Izzo advised Crean to leave

[Big East Warriors]

Hate to beat a dead (fake tan) dog here, but I got a laugh out of this. Tom Izzo dicussed how he advised Crean to leave because "You've gotta. It's Indiana. It's Big Ten". I dont know about you, but i cant think of anything better than Big Ten ball. Oh wait...

"Michigan State coach Tom Izzo, who hired Crean as a graduate assistant and an assistant coach for the Spartans, advised Crean to leave a Marquette program he took to the Final Four to tackle the job that awaits at Indiana.

"I'll just say ... it all happened very quick, as you know," Izzo said. "I was a part of it. We did talk. And as much as I love what Marquette did for Tom Crean, my immediate was, "You've gotta. It's Indiana. It's Big Ten.'

"We knew some of the things that went on, but not the depth as he found out in the next three weeks," Izzo said of the turmoil at Indiana. "But at the same time, I think it was a no-brainer, and that's no insult to Marquette. It was a job I think he had to take."

Izzo said Crean will succeed at Indiana.


http://www.southbendtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081028/SPORTS10/810280388/1001/Sports

[MUfan12]

Managed to talk to Izzo but not Wild or Cottingham. Turns out that was true after all.

Still hope they go winless.

[4everwarriors]

How is it not a knock on Marquette? For my part he should have left after Kansas handed his ass to him in 2003. Really started to smell like week old fish at that point.

[IAmMarquette]

Present day: Marquette >>>>> Indiana

Historically: Marquette <<  Indiana

To quote Bruce Weber, "indiana will suck."

[Gwaki]

Managed to talk to Izzo but not Wild or Cottingham. Turns out that was true after all.

Still hope they go winless.

I do too but we have seen how Crean and his nonconference scheduling goes..

[reinko]

Edit: I took 94Warriors epic post about Mbakwe and did some slight modifications.  Sorry about any confusion.

Who?  Never heard of him.

Seriously, I'd be more concerned with his team of scrubs than who advised to go to IU.  If you want a guy who takes advantage of a university only to abandon them in the middle of the night and let the media tell his players he was leaving - giving the program no warning - you are welcome to him. 

You can find him, his tan, his unlimited supply of Diet Pepsi, and his obscenely long ties at IU.  He'll have 2 yrs to polish that turd of a roster after this season, while accomplishing absolutely nothing.

[RawdogDX]

By him saying "It's the big 10" do you think he was saying "it's going to be much easier to win the conference"?

[77ncaachamps]

By him saying "It's the big 10" do you think he was saying "it's going to be much easier to win the conference"?

I think so.

I also think Izzo meant: "it's going to be much easier to win the conference...When I finally leave for the NBA."

[Hards Alumni]

I think so.

I also think Izzo meant: "it's going to be much easier to win the conference...When I finally leave for the NBA."

I guess I don't really understand the hard on that a lot of people have for Tom Izzo.

What has he done since 2000?  One Final Four, One Elite eight, and a sweet sixteen.  Other than that a lot of one and dones. (Tom Crean anyone?)

I won't deny he had a great run before 2000, but his legacy over the last 8 years has been mediocrity with a few bright spots... since 2000 Bo Ryan has a better record... sorry to bring up the team from Madison, but it validates my point.

Bo (173-58) for a .749 avg.
Izzo (151-77) for a .662 avg.

I would also argue that Bo Ryan has done a LOT more with less.  Izzo has gotten recruits and pretty talented guys, and has produced less success than Bo Ryan in the last 8 years.

a point for Izzo would be his ability to turn a good team into a monster team in the tournament... since Ryan can't beat anything better than the 9th ranked team.

The Big Ten is so effing overrated... I can't handle hearing from my coworkers (I work in the Madison area) that the Big Ten even resembles a decent basketball conference when half the teams barely field a team.

[wadesworld]

I guess I don't really understand the hard on that a lot of people have for Tom Izzo.

What has he done since 2000?  One Final Four, One Elite eight, and a sweet sixteen.  Other than that a lot of one and dones. (Tom Crean anyone?)

I won't deny he had a great run before 2000, but his legacy over the last 8 years has been mediocrity with a few bright spots...

HAH!  There is nothing mediocre about a Final Four, an Elite Eight, and a Sweet Sixteen over the last 8 years.  If you aren't UCLA, Kansas, Duke, Texas, or UNC you'll definitely take that.  I think he may have only had one senior class leave Michigan State without making a Final Four.  That's ridiculous.  I'll take him over just about any coach other than 2 in the state of North Carolina.

[Hards Alumni]

no, there isn't, but Crean had a final four and a bunch of 'good' seasons and everyone swears up and down that they hated him.

I'm just pointing out that a lot of people think that Izzo is the next Roy Williams et al. without actually looking at his overall record.

he is a phenominal tournament coach... dont get me wrong.

[Pago Warrior]

Since the 00-01 season, TC posted 1 FF, one 2nd Rd, and the rest were either 1 and done or worse -not not even making the NCAA.
Izzo made it to the NCAAs every year since 00-01 and posted 2 FF, 1 elite 8, 1 sweet 16, 1 2nd Rd, and 3 1st round.

The records are not even remotely comparable.

His reg game record may not be as good as Bo's or most any other coach.  But like you mentioned, he's good when it matters and his name belongs in the discussion of the top tier coaches.

