.
“Because we usually carried out the attacks with dumb bombs, and that meant literally dropping the whole house on its occupants. But even if an attack is averted, you don’t care – you immediately move on to the next target. Because of the system, the targets never end. You have another 36,000 waiting.”
According to conflict experts, if Israel has been using dumb bombs to flatten the homes of thousands of Palestinians who were linked, with the assistance of AI, to militant groups in Gaza, that could help explain the shockingly high death toll in the war."
"Another intelligence officer said that more recently in the conflict, the rate of permitted collateral damage was brought down again. But at one stage earlier in the war they were authorised to kill up to “20 uninvolved civilians” for a single operative, regardless of their rank, military importance, or age."
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As is the history in that region, everything is very complicated and messy. I don't care if your a Democrat or Republican or other, if you are honest you have to recognize this is a very difficult situation for Biden to navigate. Allies and other beneficial relationships in that part of the world can not be cast aside without serious consideration of long term effects beyond the current leadership over there and domestically.
The vacuum the US creates when it withdraws, both politically and diplomatically, will be filled by some other party(ies) like Russia, China, Iran, etc. (obviously not speaking about Israel specifically)
That said, the demands for a more humanitarian resolution are very valid. The actions of a sovereign first world country should not mirror a terrorist group. I acknowledge, this is easier said than done from someone like me who doesn't have loved ones held hostage or butchered.
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What's the direction of this military campaign of meaningful killing?
To rid Gaza of Hamas completely. Whether that is a realistic or achievable goal is certainly up for debate, but its been the stated goal from the start.
You can be critical or bothered by the methods and/or the ambivalence to collateral damage, but that doesn't change the aim of the campaign. Its intellectually dishonest to ignore that just paint this all as genocidal push to eradicate Palestinians, as many have been doing for months now.
Ive been very disappointed with the optics of Israel's actions (obviously also incredibly saddened by the ever increasing death count regardless of whose numbers are to be believed) because it gives amplification to any number of dumb voices critical of Israel's existence and place in the world and accomplishes exactly what Iran wanted.
At this point they could completely wipe out any and all leadership of Hamas and people would still find a way of invalidating Israel's whole campaign as tyrannical and oppressive and to make Hamas and its cause the sympathetic victims. Ive already seen an uptick in the general "Hamas were freedom fighters" narrative over the last few months. That as much as anything is why Bibi and his cabal need to be gone ASAP.
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To rid Gaza of Hamas completely. Whether that is a realistic or achievable goal is certainly up for debate, but its been the stated goal from the start.
You can be critical or bothered by the methods and/or the ambivalence to collateral damage, but that doesn't change the aim of the campaign. Its intellectually dishonest to ignore that just paint this all as genocidal push to eradicate Palestinians, as many have been doing for months now.
Ive been very disappointed with the optics of Israel's actions (obviously also incredibly saddened by the ever increasing death count regardless of whose numbers are to be believed) because it gives amplification to any number of dumb voices critical of Israel's existence and place in the world and accomplishes exactly what Iran wanted.
At this point they could completely wipe out any and all leadership of Hamas and people would still find a way of invalidating Israel's whole campaign as tyrannical and oppressive and to make Hamas and its cause the sympathetic victims. Ive already seen an uptick in the general "Hamas were freedom fighters" narrative over the last few months. That as much as anything is why Bibi and his cabal need to be gone ASAP.
All well and good, but I didn't ask you the - ahem- stated goal of the campaign. I asked you the direction.
Point being - and I say this admittedly no expert in military tactics - there seems to be little direction or coherent strategy in how Israel has conducted this campaign, nor does there seem to be any clear long-term plan for what happens when it's done.We'll, maybe beyond turning over some prime Mediterranean-front real estate over to Jared for development.
There are some people who would have been opposed to anything Israel did. But the support they're losing now isn't because people are anti-Isreal. It's because the longer this goes on, the more and more it appears Israel's only strategy is collective punishment.
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Just as a reminder, on October 6, a cease fire existed in the Middle East. On October 7, Hamas broke that cease fire by attacking, killing, and kidnapping innocent Israelis while the world sat back and nodded approval with its silence. And now as da BOTUS sees his polling numbers plummet faster than cockroaches scatter in a kitchen when the lights are turned on, he willingly throws the only democracy in the Middle East under the bus simply to garner Arab American votes in key swing states...despicable, aina?
#fromthejordanrivertothemediterreanseaandpalestinewillbefree
#neveragain
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Just as a reminder, on October 6, a cease fire existed in the Middle East. On October 7, Hamas broke that cease fire by attacking, killing, and kidnapping innocent Israelis while the world sat back and nodded approval with its silence. And now as da BOTUS sees his polling numbers plummet faster than cockroaches scatter in a kitchen when the lights are turned on, he willingly throws the only democracy in the Middle East under the bus simply to garner Arab American votes in key swing states...despicable, aina?
#fromthejordanrivertothemediterreanseaandpalestinewillbefree
#neveragain
Oh, we care about protecting democracies now?
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Just as a reminder, on October 6, a cease fire existed in the Middle East. On October 7, Hamas broke that cease fire by attacking, killing, and kidnapping innocent Israelis while the world sat back and nodded approval with its silence. And now as da BOTUS sees his polling numbers plummet faster than cockroaches scatter in a kitchen when the lights are turned on, he willingly throws the only democracy in the Middle East under the bus simply to garner Arab American votes in key swing states...despicable, aina?
#fromthejordanrivertothemediterreanseaandpalestinewillbefree
#neveragain
Time for you to heat up some milk and head to bed.
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To rid Gaza of Hamas completely. Whether that is a realistic or achievable goal is certainly up for debate, but its been the stated goal from the start.
You can be critical or bothered by the methods and/or the ambivalence to collateral damage, but that doesn't change the aim of the campaign. Its intellectually dishonest to ignore that just paint this all as genocidal push to eradicate Palestinians, as many have been doing for months now.
Ive been very disappointed with the optics of Israel's actions (obviously also incredibly saddened by the ever increasing death count regardless of whose numbers are to be believed) because it gives amplification to any number of dumb voices critical of Israel's existence and place in the world and accomplishes exactly what Iran wanted.
At this point they could completely wipe out any and all leadership of Hamas and people would still find a way of invalidating Israel's whole campaign as tyrannical and oppressive and to make Hamas and its cause the sympathetic victims. Ive already seen an uptick in the general "Hamas were freedom fighters" narrative over the last few months. That as much as anything is why Bibi and his cabal need to be gone ASAP.
The casualty numbers believed are pretty much agreed upon now by the Gaza health ministry and agreed upon publicly by Israeli intelligence. That’s not really a talking point to make anymore, as it’s pivoted from “untrue” to “sacrifices that are acceptable”
Getting mad about people saying “what Iran wants” and being most concerned with “the optics”/“people won’t give Israel credit even if they achieve the impossible” isn’t really the point of the thread here. The topic is Israel continuing to target foreign aid workers in a deliberate manner which is way more effective at ruining Israel’s PR image than anything Iran is doing right now.
The majority of your post is complaining about the fringe internet. Which you have admitted to falling into the rabbit hole of before. Twitter is not real life. But the people’s lives that these “bad optics” represent are real life. Well until they aren’t because AI told the drone operator they were part of an acceptable casualty threshold.
Two thirds plus of Americans agree with a permanent ceasefire.
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Just as a reminder, on October 6, a cease fire existed in the Middle East. On October 7, Hamas broke that cease fire by attacking, killing, and kidnapping innocent Israelis while the world sat back and nodded approval with its silence. And now as da BOTUS sees his polling numbers plummet faster than cockroaches scatter in a kitchen when the lights are turned on, he willingly throws the only democracy in the Middle East under the bus simply to garner Arab American votes in key swing states...despicable, aina?
#fromthejordanrivertothemediterreanseaandpalestinewillbefree
#neveragain
Dis guy called the cops on a Sikh at the grocery store after 9/11 ^^^
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The casualty numbers believed are pretty much agreed upon now by the Gaza health ministry and agreed upon publicly by Israeli intelligence. That’s not really a talking point to make anymore, as it’s pivoted from “untrue” to “sacrifices that are acceptable”
Getting mad about people saying “what Iran wants” and being most concerned with “the optics”/“people won’t give Israel credit even if they achieve the impossible” isn’t really the point of the thread here. The topic is Israel continuing to target foreign aid workers in a deliberate manner which is way more effective at ruining Israel’s PR image than anything Iran is doing right now.
The majority of your post is complaining about the fringe internet. Which you have admitted to falling into the rabbit hole of before. Twitter is not real life. But the people’s lives that these “bad optics” represent are real life. Well until they aren’t because AI told the drone operator they were part of an acceptable casualty threshold.
Two thirds plus of Americans agree with a permanent ceasefire.
And here's the thing - I don't think there necessarily *needs* to be a ceasefire. Of course Israel has every right to defend itself and to enter Gaza to do so, but the way it has done it, by seemingly not caring a whole lot about the lives of Gazans and neutrals along the way, is why it is losing this from a PR perspective.
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PR no matta. Survival as a country and as a people is what defending Israel is all about. Few seems to understand that, hey?
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PR no matta. Survival as a country and as a people is what defending Israel is all about. Few seems to understand that, hey?
Then why are they conducting activities that put that more at risk?
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Its a war in which Israel was attacked on Oct. 7. By your own admission, you state Israel has the right to defend itself. So, what is it? Either the right to defend itself or the obligation to help Biden get re-elected, hey?
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Its a war in which Israel was attacked on Oct. 7. By your own admission, you state Israel has the right to defend itself. So, what is it? Either the right to defend itself or the obligation to help Biden get re-elected, hey?
Quit killing aid workers, hey
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Its a war in which Israel was attacked on Oct. 7. By your own admission, you state Israel has the right to defend itself. So, what is it? Either the right to defend itself or the obligation to help Biden get re-elected, hey?
You think the right to defend themselves is absolute? So they can kill numerous civilians and relief workers and that’s OK? What if they used nuclear weapons? That’s OK with you too?
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Raping women, killing children, torturing hostages...man, oh man, the hypocrisy here is unbelievable, hey?
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Raping women, killing children, torturing hostages...man, oh man, the hypocrisy here is unbelievable, hey?
Your inability to answer my questions is noted.
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Raping women, killing children, torturing hostages...man, oh man, the hypocrisy here is unbelievable, hey?
No, it isn’t. It would be if someone said Hamas should be able to rape women and kill children and torture hostages.
Israel has a right to defend itself. Israel also will be condemned when doing so results in the loss of innocent life of aid workers.
The criticism of Israel is valid. Their response to what happened on October 6th is valid. Both things can be true.
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Raping women, killing children, torturing hostages...man, oh man, the hypocrisy here is unbelievable, hey?
Is there a source for this that hasn't been debunked?
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Its a war in which Israel was attacked on Oct. 7. By your own admission, you state Israel has the right to defend itself. So, what is it? Either the right to defend itself or the obligation to help Biden get re-elected, hey?
Israel is defending itself against aid workers and children?
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Raping women, killing children, torturing hostages...man, oh man, the hypocrisy here is unbelievable, hey?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/22/claims-of-israeli-sexual-assault-of-palestinian-women-are-credible-un-panel-says (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/22/claims-of-israeli-sexual-assault-of-palestinian-women-are-credible-un-panel-says)
13,800 children killed
and plenty of torture
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/11/israel-opt-horrifying-cases-of-torture-and-degrading-treatment-of-palestinian-detainees-amid-spike-in-arbitrary-arrests/ (https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/11/israel-opt-horrifying-cases-of-torture-and-degrading-treatment-of-palestinian-detainees-amid-spike-in-arbitrary-arrests/)
https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/06/middleeast/doctor-israel-hospital-conditions-intl/index.html
(https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/06/middleeast/doctor-israel-hospital-conditions-intl/index.html)
Which side are you describing here?
The thing is, everyone has denounced Hamas for reports of similar actions, but some here say it is perfectly ok for Israel to do the same, you being one of them.
Israeli leadership has mishandled all of this, they are apparently doing everything they can to lose the respect and trust of the rest of the world. The Israeli people deceiver better, and so do the Palestinians.
I'm still just hoping that this doesn't blow up bigger.
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https://x.com/thedailyshow/status/1777668493447406025?s=46&t=G2FhP_F2kWewaBOpvRv5lg
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Truly unfortunate for many of the well meaning and clean organizations that Hamas has its claws in so many other aid groups/the aid pipeline.
Does the IDF have an overly itchy trigger finger when it comes to suspected targets? Yes, absolutely. Did they attack this convoy solely cause "screw Gazans, we're killing anyone who helps them?" Dont be naive.
The sad fact of this whole situation is neither side is going to stop. Hamas isn't going to release the remaining hostages, they aren't going to withdraw from Gaza. Israel isn't going to stop pushing forward until they have eradicated Hamas. Unfortunately for Israel, most people who have any remaining interest in the war have chosen to forget that Hamas is still involved and that its an ongoing conflict. War is horrific. Even more so when its taking place in and around a civilian population.
This is no more disgusting than any number of events that are going on around the world, it just has more media coverage.
It may not be intentional, but it is absolutely wanton negligence.
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PR no matta. Survival as a country and as a people is what defending Israel is all about. Few seems to understand that, hey?
A rag tag bunch of loser terrorists can't destroy a country. Israel's survival was never in doubt.
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If Biden and Blinken would shut up and get out of the way, Hamas would have been defeated months ago. However, that doesn't fit da Buffoon's agenda as he panders American Arab votes while his polling numbers are sinkin' faster than the Titanic, hey?
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If Biden and Blinken would shut up and get out of the way, Hamas would have been defeated months ago. However, that doesn't fit da Buffoon's agenda as he panders American Arab votes while his polling numbers are sinkin' faster than the Titanic, hey?
Brainwashed.
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Brainwashed.
He’s getting more adel minded by the week.
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If Biden and Blinken would shut up and get out of the way, Hamas would have been defeated months ago. However, that doesn't fit da Buffoon's agenda as he panders American Arab votes while his polling numbers are sinkin' faster than the Titanic, hey?
There's no way to prove this, but you keep saying it. Not surprisingly given your continued devotion to the king of lies, the antisemite Dementia Don.
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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/22/claims-of-israeli-sexual-assault-of-palestinian-women-are-credible-un-panel-says (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/22/claims-of-israeli-sexual-assault-of-palestinian-women-are-credible-un-panel-says)
13,800 children killed
and plenty of torture
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/11/israel-opt-horrifying-cases-of-torture-and-degrading-treatment-of-palestinian-detainees-amid-spike-in-arbitrary-arrests/ (https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/11/israel-opt-horrifying-cases-of-torture-and-degrading-treatment-of-palestinian-detainees-amid-spike-in-arbitrary-arrests/)
https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/06/middleeast/doctor-israel-hospital-conditions-intl/index.html
(https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/06/middleeast/doctor-israel-hospital-conditions-intl/index.html)
Which side are you describing here?
The thing is, everyone has denounced Hamas for reports of similar actions, but some here say it is perfectly ok for Israel to do the same, you being one of them.
Israeli leadership has mishandled all of this, they are apparently doing everything they can to lose the respect and trust of the rest of the world. The Israeli people deceiver better, and so do the Palestinians.
I'm still just hoping that this doesn't blow up bigger.
I cannot get past 13,800 kids...horrifying.
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There's no way to prove this, but you keep saying it. Not surprisingly given your continued devotion to the king of lies, the antisemite Dementia Don.
"king of lies" whoa nelly! you eating the same ice cream as weekend at bernies?
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He’s getting more adel minded by the week.
The lack of crime reports on campus has him in withdrawal
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I cannot get past 13,800 kids...horrifying.
“This is fine, in fact this is encouraged and should be done more” - dentists apparently
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If Biden and Blinken would shut up and get out of the way, Hamas would have been defeated months ago. However, that doesn't fit da Buffoon's agenda as he panders American Arab votes while his polling numbers are sinkin' faster than the Titanic, hey?
Quite the opposite, actually. He's been Israel's biggest ally in congress for decades, and has allowed this mess to continue to the detriment of his polling numbers. The youth is unhappy with him, as well as Muslim voters (since this is what you probably should have said, not Arab).
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Quite the opposite, actually. He's been Israel's biggest ally in congress for decades, and has allowed this mess to continue to the detriment of his polling numbers. The youth is unhappy with him, as well as Muslim voters (since this is what you probably should have said, not Arab).
Not only should Netanyahu be in jail for a variety of crimes, his leadership over the last year has been atrocious as evidenced by his latest failure dealing with Hamas. Luckily, it appears the Israel population has realized what a disaster he is and he’ll hopefully soon be out of office.
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https://mondoweiss.net/2024/04/come-out-you-animals-how-the-massacre-at-al-shifa-hospital-happened/
Dentist- this is good
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Not only should weekend at Bernie’s be in jail for a variety of crimes, his leadership over the last 3 1/2 years has been atrocious as evidenced by his latest failure dealing with Hamas and everything else Luckily, it appears the US population has realized what a disaster he is and he’ll HOPEFULLY soon be out of office.
Love these little erasers on the golf pencils, eyna?
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Love these little erasers on the golf pencils, eyna?
So, you can’t defend Netanyahu is what you’re saying?
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https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/12/middleeast/west-bank-village-stormed-by-israeli-settlers-intl/index.html (https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/12/middleeast/west-bank-village-stormed-by-israeli-settlers-intl/index.html)
How is this different than state sponsored terrorism?
And we might be looking at an open war between Israel, the US, and Iran, because Israel found a need to bomb an embassy to assassinate Iranian leaders.
Israel has a right to defend itself, but what they have been doing lately demonstrates a complete disregard for international laws and human decency.
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https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/12/middleeast/west-bank-village-stormed-by-israeli-settlers-intl/index.html (https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/12/middleeast/west-bank-village-stormed-by-israeli-settlers-intl/index.html)
How is this different than state sponsored terrorism?
And we might be looking at an open war between Israel, the US, and Iran, because Israel found a need to bomb an embassy to assassinate Iranian leaders.
They're the US's ally. That's all that matters. The rest of the world sees it, but we ignore it because of... reasons.
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So, you can’t defend Netanyahu is what you’re saying?
The dentists believe that any American who criticizes Netanyahu is anti-Israel and antisemitic, but any American who criticizes the U.S. president (regardless of which president it is) is just exercising his or her freedom of speech.
Never mind that millions of Israeli Jews are done with Bibi. Acknowledging that hurts the narrative.
And of course, there are exceptions. When Schumer (a Jew who has spent decades strongly supporting Israel) criticized Bibi, he was anti-Israel and antisemitic. When Dementia Don (a make-believe Christian who in just the past couple of weeks has made multiple antisemitic comments about American Jews) criticized Bibi, he was just trying to help.
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I see where da Buffoon's ironclad defense of Israel has now resulted in Iranian drones, of which no doubt the U.S. funded with its billion$, attacking our ally and the only democracy in the Middle East. In fact, the world's mess in Afghanistan, the Ukraine, and now Gaza can be traced to our weak "commander and chief," and how we're viewed by the rest of the world, aina?
#fromtherivertothesea
#neveragain
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Does Iran have a right to defend itself?
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Iran getting involved was inevitable after Israel blew up their generals. Bibi is the buffoon now.
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Does Iran have a right to defend itself?
Iran is the biggest driver of terrorism, murder, and unrest in the Middle East. They are not “defending” themselves.
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Iran is the biggest driver of terrorism, murder, and unrest in the Middle East. They are not “defending” themselves.
Israel should be allowed to blow up whomever they want wherever they want then.
If the Iranians air striked the American embassy in Jerusalem and killed military leaders, you'd be calling for air strikes on Iran.
Double standard typical American take.
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Israel should be allowed to blow up whomever they want wherever they want then.
If the Iranians air striked the American embassy in Jerusalem and killed military leaders, you'd be calling for air strikes on Iran.
Double standard typical American take.
Of course, I never said that. I simply stated a fact. And the “military” leaders were Hezbollah - terrorists meeting with terrorist leaders from another country.
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My kneejerk reaction is that this is a face saving response by Iran designed to fail and not further inflame things. If a meaningful number of these strikes end up hitting their targets, I’ll change that position. But right now it looks like these are all being intercepted. I have to think that if Iran actually wanted to land strikes in Israel, they have that ability.
The fact that even I knew these were coming ahead of time because they cut into Masters coverage tells me that they weren’t actually designed to land. If this is truly the best Iran can do, they just showed their ass.
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Iran is the biggest driver of terrorism, murder, and unrest in the Middle East. They are not “defending” themselves.
The first sentence can be true, and they can still be defending themselves. Israel bombed an Iranian embassy.
That would and is viewed as an open act of war for any country, and there isn't a country in the world that wouldn't respond militarily.
The entire world, and the US should have denounced that attack immediately.
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I guess it is wait and see time.
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News sounds about as good as could be hoped- between US shooting down several of the missiles, with significant help from Jordan and Egypt, and Israel air defense system, sounds like almost nothing got through.
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Iran is the biggest driver of terrorism, murder, and unrest in the Middle East. They are not “defending” themselves.
💯
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My kneejerk reaction is that this is a face saving response by Iran designed to fail and not further inflame things. If a meaningful number of these strikes end up hitting their targets, I’ll change that position. But right now it looks like these are all being intercepted. I have to think that if Iran actually wanted to land strikes in Israel, they have that ability.
