Recruiting as of 5/15/24

[brewcity77]

15 in 20 years? That doesn't seem right...

2018 (1): Joey Hauser
2016 (3): Sam Hauser, Markus Howard, Brendan Bailey
2015 (2): Henry Ellenson, Haanif Cheatham
2014 (1): Sandy Cohen
2013 (3): Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton, Duane Wilson
2012 (1): Steve Taylor
2011 (1): Juan Anderson
2010 (2): Vander Blue, Jamail Jones
2009 (3): Junior Cadougan, Jeronne Maymon, Erik Williams

That's 17 in the last 10 years. That doesn't include the Amigos, Mason, Novak, Diener...

[Herman Cain]

15 in 20 years? That doesn't seem right...

2018 (1): Joey Hauser
2016 (3): Sam Hauser, Markus Howard, Brendan Bailey
2015 (2): Henry Ellenson, Haanif Cheatham
2014 (1): Sandy Cohen
2013 (3): Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton, Duane Wilson
2012 (1): Steve Taylor
2011 (1): Juan Anderson
2010 (2): Vander Blue, Jamail Jones
2009 (3): Junior Cadougan, Jeronne Maymon, Erik Williams

That's 17 in the last 10 years. That doesn't include the Amigos, Mason, Novak, Diener...

Before he collapsed, Noskowiak was ranked in the top 100 at one point as high as 41.

[Hards Alumni]

15 in 20 years? That doesn't seem right...

2018 (1): Joey Hauser
2016 (3): Sam Hauser, Markus Howard, Brendan Bailey
2015 (2): Henry Ellenson, Haanif Cheatham
2014 (1): Sandy Cohen
2013 (3): Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton, Duane Wilson
2012 (1): Steve Taylor
2011 (1): Juan Anderson
2010 (2): Vander Blue, Jamail Jones
2009 (3): Junior Cadougan, Jeronne Maymon, Erik Williams

That's 17 in the last 10 years. That doesn't include the Amigos, Mason, Novak, Diener...

Facts be damned with that man.

[Herman Cain]

NBPA Camp coming up this week at UVA. College Coaches and Pro Scouts will be there for the first time. Quite a few of the MU prospects will be there. Here is the roster:

https://hoopseen.com/news/event/201906/2019-nbpa-top-100-camp-roster

[forgetful]

15 in 20 years? That doesn't seem right...

2018 (1): Joey Hauser
2016 (3): Sam Hauser, Markus Howard, Brendan Bailey
2015 (2): Henry Ellenson, Haanif Cheatham
2014 (1): Sandy Cohen
2013 (3): Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton, Duane Wilson
2012 (1): Steve Taylor
2011 (1): Juan Anderson
2010 (2): Vander Blue, Jamail Jones
2009 (3): Junior Cadougan, Jeronne Maymon, Erik Williams

That's 17 in the last 10 years. That doesn't include the Amigos, Mason, Novak, Diener...

You missed Cain, RSCI 93, #80 Rivals, #99 247.

edit: I am incorrect, I was using data on Draft Express that had the RSCI rankings, but they differ from the official RSCI rankings. Cain is not in the official RSCI ranking...as noted below, Heldt is though.

[Marcus92]

Matt Heldt was ranked #96 according to RSCI.

[Herman Cain]

NBPA Camp coming up this week at UVA. College Coaches and Pro Scouts will be there for the first time. Quite a few of the MU prospects will be there. Here is the roster:

https://hoopseen.com/news/event/201906/2019-nbpa-top-100-camp-roster

Date of camp June 11-16

[brewcity77]

Matt Heldt was ranked #96 according to RSCI.

So 18 in 10 years. Seems pretty okay to me.