[RawdogDX]

+1,  you are a bit off the mark here hards.

[shaquilvaine]

Hards... you are the perfect example of today's spoiled fan.  If you are asking what has Izzo done lately, then you are clueless. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

Present day: Marquette >>>>> Indiana

Historically: Marquette <<  Indiana

To quote Bruce Weber, "indiana will suck."

But for how long?  My guess is, not that long.

[OneMadWarrior]

At this point I do not think Hards is a spoiled fan. That is an incorrect assertion, his argument is taht why does everyone automatically assume that Izzo is the coach to end all for the Big 10. He makes valid points about how Ryan has done more with less and has more big 10 championships since arriving in Madison. He in no way is belittling what Izzo did in the 90's he is only pointing out that holding him as the standard of Big 10 coaches. Now comparing him to Crean is ridiculous, Crean has one tournament win sans Dwyane Wade, and a bunch of NIT appearances. I think in the long run Indiana will wave goodbye to Crean after he wins 20-25 a year, but can't get over that "hump" that izzo still manages to get over form time to time (even as a 5 seed) He will then get fired because its not Marquette, Its Indiana, It's Indiana.

[Hards Alumni]

mostly that is what I was getting at.  I wasn't saying he was a terrible coach... but he shouldn't be the benchmark that every other coach should be compared to.

as for Crean vs Izzo records... calling it 'not remotely comparable' is completely wrong... since words matter.

Crean since 2000 : 160-68 which is a .702 avg.
Izzo since 2000 : 151-77 which is a .662 avg.

my argument holds weight, yours does not.

Again, I never said that Izzo was a bad tourney coach, in fact, I said just the opposite.

I mentioned overall records since the year 2000, including post season records in the argument does not support an argument that proves me wrong... since I am arguing only overall records.

Also, I don't understand how I am a spoiled fan?.. Are you implying and assuming that I think Crean is a great coach?  Look up my history on these boards, I'm quite sure you will find just the opposite.  I respect what he did for the team, but he is not the top tier coach that he or the media thinks he is.  He is a salesman and a good one at that.

My point is that Izzo is not the great coach that everyone professes him to be.  He has had good teams, and good players... and he is a great tournament coach.  But for God's sake, he hasn't even won a shared title of the BIG TEN since 2000-2001.

[jce]

no, there isn't, but Crean had a final four and a bunch of 'good' seasons and everyone swears up and down that they hated him.

I'm just pointing out that a lot of people think that Izzo is the next Roy Williams et al. without actually looking at his overall record.

he is a phenominal tournament coach... dont get me wrong.

Izzo the next Roy Williams?  That should be reversed.  Izzo won his championship before Williams did.

[Hards Alumni]

again, you are missing or ignoring the point I made.

[jce]

I completely understood your point.  I just found it misguided.

The only current coaches that have outperformed Izzo are Coach K, Pitino, Donovan, and Williams.  You could make a case for Calipari, Self, Boeheim and Howland.  Outside of that, who?

[RawdogDX]

again, you are missing or ignoring the point I made.

don't get defensive but you can't expect everyone to agree with you here.  You can show the regualar season reccords if you want but i don't feel like that means much.  You are the one who came out fireing saying we had a "hard on" for him.  I'm not sure how good i have to think someone is to have a "hard on" for them.  I wouldn't put him in the top 5 but i'd think about top 10 and for sure i'd have him in the top 15.  Does that mean I have a hard on for him?

If someone asked me if i'd be happy if over the next 8 years buzz has 8 NCAA appearences with 1 final four, one eleite 8 and one sweet 16 i'd be pretty excited about it. 

[bma725]

as for Crean vs Izzo records... calling it 'not remotely comparable' is completely wrong... since words matter.

Crean since 2000 : 160-68 which is a .702 avg.
Izzo since 2000 : 151-77 which is a .662 avg.

They aren't comparable when you factor in that Crean had 5 years in C-USA in there, which as good as it used to be was not the Big 10.

[bma725]

I guess I don't really understand the hard on that a lot of people have for Tom Izzo.

What has he done since 2000?  One Final Four, One Elite eight, and a sweet sixteen.  Other than that a lot of one and dones. (Tom Crean anyone?)

Izzo went to the Final Four in 2001 and 2005, how is that one Final Four since 2000?

[77ncaachamps]

as for Crean vs Izzo records... calling it 'not remotely comparable' is completely wrong... since words matter.

Crean since 2000 : 160-68 which is a .702 avg.
Izzo since 2000 : 151-77 which is a .662 avg.

My point is that Izzo is not the great coach that everyone professes him to be.  He has had good teams, and good players... and he is a great tournament coach.  But for God's sake, he hasn't even won a shared title of the BIG TEN since 2000-2001.

The Top Two positions in the Big Ten is like aiming to be one of the top 4 or 5 in the Big East. So it just shows how GOOD of a coach he is when it matters since he's been in the NCAAs since 2000 and reached those different pinnacles despite not sharing or owning the Big Ten regular season title.

BTW, the only comparison that matters between Crean and Izzo is this one:


3/15/2007,   L 49-61, NCAA Tournament @ Winston-Salem

[Hards Alumni]

Izzo went to the Final Four in 2001 and 2005, how is that one Final Four since 2000?

to clarify, I didn't count the 2000-2001 season in my records, I must have mistyped that at the time.