The fact that even I knew these were coming ahead of time because they cut into Masters coverage tells me that they weren’t actually designed to land. If this is truly the best Iran can do, they just showed their ass.
Exactly. Iran would have lost its street cred if it did nothing. Hopefully the fact that this attack was not intended to commit major damage will mitigate any Israeli response.
But never underestimate what Netanyahu might do. He is an authoritarian madman.
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The first sentence can be true, and they can still be defending themselves. Israel bombed an Iranian embassy.
That would and is viewed as an open act of war for any country, and there isn't a country in the world that wouldn't respond militarily.
The entire world, and the US should have denounced that attack immediately.
This is fair, I don’t have much against it. However, I do think it’s silly that people are acting like Israel maliciously attacked a country minding its own business when they attacked the embassy, and not that Iran has been attacking Israel by proxy for months/years.
There is no innocent victims here. Israel is undeniably overaggressive at the moment, but anyone trying to lionize or stump for Iranian leadership are just blind Israel haters and would root for a Charles Manson/Jeffrey Dahmer tag team if they were opposing Israel
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Does Iran have a right to defend itself?
You left out the fact that Israel's attack on April 1 took out the POS who masterminded the October 7 attack on Israel, hey?
#neveragain
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The first sentence can be true, and they can still be defending themselves. Israel bombed an Iranian embassy.
That would and is viewed as an open act of war for any country, and there isn't a country in the world that wouldn't respond militarily.
The entire world, and the US should have denounced that attack immediately.
They bombed Iran's embassy/consulate in Syria a country that has no problem attacking anyone else's embassy including our own in 1979. So what is the problem?
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News sounds about as good as could be hoped- between US shooting down several of the missiles, with significant help from Jordan and Egypt, and Israel air defense system, sounds like almost nothing got through.
The news will be as good as could be hoped when/if there's no retaliation
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Israel should be allowed to blow up whomever they want wherever they want then.
If the Iranians air striked the American embassy in Jerusalem and killed military leaders, you'd be calling for air strikes on Iran.
Double standard typical American take.
What double standard? Jimmy Carter did squat when they seized our embassy in 1979.
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https://www.axios.com/2024/04/14/biden-netanyahu-iran-israel-us-wont-support
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They bombed Iran's embassy/consulate in Syria a country that has no problem attacking anyone else's embassy including our own in 1979. So what is the problem?
Hear me out here…
Perhaps none of these actions are worth defending and we should just stay out of it.
When you have to bring up an action from 44 years ago, that should probably tell you something.
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Huh? The voice of reason, hey?
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What double standard? Jimmy Carter did squat when they seized our embassy in 1979.
They had hostages. Consider that the most simple difference.
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Hear me out here…
Perhaps none of these actions are worth defending and we should just stay out of it.
When you have to bring up an action from 44 years ago, that should probably tell you something.
yes
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This is fair, I don’t have much against it. However, I do think it’s silly that people are acting like Israel maliciously attacked a country minding its own business when they attacked the embassy, and not that Iran has been attacking Israel by proxy for months/years.
There is no innocent victims here. Israel is undeniably overaggressive at the moment, but anyone trying to lionize or stump for Iranian leadership are just blind Israel haters and would root for a Charles Manson/Jeffrey Dahmer tag team if they were opposing Israel
No real disagreements, but attacks by proxies, and direct attacks are different, everyone in the world knows this, and it is why the US and every other major country constantly is funding proxies to do their dirty work.
And even then, bombing an embassy is a whole other level of...you just don't do that, even if it had been proxies. It is why Israel didn't "take credit for it." They even knew it was wrong and was going to be a powder keg moment.
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Huh? The voice of reason, hey?
That means staying complete out you know. No arms sales. No helping with their defense.
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This is fair, I don’t have much against it. However, I do think it’s silly that people are acting like Israel maliciously attacked a country minding its own business when they attacked the embassy, and not that Iran has been attacking Israel by proxy for months/years.
There is no innocent victims here. Israel is undeniably overaggressive at the moment, but anyone trying to lionize or stump for Iranian leadership are just blind Israel haters and would root for a Charles Manson/Jeffrey Dahmer tag team if they were opposing Israel
Important to remember that Putin is supplying war machines and financial support to Iran, and has been for years. The same Putin that a good chunk of one U.S. political party, including its presidential candidate (who claims to love Israel), is kowtowing to. Even some top Republicans are furious that their party has been infected by Putin's propaganda machine.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2024/04/07/russian-propaganda-republicans-congress/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F3d5525b%2F6614140ec8507e7d8b23a0de%2F5f8d147cae7e8a56e5b732a4%2F17%2F53%2F6614140ec8507e7d8b23a0de
Rep. Michael R. Turner (R-Ohio), who chairs the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, said Sunday that it was “absolutely true” that some Republican members of Congress were repeating Russian propaganda about the invasion of Ukraine instigated by Russian President Vladimir Putin.
Turner did not specify which members he was referring to, but he said he agreed with House Foreign Affairs Committee Chair Michael McCaul (R-Tex.), who said in an interview with Puck News last week that Russian propaganda had “infected a good chunk of my party’s base” and suggested that conservative media was to blame.
Reagan is rolling over in his grave about the tragedy that is his former party.
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Interesting historical analysis on the news just a bit ago, discussing on how the UN and world leaders failed in averting what might become a wider Middle East war.
Apparently in 1998, the Taliban attack an Iranian consulate. Iran needed to retaliate, but was able to avert an actual war/battle, because the UN and world leaders intervened to strongly condemn the Taliban attack.
The UN Security Council did not condemn the Israeli attack on an Iranian embassy this time, and they were largely forced to respond. It really is a failure of world leadership.
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Well Heisey was right about one thing. (Shocker…) Israel is moving forward without caring what the rest of the world thinks. But it’s not going to end for them how they think it will.
They have accomplished none of their larger goals and have managed to widen the war in the process.
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https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/netanyahu-called-off-retaliatory-strike-on-iran-after-call-with-biden-new-york-times/
Looks like Israel gonna lay low for now. Joe does have a bit of influence, it seems
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Interesting historical analysis on the news just a bit ago, discussing on how the UN and world leaders failed in averting what might become a wider Middle East war.
Apparently in 1998, the Taliban attack an Iranian consulate. Iran needed to retaliate, but was able to avert an actual war/battle, because the UN and world leaders intervened to strongly condemn the Taliban attack.
The UN Security Council did not condemn the Israeli attack on an Iranian embassy this time, and they were largely forced to respond. It really is a failure of world leadership.
I strongly disagree with that conclusion, and think it ignores who all of the players here have shown themselves to be. The UN has been plenty hostile toward Israel, not least of all lately with the South Africans using apartheid as moral currency to bring an ICJ case against Israel. Its not like the UN is afraid to condemn Israel.
I also think that has almost no relationship to how Iran would have responded. Since when has Iran's leadership given two craps about internaitonal pressure or UN declarations? Saying they wouldn't have responded if the UN condemned Israel both gives the Iranians too much diplomatic credit and overincentivizes isolating Israel.
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Well Heisey was right about one thing. (Shocker…) Israel is moving forward without caring what the rest of the world thinks. But it’s not going to end for them how they think it will.
They have accomplished none of their larger goals and have managed to widen the war in the process.
Bibi's motivation to preserve his political position (and stay out of jail) cast such a shadow over Israel's next move. The Iranian response was calculated so as not do any actual damage, but Bibi has no personal/political incentive to prevent escalation.
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Well Heisey was right about one thing. (Shocker…) Israel is moving forward without caring what the rest of the world thinks. But it’s not going to end for them how they think it will.
They have accomplished none of their larger goals and have managed to widen the war in the process.
So
A. How is it going to end?
B. How do they think it’s going to end?
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I strongly disagree with that conclusion, and think it ignores who all of the players here have shown themselves to be. The UN has been plenty hostile toward Israel, not least of all lately with the South Africans using apartheid as moral currency to bring an ICJ case against Israel. Its not like the UN is afraid to condemn Israel.
I also think that has almost no relationship to how Iran would have responded. Since when has Iran's leadership given two craps about internaitonal pressure or UN declarations? Saying they wouldn't have responded if the UN condemned Israel both gives the Iranians too much diplomatic credit and overincentivizes isolating Israel.
You are mixing concepts. Individual countries within the UN have acted against Israel, and made statements criticizing Israel, but the UN is meaningless as they can't institute anything formal without policy from the Security Council.
The UN Security Council has done next to nothing.
Regarding your latter comments. Iran in 1998 did stand down, after the UN Security Council Condemned the Taliban for its attack on the Iranian consulate. Iran doesn't want open war, and Iran did say that had the UN Security Council acted here, they may have been able to avoid having to respond.
https://www.reuters.com/world/un-security-council-should-have-condemned-iran-embassy-attack-syria-irans-un-2024-04-11/ (https://www.reuters.com/world/un-security-council-should-have-condemned-iran-embassy-attack-syria-irans-un-2024-04-11/)
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https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/netanyahu-called-off-retaliatory-strike-on-iran-after-call-with-biden-new-york-times/
Looks like Israel gonna lay low for now. Joe does have a bit of influence, it seems
Ah, you mean BO, aina?
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So
A. How is it going to end?
B. How do they think it’s going to end?
It's going to end in a stalemate with a situation similar to the previous - but a lot of people will have suffered and died in the process.
They thought it was going to end in a similar way we thought Afghanistan and Iraq were going to end. It always sounds simple and easy. But it's not. For far too long we have thought the absolute surrender of WWII was the obvious end to wars. Its not. They're messy and inconclusive.
Their objectives were to beat Hamas and rescue the hostages. They will end up doing neither...at least fully. I'm not sure they ever could have, but their standing worldwide has taken a massive hit in the process. Even their greatest ally is growing tired of their actions in Gaza.
And that's not a Biden thing - that's a Bibi thing.
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“ But it’s not going to end for them how they think it will.”
Gee, tell us oh wise man, how is this going to end?? Hang on, I’ve got to gather my family so they don’t miss some history here
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You are mixing concepts. Individual countries within the UN have acted against Israel, and made statements criticizing Israel, but the UN is meaningless as they can't institute anything formal without policy from the Security Council.
The UN Security Council has done next to nothing.
Regarding your latter comments. Iran in 1998 did stand down, after the UN Security Council Condemned the Taliban for its attack on the Iranian consulate. Iran doesn't want open war, and Iran did say that had the UN Security Council acted here, they may have been able to avoid having to respond.
https://www.reuters.com/world/un-security-council-should-have-condemned-iran-embassy-attack-syria-irans-un-2024-04-11/ (https://www.reuters.com/world/un-security-council-should-have-condemned-iran-embassy-attack-syria-irans-un-2024-04-11/)
You're right, I skipped over the Security Counsel reference in your op - that was my mistake.
I do still think that the Iranians' statement is BS. Dropping a "you made us do this" while referring to Israel as the "Zionist regime," and then being taken seriously, is really something. I understand that reference reflects that Iran doesn't diplomatically recognize Israel - but that's kind of the whole game here.
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“ But it’s not going to end for them how they think it will.”
Gee, tell us oh wise man, how is this going to end?? Hang on, I’ve got to gather my family so they don’t miss some history here
Too late. I already answered above.
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You're right, I skipped over the Security Counsel reference in your op - that was my mistake.
I do still think that the Iranians' statement is BS. Dropping a "you made us do this" while referring to Israel as the "Zionist regime," and then being taken seriously, is really something. I understand that reference reflects that Iran doesn't diplomatically recognize Israel - but that's kind of the whole game here.
Right. In no way should Iran be seen as a victim here. My guess is that it was their entire idea to start this in the first place.
But Israel has played right into their hands.
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You're right, I skipped over the Security Counsel reference in your op - that was my mistake.
I do still think that the Iranians' statement is BS. Dropping a "you made us do this" while referring to Israel as the "Zionist regime," and then being taken seriously, is really something. I understand that reference reflects that Iran doesn't diplomatically recognize Israel - but that's kind of the whole game here.
I agree. Their language is terrible and wrong, and highlights a lot of the problems.
But I do believe that Iran has zero desire for an open war, and believe that if the UN Security Council denounced Israel's attack on their Embassy, that would have been sufficient for them to be able to save face without retaliating. I don't think Iran ever envisioned a scenario where Israel would bomb an Embassy, or would attack them directly.
It's also quite simply a fact, that Israel was 100% aware that Iran would retaliate, in Israel, if they bombed the Iranian Embassy. They bombed it anyway.
That in no way says Iran is a victim.
I'm seriously hoping that cooler heads start to prevail.
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If I'm understanding correctly, the US provides missiles for the iron dome. If true, the US spent $1+ bil against the Iranian drones.
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This seems like poor advice. Though perhaps not surprising from the guy who wanted to use the Army against Americans in 2020.
As pro-Palestinian protesters blocked major U.S. transportation infrastructure on Monday, from San Francisco’s Golden Gate Bridge to the entrance to Chicago’s O’Hare International Airport, one Republican senator joined Fox News to call for Americans “to take matters into their own hands.”
https://www.mediaite.com/tv/tom-cotton-urges-americans-to-take-matters-into-their-own-hands-to-stop-pro-palestinian-protestors/
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If I'm understanding correctly, the US provides missiles for the iron dome. If true, the US spent $1+ bil against the Iranian drones.
Israeli reports say that it cost between $1-1.35B to repel the Iranian attack.
Hezbollah alone, has the capacity to fire ~500-1000x the number of rockets/missiles that were fired in that attack. Iran has the capacity to match that or more.
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This seems like poor advice. Though perhaps not surprising from the guy who wanted to use the Army against Americans in 2020.
As pro-Palestinian protesters blocked major U.S. transportation infrastructure on Monday, from San Francisco’s Golden Gate Bridge to the entrance to Chicago’s O’Hare International Airport, one Republican senator joined Fox News to call for Americans “to take matters into their own hands.”
https://www.mediaite.com/tv/tom-cotton-urges-americans-to-take-matters-into-their-own-hands-to-stop-pro-palestinian-protestors/
Yet he supported WHITE Americans who attempted to overthrow the US government.
Interesting.
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After reading four sections of comments on Israel/Hamas/Gaza and assorted diversions, the one conclusion that's apparent is that we're rather weak on the history of the area.
The Western Middle East has been a battleground since the Jewish people under Moses fled Pharaoh. Muslims are taught from the moment they begin nursing at their mother's breasts that Jews are infidels and should be killed. Every Jew since the mid-1940s has the Holocaust drilled into them from the day they nurse from their Mother. This is the classic immovable object meets and unstoppable force.
Hamas is nothing more than a reflagged, undisciplined Iranian army. Ditto Hezbollah. Their mercenaries aimed at creating instability and giving Iran plausible deniability in its ongoing war with the Great Satan.
We see things through domestic political and social considerations. In our culture, we try to be inclusive and believe if people vote, they can change the political and social direction of our country. Nobody in the Middle East gives a rat's backside about inclusion. The whole war is about turf and about survival.
Two things are paramount in the debate. First, despite the pleadings of the President, U.S. Domestic political considerations carry no weight when Israel's life and death is on the line. Diamona exists because Israel will do any and everything to assure its survival, lest we end up with Holocaust II.
Second, when you go to war, civilians get killed. Lots and lots of them. There is no avoiding it.
As a side note, the only people who brought an even limited peace to the Middle East were Jimmy Carter and Anwar Sadat. That worked out well for President Sadat, didn't it?
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After reading four sections of comments on Israel/Hamas/Gaza and assorted diversions, the one conclusion that's apparent is that we're rather weak on the history of the area.
The Western Middle East has been a battleground since the Jewish people under Moses fled Pharaoh. Muslims are taught from the moment they begin nursing at their mother's breasts that Jews are infidels and should be killed. Every Jew since the mid-1940s has the Holocaust drilled into them from the day they nurse from their Mother. This is the classic immovable object meets and unstoppable force.
Hamas is nothing more than a reflagged, undisciplined Iranian army. Ditto Hezbollah. Their mercenaries aimed at creating instability and giving Iran plausible deniability in its ongoing war with the Great Satan.
We see things through domestic political and social considerations. In our culture, we try to be inclusive and believe if people vote, they can change the political and social direction of our country. Nobody in the Middle East gives a rat's backside about inclusion. The whole war is about turf and about survival.
Two things are paramount in the debate. First, despite the pleadings of the President, U.S. Domestic political considerations carry no weight when Israel's life and death is on the line. Diamona exists because Israel will do any and everything to assure its survival, lest we end up with Holocaust II.
Second, when you go to war, civilians get killed. Lots and lots of them. There is no avoiding it.
As a side note, the only people who brought an even limited peace to the Middle East were Jimmy Carter and Anwar Sadat. That worked out well for President Sadat, didn't it?
Yes. That certainly seems to be the case.
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Yes. That certainly seems to be the case.
Correct. Regardless of administration, policy in the Middle East will be a failure, dating back to Truman
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This seems like poor advice. Though perhaps not surprising from the guy who wanted to use the Army against Americans in 2020.
As pro-Palestinian protesters blocked major U.S. transportation infrastructure on Monday, from San Francisco’s Golden Gate Bridge to the entrance to Chicago’s O’Hare International Airport, one Republican senator joined Fox News to call for Americans “to take matters into their own hands.”
https://www.mediaite.com/tv/tom-cotton-urges-americans-to-take-matters-into-their-own-hands-to-stop-pro-palestinian-protestors/
A U.S. senator is advocating for vigilante violence as the way to deal with peaceful protests. What could go wrong?
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seems kinda insurrectiony to me. track em all down, use any means necessary, throw em in prison without bail, hold trials if really necessary...oh we'll get around to it some year or another as long as they are off the streets. if blocking people from doing their day to day avtivites doesn't get their attentions, maybe preventing emergency vehicles from saving lives will
freedom of speech here is pretty cool here, river to sea by any means necessary, eyn'a?
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seems kinda insurrectiony to me. track em all down, use any means necessary, throw em in prison without bail, hold trials if really necessary...oh we'll get around to it some year or another as long as they are off the streets. if blocking people from doing their day to day avtivites doesn't get their attentions, maybe preventing emergency vehicles from saving lives will
freedom of speech here is pretty cool here, river to sea by any means necessary, eyn'a?
Are you drunk this morning? You seem more incoherent than usual.
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I like Tom Cotton, hey?
#neveragain
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A U.S. senator is advocating for vigilante violence as the way to deal with peaceful protests. What could go wrong?
But members of the U.S. House displaying Palestinian flags in their official office is okay by you, hey?
#shameful
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Ranks up there with the Putin propogandists of the GOP.
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Ranks up there with the Putin propogandists of the GOP.
Well, that’s different. They’re just bought and paid for, plus, some of them don’t want their bedroom secrets out in the open
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seems kinda insurrectiony to me. track em all down, use any means necessary, throw em in prison without bail, hold trials if really necessary...oh we'll get around to it some year or another as long as they are off the streets. if blocking people from doing their day to day avtivites doesn't get their attentions, maybe preventing emergency vehicles from saving lives will
freedom of speech here is pretty cool here, river to sea by any means necessary, eyn'a?
Just so we're clear here, Tom.Cotton is arguing that people who block traffic on the Golden Gate Bridge in protest should be thrown off the bridge.
A fall/jump from the bridge is fatal more than 90% of the time.
So, in the world of Tom, 4ever and rocket, the proper response to someone blocking traffic is to murder them.
I think these protesters are a-holes and these protests do more harm than good for their cause, but advocating for them to be murdered seems perhaps a bit extreme.
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They’re all fake-tough guys who wouldn’t really do anything if the situation arose.
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But members of the U.S. House displaying Palestinian flags in their official office is okay by you, hey?
#shameful
I'd rather they didn't. But yes, compared to publicly advocating for vigilante violence as an answer to a peaceful protest, I'd prefer a display of a flag.
Given that you love a demented dictator-wannabe who fomented a violent coup attempt against his own country (and also happens to be an antisemite), I'm not surprised that you love this clown, too.
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After reading four sections of comments on Israel/Hamas/Gaza and assorted diversions, the one conclusion that's apparent is that we're rather weak on the history of the area.
The Western Middle East has been a battleground since the Jewish people under Moses fled Pharaoh. Muslims are taught from the moment they begin nursing at their mother's breasts that Jews are infidels and should be killed. Every Jew since the mid-1940s has the Holocaust drilled into them from the day they nurse from their Mother. This is the classic immovable object meets and unstoppable force.
Hamas is nothing more than a reflagged, undisciplined Iranian army. Ditto Hezbollah. Their mercenaries aimed at creating instability and giving Iran plausible deniability in its ongoing war with the Great Satan.
We see things through domestic political and social considerations. In our culture, we try to be inclusive and believe if people vote, they can change the political and social direction of our country. Nobody in the Middle East gives a rat's backside about inclusion. The whole war is about turf and about survival.
Two things are paramount in the debate. First, despite the pleadings of the President, U.S. Domestic political considerations carry no weight when Israel's life and death is on the line. Diamona exists because Israel will do any and everything to assure its survival, lest we end up with Holocaust II.
Second, when you go to war, civilians get killed. Lots and lots of them. There is no avoiding it.
