Malek Harris - Reason for suspension

[willie warrior]

Read the freaking link I included again.

http://blogs.newsobserver.com/dukenow/former-duke-basketball-player-lance-thomas-settles-jewelry-lawsuit

“We have reached a settlement,” Mike Bowers, the attorney for Rafaello & Co. wrote in an email. “I cannot make further comment."

Thomas purchased $97,800 worth of custom jewelry on Dec. 21, 2009, while the team was on winter break in the middle of his senior year. He made a $30,000 down payment and signed a purchase agreement that said he would pay the remaining $67,800 within 15 days.

Rafaello & Co. filed a lawsuit in January after repeated attempts to collect payment. Bowers confirmed to the News & Observer last week that his client had declined to speak with the NCAA about a possible extra benefits investigation.

-----

This event should have made Thomas ineligible for the season.  The fact that he played, and Duke won the national Championship should have voided all those games. 

http://www.sbnation.com/2012/10/1/3440196/lance-thomas-duke-lawsuit-ncaa-punishment

In the end the NCAA did nothing so Duke wins

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/eye-on-college-basketball/22170661/ncaa-duke-faces-no-punishment-in-lance-thomas-jewelry-case

And Duke also did not get punished in the Corey Magette situation (you can Google that).

So let's be clear with our words. 

"Duke has never been caught doing wrong" is an accurate statement. 

Do not confuse it with "Duke does no wrong."

Thank you for pointing that out. So Duke, and by association Coach K cheats. Don't know if Coach K did any of that. By the way, Buzz was suspended for a game for a T-shirt violation committed by an Asst. who was fired. So I guess the point is that Buzz is a Saint and Coach K is not. I am Ok with that. But many would consider Coach K a measuring stick--that was my point.

[Lennys Tap]

Open up your student handbook, three times and you are out of the dorms.

Damn. I didn't get out of the dorm and into an apartment until junior year. If only I had known...

[Tugg Speedman]

Thank you for pointing that out. So Duke, and by association Coach K cheats. Don't know if Coach K did any of that. By the way, Buzz was suspended for a game for a T-shirt violation committed by an Asst. who was fired. So I guess the point is that Buzz is a Saint and Coach K is not. I am Ok with that. But many would consider Coach K a measuring stick--that was my point.

Lance Thomas bought $100k of Jewerly in the middle of the season using a loan (violation of NCAA rules).  We are to believe Duke did not know.  No one at Duke gets in trouble.  Do not have to vacate the NC.  Corey Magette took cash from a coach.  Duke gets nothing (when this happens to Calipari at Mass and Memphis the NCAA crucifies him and his programs).

Reminding me again what we are measuring K against ... running a clean program or getting caught?

[Lennys Tap]

. But many would consider Coach K a measuring stick--that was my point.

Agree 100%.

[ResidentBrown]

When I was in high school, kids on my hockey team would always get suspended for something like drinking, so they'd just join the soccer team or track team and have their suspensions apply to that sport. It was a neat loophole.

[Silkk the Shaka]

What happened about caring for the whole person?  We are so quick to cut bait on a kid that may or may not have had a lapse in judgement that may or may not have involved being around drugs or alcohol.  Personally, if the kid has some issues to straighten out I can't imagine a better program or coach than Buzz and MU.  Buzz and Larry will do the right thing and until than this is all just a giant circle jerk for you guys.

Only thing that really needs to be said.

[ChicosBailBonds]

It's one of those "the school won't say, but these facts fit this situation" kind of deal.

Sounds multiple to me

[bilsu]

It is true that Harris is just a kid and kids do stupid things. He may or may not come from a poor home. There are plenty of kids in college basketball with situations that are somewhat similar and they were able to get through their high school careers without being suspended. I think being caught three times would make it unlikely he would survive Buzz's demands at MU and would be very likely to be gone in a short time anyways. When Buzz was under attack for past player violations, I defended him saying how was he suppose to know what was going to happen. Assuming the players did not have a past history he should be given a break. You can attack me for being hardline, but if he brings in Malek, I no longer trust in Buzz's judgement.

[brandx]

It is true that Harris is just a kid and kids do stupid things. He may or may not come from a poor home. There are plenty of kids in college basketball with situations that are somewhat similar and they were able to get through their high school careers without being suspended. I think being caught three times would make it unlikely he would survive Buzz's demands at MU and would be very likely to be gone in a short time anyways. When Buzz was under attack for past player violations, I defended him saying how was he suppose to know what was going to happen. Assuming the players did not have a past history he should be given a break. You can attack me for being hardline, but if he brings in Malek, I no longer trust in Buzz's judgement.

I think it is time we crucify the Packer's brass as well. Bringing in an admitted criminal like Donald Driver. What good could become if it?

BTW, Buzz is really hurt that you may not trust him anymore

[ChicosBailBonds]

I think it is time we crucify the Packer's brass as well. Bringing in an admitted criminal like Donald Driver. What good could become if it?