[Dawson Rental]

I'm okay with your approach...IF recruiting gets to the point that your talent is good enough 1-10, to justify NOT having to take a grad transfer every year. That's not to say Wojo has done a bad job recruiting, but it's not yet to the point either where you can just plug the next guy in and go, without skipping much of a beat 6-10 as you would 1-5. A lot of times recruiting rankings don't mean anything, but Paint touches had a few tweets a couple days ago stating how only 5 of the 15 top 100 recruits MU has had the last 20 years or so have stayed the full 4 years. To me, the problem isn't that only 5 have stayed, the problem is only having 15 top 100 recruits in the last 20 years...that's pretty telling if you ask me. If you do basic math on that...and let's assume 2 per school, that means the top 50 schools(and MU should CERTAINLY be at least a top 50 school every year) can have two, EVERY year. MU has only had 15 in 20 years! Now, obviously, it's not that simple, but to me, 15 in 20 years is the problem, not that only 5 have stayed the full 4 years.

Math much?

If MU is only top 50 getting two top 100 guys a year that means that nobody is getting more than two a year.  Not really the case, is it?

[muguru]

15 in 20 years? That doesn't seem right...

2018 (1): Joey Hauser
2016 (3): Sam Hauser, Markus Howard, Brendan Bailey
2015 (2): Henry Ellenson, Haanif Cheatham
2014 (1): Sandy Cohen
2013 (3): Jajuan Johnson, Deonte Burton, Duane Wilson
2012 (1): Steve Taylor
2011 (1): Juan Anderson
2010 (2): Vander Blue, Jamail Jones
2009 (3): Junior Cadougan, Jeronne Maymon, Erik Williams

That's 17 in the last 10 years. That doesn't include the Amigos, Mason, Novak, Diener...

My bad, it was 15 in 10 years...and they were using RSCI top 100...


Paint Touches
‏ @PaintTouches
Jun 4

But one thing I do think is particularly curious, despite not grabbing the elite talent, only 5 out of 15 RSCI top-100 #mubb players in the last 10 years have exhausted their eligibility at MU.


Still not good enough IMO...15 in 10 years??

[muguru]

Math much?

If MU is only top 50 getting two top 100 guys a year that means that nobody is getting more than two a year.  Not really the case, is it?

Umm, did you read my post?? It was using basic math, and I said, I realize it isn't that simple...but let's say 3 teams get 4 each...that still leaves 88 top 100's for 47 schools...MU should be getting at LEAST 1 per year IMO. Remember, we aren't talking top 25, or even top 50, we are talking top 100. Regardless, MU should have enough cache to get at least one top 100 every year. Just my opinion.

[brewcity77]

Umm, did you read my post?? It was using basic math, and I said, I realize it isn't that simple...but let's say 3 teams get 4 each...that still leaves 88 top 100's for 47 schools...MU should be getting at LEAST 1 per year IMO. Remember, we aren't talking top 25, or even top 50, we are talking top 100. Regardless, MU should have enough cache to get at least one top 100 every year. Just my opinion.

So in the past 10 years, they missed that one. Torrence will likely finish top-100, so the only year without was 2017 with Cain, Elliott, & John.

[muguru]

So in the past 10 years, they missed that one. Torrence will likely finish top-100, so the only year without was 2017 with Cain, Elliott, & John.

And yet, some people grimace at the thought of bringing someone else in to play ahead of one of those 3..

[forgetful]

Math much?

If MU is only top 50 getting two top 100 guys a year that means that nobody is getting more than two a year.  Not really the case, is it?

Note for the below I'm using RSCI final rankings.

I was curious (and bored) so ran some statistics for the 2008-18 classes (11 total years). Through that span only 12 teams had an average of 2 top 100 recruits per year they are:

School	Recruits	Average per year
Kentucky	52	4.73
Duke	43	3.91
Kansas	33	3
UCLA	32	2.91
Arizona	31	2.82
UNC	30	2.73
Texas	29	2.64
Louisville	27	2.45
Florida	26	2.36
Michigan St	24	2.18
Ohio State	24	2.18
Syracuse	22	2

During that window, we are tied for 17th in terms of RSCI top 100 recruits at 18. We are tied with NC State. Right in front of us with 20 recruits are: Villanova, Indiana, Memphis and Maryland.