As a side note, the only people who brought an even limited peace to the Middle East were Jimmy Carter and Anwar Sadat. That worked out well for President Sadat, didn't it?
Oh boy.
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Oh boy.
a lot going on there
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Just as a reminder, on October 6, a cease fire existed in the Middle East. On October 7, Hamas broke that cease fire by attacking, killing, and kidnapping innocent Israelis while the world sat back and nodded approval with its silence. And now as da BOTUS sees his polling numbers plummet faster than cockroaches scatter in a kitchen when the lights are turned on, he willingly throws the only democracy in the Middle East under the bus simply to garner Arab American votes in key swing states...despicable, aina?
#fromthejordanrivertothemediterreanseaandpalestinewillbefree
#neveragain
https://www.propublica.org/article/israel-gaza-blinken-leahy-sanctions-human-rights-violations
These are from pre 10/7
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House Speaker Mike Johnson could get ousted by his party's growing batshyte-crazy faction for putting forth an aid package for Israel, Ukraine and Gaza relief - a package that can only pass with the help of the other party.
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Congratulations to the U.S. House of Representatives, which overwhelmingly passed a bipartisan package to provide military aid to Israel and Ukraine, humanitarian aid to Gaza, and support to Taiwan. The Senate, which had come up with the blueprint for the bill, is expected to easily pass this version early next week, and President Biden said he will sign it.
It is important to strongly support our democratic allies and to send a message that authoritarian regimes cannot simply take what is not theirs.
Special plaudits to Speaker Johnson, who pushed for this needed legislation despite the Jew-hating, Putin-loving faction that is threatening to take the speakership away from him.
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Congratulations to the U.S. House of Representatives, which overwhelmingly passed a bipartisan package to provide military aid to Israel and Ukraine, humanitarian aid to Gaza, and support to Taiwan. The Senate, which had come up with the blueprint for the bill, is expected to easily pass this version early next week, and President Biden said he will sign it.
It is important to strongly support our democratic allies and to send a message that authoritarian regimes cannot simply take what is not theirs.
Special plaudits to Speaker Johnson, who pushed for this needed legislation despite the Jew-hating, Putin-loving faction that is threatening to take the speakership away from him.
Amen.
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That lauded casualty ratio might start taking a hit
https://news.sky.com/story/baby-saved-from-womb-of-mother-killed-in-israeli-strike-13120661
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Hamas kills aid workers to manufacture Gaza food crisis, Fatah charges
A Fatah TV anchor reported that Hamas had attacked aid workers, stolen food and water and caused food prices to skyrocket in the Gaza Strip.
APRIL 22, 2024 01:29 Updated: APRIL 23, 2024 10:32
https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-798185?s=02#798185
The Palestinian political faction Fatah charged on air that Hamas had deliberately killed aid workers, stolen aid and manufactured a food crisis in Gaza, according to a Palestinian Media Watch (PMW) investigation published on Sunday.
A Fatah TV anchor reported that Hamas had attacked aid workers, stolen food and water and caused food prices to skyrocket in the Gaza Strip – which PMW said constituted a triple crime.
“Hamas’ persecution of any party who is a source for distributing the [humanitarian] aid or securing it began from the start of the war, as Hamas persecuted well-known figures and teams of volunteers on the ground in mid-October [2023],” the anchor said. ”It attacked them and killed some of them for two reasons: Firstly, to prevent any activity by any [other] party in the Gaza Strip; and secondly, to ensure Hamas control over the aid and its storage, which of course leads to these crazy and unreal prices that no one can pay in the shadow of this destruction.
“After the occupation bombed storehouses controlled by Hamas, the accumulation of tons of various food and aid products that Hamas had taken exclusivity over became clear, at a time when the Gaza Strip is suffering from hunger.”
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https://euromedmonitor.org/en/article/6271/Israeli-army-broadcasts-intimidating-sounds-to-lure,-kill,-and-forcibly-displace-civilians-in-the-Nuseirat-camp
Sheesh
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Yeah, certainly rape and beheadin' babies is much kinder, aina?
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https://euromedmonitor.org/en/article/6271/Israeli-army-broadcasts-intimidating-sounds-to-lure,-kill,-and-forcibly-displace-civilians-in-the-Nuseirat-camp
Sheesh
Terrible if true, but caution via the source. Especially since its gives away its complete bias in the first sentence without even needing to look into the group, which is a Palestinian advocacy group. Much in the same way that everyone looks at any IDF or Israeli publication with a cautious lens on reporting.
As for the previous post, I'm shocked its taken this long for Fatah to get in on the anti-Hamas publicity action.
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Yeah, certainly rape and beheadin' babies is much kinder, aina?
Non-debunked source?
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Terrible if true, but caution via the source. Especially since its gives away its complete bias in the first sentence without even needing to look into the group, which is a Palestinian advocacy group. Much in the same way that everyone looks at any IDF or Israeli publication with a cautious lens on reporting.
As for the previous post, I'm shocked its taken this long for Fatah to get in on the anti-Hamas publicity action.
Appreciated and agreed
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Yeah, certainly rape and beheadin' babies is much kinder, aina?
Comparing the IDF's actions with that of Hamas isn't the winning defense of Israel that you think it is.
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They’re not raping women and beheading infants
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They’re not raping women and beheading infants
You sure about that?
What do you think happens to infants when a 500-pound bomb hits their home? Think their bodies stay intact?
As for raping women ...
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/05/gazan-detainees-beaten-and-sexually-assaulted-at-israeli-detention-centres-un-report-claims
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/22/claims-of-israeli-sexual-assault-of-palestinian-women-are-credible-un-panel-says
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They’re not raping women and beheading infants
A dead kid is still dead. Plus most of what you're talking about was fabricated, and has been debunked.
I'm not excusing any behavior, but certainly both sides are very responsible for committing war crimes.
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Neither side has any moral high ground remaining.
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Nor do the sides that continue to arm them without conditions or restriction.
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Tough night for the corrupt Netanyahu
https://x.com/danarbell/status/1783200302448972250?s=46&t=QSiaGcOIKZrrpw0ciZkI5Q
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A dead kid is still dead. Plus most of what you're talking about was fabricated, and has been debunked.
I'm not excusing any behavior, but certainly both sides are very responsible for committing war crimes.
And there’s more and more of them dying with every passing day, with our direct assistance and approval.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68881325.amp
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And there’s more and more of them dying with every passing day, with our direct assistance and approval.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68881325.amp
Man, that article is tough to parse and a real Rorschach test. I separate the hospital issue and Rafah offensive. Re the hospital piece, if the IDF's numbers on killed and detained Hamas militants are accurate, that's the most important fact for me. As far as I've read, it is widely accepted that Hamas used tunnels under and around Al-Shifa. It sucks that the legitimate medical professionals were subjected to interrogation, but if Hamas militants are using hospitals to shield their operations and trying to blend into a hospital setting, the IDF can't just say "welp, its a hospital, can't go there."
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Man, that article is tough to parse and a real Rorschach test. I separate the hospital issue and Rafah offensive. Re the hospital piece, if the IDF's numbers on killed and detained Hamas militants are accurate, that's the most important fact for me. As far as I've read, it is widely accepted that Hamas used tunnels under and around Al-Shifa. It sucks that the legitimate medical professionals were subjected to interrogation, but if Hamas militants are using hospitals to shield their operations and trying to blend into a hospital setting, the IDF can't just say "welp, its a hospital, can't go there."
I dunno man. Women and children execution style doesn’t really ever have a “ends justify the means” level does it?
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I dunno man. Women and children execution style doesn’t really ever have a “ends justify the means” level does it?
Yet you automatically assume that the IDF is executing the elderly and women/children?
The IDF has certainly been reckless and wanton in their bombings and killed many civilians in pursuit of their targets, but the side pointing fingers at the IDF "executing" civilians and dumping them in a mass grave...is the one that executed hundreds of civilians at close range, many while bound and gagged. So Hamas directly accusing the IDF of doing that is amusing.
Also, that article literally states the UN didn't have evidence to corroborate the story and it was coming from Hamas...which was also unsubstantiated. There is plenty to criticize Israel about as this continues to drag on without gobbling up Hamas driven hearsay
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Yet you automatically assume that the IDF is executing the elderly and women/children?
The IDF has certainly been reckless and wanton in their bombings and killed many civilians in pursuit of their targets, but the side pointing fingers at the IDF "executing" civilians and dumping them in a mass grave...is the one that executed hundreds of civilians at close range, many while bound and gagged. So Hamas directly accusing the IDF of doing that is amusing.
Also, that article literally states the UN didn't have evidence to corroborate the story and it was coming from Hamas...which was also unsubstantiated. There is plenty to criticize Israel about as this continues to drag on without gobbling up Hamas driven hearsay
Yeah, this is where I was coming from and why I thought that article read like a Rorschach test. I had to read it multiple times to understand what had been substantiated and what was just rumor. If the IDF were executing women and children in cold blood, that would obviously be straight up evil. But I haven't seen any reason to believe that is happening, nor, for example, that the IDF intentionally targeted the World Central Kitchen convoy (this is a great article on that - https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-aid-workers-killed-2d08786a9839dfc402632c7ca745acca (https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-aid-workers-killed-2d08786a9839dfc402632c7ca745acca)).
Like you said Wags, Israel needs to be criticized on a number of fronts - insufficient discrimination between Hamas and civilian targets, siege-style warfare leading to starvation, and military forays into areas they had themselves previously designated as civilian retreat zones. But this notion that they are tying up and executing civilians and dumping them in mass graves is dangerous misinformation.
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Yet you automatically assume that the IDF is executing the elderly and women/children?
The IDF has certainly been reckless and wanton in their bombings and killed many civilians in pursuit of their targets, but the side pointing fingers at the IDF "executing" civilians and dumping them in a mass grave...is the one that executed hundreds of civilians at close range, many while bound and gagged. So Hamas directly accusing the IDF of doing that is amusing.
Also, that article literally states the UN didn't have evidence to corroborate the story and it was coming from Hamas...which was also unsubstantiated. There is plenty to criticize Israel about as this continues to drag on without gobbling up Hamas driven hearsay
Yeah, this is where I was coming from and why I thought that article read like a Rorschach test. I had to read it multiple times to understand what had been substantiated and what was just rumor. If the IDF were executing women and children in cold blood, that would obviously be straight up evil. But I haven't seen any reason to believe that is happening, nor, for example, that the IDF intentionally targeted the World Central Kitchen convoy (this is a great article on that - https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-aid-workers-killed-2d08786a9839dfc402632c7ca745acca (https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-aid-workers-killed-2d08786a9839dfc402632c7ca745acca)).
Like you said Wags, Israel needs to be criticized on a number of fronts - insufficient discrimination between Hamas and civilian targets, siege-style warfare leading to starvation, and military forays into areas they had themselves previously designated as civilian retreat zones. But this notion that they are tying up and executing civilians and dumping them in mass graves is dangerous misinformation.
Are you suggesting they didn’t find a mass grave by a hospital that had been under siege for weeks full of people bound, in medical clothing, and with medical devices still attached to them?
Or are you suggesting because Oct 7th occurred then it had to have been the perpetrators of that? The IDF don’t execute people.
https://thehill.com/policy/international/4477340-un-experts-reports-executions-sexual-assault-israeli-soldiers/amp/
The existence of these graves are not misinformation. But went with Occam's Razor based on the details of the article.
I’ve been wrong before though. Was told there’s simply no way the IDF would attack a hospital when the rocket incident happened.
Tens of thousands of civilians are dead, you tend to gravitate towards the cause of that when things like this are discovered.
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Are you suggesting they didn’t find a mass grave by a hospital that had been under siege for weeks full of people bound, in medical clothing, and with medical devices still attached to them?
The existence of these graves are not misinformation. But went with Occam's Razor based on the details of the article.
No one is suggesting the graves aren't real. If you carefully read the article, the IDF says they never buried anyone, except for already-buried bodies they exhumed when searching for dead Israeli hostages. Hamas themselves acknowledges that a "large number of people were buried in makeshift cemetaries" by Palestinians, becuase they accuse the IDF of treating those bodies poorly. Its quite a jump to "the IDF is executing innocents and dumping them in mass graves." That jump isn't Occam's Razor, its confirmation bias.
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No one is suggesting the graves aren't real. If you carefully read the article, the IDF says they never buried anyone, except for already-buried bodies they exhumed when searching for dead Israeli hostages. Hamas themselves acknowledges that a "large number of people were buried in makeshift cemetaries" by Palestinians, becuase they accuse the IDF of treating those bodies poorly. Its quite a jump to "the IDF is executing innocents and dumping them in mass graves." That jump isn't Occam's Razor, its confirmation bias.
For you and JWags, at what point does Israel not get the benefit of the doubt.
They provide minimal to no evidence of their claims, have been caught in numerous lies, and leaks indicate that they have completely disregarded civilian casualties.
No other nation in the world would be given this much leeway with so many documented atrocities committed. The only reason there aren't security council resolutions condemning their actions is because the US vetoes them.
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For you and JWags, at what point does Israel not get the benefit of the doubt.
They never provide evidence of their claims, have been caught in numerous lies, and leaks indicate that they have completely disregarded civilian casualties.
No other nation in the world would be given this much leeway with so many documented atrocities committed. The only reason there aren't security council resolutions condemning their actions is because the US vetoes them.
I guess I would say first that I disagree with the bolded. Because of the US's relationship with Israel, we think that Israel somehow has a privileged status in the international community - but that isn't true. Israel is the most condemned nation at the UN. Depending on the eye of the beholder, you can take that as either evidence of Israel's consistent wrongdoing or a commentary on the value of UN condemnation, but its not like Israel "gets away" with things other countries don't.
And I'm not sure what "getting leeway" would mean, anyway. Like - should the international community levy economic sanctions against Israel for its actions in Gaza? Between paying lip service to "Israel's right to defend itself" and saying that the security counsel should pass condemning resolutions, there is a lot of vague posturing without any real moral clarity on how Israel should be proceeding.
For me the question isn't when should Israel stop getting the benefit of the doubt, its - whats the alternative? Take the Gaza hospital situation. We know Hamas siphons aid away from the Gazan people to fund its militant goals and operates in tunnels under hospitals (if not also blending into hospital environments above ground). Its a really weird solution to say "but because its a hospital, that is off limits for Israel, we just have to keep letting Hamas do that." As I mentioned, Israel is absolutely doing a piss poor job defining realistic victory conditions and increasingly at sufficiently minimizing collateral damage. But at the end of the day, you have to default to one of "Israel has a right to defend itself" or "Israel shouldn't get the benefit of the doubt" more than the other. For me, its the former until their modus operandi is morally worse than the vision put forward by their enemies. And we aren't there.
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I guess I would say first that I disagree with the bolded. Because of the US's relationship with Israel, we think that Israel somehow has a privileged status in the international community - but that isn't true. Israel is the most condemned nation at the UN. Depending on the eye of the beholder, you can take that as either evidence of Israel's consistent wrongdoing or a commentary on the value of UN condemnation, but its not like Israel "gets away" with things other countries don't.
And I'm not sure what "getting leeway" would mean, anyway. Like - should the international community levy economic sanctions against Israel for its actions in Gaza? Between paying lip service to "Israel's right to defend itself" and saying that the security counsel should pass condemning resolutions, there is a lot of vague posturing without any real moral clarity on how Israel should be proceeding.
For me the question isn't when should Israel stop getting the benefit of the doubt, its - whats the alternative? Take the Gaza hospital situation. We know Hamas siphons aid away from the Gazan people to fund its militant goals and operates in tunnels under hospitals (if not also blending into hospital environments above ground). Its a really weird solution to say "but because its a hospital, that is off limits for Israel, we just have to keep letting Hamas do that." As I mentioned, Israel is absolutely doing a piss poor job defining realistic victory conditions and increasingly at sufficiently minimizing collateral damage. But at the end of the day, you have to default to one of "Israel has a right to defend itself" or "Israel shouldn't get the benefit of the doubt" more than the other. For me, its the former until their modus operandi is morally worse than the vision put forward by their enemies. And we aren't there.
The bolded should be read with the sentence following it. The key part is that no actions are ever taken against Israel, because we protect them in the security council.
Next, Israel does have a right to defend itself. It is hard for anyone to argue what they are doing right now is defending themselves.
If you are a person in the West Bank, your homes are raided, and burned to the ground by settlers, family/friends shot by settlers, who are helped by the IDF. The IDF rapes and murders civilians, and the only punishment is that those involved aren't allowed to be promoted for 2-years (these are conclusions by US investigations). Those events are documented facts. Is that them defending themselves? At what point are they no better than Hamas, when they act in that way?
Pretty much everything else you bring up, is the IDF account of what occurred, which contradicts photographic evidence, and eyewitness reports. The IDF has been caught in numerous lies. The IDF doesn't provide evidence to justify their claims. When does someone like you stop giving them the benefit of the doubt?
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At what point are they no better than Hamas, when they act in that way?
So its this, right here. We've entered this insane place where a significant portion of America doesn't think Israel is better than Hamas. The best comparison for Israel's quagmire in Gaza is America's war in Afghanistan - not militant Islamists. When you say that you can't argue Israel is defending themselves right now, that's no more true than it is to say that America wasn't defending itself in Afghanistan.
Let's say I "stop giving Israel the benefit of the doubt" - to the degree that matters for anything - and all IDF personnel leave Gaza tomorrow. How long until Hamas is again stealing international aid to fund militant incursions (to the extent they aren't now) and tunneling under hospitals again? How long until rockets are flying into Israel again? I can come up with a laundry list of Israeli policies toward the Palestinians that I think are awful, and the West Bank is at the top of the list. Bibi should be removed from office yesterday, if not put in jail. But the outrage is coming from a privileged place of not actually having to consider any alternatives.
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Yet you automatically assume that the IDF is executing the elderly and women/children?
The IDF has certainly been reckless and wanton in their bombings and killed many civilians in pursuit of their targets, but the side pointing fingers at the IDF "executing" civilians and dumping them in a mass grave...is the one that executed hundreds of civilians at close range, many while bound and gagged. So Hamas directly accusing the IDF of doing that is amusing.
Also, that article literally states the UN didn't have evidence to corroborate the story and it was coming from Hamas...which was also unsubstantiated. There is plenty to criticize Israel about as this continues to drag on without gobbling up Hamas driven hearsay
I hate to tell you that using the excuse of, "well they did it also" isn't a great one when you're trying to defend horrible actions. One group involved is a government entity and the other is a terrorist organization. The world should PROBABLY hold one of them to a higher standard. Bombing places into rubble to kill one or two fighters with the knowledge that there are civilians inside is still kinda murderous. Israel can claim that Hamas uses human shields in any building they want to destroy and as long as they say, "well there was a terrorist in there" they're allowed to annihilate it... who cares if women and children are maimed, disfigured, or turned into a red mist as long as they got their guy!
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Hamas attacked Israel on Oct. 7. War's a bitch. Sometimes you're the hydrant and sometimes you're the dog. Israel would have squashed Hamas in a NY minute if Blinken and Biden/Obama would STFU, aina?
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I hate to tell you that using the excuse of, "well they did it also" isn't a great one when you're trying to defend horrible actions. One group involved is a government entity and the other is a terrorist organization. The world should PROBABLY hold one of them to a higher standard. Bombing places into rubble to kill one or two fighters with the knowledge that there are civilians inside is still kinda murderous. Israel can claim that Hamas uses human shields in any building they want to destroy and as long as they say, "well there was a terrorist in there" they're allowed to annihilate it... who cares if women and children are maimed, disfigured, or turned into a red mist as long as they got their guy!
I'm not using the "well they also did it" as an excuse. I'm using it, as Burrow alluded to, in highlighting the fact that the claims are being made directly by Hamas. And without firm evidence to support the allegations against Israel, the burden of proof is on the accuser and that's literal terrorists.
I already said their bombing is reckless and too heavy handed. Even reasonable supporters of Israel can admit that. But thats a far cry from accepting Hamas at their word without substantiating evidence because you think the IDF is horrible. Like Burrow said, its not a soverign nation/government thats reporting from the other side. Its Hamas, and people are just glossing over it cause "Israhell bad!"
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I guess I would say first that I disagree with the bolded. Because of the US's relationship with Israel, we think that Israel somehow has a privileged status in the international community - but that isn't true. Israel is the most condemned nation at the UN. Depending on the eye of the beholder, you can take that as either evidence of Israel's consistent wrongdoing or a commentary on the value of UN condemnation, but its not like Israel "gets away" with things other countries don't.
Of course they do. If this was the Balkans there would be worldwide condemnation and sanctions. But the Israeli government and its lobbying groups have a stranglehold on the US government. Not to mention the US uses Israel as a testing grounds for weapons as well as a massive unsinkable aircraft carrier in the region. Consider that Israel is absolutely a client state of the USA.
And I'm not sure what "getting leeway" would mean, anyway. Like - should the international community levy economic sanctions against Israel for its actions in Gaza? Between paying lip service to "Israel's right to defend itself" and saying that the security counsel should pass condemning resolutions, there is a lot of vague posturing without any real moral clarity on how Israel should be proceeding.