BTW, Buzz is really hurt that you may not trust him anymore

I don't believe the professional vs college comparison is apt.  A professional team's sole goal is to win games, championships, etc.  A college program is part of a university, not a separate entity.  Athletic programs to a higher authority with goals that don't always mesh with that authority.

[LastWarrior]

I guess I don't really care that the kid smokes weed and/or drinks. I care that he is stupid enough to get caught three times.

Once might be bad luck.
A second time could be...poor planning.
A third time means you're an idiot.

Nailed it... nice work!

[wadesworld]

I don't believe the professional vs college comparison is apt.  A professional team's sole goal is to win games, championships, etc.  A college program is part of a university, not a separate entity.  Athletic programs to a higher authority with goals that don't always mesh with that authority.

While you are correct, I think his point was that just because an individual may have made a mistake in the past does not mean he cannot turn it around and figure things out.  Donald Driver turned out to be a model citizen and a very good role model with the Green Bay Packers despite having a criminal background.  Malek is 17 years old.  I do not know the details as to what Malek did or did not do and I cannot pretend I do know the details.  Therefore, if Buzz is willing to bring Malek into the program, I have to trust that it was not something like lighting a girl's hair on fire.  If he decides it's not worth it and says good luck but you aren't welcome to Marquette then I will assume it was something worse than just being in the same house as underage drinkers.  Time will tell.

[ChicosBailBonds]

While you are correct, I think his point was that just because an individual may have made a mistake in the past does not mean he cannot turn it around and figure things out.  Donald Driver turned out to be a model citizen and a very good role model with the Green Bay Packers despite having a criminal background.  Malek is 17 years old.  I do not know the details as to what Malek did or did not do and I cannot pretend I do know the details.  Therefore, if Buzz is willing to bring Malek into the program, I have to trust that it was not something like lighting a girl's hair on fire.  If he decides it's not worth it and says good luck but you aren't welcome to Marquette then I will assume it was something worse than just being in the same house as underage drinkers.  Time will tell.

Of course, that is true.  Gets back to the questions earlier in the week, how many chances does someone get.  Some kids figure it out without any chances, some after 1, 2, 3, 10 chances.  Some are willing to keep giving chances, others are not.

Buzz is the President of the basketball program, he reports to a President  of the Athletic Department who reports to a president of the school. Certainly a level of added complexity.  Even pro teams go through these things, but to a lessor level.  How many teams passed on Randy Moss because he had issues?  Buzz will do what he does and the accountability will ultimately be on him and the kid.  Hopefully this is all about nothing and he was just caught multiple times doing something silly.  If I'm Buzz, and I put my neck out I make darn sure the kid doesn't mess up because ultimately it comes back on Buzz....fair or not, that's the deal, especially when there are red flags or suspensions or the like the background.  Fair or unfair, that's the deal.

[TeamOh]

nm.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Of course, that is true.  Gets back to the questions earlier in the week, how many chances does someone get.  Some kids figure it out without any chances, some after 1, 2, 3, 10 chances.  Some are willing to keep giving chances, others are not.

Some have been banned 1, 2, 3, 10 times, how many chances should they get? 

[ChicosBailBonds]

Some have been banned 1, 2, 3, 10 times, how many chances should they get? 

Great question.  Especially considering the millions of dollars, media exposure, etc, that posters at MU Scoop are part of bringing in for the university.  Personally, I'm glad Keefe is back.

[Lennys Tap]

Some have been banned 1, 2, 3, 10 times, how many chances should they get? 

Hilarious

[Silkk the Shaka]

Some have been banned 1, 2, 3, 10 times, how many chances should they get? 

Perfect. Exposing the "hypocrisy" of the hypocrisy crusader.

[brewcity77]

It is true that Harris is just a kid and kids do stupid things. He may or may not come from a poor home. There are plenty of kids in college basketball with situations that are somewhat similar and they were able to get through their high school careers without being suspended. I think being caught three times would make it unlikely he would survive Buzz's demands at MU and would be very likely to be gone in a short time anyways. When Buzz was under attack for past player violations, I defended him saying how was he suppose to know what was going to happen. Assuming the players did not have a past history he should be given a break. You can attack me for being hardline, but if he brings in Malek, I no longer trust in Buzz's judgement.

But maybe part of the reason Buzz is bringing Harris in is because he sees a kid who is a hard worker that he feels he can develop into a better man. Yes, obviously basketball is a factor, but Buzz didn't shy away from Jimmy's background, or Otule when he discovered he only had one eye, or Junior who went through so much hardship. Yes, this stuff is Malek's choice, but possibly Buzz sees a kid who can succeed if he is guided to make better choices. I don't know the full story here, only what little has come out, but if we're maligning him for enjoying party favors, half this board should probably be permanently banned.

I wouldn't blame Buzz if he does shy away (maybe he already talked to Harris about his previous bans and said it can't happen again) and I wouldn't blame him if he took the kid (maybe thinking that with the right direction he can keep his nose clean). I don't know enough about the situation or personal relationship. I will trust our coach to make the right decision, but will also definitely hope that Harris doesn't have similar habitual trouble once and if he gets here.

