Comment On One Aspect Of The PSU Sanctions

[Tugg Speedman]

The sanctions were handed down and they were harsh.

One thing that I noticed was all current and incoming Penn State football players are free to transfer now without sitting out.  They can play this fall for another school.  Further, if they want to transfer to a school that is out of scholarships, they can as the NCAA will allow that school to expand it roster for PSU transfers.

I've never heard of this before, is this new?  If so, I like the move.  They should consider this for future schools that will be hit by sanctions.  This says that current players are not punished by the actions of their precessors and it will make a school think twice about cheating if everyone can leave (Lane Kifflin at USC, I'm talking to you).

Thoughts.

[77ncaachamps]

Thoughts?

Is there a shooting guard among them?

[🏀]

Really needed a new thread for this?

[T-Bone]

Sounds like Marquette should start a football program by making offers to all current PSU players - not the coaches.  Buzz can do that in his free time.  

/walks away

//And how does this affect Newbill's status?

[Benny B]

I think relaxing the transfer rules work for football... not so sure I'd ever extend this to basketball, however.  Consider a scenario where Calipari finally gets caught and all of his players transferred to Syracuse.  The Orange would have more 5-stars on their bench than any other team in D-I would have in their starting lineup.  And if you didn't allow rosters to be expanded to accommodate, you'd be opening up the floodgates for other players to be "cut," thus creating even more transfers.

At some point the NCAA has to tell student-athletes to "man up" and take responsibility for their decisions.  If a S-A happens to choose a program that happens to be dirty, then he/she has to live with the consequences if the program is ever sanctioned.  Universities should have to disclose all investigations, APR scores, etc. so that the S-A can make an "informed" decision before signing an NLI, and if the university gets sanctioned for something it didn't disclose (but knew about), then the S-A should have the ability to seek retribution from the university (e.g., a multiple of the scholarship award value).

[Tugg Speedman]

Same applies for football ... they can all wind up at Ohio State or Alabama.

[4everwarriors]

We got room for Newbill.

[Spotcheck Billy]

Same applies for football ... they can all wind up at Ohio State or Alabama.

well, maybe not Ohio State this year (also under a post-season ban and scholarship restrictions)

if WI doesn't make the Big 10 title game this year, well can you spel H-i-r-o-s-h-i-m-a?

[Benny B]

Same applies for football ... they can all wind up at Ohio State or Alabama.

Unlike basketball, football has a roster maximum - 105.  If you already have your own 85 scholarship players, you're only going to take 20 PSU transfers.  So instead of 85 scholarship players, you'd have 105... less than a 25% addition.  In basketball, taking just five scholarship players from a "disciplined" program would increase your scholarship numbers by nearly 40% and still keep you under the roster size of D-I teams carrying a bunch of walk-ons.

[Nukem2]

Sad part of all of this, other than obvioulsy those violated by Sandusky, is that this never needed to be about Penn State FB in the first place.  It took the mis-guided actions of PSU adminstrators and Paterno to "protect" the program.  Had they done the right thing in the first place, the storyline would have been about a former employee who abused the privileges of using PSU facilities and events with some small "taint" on PSU.

Now Sandusky is in jail for life and the admiinstrators have ruined their own professional lives and are subject to criminal and civil actions and likely could end upo in jail.  Paterno's legacy is ruind and his family has and will continue to suffer.  And, PSU and its FB program now suffer far, far, far more in many ways than any perceived taint that may have arisen in dealing with Sandusky in the proper manner in the first place.

[Tugg Speedman]

At some point the NCAA has to tell student-athletes to "man up" and take responsibility for their decisions.  If a S-A happens to choose a program that happens to be dirty, then he/she has to live with the consequences if the program is ever sanctioned.  Universities should have to disclose all investigations, APR scores, etc. so that the S-A can make an "informed" decision before signing an NLI, and if the university gets sanctioned for something it didn't disclose (but knew about), then the S-A should have the ability to seek retribution from the university (e.g., a multiple of the scholarship award value).

This is not about football players "man-ing up" but about hammering a dirty program so they change their ways.  I like the "free to transfer" punishment handed to school because it will get a dirty program to think twice about cheating.

[bilsu]

This is not about football players "man-ing up" but about hammering a dirty program so they change their ways.  I like the "free to transfer" punishment handed to school because it will get a dirty program to think twice about cheating.

This is different, because it did not involve cheating in recruiting. A player that goes to a University that cheated to get him, should not be allowed a free transfer. The player knowingly or unknowingly is involved in the cheating process. Recruits should also be expected to know the recruiting rules and abide by them. A recruit should be expected to run from a coach that contacts them in a quiet period or offers them something that is not permitted.

[Tugg Speedman]

Does anyone know ...

Can a current PSU "re-sign" with the team?  Otherwise, they are on the open market and will be hounded forever by other schools assistants, "street agents" and/or boosters.  So, can a current PSU player "re-sign" as a way to tell all of them to leave him alone?

[Nukem2]

Does anyone know ...

Can a current PSU "re-sign" with the team?  Otherwise, they are on the open market and will be hounded forever by other schools assistants, "street agents" and/or boosters.  So, can a current PSU player "re-sign" as a way to tell all of them to leave him alone?

Unless the player asks for a release, he would be off-limits for other schools technically.  Though, I suspect there will be an awful lot of back-channeling going on .......

[MerrittsMustache]

Unless the player asks for a release, he would be off-limits for other schools technically.  Though, I suspect there will be an awful lot of back-channeling going on .......