Yes. There should be sanctions for bad behavior. There is no other way to force a country to conform to international norms. At some point "Israel defending itself" went bye bye. This doesn't look like defense. It looks like wanton destruction, civilian slaughter, and no end in sight. If Israel wants the hostages back they should agree to a ceasefire and an exchange. Personally, I doubt very much that Hamas can produce as many hostages as Israel is still looking for. But this has to end, and all wars end in peace, eventually.
For me the question isn't when should Israel stop getting the benefit of the doubt, its - whats the alternative? Take the Gaza hospital situation. We know Hamas siphons aid away from the Gazan people to fund its militant goals and operates in tunnels under hospitals (if not also blending into hospital environments above ground). Its a really weird solution to say "but because its a hospital, that is off limits for Israel, we just have to keep letting Hamas do that." As I mentioned, Israel is absolutely doing a piss poor job defining realistic victory conditions and increasingly at sufficiently minimizing collateral damage. But at the end of the day, you have to default to one of "Israel has a right to defend itself" or "Israel shouldn't get the benefit of the doubt" more than the other. For me, its the former until their modus operandi is morally worse than the vision put forward by their enemies. And we aren't there.
The alternative is stop. Pick up the pieces of millions of people's broken lives. There will be enmity for years. Also, don't worry, there are no more hospitals to bomb in Gaza. There are many fewer doctors to work at those hospitals since they've been killed. Israel isn't doing a piss poor job of defining realistic victory conditions. They aren't doing it at all. "Destroying Hamas" isn't realistic. In a patch of land that size there will be fighters hiding for decades. There will ALWAYS be a reason to fight Israel as long as there is no way to compensate all of the Palestinians that have been forcefully displaced since the nakba. People can dream about a two state solutions, but there is no trust from either side. The continued forceful displacement of Palestinians in the West Bank is a perfect example. If you're going to lose everything you own including your home and the land under your feet to someone who showed up and kicked you and your family out how would you respond? How would an Israeli family respond? I will reiterate the saying I've been using for months. You can't destroy an ideology at the end of a barrel of a gun.
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Hamas attacked Israel on Oct. 7. War's a bitch. Sometimes you're the hydrant and sometimes you're the dog. Israel would have squashed Hamas in a NY minute if Blinken and Biden/Obama would STFU, aina?
Look how well the US accomplished its mission in Iraq and Afghanistan. We pissed all over that fire hydrant and what do we have to show for it. The US spent trillions of dollars, thousands of lives and decades to prove that you can't kill all the extremists. You just create more.
But you're not exactly a historian, are you?
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I'm not using the "well they also did it" as an excuse. I'm using it, as Burrow alluded to, in highlighting the fact that the claims are being made directly by Hamas. And without firm evidence to support the allegations against Israel, the burden of proof is on the accuser and that's literal terrorists.
I already said their bombing is reckless and too heavy handed. Even reasonable supporters of Israel can admit that. But thats a far cry from accepting Hamas at their word without substantiating evidence because you think the IDF is horrible. Like Burrow said, its not a soverign nation/government thats reporting from the other side. Its Hamas, and people are just glossing over it cause "Israhell bad!"
There is an incredible double standard that applies here. Both sides are waging not just a war, but a strong propaganda war as well. Prior to 10/7 the numbers that Hamas put out for deaths etc were believed. Now they're not for some reason. Same goes for Israel. There are a lot of people (especially politicians who benefit financially) who accept whatever Israel says. It doesn't matter if what they've said has been proven to be false. Those lies are pushed and propagated and repeated until they are made truth.
Both sides lie their asses off. But one side always gets the benefit of the doubt in the mainstream press of the USA.
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Look how well the US accomplished its mission in Iraq and Afghanistan. We pissed all over that fire hydrant and what do we have to show for it. The US spent trillions of dollars, thousands of lives and decades to prove that you can't kill all the extremists. You just create more.
But you're not exactly a historian, are you?
It’s hilarious that’s the narrative they’re going with. The billions of dollars and military support to Israel isn’t real, I guess.
The problem is Israel leadership and the people of Israel know it but the Fox News brigade is ignoring that
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I also think you can't underestimate the damage that Israel is doing in the United States right now. All of the sympathy that 10/7 generated has been washed away. The next generation of political leaders is not going to be supporting them like the previous.
Frankly I think it is remarkable that country's like Saudi Arabia and Jordan haven't been more vocal here. They know the true agitator is Iran, but Israel is caught up too much in their internal politics and their revenge to see the big picture.
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There is an incredible double standard that applies here. Both sides are waging not just a war, but a strong propaganda war as well. Prior to 10/7 the numbers that Hamas put out for deaths etc were believed. Now they're not for some reason. Same goes for Israel. There are a lot of people (especially politicians who benefit financially) who accept whatever Israel says. It doesn't matter if what they've said has been proven to be false. Those lies are pushed and propagated and repeated until they are made truth.
Both sides lie their asses off. But one side always gets the benefit of the doubt in the mainstream press of the USA.
Do you truly believe there is no difference between Israel and Hamas? Not snarky, legitimate question. You don't have to absolve Israel of blame or war crimes to differentiate.
If you need a damning indictment of Bibi, look no further than the fact that the above even comes into question.
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Do you truly believe there is no difference between Israel and Hamas? Not snarky, legitimate question. You don't have to absolve Israel of blame or war crimes to differentiate.
If you need a damning indictment of Bibi, look no further than the fact that the above even comes into question.
Of course there is a difference. And at the end of the day neither of the two governments have their citizens best interest at heart.
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So it’s this, right here. We've entered this insane place where a significant portion of America doesn't think Israel is better than Hamas.
Actually we’ve entered a place even more insane than that. Our elite universities are filled with teachers and students who think than Hamas are the good guys. “I am Hamas!” Is their battle cry. Nice.
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This country has lost its moral compass. All politicians sell out for the almighty vote. We have no judges and prosecutors you uphold the law. This country is so fooked it may never recover, aina?
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Actually we’ve entered a place even more insane than that. Our elite universities are filled with teachers and students who think than Hamas are the good guys. “I am Hamas!” Is their battle cry. Nice.
Well obviously that's a ridiculous sentiment. And even more ridiculous is the antisemetic language and actions, including violence, that is part of this.
But that has nothing to do with Israel's actions in Gaza, which can most certainly be condemned while not agreeing with the aforementioned protesters.
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This country has lost its moral compass. All politicians sell out for the almighty vote. We have no judges and prosecutors you uphold the law. This country is so fooked it may never recover, aina?
Thanks, boomers
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Actually we’ve entered a place even more insane than that. Our elite universities are filled with teachers and students who think than Hamas are the good guys. “I am Hamas!” Is their battle cry. Nice.
Lol.
Someone is watching too much Fox News.
But your boy Tom Cotton says it's exactly like 1930s Germany and the military must be deployed to college campuses, so it must be true.
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This country has lost its moral compass. All politicians sell out for the almighty vote. We have no judges and prosecutors who uphold the law. This country is so fooked it may never recover, aina?
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This country has lost its moral compass. All politicians sell out for the almighty vote. We have no judges and prosecutors you uphold the law. This country is so fooked it may never recover, aina?
Fear and control.
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This country has lost its moral compass. All politicians sell out for the almighty vote. We have no judges and prosecutors you uphold the law. This country is so fooked it may never recover, aina?
Grandpa rant
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At some point "Israel defending itself" went bye bye. This doesn't look like defense. It looks like wanton destruction, civilian slaughter, and no end in sight. If Israel wants the hostages back they should agree to a ceasefire and an exchange. Personally, I doubt very much that Hamas can produce as many hostages as Israel is still looking for.
The alternative is stop. Pick up the pieces of millions of people's broken lives. There will be enmity for years.
Okay but this is another striking double standard. The idea that after 10/7, it is incumbent on Israel to just return to the 10/6 status quo is bizarre to me. We have come to expect and accept an ambient level of violence from Iran's proxies such that we rely on the Iron Dome and bunkers in each Israeli residence to maintain any sense of broader peace. The laughably low expectation that traditional rules of territorial sovereignty and violence don't apply to Hamas and Hezbollah is disrespectful. Gazans should have to live under Hamas's thumb and accept border violence with Israel because we're afraid of the collateral damage of the alternative? The degree to which Hamas's actions shoudl be imputed to Gaza generally was always an elephant in the room of how one judge's Israel response. The IDF is losing me now that they are continuing into Rafah, but I always thought that the endgame here was an occupation and buffer zone of parts of Gaza, and it was hard for me to fault Israel for that despite the optics.
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This country has lost its moral compass. All politicians sell out for the almighty vote. We have no judges and prosecutors you uphold the law. This country is so fooked it may never recover, aina?
Jack Smith and other prosecutors are working like hell to uphold the law. I join you in hoping they succeed.
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Palestinians don't want a 2 state solution. They were given Gaza between 1994 and 1999, eventually held elections and chose Hamas.
Pure and simple nothing short of the total elimination of Israel will be satisfactory, hey?
#from the river to the sea and Palestine will be free
#neveragain
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Okay but this is another striking double standard. The idea that after 10/7, it is incumbent on Israel to just return to the 10/6 status quo is bizarre to me. We have come to expect and accept an ambient level of violence from Iran's proxies such that we rely on the Iron Dome and bunkers in each Israeli residence to maintain any sense of broader peace. The laughably low expectation that traditional rules of territorial sovereignty and violence don't apply to Hamas and Hezbollah is disrespectful. Gazans should have to live under Hamas's thumb and accept border violence with Israel because we're afraid of the collateral damage of the alternative? The degree to which Hamas's actions shoudl be imputed to Gaza generally was always an elephant in the room of how one judge's Israel response. The IDF is losing me now that they are continuing into Rafah, but I always thought that the endgame here was an occupation and buffer zone of parts of Gaza, and it was hard for me to fault Israel for that despite the optics.
I don't recall saying return to the status quo of 10/6. That would only breed more violence.
Also, I wasn't aware of your Israeli citizenship.
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Also, I wasn't aware of your Israeli citizenship.
What does that have to do with anything?
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Jack Smith and other prosecutors are working like hell to uphold the law. I join you in hoping they succeed.
Well, that’s different.
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What does that have to do with anything?
Nothing. I just didn't know we had Israeli scoopers!
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Nothing. I just didn't know we had Israeli scoopers!
Oh, I see, it was the "we rely on the Iron Dome..." comment. My language was unclear - I was using "we" broadly. E.g. the US had to play a role in intercepting Iran's attack. So I when I say "we" I mean from a gloabl security and de-escalation of hostilities standpoint.
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Oh, I see, it was the "we rely on the Iron Dome..." comment. My language was unclear - I was using "we" broadly. E.g. the US had to play a role in intercepting Iran's attack. So I when I say "we" I mean from a gloabl security and de-escalation of hostilities standpoint.
Oh, okay, makes sense.
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Actually we’ve entered a place even more insane than that. Our elite universities are filled with teachers and students who think than Hamas are the good guys. “I am Hamas!” Is their battle cry. Nice.
Lenny, citation please? Haven't seen that anywhere, and I'm pretty attuned to campus cultures.
For the record, I think the university and police should crack down on these protests, even though they are peaceful protests, because Universities have a right to regulate their private campuses.
I just hope everyone realizes and respects the above the next time that private campuses are doing the same regulating their campuses for when protesters are speaking up about what you/they believe in.
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I don't recall saying return to the status quo of 10/6. That would only breed more violence.
Also, I wasn't aware of your Israeli citizenship.
Too many people use 10/6 as a benchmark imo. There was no ceasefire on 10/6.
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Lenny, citation please? Haven't seen that anywhere, and I'm pretty attuned to campus cultures.
For the record, I think the university and police should crack down on these protests, even though they are peaceful protests, because Universities have a right to regulate their private campuses.
I just hope everyone realizes and respects the above the next time that private campuses are doing the same regulating their campuses for when protesters are speaking up about what you/they believe in.
Cracking down on peaceful protests tends to accomplish the opposite of what the crackdown is intended to do. As we seem to be seeing by their rapid growth around the country.
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Cracking down on peaceful protests tends to accomplish the opposite of what the crackdown is intended to do. As we seem to be seeing by their rapid growth around the country.
Correct. Drive them out of a fairly safe place to protest and you're going to end up with a powder keg somewhere else.
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Shockin' how the elephant in the room...the blatant, rising antisemitism in this country is not only tolerated, but also accepted.
A kinder, gentler nation where hate has no home here, hey?
#bullchit
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Cracking down could mean a number of things. Limiting campus grounds to members of the campus community (students and faculty) for instance. Or limiting the space in which a protest could be held.
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Cracking down could mean a number of things. Limiting campus grounds to members of the campus community (students and faculty) for instance. Or limiting the space in which a protest could be held.
"You can protest where we say and when we say" never has a positive effect. Nor does sending in National Guard and overly militarized police.
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Shockin' how the elephant in the room...the blatant, rising antisemitism in this country is not only tolerated, but also accepted.
A kinder, gentler nation where hate has no home here, hey?
#bullchit
I had forgotten you think young American Jews need to “know their place”. After all they have had a prominent presence in these protests.
Can we get Bill Ackman to weigh in here while we are recycling the classics?
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Cracking down on peaceful protests tends to accomplish the opposite of what the crackdown is intended to do. As we seem to be seeing by their rapid growth around the country.
I agree, and I think it was heavy handed, and enflamed situations. But it was within the rights of the campuses.
Same when far-right groups and/or Antifa were disrupting campuses. It was within the rights of the campus to shut things down.
All I ask for is that people apply their outrage equally in these types of situations, instead of only directing outrage when "your" side is affected.
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"You can protest where we say and when we say" never has a positive effect. Nor does sending in National Guard and overly militarized police.
It's problematic sure, but there are a lot of problems with how the protesters are acting.
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Outstanding of Robert Kraft to end donations to Columbia for failure to protect their students. When all fails, hit 'em in the pocket book, aina?
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Outstanding of Robert Kraft to end donations to Columbia for failure to protect their students. When all fails, hit 'em in the pocket book, aina?
Truth be told, he needed the moolah for more handys.
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It's problematic sure, but there are a lot of problems with how the protesters are acting.
I'm sure the kind folks of Selma and Birmingham in the 60s would have agreed with you.
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I'm sure the kind folks of Selma and Birmingham in the 60s would have agreed with you.
::) OK, I guess you don't want a serious dialogue here.
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::) OK, I guess you don't want a serious dialogue here.
I do, but I understand your POV as a school admin prevents you from having an honest dialogue.
Protests are intended to be inconvenient. Occupying a quad/open space on a college campus isn't even that inconvenient, nor is it dangerous enough that police need to forcibly remove the peaceful protesters. I'm sure you can agree that there shouldn't be a blanket ban on all protests at college campuses, correct? What about this particular situation requires the protest to be broken up?
Removing peaceful protestors typically leads to radicalization and violence.
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If this nonsense isn't dealt with now, commencement will be disrupted throughout much of the country, aina?
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I do, but I understand your POV as a school admin prevents you from having an honest dialogue.
Protests are intended to be inconvenient. Occupying a quad/open space on a college campus isn't even that inconvenient, nor is it dangerous enough that police need to forcibly remove the peaceful protesters. I'm sure you can agree that there shouldn't be a blanket ban on all protests at college campuses, correct? What about this particular situation requires the protest to be broken up?
Removing peaceful protestors typically leads to radicalization and violence.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with protests on college campuses. However protesters should not be able to block access to buildings where students go to class and people go to work. I was under the impression, though I may be wrong, that protesters were blocking such access. If not, then I have no problem.
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If this nonsense isn't dealt with now, commencement will be disrupted throughout much of the country, aina?
I'm glad somebody is thinking about commencement
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There is absolutely nothing wrong with protests on college campuses. However protesters should not be able to block access to buildings where students go to class and people go to work. I was under the impression, though I may be wrong, that protesters were blocking such access. If not, then I have no problem.
If they're blocking building access that sounds like a job for campus security to handle. If violence is involved have the police arrest the offenders blocking access.
Yes, we agree here.
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Speaking of antisemitism, make sure you tell Jewish people how they should vote and tell them they’re not real Jews for not voting the way you tell them to
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I'm glad somebody is thinking about commencement
What’s wildly hilarious about this discussion about campuses is, the protests currently ongoing in Israel will have a far greater impact than what is happening here.
However, campus protest here are an excellent distraction from the Israel populace protesting their current government and their continuing failure that began well before October 6th.
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If this nonsense isn't dealt with now, commencement will be disrupted throughout much of the country, aina?
Only drunk graduates and obnoxious families should be allowed to disrupt commencement.
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Only drunk graduates and obnoxious families should be allowed to disrupt commencement.
All is fair if the commencement speaker is boring
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FWIW, my cousin is a post grad at Columbia and also Jewish. His non-Jewish faculty advisor recommended he and another Jewish researcher in their lab steer clear of campus for a bit and went so far as to set them up with potential other research space in the city for the short term. This was based on feedback he got from other faculty about the reactions to and treatment of Jewish students on and around campus.
There are plenty of peaceful protesters, but there are also plenty of hateful idiots who are shooting from the hip with a bunch of BS.
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Anti-israel or anti-zionist =\= anti-Semitic
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FWIW, my cousin is a post grad at Columbia and also Jewish. His non-Jewish faculty advisor recommended he and another Jewish researcher in their lab steer clear of campus for a bit and went so far as to set them up with potential other research space in the city for the short term. This was based on feedback he got from other faculty about the reactions to and treatment of Jewish students on and around campus.
There are plenty of peaceful protesters, but there are also plenty of hateful idiots who are shooting from the hip with a bunch of BS.
Strange, especially since there are also a bunch of Jewish students who are active in the protests.
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FWIW, my cousin is a post grad at Columbia and also Jewish. His non-Jewish faculty advisor recommended he and another Jewish researcher in their lab steer clear of campus for a bit and went so far as to set them up with potential other research space in the city for the short term. This was based on feedback he got from other faculty about the reactions to and treatment of Jewish students on and around campus.
There are plenty of peaceful protesters, but there are also plenty of hateful idiots who are shooting from the hip with a bunch of BS.
There are too many bigots and bad actors who will be opportunists and try and co-opt events like these. The summer of the George Floyd protests illustrated that again and again.
It's when you leave the gates of campus where the circus has congregated, and national media people are misinterpreting those there as being part of the core on campus demonstration.
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Reports that after the arrests last night the crowd at UT is five times larger today.
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Speaking of antisemitism, make sure you tell Jewish people how they should vote and tell them they’re not real Jews for not voting the way you tell them to
Yes, Doc’s hero really built up his antisemitic points with that one … as if kowtowing to Putin, accepting support from the Proud Boys, pumping up MTG, dining with Fuentes, and praising very fine people who were chanting “Jews will not replace us!” weren’t enough.
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"Four more years...(pause). Four more years...(pause)" what a joke, hey?
https://twitter.com/alexbruesewitz/status/1783532839096447362?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1783532839096447362%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=about%3Ablank
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Doc
That was from the heart.
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Yes, Doc’s hero really built up his antisemitic points with that one … as if kowtowing to Putin, accepting support from the Proud Boys, pumping up MTG, dining with Fuentes, and praising very fine people who were chanting “Jews will not replace us!” weren’t enough.
Just so we're clear, if this gets locked, and I know it will be. I 100% blame you.
You don't need to make everything about Trump or Elon Musk. If you're better than 4elder, start acting like it.
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"Four more years...(pause). Four more years...(pause)" what a joke, hey?
https://twitter.com/alexbruesewitz/status/1783532839096447362?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1783532839096447362%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=about%3Ablank
What does that have to do with Israel’s quagmire?
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What quagmire? Doesn't seem like there is one accordin' to The Jerusalem Post, hey?
https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-792001
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What quagmire? Doesn't seem like there is one accordin' to The Jerusalem Post, hey?
https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-792001
Huh. Here’s an article from today, hey?
https://m.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-798695
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"Four more years...(pause). Four more years...(pause)" what a joke, hey?
https://twitter.com/alexbruesewitz/status/1783532839096447362?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1783532839096447362%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=about%3Ablank
Lol what a snowflake
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it's a good thing weekend's release of those billion$ of dollar$ to Iran can only be used for humanitarian purposes, but the mooolas say otherwise? it's their money to use as it pleases?
fool weekend once, twice, three times? aww the hell with it
I thought he said DON'T
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You don't need to make everything about Trump or Elon Musk.
Damn - I forgot to mention Musk.
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Here’s what you’re not being told: The most pressing threats to our safety as Jewish students do not come from tents on campus. Instead, they come from the Columbia administration inviting police onto campus, certain faculty members, and third-party organizations that dox undergraduates. Frankly, I regret the fact that writing to confirm the safety of Jewish Ivy League students feels justified in the first place. I have not seen many pundits hand-wringing over the safety of my Palestinian colleagues mourning the deaths of family members, or the destruction of Gaza’s cherished universities.
https://zeteo.com/p/i-am-a-jewish-student-at-columbia
I Am a Jewish Student at Columbia. Don’t Believe What You’re Being Told About ‘Campus Antisemitism’
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1-point plan to solve this new Biggest Problem In America:
Call in the military and introduce the protesters to darkness.
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1-point plan to solve this new Biggest Problem In America:
Call in the military and introduce the protesters to darkness.
https://twitter.com/prem_thakker/status/1783543295135617195
Prem Thakker
@prem_thakker
Think about how fast this country sent hordes of riot police with tear gas, batons, and tasers to arrest anti-war students & their teachers.