So muguru's inclination of us doing poorly is not accurate. We are averaging 1.64 recruits per year, and we are very close to 'Nova quality recruiting.

[forgetful]

Some interesting observations from the analysis. Teams that are greatly outperforming their recruiting:

Wisconsin (6 RSCI100 recruits)
Virginia (12 RSCI100 recruits)

Vastly underperforming teams:

LSU (17 RSCI100 recruits)
Alabama (17 RSCI100 recruits)
Miss. St. (17 RSCI100 recruits)

Surprises. San Diego State has more (7) top 100 recruits than Wisconsin.

[muguru]

Note for the below I'm using RSCI final rankings.

I was curious (and bored) so ran some statistics for the 2008-18 classes (11 total years). Through that span only 12 teams had an average of 2 top 100 recruits per year they are:

School	Recruits	Average per year
Kentucky	52	4.73
Duke	43	3.91
Kansas	33	3
UCLA	32	2.91
Arizona	31	2.82
UNC	30	2.73
Texas	29	2.64
Louisville	27	2.45
Florida	26	2.36
Michigan St	24	2.18
Ohio State	24	2.18
Syracuse	22	2

During that window, we are tied for 17th in terms of RSCI top 100 recruits at 18. We are tied with NC State. Right in front of us with 20 recruits are: Villanova, Indiana, Memphis and Maryland.

So muguru's inclination of us doing poorly is not accurate. We are averaging 1.64 recruits per year, and we are very close to 'Nova quality recruiting.

But, you also have to remember, some of those schools are pulling in top 25-50(or higher kids). That tips the scales. I'm not saying MU should be(regularly), but I don't think it's a fair comparison in that a top 25-50 kid(at least on paper), isn't the same as a top 85-90 kid(where MU and others) would typically live. If you have two top 20 kids, and two kids ranked 90 & 95, sure they are still top 100, but that's quite the difference isn't it??

Now if you land a top 25 kid and another that's ranked 99th...that also makes a difference.

Or...if you land a top 25 kid, and not another top 100, that also makes a difference. In other words...the higher you go, the greater the impact(theoretically).

Just once, I would love for MU to land a class like Memphis has this year...Memphis...stop and think about that.

[D'Lo Brown]

Note for the below I'm using RSCI final rankings.

I was curious (and bored) so ran some statistics for the 2008-18 classes (11 total years). Through that span only 12 teams had an average of 2 top 100 recruits per year they are:

School	Recruits	Average per year
Kentucky	52	4.73
Duke	43	3.91
Kansas	33	3
UCLA	32	2.91
Arizona	31	2.82
UNC	30	2.73
Texas	29	2.64
Louisville	27	2.45
Florida	26	2.36
Michigan St	24	2.18
Ohio State	24	2.18
Syracuse	22	2

During that window, we are tied for 17th in terms of RSCI top 100 recruits at 18. We are tied with NC State. Right in front of us with 20 recruits are: Villanova, Indiana, Memphis and Maryland.

So muguru's inclination of us doing poorly is not accurate. We are averaging 1.64 recruits per year, and we are very close to 'Nova quality recruiting.

Great post. Thanks for sharing.

[Bocephys]

But, you also have to remember, some of those schools are pulling in top 25-50(or higher kids). That tips the scales. I'm not saying MU should be(regularly), but I don't think it's a fair comparison in that a top 25-50 kid(at least on paper), isn't the same as a top 85-90 kid(where MU and others) would typically live. If you have two top 20 kids, and two kids ranked 90 & 95, sure they are still top 100, but that's quite the difference isn't it??

Now if you land a top 25 kid and another that's ranked 99th...that also makes a difference.

Or...if you land a top 25 kid, and not another top 100, that also makes a difference. In other words...the higher you go, the greater the impact(theoretically).