Urban Meyer and Lane Kiffin were already seen on PSU's campus wearing sunglasses and fake mustaches.

[Skitch]

Hasn't this scenario already happened in basketball?  I thought this is why the guy from UConn (who's name I can't remember)  was allowed to transfer without sitting out.

[ecompt]

This just in: the Big Ten Network has merged with Court TV.

[T-Bone]

Hasn't this scenario already happened in basketball?  I thought this is why the guy from UConn (who's name I can't remember)  was allowed to transfer without sitting out.

Roscoe Smith, Oriaki, etc.
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/7846769/roscoe-smith-michael-bradley-granted-release-connecticut-huskies
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/7974198/former-uconn-huskies-forward-roscoe-smith-transfers-unlv-rebels

[Benny B]

Hasn't this scenario already happened in basketball?  I thought this is why the guy from UConn (who's name I can't remember)  was allowed to transfer without sitting out.

The difference is that they could transfer to another program so long as the other program had a scholarship available (or could make one available).  In this case with Penn State, an "accepting" school can offer a scholarship to a PSU transfer even if it puts them over the maximum.

[frozena pizza]

This was an important aspect of the "death penalty" given to SMU.  I do like the fact that current PSU players are not being punished for something they likely had nothing to do with and knew nothing about.  It is also a very severe penalty on PSU because it gives them no means to keep their current players.  They will crumble.

[bilsu]

It will be interesting what the Big 10 does about them. They should easily become the worst football team in the Big 10 for several years. I suppose a team that would not of been bowl eligible now would be eligible, because they are beating a poor Penn St team vs. losing to a very good one. However, ignoring that the Big 10 has lost a bowl game, which hurts every team's pocket book.

[axaguy]

I think some very important points are getting missed and mslabeled in an attempt by the NCAA to come accross as the "cops" or the good guys here. The crimes committed by Sandusky are henious and cruel and should go punished and prosecuted as they have been. He has fnally been stopped and can do no more harm to anyone, but the harm already done can not be "undone."

The real crimes here are the inability of the people in power at the university to act a long time ago. I don't think they actually acted to protect the football program, at all. Certainly they delayed bad publicity on it and themselves. I think they acted, or didn't act out of fear for themselves, the unknown, the fear of being wrong, the fear of being right, the fear of Sandusky, the fear of not really knowing what to do and how to go about it. This is not making their actions right by any means, at all.

Victims are talking now but in how many cases, with other people and vicitms, have the vicitms not spoken out until very much later?? Would they have testified against Sandusky then or even come forward? Remember that Sandusky was a pretty revered guy in the PSU commnuity, as well. Many of the vicitms held Sandusky in high regard and may not have sought to prosecute him then....

The university and it's board of trustees should be punished hard or even harder. Criminal charges are and should be pending against those with ANY iota of information or influence or official responsibility at the time. Paterno's legacy will be irreparably harmed but he can not defend himself or offer any insight into his actions today. We know some but not all he knew or thought.

The current players ARE paying a price for "others" cirmes!! The school didn't cheat to win games, increase revenues, change grades, illegally recruit. The program WAS run above board, or so it seems, noted by many in the business then and now. The current players and staff ARE paying a price for the "lack of institutional control" of others.

Why take away bowl games? Limit recruiting? The reputation, stigma of the crimes, change in coaching staff and heavy negative recruiting by other programs will certainly take a toll on the future of Penn State football without "official" santions.

I believe the fines are just, as well as the establishment of the use of the funds for the protection of abused children and the like. Even raise the fines!! Make annual, future, fines permanent!! Like an endowment. No cap or ceiling. It's never over for the abused kids, why should it be for the school if you want to make a point.

BUT. Don't cripple the program by limiting grants-in-aid. Don't drive off current players. Enough other changes will do that. How do you expect the school to come up with the funds to PAY the fines??? Tax revenues? You live in Pa? If this was Marquette would tuition be raised to cover lost athletic revenues, which are substantial? How would future students families like that?

The football program was financially successful. Tax the hell out of it, don't kill it. The "death penalty" or severe actions against the team and players should only be invoked if it was an actual beneficiary of bad deeds. The adminstration made some bad decisions for sure, should be fired and prosecuted and punished as a result and example.

I am not a Penn State alumni, fan or supporter by any means, but let's look a bit deeper in the actions and reactions we take. Knee jerk and "good" publicity reactions may not be the answers either, at all. What do we really need to do? Not forget for sure and that may be the biggest legacy to leave here.........

[Spotcheck Billy]

BUT. Don't cripple the program by limiting grants-in-aid. Don't drive off current players. Enough other changes will do that. How do you expect the school to come up with the funds to PAY the fines??? Tax revenues? You live in Pa? If this was Marquette would tuition be raised to cover lost athletic revenues, which are substantial? How would future students families like that?

some one posted earlier about the size of the university's endowment ($1.3 Billion?)

[Spotcheck Billy]

It will be interesting what the Big 10 does about them.

the only thing the Big 10 did was that they are not eligible for any bowl revenue during the 4 years they are not bowl eligible - around $13 million will be split amongst the remaining teams which I guess will have to take that as compensation for PSU driving down the conference market value

another's reply below is correct

I thought the $13 million was being donated to charity.

[Tugg Speedman]

the only thing the Big 10 did was that they are not eligible for any bowl revenue during the 4 years they are not bowl eligible - around $13 million will be split amongst the remaining teams which I guess will have to take that as compensation for PSU driving down the conference market value

I thought the $13 million was being donated to charity.