Now think about every medical bill you've paid, every homeless person you've seen, every school that relies on bake sales to buy supplies.
12:07 PM · Apr 25, 2024
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676K
Views
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So what you're saying is that brilliant, failproof plan has a chance?!?!
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So what you're saying is that brilliant, failproof plan has a chance?!?!
Hey man, some kids gotta die before anyone takes it seriously!
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In 2019, Texas Gov. Greg Abbott proudly signed a law protecting free speech on college campuses in common outdoor areas as long as they were not breaking the law or disrupting the regular functioning of the school.
This week, he sent in 100 state troopers to arrest those protesting Israel even though the protesters were not breaking the law or disrupting the regular functioning of the school.
From the Washington Post:
Abbott’s office did not respond to a request for comment on the rationale for his action nor criticism of it. But on social media, the governor responded approvingly to the law enforcement response, saying the protesters “belong in jail” and that any students taking part in “hate-filled, antisemitic protests” at public colleges should be expelled.
State Sen. Sarah Eckhardt (D), whose district includes the Austin campus, said the politics involved in the response “is not going to let this go, and that’s deeply, deeply troubling.”
“I’ve not yet heard any evidence of property damage or personal injury, and so the response — the police response — seems to have been in anticipation of something that didn’t happen, that ultimately didn’t happen,” Eckhardt said.
On Thursday, protesters said the show of force ordered by Abbott was striking but not surprising.
“Gov. Abbott is taking a very political opportunity to enforce his agenda, a very right-wing agenda focused on control, not on governance,” said Chelsea Collier, a doctoral student at the school of information and a native Texan who spent her entire academic career at UT.
Varun Jawarani, 21, a senior from Austin majoring in computer science, said the message he received was “Don’t have a dissenting opinion from state government or we’ll send in the police.”
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Abbott is a fascist authoritarian.
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From the NYT DealBook newsletter's Andrew Ross Sorkin:
Many business leaders have told me they are deeply concerned about incidents of harassment against Jewish students that have taken place at and around universities like Columbia and appear to be increasing.
Inside corner offices, there has been a lot of hand-wringing about the most blatant examples, like antisemitic signs and chants or the assault of an Israeli student. But there has been little action from corporations, which have a synergistic relationship with the schools where they recruit employees.
Some executives are privately pondering what they can do. The most common course of action so far has been to pull back on individual donations. The New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft, for example, said this week that he was “no longer comfortable supporting Columbia University.”
But businesses have other levers that affect universities, and some of those levers would undoubtedly put more pressure on universities to take action against antisemitism.
Here’s one out-of-the-box thought experiment: Most businesses scrutinize their vendors quite carefully and maintain approved lists of vendors whose policies align with their own. Companies could scrutinize universities, a main source of their talent, as they would any other vendor. They could tell universities that they won’t hire their students unless the schools take decisive action to stem antisemitism.
After all, no company in this day and age would use an executive search firm with employees who openly engaged in antisemitism.
To be clear, companies would need to define antisemitism and the satisfactory actions to mitigate it — currently both topics of fierce debate.
And it is important to differentiate between peaceful protesters against Israel’s war in Gaza (who include many Jewish students, and who say they are being unfairly painted as antisemitic to distract from their objectives) and people who are calling for the death of Jews, harassing students and creating an unsafe environment. A decision to stop hiring all students from a particular school would inevitably punish some who have nothing to do with the worst offenders on campus.
But these corporate actions would put real pressure — including the pressure that would inevitably come from those uninvolved students — on college administrations to police blatant antisemitism.
There is another pressure point that Wall Street, private equity and venture capital firms may uniquely have to influence action against antisemitism on university campuses: They could threaten to stop managing their endowments. Most elite universities in America rely on venture capital firms for their relatively high investment returns.
Many university endowments send questionnaires and conduct due diligence on the internal policies of the Wall Street firms — examining their D.E.I. policies, for example. What would happen if the Wall Street firms also sent such questionnaires to the universities before deciding to work with them as clients?
“That’s a really interesting thought experiment,” said Charlie Eaton, the author of “Bankers in the Ivory Tower: The Troubling Rise of Financiers in U.S. Higher Education” and an associate professor of sociology at the University of California, Merced. He said that such a decision would most likely have a big impact on the decision-making of universities, but would also raise big questions about “who is able to exercise what kind of power” in our economy.
Businesses may be unlikely to rush into formally patrolling universities’ policies by adopting either of these theoretical maneuvers, but they might amp up the pressure in some other way through their informal preferences. As Darren Woods, the chief executive of Exxon Mobil, said of campus protests in an interview with CNBC this week: “If that action or those protests reflect the values of the campuses where they’re doing it, we wouldn’t be interested in recruiting students from those campuses.”
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There have been 100's of reports of assaults, and hate crimes against Palestinian and Arab students on Columbia's campus, including one where 8 students were assaulted with a chemical weapon (skunk spray) by former Israeli soldiers. Six of these students were hospitalized. The perpetrators weren't even arrested (after months 1 was finally suspended; and even then there was some Jewish public outcry about discrimination against the suspended student, who assaulted people). These attacks and hate crimes are almost never reported on. And either investigations are minimal, or non-existent.
There have also been assaults on Israeli students, they are actually significantly smaller in number, but they reach the front page of all major news outlets, and it is discussed as creating an unsafe environment for Jewish students.
Then suddenly, some donors are threatening defunding Columbia if they don't crack down harder on mostly peaceful protesters. They apparently have no problem with the 100's of reports of assaults and hate crimes against Palestinian/Arab students, and for a long time they covered up that over 300 female students were sexually assaulted by a Columbia University physician. None of these events were worthy of "defunding" Columbia, or congressional calls to action.
None of these students should have to deal with being unsafe on a campus, and all these assaults are wrong.
But, if we are going to have an honest discussion on the problems on campuses, incidents and reports need to be treated equally. They are not.
This is evident at Columbia, it is evident at UT, where Abbott proudly broke his own laws, and pretty much every campus seeing protests. It is evident in the narratives on here, and in the media.
It is in part why there are these protests to being with. They coincided with the Columbia University president speaking about anti-semitism on campus, because of congressional demands. The focus was on anti-semitism and cracking down on speech by students (including Jewish students) opposition to Israeli military action, and human rights abuses against Palestinians. What was left out of the questioning, and congressional actions, was the 100's of attacks and hate crimes against Palestinian/Arab students.
If these were "blue-lives matter" or "all-lives matter" protests being treated this way, people would be up in arms about the suppression of free speech. And any assaults of counter-protestors would be blamed on "Antifa-instigators".
How would people on here react, if this was a crackdown on encapments/protests by Jewish students? Encampments setting up Shabbat tables for all the victims of the Oct. 7th attacks, provided that they were equally disruptive and created an equally "unsafe environment feeling" for some students.
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tik tok shows a 50-1 pro-terrorist vs pro Israeli
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tik tok shows a 50-1 pro-terrorist vs pro Israeli
Source?
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Where are all those tough Texas police when the uvalde shooting was happening?
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Any instances of the state breaking up peaceful protest is literally a first amendment violation.
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Where are all those tough Texas police when the uvalde shooting was happening?
Turning tail.
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This is a good article.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/27/opinions/yale-student-palestinian-protests-berlin/index.html (https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/27/opinions/yale-student-palestinian-protests-berlin/index.html)
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Source?
https://www.instagram.com/theisraelguys/reel/C3GG6dnoMDt/
depends on the source I guess, this one states 36-1 and other sources are 8-1
still pretty wide chasm-hard to believe the world has developed such a pro terrorist viewpoint...until their ass gets bombed or wife gets raped and beheaded, I guess it's the way it goes-sad
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https://www.instagram.com/theisraelguys/reel/C3GG6dnoMDt/
depends on the source I guess, this one states 36-1 and other sources are 8-1
still pretty wide chasm-hard to believe the world has developed such a pro terrorist viewpoint...until their ass gets bombed or wife gets raped and beheaded, I guess it's the way it goes-sad
That's not a source, and pro-palestinian does not equal pro-terrorist. 35% of Israeli Jews want a 2-state solution, by your assessment, and your sources assessment, they would be pro-terrorist.
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https://www.instagram.com/theisraelguys/reel/C3GG6dnoMDt/
depends on the source I guess, this one states 36-1 and other sources are 8-1
still pretty wide chasm-hard to believe the world has developed such a pro terrorist viewpoint...until their ass gets bombed or wife gets raped and beheaded, I guess it's the way it goes-sad
The "The Israel Guys."
Very credible.
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The "The Israel Guys."
Very credible.
Yeah rocket falls for pretty much anything that reinforces his world view.
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100% of Palestinians want to abolish the State of Israel.
#fromthejordanrivertothemediterreanseaandpalestinewillbefree
#neveragain
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100% of Palestinians want to abolish the State of Israel.
#fromthejordanrivertothemediterreanseaandpalestinewillbefree
#neveragain
Should be 1 secular state with equal rights for all citizens
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Palestinians are free to emigrate to Israel, become citizens, and live freely, hey?
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Palestinians are free to emigrate to Israel, become citizens, and live freely, hey?
Israel is a secular state?
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Palestinians are free to emigrate to Israel, become citizens, and live freely, hey?
LOL. No they aren't. Where did you get that?
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Well, they could and tens of thousands did until 2003, hey?
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Well, they could and tens of thousands did until 2003, hey?
In other words, you were wrong. Add it to the list.
I guess 21 years out of date is pretty good for you so I should probably cut you some slack.
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100% of Palestinians want to abolish the State of Israel.
#fromthejordanrivertothemediterreanseaandpalestinewillbefree
#neveragain
I'm not even going to ask for a source, because this is 100% made up. Currently 64% of Gazans prefer a 2-state diplomatic solution over an armed struggle.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/gazans-back-two-state-solution-rcna144183 (https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/gazans-back-two-state-solution-rcna144183)
Well, they could and tens of thousands did until 2003, hey?
Also false, Palestinians who either married Israeli citizens, or who had direct family who were Israeli citizens could emigrate. Almost all did.
It was stopped. Now even if a Palestinian marries an Israeli citizen, they cannot move to Israel.
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Hard to differentiate fact from fiction, aina?
https://x.com/Osint613/status/1783523529167692064
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Hard to differentiate fact from fiction, aina?
https://x.com/Osint613/status/1783523529167692064
perhaps for you and rocket
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UW-Madison, UW-Milwaukee students organize pro-Palestinian rallies Monday
https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2024/04/29/uw-madison-uw-milwaukee-students-hold-pro-palestinian-rallies-live/73468026007/
As pro-Palestinian encampments pop up at colleges across the country, student groups have scheduled Monday morning rallies at the University of Wisconsin-Madison and UW-Milwaukee.
Since the Israel-Hamas war began Oct. 7, protests on Wisconsin campuses have been largely peaceful. The Monday rallies are among the first scheduled in the state since New York police arrested more than 100 pro-Palestinian demonstrators at Columbia University, which set off protests at other colleges nationally.
There do not appear to be any protests or major gatherings on the Marquette University campus. However, some Marquette students are in attendance at the UW-Milwaukee demonstration.
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So Columbia has given students a 2:00 p.m. EDT deadline to disband the encampment. If they do not they will face student judicial action.
Man, that's...something.
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'bout tyme, aina?
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'bout tyme, aina?
Shockingly, your love of the Constitution is conditional.
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These have not been peaceful gatherings. Where are the constitutional rights of students, faculty, and staff? Columbia took the easy approach at first hoping it all goes away by encouraging Jewish students to go home and remote learn. Weak sauce respond, hey?
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These have not been peaceful gatherings. Where are the constitutional rights of students, faculty, and staff? Columbia took the easy approach at first hoping it all goes away by encouraging Jewish students to go home and remote learn. Weak sauce respond, hey?
If students are violent, they should arrest them. If students are restricting access to buildings where other sudents learn, faculty teach or staff work, then arrest them. Otherwise they are doing no harm except embarrassing the administration.
Don't get me wrong, as a private institution, they have the legal right to do this. But this is going to result in all sorts of unintended consequences.
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So Columbia has given students a 2:00 p.m. EDT deadline to disband the encampment. If they do not they will face student judicial action.
Man, that's...something.
Photo of the student judicial board:
(https://people.csail.mit.edu/paulfitz/spanish/tt3.jpg)
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These have not been peaceful gatherings. Where are the constitutional rights of students, faculty, and staff? Columbia took the easy approach at first hoping it all goes away by encouraging Jewish students to go home and remote learn. Weak sauce respond, hey?
If others' constitutional rights are being impeded by any protestor, then arrest the protestor.
Otherwise let the protests carry on.
Do you have any evidence of violence or direct threats of violence or other arrestable crimes being committed by protestors?
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Its been reported several places on the internet. Google is your friend, hey?
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Its been reported several places on the internet. Google is your friend, hey?
LOL, dude who breathlessly reports every speck of crime affecting Marquette, tells someone else to look something up after making a claim.
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Its been reported several places on the internet. Google is your friend, hey?
and some also say Soros is funding ALL of the protests
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Of course, twisted old codger that he is, aina?
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84 didn't get da nickname, Source, for nothing, hey?
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Of course, twisted old codger that he is, aina?
How antisemitic of you.
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Of course, now faculty members and students who weren't involved are now encircling the encampment to "protect" it. Not sure the University could have handled this worse. This was an obvious outcome.
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Its been reported several places on the internet. Google is your friend, hey?
I googled. Found nothing substantial or with sufficient evidence.
I guess that settles it.
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First hand account, the UPenn campus includes students from Penn, Temple, and Drexel along with outsiders. Peaceful Muslim service at one time, shouting intifada and other rhyming chants another. No violence from my account, not saying it doesn’t exist at all. Jewish families/students are both scared and supportive, the most vocal in my circle are afraid, angry, and disgusted with the handling of the situation by Penn admin.
My personal opinion is we have to allow the protests, that is nonnegotiable. We can enforce campus policy and safety measures, and we should absolutely protect Jewish students from harm. We should absolutely protect non-Jewish students from harm.
I recently listened to a podcast called Philosophize This Episode 200: Postmodern Subject and “Ideology without Ideology.” I found it thought provoking as it pertains to how we might view the Israel/Palestine conflict through our need to allow for individuality while also trying to find universality. It discusses how we want to be humble, open, inclusive, but are we really just narcissists. It doesn’t directly speak on the conflict, but it is relevant and worth a listen.
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Thanks for sharing, 21
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Thanks for sharing, 21
You’re welcome. I’ll add that a specific sophomore celebration (my son) is being moved from the normal location on the College Green where the encampment is set up to an end of campus where he lives in a high rise with open space. While not ideal, it seems like a compromise at the moment. Of course, this means the encampment is staying for the time being (of course things change rapidly).
Additionally, unlike USC, it doesn’t appear that Penn is cancelling graduation or their annual Hey Day which takes place on Locust Walk and the College Green, the main path through campus. While Locust Walk is within the UPenn campus it remains accessible by law to anyone. I sincerely hope none of these events are cancelled and that none of the protesters physically keep them from happening.
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You’re welcome. I’ll add that a specific sophomore celebration (my son) is being moved from the normal location on the College Green where the encampment is set up to an end of campus where he lives in a high rise with open space. While not ideal, it seems like a compromise at the moment. Of course, this means the encampment is staying for the time being (of course things change rapidly).
Additionally, unlike USC, it doesn’t appear that Penn is cancelling graduation or their annual Hey Day which takes place on Locust Walk and the College Green, the main path through campus. While Locust Walk is within the UPenn campus it remains accessible by law to anyone. I sincerely hope none of these events are cancelled and that none of the protesters physically keep them from happening.
Good decisions by Penn.
Just equally apply the law. Protest without violence or law breaking? Do nothing. Protest with acts of assault, individually targeted speech, etc? Arrest as indicated.
Of course, that becomes significantly complex with agent provocateurs, etc.
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The East Coast schools could learn a thing or two from Northwestern.
Northwestern University officials announced Monday that they have reached an agreement with students and faculty protesting against Israel-Hamas war outlining a plan intended to allow demonstrations to continue while preventing the chaos and occasional violence that has engulfed other campuses across the country.
The deal comes five days after demonstrators established an encampment in Deering Meadow, a popular common area on the Evanston campus. Administrators responded to the protest by banning tents and temporary structures, but they did nothing to enact the new policy as they negotiated with protesters throughout the weekend.
The agreement, which Northwestern President Michael Schill announced in a campus-wide email, requires the immediate removal of tents and sound systems, as well as a commitment that all protesters will adhere to university policies. In return, demonstrations can continue on the meadow through June 1.
Only students and university staff may participate in the protests, according to the deal posted on the university’s website.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/2024/04/29/northwestern-university-reaches-agreement-with-protesters/
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If students are violent, they should arrest them. If students are restricting access to buildings where other sudents learn, faculty teach or staff work, then arrest them. Otherwise they are doing no harm except embarrassing the administration.
Don't get me wrong, as a private institution, they have the legal right to do this. But this is going to result in all sorts of unintended consequences.
They may have the legal right to do this. Depends on their rules and policies and what is and isn't going on at the protests. I suspect there will be several successful (or more likely settled) lawsuits when the dust settles.
From a bystander perspective, they have handled this about as poorly as they could.
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these "peaceful protests" seem to be getting kind of insurrectiony. mobs of unruly people moving in at the indirect direction of tlaib's and Omar's puppy whistles
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these "peaceful protests" seem to be getting kind of insurrectiony. mobs of unruly people moving in at the indirect direction of tlaib's and Omar's puppy whistles
So not really at all like your favorite insurrectionists moving in to attack the Capitol Police and hang the vice president at the direct direction of the then-president of the United States.
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So not really at all like your favorite insurrectionists moving in to attack the Capitol Police and hang the vice president at the direct direction of the then-president of the United States.
as of this morning, i'd like to think you'd have a change of opinion as the terrorists continued involvement nationwide make your exaggerations seem tame by comparison.
btw, you may want to brush up on your definition of "insurrection" as i may even be over stating just a bit myself, but you set the bar. regardless, i'm a little more closer than your out of breath nonsense
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and why are the terrorists allowed to mask up? surely COVID isn't still an issue here even though masks have been ruled impotent or has Dr fettuccine trying to make one last gasp of relevance? maybe, as we are finding out, all of those millions of illegals weekend at Bernie's is flooding the country with are also bringing back measles and other diseases that we had once essentially eradicated. the great unifier is just flooding us with unification it brings a tear(s) to my eye(s) and many others
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and why are the terrorists allowed to mask up? surely COVID isn't still an issue here even though masks have been ruled impotent or has Dr fettuccine trying to make one last gasp of relevance? maybe, as we are finding out, all of those millions of illegals weekend at Bernie's is flooding the country with are also bringing back measles and other diseases that we had once essentially eradicated. the great unifier is just flooding us with unification it brings a tear(s) to my eye(s) and many others
8.5 out of 10
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and why are the terrorists allowed to mask up? surely COVID isn't still an issue here even though masks have been ruled impotent or has Dr fettuccine trying to make one last gasp of relevance? maybe, as we are finding out, all of those millions of illegals weekend at Bernie's is flooding the country with are also bringing back measles and other diseases that we had once essentially eradicated. the great unifier is just flooding us with unification it brings a tear(s) to my eye(s) and many others
If you think that the "illegals" are bringing back these diseases, you are pretty much a dimwit.
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as of this morning, i'd like to think you'd have a change of opinion as the terrorists continued involvement nationwide make your exaggerations seem tame by comparison.
btw, you may want to brush up on your definition of "insurrection" as i may even be over stating just a bit myself, but you set the bar. regardless, i'm a little more closer than your out of breath nonsense
They aren't "terrorists." But yeah occupying buildings isn't great and those who do so should be arrested.
It probably would have been best just to leave the encampment alone.
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If you think that the "illegals" are bringing back these diseases, you are pretty much a dimwit.
Well, it’s definitely not the lunatics no longer having their kids immunized. Can’t imagine why anyone wouldn’t have their kids immunized. Can’t put my finger on it. I’ll just blame illegals instead
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as of this morning, i'd like to think you'd have a change of opinion as the terrorists continued involvement nationwide make your exaggerations seem tame by comparison.
btw, you may want to brush up on your definition of "insurrection" as i may even be over stating just a bit myself, but you set the bar. regardless, i'm a little more closer than your out of breath nonsense
Why are you soft on seditionist felons and antisemites?
I have repeatedly condemned those who are violent and who break the law. You, meanwhile, praise treasonous criminals who beat up cops at the behest of the ex-president, and politicians who advocate for violent vigilantes to harm peaceful people.
maybe, as we are finding out, all of those millions of illegals weekend at Bernie's is flooding the country with are also bringing back measles and other diseases that we had once essentially eradicated.
Wait ... anti-vaxxers are illegals? That explains why the lord smote Aaron Rodgers' achilles tendon, just as it was written in the $60 bible.
Now toddle off to Gettysburg and praise the great Irish-Confederate leader Robert E. Lee, who famously said: "Never fight uphill, me boys."
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They aren't "terrorists." But yeah occupying buildings isn't great and those who do so should be arrested.
It probably would have been best just to leave the encampment alone.
How do we not learn anything from Vietnam protests? Kent state? Iraq protests?