Just once, I would love for MU to land a class like Memphis has this year...Memphis...stop and think about that.

Memphis is almost clearly dropping bags left and right to get that class.

[muguru]

Memphis is almost clearly dropping bags left and right to get that class.

Not sure, just think it has more to do with Penny's AAU connections.

[tower912]

Money bags and Penny's AAU connections are not mutually exclusive.   

[D'Lo Brown]

Didn't we have a "reply to muguru" thread going elsewhere? That idea was genius.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Has Memphis ever been successful without some cheating going on?

[brewcity77]

And yet, some people grimace at the thought of bringing someone else in to play ahead of one of those 3..

You're deflecting. You had a gripe that we didn't land enough top-100 kids. Turns out it was twice as many as you thought. Maybe a mea culpa is in order.

If you're talking about Theo, it's worth looking at this thread from Paint Touches.

https://twitter.com/painttouches/status/1137057865208934401?s=21

Theo was 17th in the nation in Defensive Player Impact Plus Minus last year. Half the guys ahead of him left. So he stands to be a legitimately elite defensive player next year. The biggest need doesn't seem to be taking minutes from a guy who is arguably better defensively than Markus is offensively.

[muguru]

You're deflecting. You had a gripe that we didn't land enough top-100 kids. Turns out it was twice as many as you thought. Maybe a mea culpa is in order.

If you're talking about Theo, it's worth looking at this thread from Paint Touches.

https://twitter.com/painttouches/status/1137057865208934401?s=21

Theo was 17th in the nation in Defensive Player Impact Plus Minus last year. Half the guys ahead of him left. So he stands to be a legitimately elite defensive player next year. The biggest need doesn't seem to be taking minutes from a guy who is arguably better defensively than Markus is offensively.

How am I deflecting?? It was NOT twice as many as I thought...I was using Paint touches tweet..15 in 10 years..My mistake was saying 20 years. Regardless, to me, it's still not enough...again, that's MY opinion. Others may think it's fine, and that's okay too.

As far as Theo goes..great, he figures to be elite defensively, and that can't be underestimated. However, I prefer my bigs to be able to be competent scoring the ball. I have always preferred bigs where even if they aren't the focal point of the offense, but your offense is struggling in a particular day, you can dump it down to him and have confidence it will be points. Like Robert Jackson...that's how I like my bigs. Not a focal point, but can take over a game when/if necessary.

Cain and Greg are loved by so many here...I don't see it, at least not yet. They are role players to me, maybe a bit better, but not guys that can take over a game if/when needed. You don't think their minutes couldn't be replaced with a more talented player??

[BCHoopster]

How am I deflecting?? It was NOT twice as many as I thought...I was using Paint touches tweet..15 in 10 years..My mistake was saying 20 years. Regardless, to me, it's still not enough...again, that's MY opinion. Others may think it's fine, and that's okay too.

As far as Theo goes..great, he figures to be elite defensively, and that can't be underestimated. However, I prefer my bigs to be able to be competent scoring the ball. I have always preferred bigs where even if they aren't the focal point of the offense, but your offense is struggling in a particular day, you can dump it down to him and have confidence it will be points. Like Robert Jackson...that's how I like my bigs. Not a focal point, but can take over a game when/if necessary.

Cain and Greg are loved by so many here...I don't see it, at least not yet. They are role players to me, maybe a bit better, but not guys that can take over a game if/when needed. You don't think their minutes couldn't be replaced with a more talented player??

The biggest gripe I have about Wojo's recruiting is that he has not found a center that can face the basket and make a shot.  Heldt, Theo, Morrow never got a chance to do that as Wojo always has there back to the basket.  The last center that was not a center was Jae Crowder,
he was a match-up nightmare and that is why he became Big East Player of the Year.  Cain and Greg right now are just players, role players at
best.  Hope they prove me wrong.