COVID-19 (f/k/a "the Coronavirus")

[GooooMarquette]

That is absolutely damning.

"Mr. Trump was walking up the steps of Air Force One to head home from India on Feb. 25 when Dr. Nancy Messonnier, the director of the National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases, publicly issued the blunt warning they had all agreed was necessary.

But Dr. Messonnier had jumped the gun. They had not told the president yet, much less gotten his consent.

On the 18-hour plane ride home, Mr. Trump fumed as he watched the stock market crash after Dr. Messonnier’s comments. Furious, he called Mr. Azar when he landed at around 6 a.m. on Feb. 26, raging that Dr. Messonnier had scared people unnecessarily."


FEBRUARY 25!!!!

Agreed. I don’t understand how people can ignore such clear evidence of callous self-interest at the expense of human lives and our economic well-being. People are dying and the economy is collapsing.

We desperately need the CDC to take over to minimize the damage. Will he ever allow it?!?

[HutchwasClutch]

We desperately need the CDC to take over to minimize the damage. Will he ever allow it?!?

Take over what exactly? 

[GooooMarquette]

Take over what exactly?

The testing and contact tracing - our best chance to reopen the country in any reasonable timeframe.

See my earlier post where the CDC itself described its role in the H1N1 outbreak, and prevented the disaster we’re living with today. And ask yourself why it isn’t doing the same thing today.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

The testing and contact tracing - our best chance to reopen the country in any reasonable timeframe.

See my earlier post where the CDC itself described its role in the H1N1 outbreak, and prevented the disaster we’re living with today. And ask yourself why it isn’t doing the same thing today.

WI Dept of Health is doing the contact tracing, at least in Madison/Dane Co.

[Jockey]

Agreed. I don’t understand how people can ignore such clear evidence of callous self-interest at the expense of human lives and our economic well-being. People are dying and the economy is collapsing.

We desperately need the CDC to take over to minimize the damage. Will he ever allow it?!?

Logic would seem to agree with you, but ultimately the article is immaterial.

His supporters simply don't care and he knows it. That is why he called them stupid and immoral - yet they still didn't care.

Most of his supporters will never even hear what the NYT said. He has convinced them that the NYT is fake news and they don't know any better.

The best proof of this is the reply from Hutch right after your post. Utter willful ignorance. He really doesn't care if Trump minimized and mismanaged the crisis from the start. He doesn't care how many deaths are on the president's hands by putting his own selfish concerns above the needs of the country. He doesn't care how many lies the president tells. He believes the president does no wrong.

[GooooMarquette]

WI Dept of Health is doing the contact tracing, at least in Madison/Dane Co.

And we see how well national vs local contact tracing works by comparing the H1N1 outbreak with COVID-19.

[forgetful]

The testing and contact tracing - our best chance to reopen the country in any reasonable timeframe.

See my earlier post where the CDC itself described its role in the H1N1 outbreak, and prevented the disaster we’re living with today. And ask yourself why it isn’t doing the same thing today.

I agree regarding testing and contact tracing and frankly have no idea how the CDC hasn't been running that from the start. Totally bizarre.

[Jockey]

Plasma transfusion

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/2020/04/11/milwaukee-man-stable-after-experimental-coronavirus-plasma-transfusion/2977352001/

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I agree regarding testing and contact tracing and frankly have no idea how the CDC hasn't been running that from the start. Totally bizarre.

Because the federal government is too fixated on how to "open everything back up," without understanding that you just can't open things back up without a plan for how you can manage the disease moving forward.

Read this...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/04/10/contact-tracing-coronavirus-strategy/

"Administration officials, speaking on the condition of anonymity to describe internal deliberations, say the White House has made a deliberate political calculation that it will better serve Trump’s interest to put the onus on governors — rather than the federal government — to figure out how to move ahead.

“It’s mind-boggling, actually, the degree of disorganization,” said Tom Frieden, former Centers for Disease Control and Prevention director. The federal government has already squandered February and March, he noted, committing “epic failures” on testing kits, ventilator supply, protective equipment for health workers and contradictory public health communication. The next failure is already on its way, Frieden said, because “we’re not doing the things we need to be doing in April.”