[MerrittsMustache]

Some have been banned 1, 2, 3, 10 times, how many chances should they get? 

Depends on how good they are at what they do.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

It is true that Harris is just a kid and kids do stupid things. He may or may not come from a poor home. There are plenty of kids in college basketball with situations that are somewhat similar and they were able to get through their high school careers without being suspended. I think being caught three times would make it unlikely he would survive Buzz's demands at MU and would be very likely to be gone in a short time anyways. When Buzz was under attack for past player violations, I defended him saying how was he suppose to know what was going to happen. Assuming the players did not have a past history he should be given a break. You can attack me for being hardline, but if he brings in Malek, I no longer trust in Buzz's judgement.

You are going to begin to distrust Buzz's judgement because he signs a kid who committed a violation in high school without having any idea what it is? I understand being skeptical or disagreeing but to lose all trust in his judgement seems a little rash

[ChicosBailBonds]

Depends on how good they are at what they do.

Keefe is very good, that's why they let him back in I am convinced. 

[bilsu]

But maybe part of the reason Buzz is bringing Harris in is because he sees a kid who is a hard worker that he feels he can develop into a better man. Yes, obviously basketball is a factor, but Buzz didn't shy away from Jimmy's background, or Otule when he discovered he only had one eye, or Junior who went through so much hardship. Yes, this stuff is Malek's choice, but possibly Buzz sees a kid who can succeed if he is guided to make better choices. I don't know the full story here, only what little has come out, but if we're maligning him for enjoying party favors, half this board should probably be permanently banned.

I wouldn't blame Buzz if he does shy away (maybe he already talked to Harris about his previous bans and said it can't happen again) and I wouldn't blame him if he took the kid (maybe thinking that with the right direction he can keep his nose clean). I don't know enough about the situation or personal relationship. I will trust our coach to make the right decision, but will also definitely hope that Harris doesn't have similar habitual trouble once and if he gets here.

I think it is safe to assume that Butler's home environment was worse than Harris's and I am not aware that Butler ever got into any real trouble. It is not a question of whether Harris gets another chance it is a question of whether he gets the chance at MU. Harris of course could become a very successful person, but he is not starting out well. He also could come to MU and flame out without embarrassing the University. That has to be balanced against the potential of Malek doing something that brings embarrassment to the University. I just think Buzz is better off bringing in some one that is less of a known risk. It would be interesting to see who on this site objected to the recruiting of Simeon Bowers. There were several posters that said MU should not recruit him because he was trouble in high school. I said people can change and if he stayed out of trouble in junior college I did not have a problem with Buzz recruiting him. That is the same feeling I have about Malek. MU can recruit him if he goes somewhere else first and demonstrates that he has change.

[brewcity77]

That is the same feeling I have about Malek. MU can recruit him if he goes somewhere else first and demonstrates that he has change.

The Cinmeon Bowers comparison is fair, and a year in prep school or JUCO wouldn't surprise me at all, but I'm not going to lose faith in our coach if Harris were to come here as a freshman. It's a bit of a different circumstance as we've already taken a commitment from Harris. My guess is his presence (or lack thereof) on Friday will be very telling. Either way, I trust our staff to make the right call on a kid they are very familiar with.

[Benny B]

The most likely of downside scenarios in taking a chance on someone who has already been given multiple chances is that if they f*c& up on your watch, there is going to be plenty of people who question the judgement in bringing that person to campus.  If he gets busted once for weed, drinking, academics (the meaningful, but relatively petty, stuff)... so what.  There will be some hemming and hawing about how so-and-so was a known risk, and the "I told you so" police will be out in full force for a few days (the ones wearing cardinal & white might linger around like a drum circle for few weeks), but most people without an agenda will simply be "meh."  Now if you have multiple incidents by that person's junior or senior year, it will start to reflect poorly on those who took the chance to begin with, and the media will drag MU through the mud a bit more, but at the end of the day, all will be forgiven & forgotten and perhaps the whiny I-told-you-so's might even end up acknowledging some credit due for giving an opportunity to someone who didn't have one.

However, if that same person commits a crime, causes injury, and/or does something to incur substantial civil liability - just once - that stain won't wash away so easily and the PR dept. better look at making some new hires... but that's not even the worst of it because even though the University will still be sued (just as it would if the kid had been a clean-nosed, straight-A student from Naperville), the difference here is that the words "known risk" will be drilled into every nook of each juror's brain by the time open statements conclude, and even if the previous f*c&-ups have no relation to the charges, juries aren't very sympathetic when the perception is that any red flag was ignored.

That said, the kid can choose to right his own ship anytime, and he could very well go four years without so much as stepping on an ant.  The question is whether the benefit outweighs the risk in this situation understanding, of course, that MU has a lot more to lose than your average program like Montana, and certainly can't afford the kind of hit that schools like UNLV can absorb.