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How do we not learn anything from Vietnam protests? Kent state? Iraq protests?
Because there are always types that believe college kids should believe a certain thing and behave a certain way. And if they don't, the force of the state should be used against them even if they only thing they are doing is freely assembling.
And I will go back to when this whole thing started. Despite what Douchey said, there was a real risk to Israel overreacting. They are doing long term damage to their relationship with their most important ally. No one under the age of ...45?...knows a time when Israel did not have the upper hand in this conflict. (I think I am being generous here.) They see what is happening in Gaza and in the occupied West Bank and wondering who the good guys are here.
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Wondering if Hamas will accept the latest cease fire proposal
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Stating the obvious, it's a horrible situation. I am one who has said that Israel absolutely had the right to go after Hamas after the Oct. 7 attack, even if it led to some collateral damage (as all wars do), and I still believe that. But Netanyahu couldn't have handled the situation much worse with the indiscriminate way his forces killed innocents.
As a result, in the world court of public opinion, he and his country have gone from sympathetic victims to evil aggressors. Both Trump and Biden warned Bibi that would happen, too - and those two can't even agree what day it is.
Not sure how to get out of this sh!tshow. Nobody is.
One thing I'm pretty sure of is that sending in heavily armed, military-gear wearing law enforcement to violently attack college students probably isn't the right thing to do here in the United States. Kent State happened almost exactly 54 years ago, and we apparently haven't learned a damn thing.
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Stating the obvious, it's a horrible situation. I am one who has said that Israel absolutely had the right to go after Hamas after the Oct. 7 attack, even if it led to some collateral damage (as all wars do), and I still believe that. But Netanyahu couldn't have handled the situation much worse with the indiscriminate way his forces killed innocents.
As a result, in the world court of public opinion, he and his country have gone from sympathetic victims to evil aggressors. Both Trump and Biden warned Bibi that would happen, too - and those two can't even agree what day it is.
Not sure how to get out of this sh!tshow. Nobody is.
One thing I'm pretty sure of is that sending in heavily armed, military-gear wearing law enforcement to violently attack college students probably isn't the right thing to do here in the United States. Kent State happened almost exactly 24 years ago, and we apparently haven't learned a damn thing.
mmm
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mmm
Time travel back to 1994
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More like May 1970, aina?
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mmm
As I clearly said ... almost exactly 54 years ago!
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As I clearly said ... almost exactly 54 years ago!
Acid's a hell of a drug, 82.
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Because there are always types that believe college kids should believe a certain thing and behave a certain way. And if they don't, the force of the state should be used against them even if they only thing they are doing is freely assembling.
And I will go back to when this whole thing started. Despite what Douchey said, there was a real risk to Israel overreacting. They are doing long term damage to their relationship with their most important ally. No one under the age of ...45?...knows a time when Israel did not have the upper hand in this conflict. (I think I am being generous here.) They see what is happening in Gaza and in the occupied West Bank and wondering who the good guys are here.
Being "online" isn't always a good thing.
But younger folks are more online than older. Older tend to get media information from cable news, newspaper, maybe Facebook.
Younger get it from insta, tiktok, Twitter, blogs, podcasts.
Most of the horrendous videos/pictures/first hand accounts I've encountered regarding gaza have been on the young spectrum.
It's no wonder the young have a very different opinion of this conflict.
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Has anyone ever met rocket, is this a schtick?
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Has anyone ever met rocket, is this a schtick?
I've met Rocket. Good Guy.
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Dribbler
+1000
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Has anyone ever met rocket, is this a schtick?
For the sake of the dental school, sure hope so. Then again, he’s pals with Keefe and was fine with Keefe doxxing posters
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Has anyone ever met rocket, is this a schtick?
I don't think so, but it makes sense given the out of control Dentist crime wave at the moment.
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I've met Rocket. Good Guy.
Truth.
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I've met Rocket. Good Guy.
Dribbler
+1000
Truth.
😂😂😂😂
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First hand account, the UPenn campus includes students from Penn, Temple, and Drexel along with outsiders. Peaceful Muslim service at one time, shouting intifada and other rhyming chants another. No violence from my account, not saying it doesn’t exist at all. Jewish families/students are both scared and supportive, the most vocal in my circle are afraid, angry, and disgusted with the handling of the situation by Penn admin.
My personal opinion is we have to allow the protests, that is nonnegotiable. We can enforce campus policy and safety measures, and we should absolutely protect Jewish students from harm. We should absolutely protect non-Jewish students from harm.
I recently listened to a podcast called Philosophize This Episode 200: Postmodern Subject and “Ideology without Ideology.” I found it thought provoking as it pertains to how we might view the Israel/Palestine conflict through our need to allow for individuality while also trying to find universality. It discusses how we want to be humble, open, inclusive, but are we really just narcissists. It doesn’t directly speak on the conflict, but it is relevant and worth a listen.
As with many things I think its a matter of bad apples spoiling the bunch for a lot of this. And it gives ammo to both sides. Protests/gatherings are largely peaceful, legal, etc... But there is more than a few bad actors either on the fringes or in the mix of them giving it all a bad image, whether it be gross slogans, aggressive or violent behavior, or just general need for chaos. I dont necessarily agree with their message, but I do feel sorry for the well meaning students who get umbrella'd under this nonsense.
And like so many problematic things at college campuses, its largely caused by non-student outsiders. My campus had a popular bar closed down, an annual festival severely changed, and a number of restrictive policies around certain events due to violence and poor behavior over a number of incidents. 95% of them were perpetrated by people from nearby towns
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If you think that the "illegals" are bringing back these diseases, you are pretty much a dimwit.
Actually, the data disproves your theory
The outbreaks are mainly confined to centers housing”illegals”
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For the sake of the dental school, sure hope so. Then again, he’s pals with Keefe and was fine with Keefe doxxing posters
Nice try leeeko you really are a sad soul
Hey thanks for the endorsement guys! And btw, I am a nice guy just not to people who constantly mischaracterize me
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Nice try leeeko you really are a sad soul
Hey thanks for the endorsement guys! And btw, I am a nice guy just not to people who constantly mischaracterize me
I’m not the one that doxxed scoopers. That’s a sad soul
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Actually, the data disproves your theory
The outbreaks are mainly confined to centers housing”illegals”
That would be false. Yes, migrants are getting these diseases but they are not being "brought" here. They *are* here and have been here for awhile due to vaccine hesitancy.
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Nice try leeeko you really are a sad soul
Hey thanks for the endorsement guys! And btw, I am a nice guy just not to people who constantly mischaracterize me
Any mischaracterization is due to how you characterize yourself here. And I have my doubts its inaccurate.
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Actually, the data disproves your theory
The outbreaks are mainly confined to centers housing”illegals”
Source?
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Source?
It's poor form to ask for sources on this board
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Has anyone ever met rocket, is this a schtick?
A true gentleman, fantastic dentist, and a great friend, hey?
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I hope they're pinging all the phones of these terrorists "students" so they can bash down their doors in the middle of the night and throw em in jail...bwahahahaha hahaha haha oh boy that was a good one. they would never do that, this is America, but it doesn't hurt to dream a little bit. Merritt only does that to the "other people"
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I hope they're pinging all the phones of these terrorists "students" so they can bash down their doors in the middle of the night and throw em in jail...bwahahahaha hahaha haha oh boy that was a good one. they would never do that, this is America, but it doesn't hurt to dream a little bit. Merritt only does that to the "other people"
8.5 out of 10
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Has anyone ever met Sultan? Feel free to create a screen name to hide your identity.
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Any mischaracterization is due to how you characterize yourself here. And I have my doubts its inaccurate.
The royalty check is due tomorrow. Please don’t be late again.
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A true gentleman, fantastic dentist, and a great friend, hey?
(https://i.imgur.com/lNdqn.gif)
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Has anyone ever met Sultan? Feel free to create a screen name to hide your identity.
haven't had the pleasure, but i'm picturing a 6'4" 175 LB lilly white with a brush head buzz, thick black rimmed tri focals with a pen protector in his pocket, 2 cell phones holstered and ready to go
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haven't had the pleasure, but i'm picturing a 6'4" 175 LB lilly white with a brush head buzz, thick black rimmed tri focals with a pen protector in his pocket, 2 cell phones holstered and ready to go
Hasn’t keefe doxxed him?
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haven't had the pleasure, but i'm picturing a 6'4" 175 LB lilly white with a brush head buzz, thick black rimmed tri focals with a pen protector in his pocket, 2 cell phones holstered and ready to go
6’4” is spot on but I haven’t seen 175 since high school. The rest just depends on the day.
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The royalty check is due tomorrow. Please don’t be late again.
I’ve read this three times and have no idea what it means.
Anyway looking at the company rocket keeps tells me all I need to know. Actually makes me think less of him.
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6’4” is spot on but I haven’t seen 175 since high school. The rest just depends on the day.
Can ya dribble to yo left, hey?
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Can ya dribble to yo left, hey?
Probably not anymore. I was never great at it anyway.
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Kudos to Brown. This is a good way to handle this. Let the students state their case to the Board.
https://x.com/insidehighered/status/1785409558334050695?s=46&t=ppua9BCUAa7dWM9-SthPmg
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I’ve read this three times and have no idea what it means.
Anyway looking at the company rocket keeps tells me all I need to know. Actually makes me think less of him.
coming from you validates that i'm in great shape. "weekend" supporters and university types 'splains more than I need to know. no wonder our future students are so...confused with guys like you advising.
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coming from you validates that i'm in great shape. "weekend" supporters and university types 'splains more than I need to know. no wonder our future students are so...confused with guys like you advising.
8 out of 10
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Can ya dribble to yo left, hey?
dribble to his left? hell, doing anything to the right is against his religion
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dribble to his left? hell, doing anything to the right is against his religion
7 out of 10
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dribble to his left? hell, doing anything to the right is against his religion
Now THAT was funny
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coming from you validates that i'm in great shape. "weekend" supporters and university types 'splains more than I need to know. no wonder our future students are so...confused with guys like you advising.
Oh God. I don’t advise any students. That would be awful for everyone involved.
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Probably not anymore. I was never great at it anyway.
Maybe as you make a beeline for the urinal on the right, hey?
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lol
https://x.com/repmtg/status/1785755752432296283?s=46&t=QSiaGcOIKZrrpw0ciZkI5Q
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lol
https://x.com/repmtg/status/1785755752432296283?s=46&t=QSiaGcOIKZrrpw0ciZkI5Q
Christians always have been the real victim in most of these current events!
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Christians always have been the real victim in most of these current events!
Screw you. I have rights.
I read the Constitution in my Bible every day.
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if this doesn't make every American pause, then we're in more trouble than I thought
https://www.foxnews.com/world/university-tehran-professor-says-protesters-us-colleges-will-support-iran-american-conflict
"These (American students) are our people," he continued. "If tensions between America and Iran rise tomorrow or the day after, these are the people who will have to take to the streets to support Iran."
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if this doesn't make every American pause, then we're in more trouble than I thought
https://www.foxnews.com/world/university-tehran-professor-says-protesters-us-colleges-will-support-iran-american-conflict
"These (American students) are our people," he continued. "If tensions between America and Iran rise tomorrow or the day after, these are the people who will have to take to the streets to support Iran."
It made me laugh.
Does that count?
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Is Iran in the room (or Dentist office) with us?
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Is that like saying you trust Putin more than the American intelligence community? Or telling Putin he can do whatever the hell he wants? Or suggesting America should abandon Siuth Korea?
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very nice-keep those enlightened comments coming. it's very revealing of those so far but no surprise, just kind of scary, but not bogey man under the bed scary.
these are the weekend at bernies supporters(including many on this board)
if you couldn't see all this is hooked together before, that is why many of us are afraid for the futures of our kids and so forth.
we are fighting an ideology peeps. weird how many in the woke crowd, the LGBTQ's etc... they don't realize they are being used for their numbers ONLY because their lifestyles do NOT flow with those of the Iranians et.al. also surprising(a little bit) how dumb so many of these pro terrorism kids are
this is the fruits of our educational failures
next up, the lawyers dream come true-lawsuits
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Is that like saying you trust Putin more than the American intelligence community?
no
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We agree about fighting an ideology.
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Yeah I’ve been saying for a while that Iran is behind this and that Israel runs huge risks if they overreact.
Alas…
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this is the fruits of our educational failures
Huh.
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Huh.
well, if you are paying attention Sally, there is a group of UCLA professors and teachers(whatever) up in the balconies with signs saying they support the students(their political "off spring") and the protesters actions
in other words, they are giving out "A+'s" and don't have to take their finals as they hopefully won't be able to now, but remember this is hamas-west
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well, if you are paying attention Sally, there is a group of UCLA professors and teachers(whatever) up in the balconies with signs saying they support the students(their political "off spring") and the protesters actions
in other words, they are giving out "A+'s" and don't have to take their finals as they hopefully won't be able to now, but remember this is hamas-west
Yeah there is a lot of wrong there. Hopefully they will learn how to have empathy for those who are suffering without resorting to antisemitism and/or violence and destruction of property. If it takes the arrest of bad actors so be it.
I hope that you would feel similarly about those who committed violent acts on 1/6 and those who mislead them along the way.
My guess is you don’t though.
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https://x.com/elicalebon/status/1785560131100618798
I can't believe I have to explain what's happening here, but here goes. Elite students of Ivy League schools have glamorized oppression so much that they have now reached role play status to satisfy their fantasies. Here, the students have appropriated the suffering of Gazans and are cosplaying as living through humanitarian crisis. In their American make-believe story where Ivy League infrastructure sets the scene, the students play Gazans and the school administration plays Israel.
Israel (the school) is blocking their "basic humanitarian aid" in this play, and if they don't receive it soon, they will "die of thirst and starvation" (appropriating exact experiences of Gazans). They also destroy upper class buildings and claim them as "liberated" while the students repeat chants in zombie-like chorus, playing the roll of "freedom fighters" destroying Israeli infrastructure and claiming them freed. If I'm alive in a world where people don't see the levels of perversion in this, I give up.
You don't see this in lower tier schools from kids of lower socio-economic standing because they aren't plagued with the guilt of privilege that they're seeking to launder through Middle East role plays of feigned suffering. This is as first world dystopia as it gets.
Meanwhile, these Ivy League students who can have much more than a glass of water and as much food as their stomachs can take are commanding the attention of the media and the entire American audience, while actual Gazans who need humanitarian aid are ignored. I still have to pinch myself that people don't see this.
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https://x.com/elicalebon/status/1785560131100618798
I can't believe I have to explain what's happening here, but here goes. Elite students of Ivy League schools have glamorized oppression so much that they have now reached role play status to satisfy their fantasies. Here, the students have appropriated the suffering of Gazans and are cosplaying as living through humanitarian crisis. In their American make-believe story where Ivy League infrastructure sets the scene, the students play Gazans and the school administration plays Israel.
Israel (the school) is blocking their "basic humanitarian aid" in this play, and if they don't receive it soon, they will "die of thirst and starvation" (appropriating exact experiences of Gazans). They also destroy upper class buildings and claim them as "liberated" while the students repeat chants in zombie-like chorus, playing the roll of "freedom fighters" destroying Israeli infrastructure and claiming them freed. If I'm alive in a world where people don't see the levels of perversion in this, I give up.
You don't see this in lower tier schools from kids of lower socio-economic standing because they aren't plagued with the guilt of privilege that they're seeking to launder through Middle East role plays of feigned suffering. This is as first world dystopia as it gets.
Meanwhile, these Ivy League students who can have much more than a glass of water and as much food as their stomachs can take are commanding the attention of the media and the entire American audience, while actual Gazans who need humanitarian aid are ignored. I still have to pinch myself that people don't see this.
there are protests at non Ivy schools. These go relatively unreported mainly because the administrations at those schools are allowing the students to peacefully protest.
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Do you mean like the violent protests at UCLA this morning?
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PROTESTORS USING BEAR SPRAY AND PEPPER SPRAY ON LAPD AND CA STATE POLICE
It has been reported that Pro-Palestine Protestors are actually using chemical sprays (Pepper and Bear) to hold off the police.
Bear spray is incredibly stinging, and breathing into the chest is very painful.
In response, LAPD is using Tear Gas and Flash Bangs to push back the protestors.
Source: Fox, BBC
https://x.com/MarioNawfal/status/1785990302911561951
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And this police crackdown is coming days after they were given free rein to beat Jewish students on campus.
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A young Jewish woman was beaten unconscious by a group of pro H@m@s students at the UCLA campus.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C6Z44KRtDRA/
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You guys do realize these protests at Columbia, UCLA, etc., involve well below 1% of the student population, yes?
Your efforts to paint this as an indictment of "elite universities" or the entire educational system shows how sadly desperate you are to believe and advance a narrative that doesn't exist. The reality is 99+% of the students and faculty at these schools are going about their lives mostly as normal. The protesters are no more a typical Columbia student than Tyler Kolek is a typical Marquette student.
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Do you mean like the violent protests at UCLA this morning?
--
PROTESTORS USING BEAR SPRAY AND PEPPER SPRAY ON LAPD AND CA STATE POLICE
It has been reported that Pro-Palestine Protestors are actually using chemical sprays (Pepper and Bear) to hold off the police.
Bear spray is incredibly stinging, and breathing into the chest is very painful.
In response, LAPD is using Tear Gas and Flash Bangs to push back the protestors.
Source: Fox, BBC
https://x.com/MarioNawfal/status/1785990302911561951
-------------
And this police crackdown is coming days after they were given free rein to beat Jewish students on campus.
--
A young Jewish woman was beaten unconscious by a group of pro H@m@s students at the UCLA campus.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C6Z44KRtDRA/
Oh, now it's bad to use bear spray on police? I've been told by multiple Scoopers that it's no biggie.
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Arrest those who attack police and cause damage and destruction to property.
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And let's be sure we understand who these privileged children that have been arrested for supporting Hamas ...
One could literally kill you, and Daddy would get your life reduced to $110, which Mommy will pay.
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Also cuffed and removed from the Columbia campus was Isabel Jennifer Seward, daughter of high-ranking UPS executive William J. Seward.
(https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/04/www-facebook-com-isabel-seward-80371348.jpg?resize=624,1024&quality=75&strip=all)
In 2020, at the age of 16, Isabel veered her Toyota Tacoma pickup truck across a double yellow line on US Route 7 in Charlotte, Vermont, killing Chet and Connie Hawkins, a married couple in their 70s, according to a report by the Barre Montpelier Times Argus.
She pleaded no contest to a civil traffic ticket for “driving on roadways laned for traffic” and was issued a $220 fine — which her mother paid, according to the Rutland Herald.
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And explain to me what the difference is between this and someone wearing a white hood with a sign pointing at African-Americans which says, "KKK's next target".
If you're still morally confused, it is the same. So, next fall, when the KKK starts protesting on these campuses, are we going to give them the same latitude? Should we apologize to the "unite the right" protestors in Charlotteville in 2017, as they were doing the same thing and did not get the Ivy League privileged student treatment?
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Columbia protester Isabella Guisti’s family owns a $3 million, 3,000 square-foot home in Savannah, Georgia’s posh South Historic District, complete with five bedrooms and bathrooms, according to Zillow.
(https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/04/10158402983293874-set-10150090151153874-80369027.jpg?resize=1024,1024&quality=75&strip=all)
Same kid
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLsVK5MXYAAch7f?format=jpg&name=large)
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You guys do realize these protests at Columbia, UCLA, etc., involve well below 1% of the student population, yes?
Your efforts to paint this as an indictment of "elite universities" or the entire educational system shows how sadly desperate you are to believe and advance a narrative that doesn't exist. The reality is 99+% of the students and faculty at these schools are going about their lives mostly as normal. The protesters are no more a typical Columbia student than Tyler Kolek is a typical Marquette student.
Yes, so crush them like Charlottesville. Why the moral ambiguity?
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I hope that you would feel similarly about those who committed violent acts on 1/6 and those who mislead them along the way.
Yep. Rational people condemn violence in all of these incidents. But cultists aren't rational, nor are they self-aware. So they tsk-tsk Americans "going after their own" in these protests even as they defend and/or downplay the violent, cop-crushing coup attempt against the United States of America by armed domestic terrorists who were whipped into a frenzy by the deceitful, demented then-president.
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Yes, so crush them like Charlottesville. Why the moral ambiguity?
How was Charlottesville crushed, exactly?
Last I checked, the occupant of the White House hasn't called the Columbia protestors very fine people.
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All of this is merely practice for the main event ...
I am glad to see the Democrat Party, the party of the people, will need 7,500 soldiers again on the streets of Chicago to protect them from their constituents.
----
Growing campus unrest sparks Democratic fears over Chicago convention
https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4624805-growing-campus-unrest-sparks-democratic-fears-over-chicago-convention/
Protest organizers expect as many as 30,000 people to show up in Chicago to demonstrate against Israel’s military action in Gaza, almost triple the number of protesters who gathered in Grant Park in August 1968.
Illinois Gov. JB Pritzker said Chicago will be prepared for the protests, but that’s not much comfort to Democrats who remember Chicago Mayor Richard J. Daley vowing to keep the peace by deploying 12,000 police, 5,000 National Guardsmen and 7,500 regular army troops.
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Arrest those who attack police and cause damage and destruction to property.