[mu_hilltopper]

And we see how well national vs local contact tracing works by comparing the H1N1 outbreak with COVID-19.

I'm not sure what that comparison is .. but in the end, it's always the local municipality's health department (in conjuction with the state) doing contract tracing.

Sure .. the CDC can do contact tracing for XX cases, but they do not have the manpower in every city and state in the country.    It's up to the localities.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I'm not sure what that comparison is .. but in the end, it's always the local municipality's health department (in conjuction with the state) doing contract tracing.

Sure .. the CDC can do contact tracing for XX cases, but they do not have the manpower in every city and state in the country.    It's up to the localities.

No but they should be able to coordinate a plan and provide resources for the state and local governments.  Right now they aren't doing much of anything.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Read this tweet and its thread.

https://twitter.com/EricLiptonNYT/status/1249009586905939968?s=20

Quotes very specific emails that shows that the administration knew what was going on and ignoring the advice of public health professionals within HHS.  Also lamented how behind the curve both the CDC and WHO have been this entire time.

If you care about truth over political belief, read up on this.  These aren't opinions.  These are facts.

Vote for whomever you want to vote for.  I'm not going to debate you on that.  But you need to do so with full understanding of the facts at hand.  If that doesn't change your mind, then it doesn't change your mind.

But I am going to make this odd parallel.  When I decided to move from the Projo to Nojo camp earlier this year, it was logically freeing for me.  I didn't have to make excuses.  Didn't have to make illogical assumptions.  Facts are facts.  Truth is truth.

I'm going to attend my Easter service virtually now.  Have a blessed Easter everyone!

[GooooMarquette]

I'm not sure what that comparison is .. but in the end, it's always the local municipality's health department (in conjuction with the state) doing contract tracing.

Sure .. the CDC can do contact tracing for XX cases, but they do not have the manpower in every city and state in the country.    It's up to the localities.

No, it isn't always the local municipality - see the CDC's summary of H1N1. In that case, the CDC did contact tracing from the start and prevented it from becoming what COVID has become. And even though they don't have the manpower to do it now that it has spread, they still have the technology and expertise to provide the technological resources and coordinate it nationally, and yet Trump still keeps saying it's a problem for local officials to deal with on their own.

Also, if and when the country opens up, ask yourself how Dane County's contact tracing will work once people start traveling around the country. If a contact goes to Dallas before county officials get to them, is someone from Madison gonna hop a plane to Dallas? Or are they gonna call someone in Dallas and hope that they have contact tracing in place.

Or would it be better if the whole thing was led and coordinated by CDC?

[warriorchick]

Milwaukee hospitals at critically low levels of personal protective equipment

https://www.tmj4.com/news/local-news/milwaukee-hospitals-at-critically-low-levels-of-personal-protective-equipment

I can vouch for this.  My daughter recently began putting in 12-hour shifts at the Covid-19 unit at St. Luke's.  She has accepted the fact that she will likely catch the virus because she is not able to change masks as often as protocol requires. She has no hesitation, however, about going in every day to care for these folks, and I am very proud of her.

I tried to find the recent post where someone said they had a personal stash of N-95 masks, but haven't been successful so far.  If he sees this, I am humbly asking if he could spare a few for people who are literally face to face with infected people all day long.  I can PM him with my daughter's address. When she isn't at the hospital, she is quarantined.

[#UnleashSean]

Plasma transfusion

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/2020/04/11/milwaukee-man-stable-after-experimental-coronavirus-plasma-transfusion/2977352001/

This is the quickest way back to normal life. The bigger the pool gets the faster we can go back to normal.

Itll also he a great stopgap until a vaccine

[GooooMarquette]

This is the quickest way back to normal life. The bigger the pool gets the faster we can go back to normal.