Some try to make the solution more difficult than it should be. I would also add arrest those that are using "fighting words" to incite violence, if those individuals were told to stop and refused.
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All of this is merely practice for the main event ...
I am glad to see the Democrat Party, the party of the people, will need 7,500 soldiers again on the streets of Chicago to protect them from their constituents.
----
Growing campus unrest sparks Democratic fears over Chicago convention
https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4624805-growing-campus-unrest-sparks-democratic-fears-over-chicago-convention/
Protest organizers expect as many as 30,000 people to show up in Chicago to demonstrate against Israel’s military action in Gaza, almost triple the number of protesters who gathered in Grant Park in August 1968.
Illinois Gov. JB Pritzker said Chicago will be prepared for the protests, but that’s not much comfort to Democrats who remember Chicago Mayor Richard J. Daley vowing to keep the peace by deploying 12,000 police, 5,000 National Guardsmen and 7,500 regular army troops.
In Milwaukee, we’re mostly worried about strip clubs being overrun and prostitutes getting worn out when the evangelical’s invade for the RNC
And a rise in infectious diseases
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https://x.com/elicalebon/status/1785560131100618798
I can't believe I have to explain what's happening here, but here goes. Elite students of Ivy League schools have glamorized oppression so much that they have now reached role play status to satisfy their fantasies. Here, the students have appropriated the suffering of Gazans and are cosplaying as living through humanitarian crisis. In their American make-believe story where Ivy League infrastructure sets the scene, the students play Gazans and the school administration plays Israel.
Israel (the school) is blocking their "basic humanitarian aid" in this play, and if they don't receive it soon, they will "die of thirst and starvation" (appropriating exact experiences of Gazans). They also destroy upper class buildings and claim them as "liberated" while the students repeat chants in zombie-like chorus, playing the roll of "freedom fighters" destroying Israeli infrastructure and claiming them freed. If I'm alive in a world where people don't see the levels of perversion in this, I give up.
You don't see this in lower tier schools from kids of lower socio-economic standing because they aren't plagued with the guilt of privilege that they're seeking to launder through Middle East role plays of feigned suffering. This is as first world dystopia as it gets.
Meanwhile, these Ivy League students who can have much more than a glass of water and as much food as their stomachs can take are commanding the attention of the media and the entire American audience, while actual Gazans who need humanitarian aid are ignored. I still have to pinch myself that people don't see this.
Like a lot of people, you need to be online less. Go plant a garden or something.
EDIT: You are literally posting pictures of the student protestors from wealthy backgrounds on a Marquette messsage board. Think about how strange that is.
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Some try to make the solution more difficult than it should be. I would also add arrest those that are using "fighting words" to incite violence, if those individuals were told to stop and refused.
We had a very interesting meeting yesterday with our college attorney about the guidelines around protests of any sort. (There are zero protests here so this was more a thought exercise at this point.)
Keep in mind that at a private school, we don't have to allow anything. But being an educational institution, allowing protests and demonstrations can be part of the learning process. However there is a line between saying things like "Get out of Gaza" and "From the River to the Sea."
And also, while students should not be threatened or harassed, students feeling "uncomfortable" about a protest isn't necessarily a problem. Dealing with opinions different than your own is part of the educational process. You can't become resilient by living in a bubble.
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Some try to make the solution more difficult than it should be. I would also add arrest those that are using "fighting words" to incite violence, if those individuals were told to stop and refused.
Could you cite some examples of the "fighting words" being spoken that quality for prosecution?
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Could you cite some examples of the "fighting words" being spoken that quality for prosecution?
I am not there, so I haven't heard what is being said. I am speaking hypothetically.
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We had a very interesting meeting yesterday with our college attorney about the guidelines around protests of any sort. (There are zero protests here so this was more a thought exercise at this point.)
Keep in mind that at a private school, we don't have to allow anything. But being an educational institution, allowing protests and demonstrations can be part of the learning process. However there is a line between saying things like "Get out of Gaza" and "From the River to the Sea."
And also, while students should not be threatened or harassed, students feeling "uncomfortable" about a protest isn't necessarily a problem. Dealing with opinions different than your own is part of the educational process. You can't become resilient by living in a bubble.
Will you apply these standards if the protestors are wearing white hoods and carrying Confederate flags?
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In the center of the University of Alabama are pro-Hamas protestors waving Palestinian flags. To their credit, they are harassing no one and staying in their proscribed plaza area.
On the other side of the plaza are pro-American/pro-Isereali supporters, waving American and Israeli flags. To their credit, they are harassing no one and staying in their proscribed plaza area.
In between are the police, and again, it is all peaceful.
Maybe that is because they have found common ground. Hopefully, they can continue to coalescence around this idea, and we can move forward as a country,
----
Both sides now chanting “F***” Joe Biden”
https://twitter.com/MavenNavarro1/status/1785785576571994299
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Will you apply these standards if the protestors are wearing white hoods and carrying Confederate flags?
I should have said that protests on campus can only include current students and employees of the college. So we wouldn't allow the KKK to hold a rally here if it included non-College people.
But if we have a KKK student group, and it was limited to those students and staff, they could do that sure.
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In the center of the University of Alabama are pro-Hamas protestors waving Palestinian flags. To their credit, they are harassing no one and staying in their proscribed plaza area.
On the other side of the plaza are pro-American/pro-Isereali supporters, waving American and Israeli flags. To their credit, they are harassing no one and staying in their proscribed plaza area.
In between are the police, and again, it is all peaceful.
Maybe that is because they have found common ground. Hopefully, they can continue to coalescence around this idea, and we can move forward as a country,
----
Both sides now chanting “F***” Joe Biden”
https://twitter.com/MavenNavarro1/status/1785785576571994299
OK, that made me laugh.
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How was Charlottesville crushed, exactly?
Last I checked, the occupant of the White House hasn't called the Columbia protestors very fine people.
BOTUS has lockjaw, aina?
#"fourmoreyears...pause"
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BOTUS has lockjaw, aina?
#"fourmoreyears...pause"
Could be worse, could have narcolepsy during one of his many felony cases
#”lockhimup…for years”
Law and Order
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Wrong, could not be any worst than what we're stuck with for now, aina?
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I should have said that protests on campus can only include current students and employees of the college. So we wouldn't allow the KKK to hold a rally here if it included non-College people.
But if we have a KKK student group, and it was limited to those students and staff, they could do that sure.
So, was this wrong? And if it was not, should we expect several hundred such charges for all those involved in these protests who are effectively doing the same thing as "Unite the Right?"
And if any of your students protest, should they be subject to Federal Hate crime charges as well?
(To be clear, this is about being charged with a Federal Hate crime, not Trespassing, Manslaughter or Vehicular Homicide)
Ohio Man Sentenced to Life in Prison for Federal Hate Crimes Related to August 2017 Car Attack at Rally in Charlottesville, Virginia
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/ohio-man-sentenced-life-prison-federal-hate-crimes-related-august-2017-car-attack-rally
“Hatred and bigotry have no place in our nation. Violent actions inspired by such warped thinking are a disgrace to our people and our values, and the Department of Justice will not tolerate such depraved acts,” said Assistant Attorney General Eric Dreiband. “Prosecuting hate crimes and acts of domestic terrorism continues to be a top priority for the Department of Justice. Anyone who commits a crime motivated by hatred for the race, color, religion, national origin or other protected trait of any person should be on notice: the United States government will use its enormous power to bring perpetrators to justice, and we will continue to do so for as long as it takes to rid our nation of these vile and monstrous crimes.”
“On August 12, 2017, this defendant committed a hate-inspired act of domestic terrorism that killed 32-year-old Heather Heyer and injured over 30 peaceful protesters,” U.S. Attorney Thomas T. Cullen stated. “We believe that his life sentence furthers the Department of Justice’s substantial interest in prosecuting hate crimes and protecting the civil rights of all Americans. We are grateful for the dedication and hard work of the FBI and the Virginia State Police in investigating this matter and bringing the defendant to justice.”
“Hate crimes are not just an attack on the victim: they are also meant to threaten and intimidate an entire community,” said Special Agent in Charge David Archey of the FBI’s Richmond Division. “This is also a case of domestic terrorism, and we must send a message that terrorism and hatred-inspired violence have no place in our communities. The FBI will continue to work with our law enforcement partners to ensure Virginia’s citizens do not fall victim to violence because of hateful ideologies or intolerance of others. The FBI is grateful to the Office of the United States Attorney, the Virginia State Police, the Charlottesville Police Department, and to all the members of the public who assisted in this investigation.”
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Federal hate crimes require that there be some type of violent act. People aren't prosecuted for hate crimes based on engaging in a peaceful protest.
https://www.justice.gov/hatecrimes/learn-about-hate-crimes
"The "crime" in hate crime is often a violent crime, such as assault, murder, arson, vandalism, or threats to commit such crimes. It may also cover conspiring or asking another person to commit such crimes, even if the crime was never carried out.
Under the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution, people cannot be prosecuted simply for their beliefs. People may be offended or upset about beliefs that are untrue or based upon false stereotypes, but it is not a crime to express offensive beliefs, or to join with others who share such views. However, the First Amendment does not protect against committing a crime, just because the conduct is rooted in philosophical beliefs."
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Wrong, could not be any worst than what we're stuck with for now, aina?
So, you don’t believe in law and order? Interesting. I’d probably get rid of the police scanner then.
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So, was this wrong? And if it was not, should we expect several hundred such charges for all those involved in these protests who are effectively doing the same thing as "Unite the Right?"
And if any of your students protest, should they be subject to Federal Hate crime charges as well?
(To be clear, this is about being charged with a Federal Hate crime, not Trespassing, Manslaughter or Vehicular Homicide)
Ohio Man Sentenced to Life in Prison for Federal Hate Crimes Related to August 2017 Car Attack at Rally in Charlottesville, Virginia
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/ohio-man-sentenced-life-prison-federal-hate-crimes-related-august-2017-car-attack-rally
All hate crime prosecutions must have a basis in some other criminal act. So, you can't talk about a hate crime without also talking about the underlying criminal offense. Hate crime charges are, for all intents, an enhancement of the underlying crime.
In this case, this guy was prosecuted for a hate crime and sentenced to life in prison because he killed someone. The motivation (the hate) cannot be separated from the underlying act (the killing), even for the sake of a silly argument in which one attempts to compare murder to saying something offensive.
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All hate crime prosecutions must have a basis in some other criminal act. So, you can't talk about a hate crime without also talking about the underlying criminal offense. Hate crime charges are, for all intents, an enhancement of the underlying crime.
In this case, this guy was prosecuted for a hate crime and sentenced to life in prison because he killed someone. The motivation (the hate) cannot be separated from the underlying act (the killing), even for the sake of a silly argument in which one attempts to compare murder to saying something offensive.
Federal hate crimes require that there be some type of violent act. People aren't prosecuted for hate crimes based on engaging in a peaceful protest.
https://www.justice.gov/hatecrimes/learn-about-hate-crimes
"The "crime" in hate crime is often a violent crime, such as assault, murder, arson, vandalism, or threats to commit such crimes. It may also cover conspiring or asking another person to commit such crimes, even if the crime was never carried out.
Under the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution, people cannot be prosecuted simply for their beliefs. People may be offended or upset about beliefs that are untrue or based upon false stereotypes, but it is not a crime to express offensive beliefs, or to join with others who share such views. However, the First Amendment does not protect against committing a crime, just because the conduct is rooted in philosophical beliefs."
They have assaulted hundreds of Jewish students. They have committed battery against dozens of Jewish Students.
At least everyone protesting at UCLA and the Ivies can be charged under these standards
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Never was a fan of BO, hey?
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How was Charlottesville crushed, exactly?
Last I checked, the occupant of the White House hasn't called the Columbia protestors very fine people.
if you are trying to quote previous potus, get it right!
"very fine people on both sides."
so tell me how this is much different from-
“I condemn the antisemitic protests,” the president told reporters en route back from a speech he had delivered to commemorate Earth Day. “That’s why I have set up a program to deal with that. I also condemn those who don’t understand what’s going on with the Palestinians.”
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if you are trying to quote previous potus, get it right!
"very fine people on both sides."
so tell me how this is much different from-
“I condemn the antisemitic protests,” the president told reporters en route back from a speech he had delivered to commemorate Earth Day. “That’s why I have set up a program to deal with that. I also condemn those who don’t understand what’s going on with the Palestinians.”
Well, you see, one guy is condemning antisemitism while the other guy called anti-semites "very fine people."
Seems kinda obvious, aina?
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if you are trying to quote previous potus, get it right!
"very fine people on both sides."
so tell me how this is much different from-
“I condemn the antisemitic protests,” the president told reporters en route back from a speech he had delivered to commemorate Earth Day. “That’s why I have set up a program to deal with that. I also condemn those who don’t understand what’s going on with the Palestinians.”
Dental school flashing its pedigree once again
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They have assaulted hundreds of Jewish students. They have committed battery against dozens of Jewish Students.
At least everyone protesting at UCLA and the Ivies can be charged under these standards
Could you provide some info on the "hundreds" of Jewish students that have been assaulted and "dozens" who have been batterered at these protests? Where? When? By whom?
(and remember ... "hundreds" and "dozens")
And no, you cannot prosecute every person at a protest if one person or some people at the protest committed a crime. By that incredibly dumb logic, every Charlottesville Nazi should have been charged with murder.
But to be clear, if there's evidence a protester assaulted anyone, that person should be arrested, charged and prosecuted. If there's evidence that crime was motivated by hate, that person should be charged with a hate crime.
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Well, you see, one guy is condemning antisemitism while the other guy called anti-semites "very fine people."
Seems kinda obvious, aina?
Actions are more telling than words. BOTUS tries to straddle the barb wire fence for vote. End result is he pisses off both sides, hey?
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This is how a POTUS should preside, aina?
https://youtu.be/P686hp6tLp0?si=9d-8EOps8hPHVVHg
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Could you provide some info on the "hundreds" of Jewish students that have been assaulted and "dozens" who have been batterered at these protests? Where? When? By whom?
(and remember ... "hundreds" and "dozens")
Certainly not supporting absurd hyperbole but if he’s using the liberal definition of “assault” including verbal assault then totally think that’s fair cause some of these attention starved protesters are absurd and unhinged. But if he’s meaning hundreds of Jewish students have been physically assaulted, then I agree that’s likely not based in truth or reality
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Certainly not supporting absurd hyperbole but if he’s using the liberal definition of “assault” including verbal assault then totally think that’s fair cause some of these attention starved protesters are absurd and unhinged. But if he’s meaning hundreds of Jewish students have been physically assaulted, then I agree that’s likely not based in truth or reality
I was working off the logical conclusion he meant assault in the legal sense, given that he was saying people should be charged and prosecuted.
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This is how a POTUS should preside, aina?
https://youtu.be/P686hp6tLp0?si=9d-8EOps8hPHVVHg
Yes, Biden should threaten to expel students from all the colleges run by the federal government.
Brilliant.
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Well, if the lily-lived governors of NY, CA, et al won't, where's the National Guard, hey?
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Well, if the lily-lived governors of NY, CA, et al won't, where's the National Guard, hey?
Too bad the RNC is run by the Trump Crime Family. Instead, Desanctimonious is on the path to Scott Walker-dom
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Well, if the lily-lived governors of NY, CA, et al won't, where's the National Guard, hey?
At home with their families and at their day jobs unless and until there is real work to be done.
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Doubt it. Lotsa golf yet to be played, hey?
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Doubt it. Lotsa golf yet to be played, hey?
No, it’s over. He’ll kiss the foot of the party dictator and then be discarded again
Also, his schtick doesn’t sell outside Florida
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Like a lot of people, you need to be online less.
You advising anyone else to spend less time online is Larkin to Jeffrey Epstein advising someone to spend less time with under aged women.
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Where does da Buffoon's schtick play well, hey?
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They have assaulted hundreds of Jewish students. They have committed battery against dozens of Jewish Students.
You just shifted the goalposts again. A couple months away and you still can't figure out how to be logically consistent.
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Also, his schtick doesn’t sell outside Florida
Yep. DeSantis' base is old people who see him as a bulwark against the social, cultural and demographic change that frightens them. He polled way better amongst the 55 and up crowd than younger voters who aren't afraid of books and gay cartoon characters.
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You advising anyone else to spend less time online is Larkin to Jeffrey Epstein advising someone to spend less time with under aged women.
Ah. You don't understand what being "too online" means.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extremely_online
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Where does da Buffoon's schtick play well, hey?
The guy who blew 45 out of the water four years ago? A lot of places apparently.
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Yep. DeSantis' base is old people who see him as a bulwark against the social, cultural and demographic change that frightens them. He polled way better amongst the 55 and up crowd than younger voters who aren't afraid of books and gay cartoon characters.
Like Walker, he was a disaster nationally. Once exposed to people outside their comfort zone, they’re awkward and unlikable.
Think back to when Desanctimonius announced. Large favorite over 45. Announced on Twitter which was a mess and got little to no traction across other media outlets, because, well Twitter is for online people. Ran on the woke agenda. Got called pudding fingers and it was over before it started.
This isn’t Nixon. He isn’t coming back in 2028 re-polished and rehabbed. They’ll be some new flavor of the day and if 45 is elected, he has zero chance of getting his endorsement in ‘28.
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Where does da Buffoon's schtick play well, hey?
It played well with millions and millions more Americans in 2020 than Dementia Don's deceitful, deranged schtick did.
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Like Walker, he was a disaster nationally. Once exposed to people outside their comfort zone, they’re awkward and unlikable.
Think back to when Desanctimonius announced. Large favorite over 45. Announced on Twitter which was a mess and got little to no traction across other media outlets, because, well Twitter is for online people. Ran on the woke agenda. Got called pudding fingers and it was over before it started.
This isn’t Nixon. He isn’t coming back in 2028 re-polished and rehabbed. They’ll be some new flavor of the day and if 45 is elected, he has zero chance of getting his endorsement in ‘28.
The entire theme of running against Disney was insanely dumb.
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All of this is merely practice for the main event ...
I am glad to see the Democrat Party, the party of the people, will need 7,500 soldiers again on the streets of Chicago to protect them from their constituents.
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Growing campus unrest sparks Democratic fears over Chicago convention
https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4624805-growing-campus-unrest-sparks-democratic-fears-over-chicago-convention/
Protest organizers expect as many as 30,000 people to show up in Chicago to demonstrate against Israel’s military action in Gaza, almost triple the number of protesters who gathered in Grant Park in August 1968.
Illinois Gov. JB Pritzker said Chicago will be prepared for the protests, but that’s not much comfort to Democrats who remember Chicago Mayor Richard J. Daley vowing to keep the peace by deploying 12,000 police, 5,000 National Guardsmen and 7,500 regular army troops.
Ah, August 1968. A transformational time at our house. My parents and aunts and uncles were all life-long, dyed in the wool Democrats. None of them would have voted for a Republican at gunpoint.
But 4 nights of riveting television in late August 1968 changed all of that. For good. And certainly for the better.
Although only in 8th grade, I was allowed to stay up and watch late into the night, because to do so was "democracy in action" and a "learning experience".
Indeed. I learned that a nightstick up aside the skull changed one's outlook about throwing a rock through a window or a brick at a cop. I learned to watch what a politician does, not what he says.
Here's hoping the 2024 convention will provide a similar TV experience for Independents and low-information Dems (but I repeat myself).
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Ah, August 1968. A transformational time at our house. My parents and aunts and uncles were all life-long, dyed in the wool Democrats. None of them would have voted for a Republican at gunpoint.
But 4 nights of riveting television in late August 1968 changed all of that. For good. And certainly for the better.
Although only in 8th grade, I was allowed to stay up and watch late into the night, because to do so was "democracy in action" and a "learning experience".
Indeed. I learned that a nightstick up aside the skull changed one's outlook about throwing a rock through a window or a brick at a cop. I learned to watch what a politician does, not what he says.
Here's hoping the 2024 convention will provide a similar TV experience for Independents and low-information Dems (but I repeat myself).
You are cheering on and wishing police beating people up this summer?
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Ah, August 1968. A transformational time at our house. My parents and aunts and uncles were all life-long, dyed in the wool Democrats. None of them would have voted for a Republican at gunpoint.
But 4 nights of riveting television in late August 1968 changed all of that. For good. And certainly for the better.
Although only in 8th grade, I was allowed to stay up and watch late into the night, because to do so was "democracy in action" and a "learning experience".
Indeed. I learned that a nightstick up aside the skull changed one's outlook about throwing a rock through a window or a brick at a cop. I learned to watch what a politician does, not what he says.
Here's hoping the 2024 convention will provide a similar TV experience for Independents and low-information Dems (but I repeat myself).
Hold on.
Your political views were permanently shaped by a violent event that happened 56 years ago, and you want that event repeated for the sake of those views?
And you call other people "low information?"
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Hold on.
Your political views were permanently shaped by a violent event that happened 56 years ago, and you want that event repeated for the sake of those views?
And you call other people "low information?"
Homeboy probably cheered for cops at Kent State lol
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Hold on.
Your political views were permanently shaped by a violent event that happened 56 years ago, and you want that event repeated for the sake of those views?
And you call other people "low information?"
At least one person was killed and hundreds of others injured - including more than 150 cops - in the convention riots.
That's a good thing, as long as it helps your side politically.
Back the blue!
Blue Lives Matter!
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At least one person was killed and hundreds of others injured - including more than 150 cops - in the convention riots.
That's a good thing, as long as it helps your side politically.
Back the blue!
Blue Lives Matter!
Weird. That’s about the time republicans became enemies of the civil rights movement and things of that ilk.
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Weird. That’s about the time republicans became enemies of the civil rights movement and things of that ilk.
It's a weird self-own to say you permanently changed your political outlook in the 8th grade because kids not much older than you were getting beaten up for protesting the Vietnam War.
"... and from that day forward, I was determined to be on the wrong side of history for the rest of my life."
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It's a weird self-own to say you changed you permanently changed your political outlook in the 8th grade because kids not much older than you were getting beaten up for protesting the Vietnam War.
"... and from that day forward, I was determined to be on the wrong side of history for the rest of my life."
Some people still think our policy with regards to Vietnam was correct. Heck, some people think Henry Kissinger wasn’t a war criminal. History and learning from it, isn’t a strong point for Americans
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I mean that kinda circles back to the whole "young Jews should know their place and think like I think" mentality of some of our favorite healthcare workers here!
The UCLA protests escalated out of control when pro-Israel counter protesters stormed and attacked the encampment. There was little to no law enforcement intervention for quite some time. But the hand wringing (Warranted!) over bad actors yelling antisemitic and hateful rhetoric about Jews is very notably absent here when the shoe is on the other foot.
"Shortly before midnight, a group of about 200 pro-Israel counter-protesters arrived at UCLA’s campus and began attempting to tear down barriers surrounding the student encampment. Videos on social media show the group firing fireworks into the encampment, beating students, throwing objects, and shouting things like “second Nakba,” at the encampment — a reference to the 1948 ethnic cleansing and expulsion of Palestinians from the territory that now comprises Israel."
Say what you will about the legality and the enforcement of the breakup of the encampments, but there are a considerable number of people who are trying to instigate violence at them in the name of destroying them unchecked. We should be concerned about the instigation of violence and its selective enforcement by our increasingly militarized police.
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Some people still think our policy with regards to Vietnam was correct. Heck, some people think Henry Kissinger wasn’t a war criminal. History and learning from it, isn’t a strong point for Americans
Say what you will about the policy but at least we won the war in the end right
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Say what you will about the policy but at least we won the war in the end right
Nah, we wasted the lives of many young Americans in a war our leaders knew we couldn’t win
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You are cheering on and wishing police beating people up this summer?
NO.
But I'm predicting with virtual certainty that there will be violence this year at the Convention in Chicago and I'm hoping television viewers take notice of who is instigating the violence and how it is or isn't being handled. That's all.
I guess I should keep in mind, though, there is no crime in Chicago.
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Could you provide some info on the "hundreds" of Jewish students that have been assaulted and "dozens" who have been batterered at these protests? Where? When? By whom?
(and remember ... "hundreds" and "dozens")
And no, you cannot prosecute every person at a protest if one person or some people at the protest committed a crime. By that incredibly dumb logic, every Charlottesville Nazi should have been charged with murder.
But to be clear, if there's evidence a protester assaulted anyone, that person should be arrested, charged and prosecuted. If there's evidence that crime was motivated by hate, that person should be charged with a hate crime.
The legal definition of assault?
Assault refers to the wrong act of causing someone to reasonably fear imminent harm.
Every chant, "from the river to the sea," and calls for intifada are an assault. Same as calls for lynchings on campus are assaults.
The legal definition of battery
is the act of intentionally touching another person, or applying force to them, in a harmful or offensive way, without their consent.
Every student who has been physically blocked from entering a campus and has a right to be on that campus has been battered.
---
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/speeches-remarks/2024/05/02/remarks-by-president-biden-on-recent-events-on-college-campuses/
Dementia in Chief said this a few hours ago
So, let me be clear. Peaceful protest in America — violent protest is not protected; peaceful protest is. It’s against the law when violence occurs.
Destroying property is not a peaceful protest. It’s against the law.
Vandalism, trespassing, breaking windows, shutting down campuses, forcing the cancellation of classes and graduations — none of this is a peaceful protest.
Threatening people, intimidating people, instilling fear in people is not peaceful protest. It’s against the law.
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The legal definition of assault?
Assault refers to the wrong act of causing someone to reasonably fear imminent harm.
Every chant, "from the river to the sea," and calls for intifada are an assault. Same as calls for lynchings on campus are assaults.
The legal definition of battery
is the act of intentionally touching another person, or applying force to them, in a harmful or offensive way, without their consent.
Every student who has been physically blocked from entering a campus and has a right to be on that campus has been battered.
---
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/speeches-remarks/2024/05/02/remarks-by-president-biden-on-recent-events-on-college-campuses/
Dementia in Chief said this a few hours ago
So, let me be clear. Peaceful protest in America — violent protest is not protected; peaceful protest is. It’s against the law when violence occurs.
Destroying property is not a peaceful protest. It’s against the law.
Vandalism, trespassing, breaking windows, shutting down campuses, forcing the cancellation of classes and graduations — none of this is a peaceful protest.
Threatening people, intimidating people, instilling fear in people is not peaceful protest. It’s against the law.
In which jurisdiction do you practice law?
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In which jurisdiction do you practice law?
La-la-land
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We had a very interesting meeting yesterday with our college attorney about the guidelines around protests of any sort. (There are zero protests here so this was more a thought exercise at this point.)
Keep in mind that at a private school, we don't have to allow anything. But being an educational institution, allowing protests and demonstrations can be part of the learning process. However there is a line between saying things like "Get out of Gaza" and "From the River to the Sea."
And also, while students should not be threatened or harassed, students feeling "uncomfortable" about a protest isn't necessarily a problem. Dealing with opinions different than your own is part of the educational process. You can't become resilient by living in a bubble.
Just so you are consistent, are you okay with protestors silently praying outside an abortion clinic? And to be clear, not blocking the entrance to threatening anyone, just praying.
If patrons/employees of the abortion clinic feel uncomfortable, that is part of the educational process. You can't become resilient by living in a bubble.
And you're ok with the protestors calling the police and asking they be protected from harassment (and/or violence) so they can pray outside an abortion as long as they wish.
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In which jurisdiction do you practice law?
Go ahead and dazzle us with your law degree.
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While Columbia and UCLA have made the headlines recently, how come others - such as university of Chicago or Brown - have not?
If protests are peaceful, let them go.
If anyone is committing crimes, arrest them.
It's really that simple.
Free speech is not a crime.
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Just so you are consistent, are you okay with protestors silently praying outside an abortion clinic? And to be clear, not blocking the entrance to threatening anyone, just praying.
If patrons/employees of the abortion clinic feel uncomfortable, that is part of the educational process. You can't become resilient by living in a bubble.
And you're ok with the protestors calling the police and asking they be protected from harassment (and/or violence) so they can pray outside an abortion as long as they wish.
We are talking about two different things here. I am talking about an educational institution and that learning how to deal with opinions different than yours is part of what should form one's experience.
But by and large people should be allowed to peacefully assemble on public property. So if people want to peacefuly pray in front of an abortion clinic, that seems fine with me. Why wouldn't it?
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The legal definition of assault?
Assault refers to the wrong act of causing someone to reasonably fear imminent harm.
Every chant, "from the river to the sea," and calls for intifada are an assault. Same as calls for lynchings on campus are assaults.
This is not correct.
The legal definition of battery
is the act of intentionally touching another person, or applying force to them, in a harmful or offensive way, without their consent.
Every student who has been physically blocked from entering a campus and has a right to be on that campus has been battered.
This is not correct.
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While Columbia and UCLA have made the headlines recently, how come others - such as university of Chicago or Brown - have not?
If protests are peaceful, let them go.
If anyone is committing crimes, arrest them.
It's really that simple.
Free speech is not a crime.
Brown bought off the protestors, like Northwestern
Northwestern under fire — Jewish groups demand president's ouster, students file harassment suit
The backlash comes days after the university made an agreement with encampment organizers to take steps toward divesting from Israel.
https://chicago.suntimes.com/israel-hamas-war/2024/05/01/northwestern-under-fire-as-adl-midwest-calls-for-university-president-to-resign-3-students-file-suit
Days after reaching an agreement with organizers of a pro-Palestinian encampment, Northwestern University is facing heavy backlash -- with three Jewish organizations calling for the school’s president to resign.
And three Jewish students have filed suit against NU over the encampment, alleging they have been harassed and subjected to hateful rhetoric.
Organizers had established the encampment to express support for Palestinian people and to call on the university to cut financial ties with Israel.
They described Monday’s agreement as a “meaningful first step to divestment.” It requires the university administration to disclose information about any investments to those associated with the school and re-establishes a committee to advise on investments, a panel that will include student representation. The university also agreed to take steps to better support Palestinian students on campus and allow protests to continue until June 1.
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The University of Chicago and Dartmouth have been leaders in heading this off.
https://chicagomaroon.com/42286/news/university-administrators-respond-to-pro-palestine-encampment/
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NO.
But I'm predicting with virtual certainty that there will be violence this year at the Convention in Chicago and I'm hoping television viewers take notice of who is instigating the violence and how it is or isn't being handled. That's all.
I guess I should keep in mind, though, there is no crime in Chicago.
You literally wrote that you were "hoping" for violence.
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UPenn asked the Philadelphia PD to help immediately dismantle the encampment. PPD refused saying Penn has to show the encampment showed imminent danger.
Edit: I am not there right now, texted my son earlier, he said it was loud and peaceful at that time.
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We are talking about two different things here. I am talking about an educational institution and that learning how to deal with opinions different than yours is part of what should form one's experience.
But by and large people should be allowed to peacefully assemble on public property. So if people want to peacefuly pray in front of an abortion clinic, that seems fine with me. Why wouldn't it?
Seem fine to you?
February 2, 2024
https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2024/february/abortion-clinic-prolife-protestors-convicted.html
The six activists convicted in Tennessee this week argued they demonstrated peacefully, saying they were singing hymns and praying in a medical pavilion hallway outside the clinic. A police officer testified at the trial that the protestors were peaceful, according to The Tennessean, but they refused to leave. They were convicted of “obstructing access to reproductive health services.”
The protestors face longer prison sentences than in the past because prosecutors have added a civil rights conspiracy charge to the most recent batch of cases, which carries a maximum 10-year sentence.
“This ‘conspiracy to violate civil rights’ [charge]—it’s a new strategy the DOJ is using,” Calvin Zastrow, one of the pro-life protestors in Tennessee who is a Christian, told CT shortly after his conviction this week. He faces an 11-year sentence, but unlike defendants in other FACE cases, he and others in his case were not immediately taken into custody.
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Seem fine to you?
February 2, 2024
https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2024/february/abortion-clinic-prolife-protestors-convicted.html
The six activists convicted in Tennessee this week argued they demonstrated peacefully, saying they were singing hymns and praying in a medical pavilion hallway outside the clinic.
They were on private property.
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Pretzels make me thirsty
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This is not correct.
This is not correct.
(https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-04-2018/SOv1Og.gif)
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Seem fine to you?
February 2, 2024
https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2024/february/abortion-clinic-prolife-protestors-convicted.html
The six activists convicted in Tennessee this week argued they demonstrated peacefully, saying they were singing hymns and praying in a medical pavilion hallway outside the clinic. A police officer testified at the trial that the protestors were peaceful, according to The Tennessean, but they refused to leave. They were convicted of “obstructing access to reproductive health services.”
The protestors face longer prison sentences than in the past because prosecutors have added a civil rights conspiracy charge to the most recent batch of cases, which carries a maximum 10-year sentence.
“This ‘conspiracy to violate civil rights’ [charge]—it’s a new strategy the DOJ is using,” Calvin Zastrow, one of the pro-life protestors in Tennessee who is a Christian, told CT shortly after his conviction this week. He faces an 11-year sentence, but unlike defendants in other FACE cases, he and others in his case were not immediately taken into custody.
The two examples cited here include one where entrances were blocked and another where they refused to leave private property.
Are you back to not reading what you post again?
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Go ahead and dazzle us with your law degree.
JD 1994, Indiana University. Unlike your degree from the google school of law. Different jurisdictions have different definitions for assault and/or battery. I would venture to say all jurisdictions would agree that chanting from the river to the sea would not constitute an assault. The imminent harm element is not there.
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JD 1994, Indiana University. Unlike your degree from the google school of law. Different jurisdictions have different definitions for assault and/or battery. I would venture to say all jurisdictions would agree that chanting from the river to the sea would not constitute an assault. The imminent harm element is not there.
L.O.L.
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They were on private property.
The two examples cited here include one where entrances were blocked and another where they refused to leave private property.
Are you back to not reading what you post again?
Maximum 10-year sentence. Are you sure these are not selective political prosecutions of "making people feel uncomfortable?"
https://thehill.com/homenews/ap/ap-u-s-news/ap-6-activists-convicted-of-illegally-blocking-abortion-clinic-in-tennessee/
Attorneys representing the defendants say they plan on appealing the convictions. The legal team has described the 2021 demonstration as a “peaceful life-affirming gathering” and has accused the federal justice department of prosecuting “pro-life activists” ever since the Supreme Court’s landmark 2022 abortion decision.
“This was a peaceful demonstration by entirely peaceable citizens — filled with prayer, hymn-singing, and worship — oriented toward persuading expecting mothers not to abort their babies,” said Steve Crampton, an attorney with the Thomas More Society.
Before Roe was overturned, the Justice Department oversaw just a handful of FACE Act violation cases. In 2021, just three cases involving three defendants were charged, and in 2020, the agency handled just one case.
By 2022, that number jumped to 11 cases involving 29 defendants. And last year, there were 10 cases and 22 defendants.
Advocates like the National Abortion Federation say the uptick in cases reflects the rise in harassment and violence abortion clinics have faced since state abortion bans have been allowed to go into effect.
In a 2022 report, the organization said abortion providers across the U.S. saw noticeable spikes in the number of death threats, stalkings, burglaries and arsons compared with the year prior.
Yet a growing number of conservative groups and Republican lawmakers have responded to these numbers by saying law enforcement has downplayed similar threats and violence against Catholic churches and so-called “crisis pregnancy centers,” which counsel against abortions.
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JD 1994, Indiana University. Unlike your degree from the google school of law. Different jurisdictions have different definitions for assault and/or battery. I would venture to say all jurisdictions would agree that chanting from the river to the sea would not constitute an assault. The imminent harm element is not there.
Jewish students disagree with your opinion.
He's one for you, counselor. Should she be arrested for assault?
If she was wearing a white hood and said, "KKK's next target," would that be assault?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLsVK5MXYAAch7f?format=jpg&name=large)
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They committed a crime on private property and got punished for it.
Nothing special.
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Maximum 10-year sentence. Are you sure these are not selective political prosecutions of "making people feel uncomfortable?"
(https://y.yarn.co/07e29a6f-70f2-403b-a583-62e3c95495d2_text.gif)
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Jewish students disagree with your opinion.
He's one for you, counselor. Should she be arrested for assault?
If she was wearing a white hood and said, "KKK's next target," would that be assault?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLsVK5MXYAAch7f?format=jpg&name=large)
If a law is not being broken, why would they be arrested.
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Jewish students disagree with your opinion.
That's not how the law works.
He's one for you, counselor. Should she be arrested for assault?
If she was wearing a white hood and said, "KKK's next target," would that be assault?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLsVK5MXYAAch7f?format=jpg&name=large)
No.
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Maximum 10-year sentence. Are you sure these are not selective political prosecutions of "making people feel uncomfortable?"
https://thehill.com/homenews/ap/ap-u-s-news/ap-6-activists-convicted-of-illegally-blocking-abortion-clinic-in-tennessee/
Attorneys representing the defendants say they plan on appealing the convictions. The legal team has described the 2021 demonstration as a “peaceful life-affirming gathering” and has accused the federal justice department of prosecuting “pro-life activists” ever since the Supreme Court’s landmark 2022 abortion decision.
“This was a peaceful demonstration by entirely peaceable citizens — filled with prayer, hymn-singing, and worship — oriented toward persuading expecting mothers not to abort their babies,” said Steve Crampton, an attorney with the Thomas More Society.
Before Roe was overturned, the Justice Department oversaw just a handful of FACE Act violation cases. In 2021, just three cases involving three defendants were charged, and in 2020, the agency handled just one case.
By 2022, that number jumped to 11 cases involving 29 defendants. And last year, there were 10 cases and 22 defendants.
Advocates like the National Abortion Federation say the uptick in cases reflects the rise in harassment and violence abortion clinics have faced since state abortion bans have been allowed to go into effect.
In a 2022 report, the organization said abortion providers across the U.S. saw noticeable spikes in the number of death threats, stalkings, burglaries and arsons compared with the year prior.
Yet a growing number of conservative groups and Republican lawmakers have responded to these numbers by saying law enforcement has downplayed similar threats and violence against Catholic churches and so-called “crisis pregnancy centers,” which counsel against abortions.
Are you thinking that I’m going to dispute that we have too many laws on the books which cause prosecutors to often over-charge people? Because I whole-heartedly agree with that.
But you brought this up as some sort of “gotcha” to my point about protestors even though the situations aren’t the same. Again shifting goalposts.
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These pretzels are making me thirsty
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Jewish students disagree with your opinion.
He's one for you, counselor. Should she be arrested for assault?
If she was wearing a white hood and said, "KKK's next target," would that be assault?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLsVK5MXYAAch7f?format=jpg&name=large)
No iminent harm by silently holding a sign.
Do I agree with their message? No. Do they have the right to speak it? Yes.
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No iminent harm by silently holding a sign.
Do I agree with their message? No. Do they have the right to speak it? Yes.
Exactly, the majority of the extreme protesters are best typified as the UF president stated in his letter back in October…
“Our Constitution protects the rights of people to make abject idiots of themselves.“
The Columbia grad student giving a speech about needing “humanitarian aid”for fellow protesters or those claiming they are being starved are out of touch morons. The cult of the oppressed who somehow feel the need to make themselves out to be persecuted in their protests to feel included are idiots….but none of them are breaking the law as a whole and our country has its foundation in allowing people to make fools of themselves for something they believe in, regardless of what it is.
Don’t block streets, don’t forcefully barricade yourselves in public buildings to the detriment of others and complain when you’re removed, don’t assault or overly intimidate passerby’s…and then you can do whatever eye rolling performative nonsense your heart desires.
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Jewish students disagree with your opinion.
Did you check with the Jewish students protesting on the pro-palestine side?
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JD 1994, Indiana University. Unlike your degree from the google school of law. Different jurisdictions have different definitions for assault and/or battery. I would venture to say all jurisdictions would agree that chanting from the river to the sea would not constitute an assault. The imminent harm element is not there.
Mike Woodson sucks
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Did you check with the Jewish students protesting on the pro-palestine side?
Those are just the pawns
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Mike Woodson sucks
I am surprised they didnt hire Damon Bailey, or Pat Knight.
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The guy who blew 45 out of the water four years ago? A lot of places apparently.
Were it not for the perfect covid storm, the Buffoon goes down quicker than the Hindenburg, aina?
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Were it not for the perfect covid storm, the Buffoon goes down quicker than the Hindenburg, aina?
True. Had 45 not bungled it so badly after throwing away the emergency plan put into place by W (He did so, of course, because he didn’t like W), he probably would have won but he was such a bad emergency president, like recommending putting bleach up your bum, it was easy peasy.
He could run off getting Operation Warp Speed accomplished but since the base is anti-vaccine, he can’t. But he does have all his indictments to run on.
Like family values and small government, the party of law and order never really believed in their values
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Greateat nickname ever entered into court records today.
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Greateat nickname ever entered into court records today.
When you surround yourself with the best people it’s hard to imagine how that could have happened
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In case you're keeping score at home you would think no one has been arrested because no laws have been broken.
At least 2,000 people arrested in pro-Palestinian protests on US campuses, AP tally shows
https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinian-campus-student-protests-war-ec3f62c51c08599f8fcecd99f7cf9e33
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No iminent harm by silently holding a sign.
Do I agree with their message? No. Do they have the right to speak it? Yes.
Just checking ... same if this happens on campus too (by students)?
By the way, they largely agree with a lot of what the current protestors believe about Jews.
(https://www.amny.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/klan-protest-penley-2017-07-13-v01VILPRINT_WEBWEB.jpg)
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Iran university offers scholarships to US students expelled over Gaza war protests
https://www.the-express.com/news/us-news/136135/iran-university-scholarship-students-expelled-gaza-war-protests
Mohammad Moazzeni, head of Shiraz University in Fars, made the offer to students demonstrating against Israel's actions in its war against Hamas in Gaza, Iranian state-owned outlet Press TV reports.
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Just checking ... same if this happens on campus too (by students)?
By the way, they largely agree with a lot of what the current protestors believe about Jews.
(https://www.amny.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/klan-protest-penley-2017-07-13-v01VILPRINT_WEBWEB.jpg)
When is the last time someone was prosecuted for assault for waving a Confederate flag?
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When is the last time someone was prosecuted for assault for waving a Confederate flag?
Plus, Trump doesn’t usually hold rallies on campuses
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Plus, Trump doesn’t usually hold rallies on campuses
Not since his "university" went under
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Not since his "university" went under
Some people apparently got their law degrees there