Itll also he a great stopgap until a vaccine

Yep. I have posted this before and on other threads, but here is a link for the national study, which currently has over 800 hospitals and blood banks participating to provide standardized administration, monitoring and data collection.

https://www.uscovidplasma.org

[forgetful]

Plasma transfusion

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/2020/04/11/milwaukee-man-stable-after-experimental-coronavirus-plasma-transfusion/2977352001/

This has been my treatment of choice for awhile. While it also is/was not a guaranteed positive treatment. There is solid precedence of this approach working in other viral diseases with great success (see Ebola).

It would have been nice if weeks ago, we were talking about the importance of those that have recovered donating blood/plasma as much as possible so we can save a lot of lives, instead of focusing on a different drug with little to no proven efficacy.

[Jockey]

This has been my treatment of choice for awhile. While it also is/was not a guaranteed positive treatment. There is solid precedence of this approach working in other viral diseases with great success (see Ebola).

It would have been nice if weeks ago, we were talking about the importance of those that have recovered donating blood/plasma as much as possible so we can save a lot of lives, instead of focusing on a different drug with little to no proven efficacy.

It would have been nice if a lot of things were done weeks ago.

[Jockey]

I agree regarding testing and contact tracing and frankly have no idea how the CDC hasn't been running that from the start. Totally bizarre.

While your point is correct, wide scale testing requires the Federal Gov't to order industries that are capable to produce test kits by the hundreds of millions. Then the CDC can then be the main hub for contact tracing working with the states.

It all comes down to testing. If we had the tests, we could start opening back up almost immediately. Work and schools.

[wadesworld]

Do the plasma transfusions have to be coming from a person who has had, and then recovered from, covid 19? Wouldn’t that require much more testing than we have available for that to be scalable to the point it can help us open things back up?

[GooooMarquette]

Do the plasma transfusions have to be coming from a person who has had, and then recovered from, covid 19? Wouldn’t that require much more testing than we have available for that to be scalable to the point it can help us open things back up?

Yes and yes.

From the national protocol: "The protocol requires the patient or family member to consent to receiving plasma from someone who has recovered from COVID-19."

[tower912]

Plasma transfusions are going through the same accelerated assessments as other treatments.   The plasma does have to come from someone who has had and recovered from the virus.   Yes, that means we need to accelerate testing and have willing donors.   

The questions have to do with whether the plasma from someone who had a mild case have the same antibodies, the same volume of antibodies, and do you want plasma from someone who survived a mild case or severe case.

[#UnleashSean]

The questions have to do with whether the plasma from someone who had a mild case have the same antibodies, the same volume of antibodies, and do you want plasma from someone who survived a mild case or severe case.

Yes, they should be the same antibodies. Unless there are multiple strains running around all over the country. Which would be good and bad.

[forgetful]

Do the plasma transfusions have to be coming from a person who has had, and then recovered from, covid 19? Wouldn’t that require much more testing than we have available for that to be scalable to the point it can help us open things back up?

Right now yes, it does require they come from a recovered patient.

The questions have to do with whether the plasma from someone who had a mild case have the same antibodies, the same volume of antibodies, and do you want plasma from someone who survived a mild case or severe case.

Yes, but we do have some data now on which antibodies are most effective at neutralizing the virus. I posted on this paper previously, but the results of this study provide some information on which antibodies are having the most effect. These can be made using recombinant approaches on scale. We can then produce industrial scale amounts of the most effective antibodies, and we would no longer need recovered patients.

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.21.990770v1.full.pdf

If it is pushed very hard, I think this would be the most effective treatment to come online fast.

[GooooMarquette]

For the past couple of days, I have been saying that, despite its initial failure, the CDC should be leading the response against COVID by aggressively increasing our testing capacity, and implementing a comprehensive contact tracing infrastructure. I pointed to the CDC's own summary of its response to H1N1, where it did those very things. And I have argued that the fragmented system of state and local public health department efforts to take over these roles will be slow and haphazard at best, because the CDC, not state and local public health departments, was created to deal with exactly this kind of threat.

On cue...this editorial in today's NYT makes the exact same argument, with additional details:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/12/opinion/cdc-coronavirus.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage