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* Next up: The long cold summer

Marquette
Marquette

Open Practice

Date/Time: Oct 11, 2024 ???
TV: NA
Schedule for 2023-24
27-10

Poll

Where would you rate Shaka's in-game coaching?

90th Percentile - right up there with the elite
5 (4.6%)
75th Percentile - better than most
49 (45.4%)
60th Percentile - upper of the middle
32 (29.6%)
50th Percentile - right in the middle
16 (14.8%)
40th Percentile - lower of the middle
3 (2.8%)
25th Percentile - worst than most
1 (0.9%)
10th Percentile - Really bad
2 (1.9%)

Total Members Voted: 108

Author Topic: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile  (Read 3911 times)

Viper

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #25 on: December 21, 2022, 08:55:59 AM »
Team is prone to 6, 7 minute scoring droughts. Not seeing set plays…isolation in the paint for Omax or Oso, or running off screens for a shooter, to break that. Doesn’t seem Shaka’s personality to hammer on a ref when deserved. T’d-up last night might have been ok. But, I think a 3-1 start to the BE is in order. 

rocky_warrior

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #26 on: December 21, 2022, 09:40:13 AM »
Shaka and staff need to improve their situational game. He is a system coach, is great on substitution patterns,

But I think that *is* his situational plan.  He has a "system", likes to use multiple guys, but will reinforce the same fundamentals regardless of the situation.   He's counting on the guys executing what he preaches every time down the floor (offense & defense).  Not changing it just because it failed a few times.  The polar opposite of Crean and his "playbook".

It's not a bad plan when it works (see, quickly running up the score), but as we've seen, all players are subject to droughts and breakdowns in executing the plan.

lawdog77

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #27 on: December 21, 2022, 09:46:59 AM »
In games decided by 5 points or less:

  • Ed Cooley is 71-29 or 71%
  • Shaka Smart is 64-69 or 48%

Shaka and staff need to improve their situational game. He is a system coach, is great on substitution patterns, but the situational anchor has travelled with him.  29-28 at VCU, 30-35 at Texas and 5-6 at MU. Consistently meh average for a coach who has a lifetime .654 winning percentage.
How many of those games were against "lesser" teams, where Cooley should have won by more than 5? How many times did they get blown out when they shouldn't have. There's a lot of nuance being missed by just using that stat.

Uncle Rico

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #28 on: December 21, 2022, 09:48:12 AM »
How many of those games were against "lesser" teams, where Cooley should have won by more than 5? How many times did they get blown out when they shouldn't have. There's a lot of nuance being missed by just using that stat.

Nuance has no place at scoop, come on
Ramsey head thoroughly up his ass.

Dr. Blackheart

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #29 on: December 21, 2022, 09:51:24 AM »
But I think that *is* his situational plan.  He has a "system", likes to use multiple guys, but will reinforce the same fundamentals regardless of the situation.   He's counting on the guys executing what he preaches every time down the floor (offense & defense).  Not changing it just because it failed a few times.  The polar opposite of Crean and his "playbook".

It's not a bad plan when it works (see, quickly running up the score), but as we've seen, all players are subject to droughts and breakdowns in executing the plan.

Oh, I agree with that (his system is his situational gameplan as seen in the Wisconsin game when Shaka said they hadn't yet practiced an end of game play). But, I also agree he has historically been a below average coach over his career at three different schools in close games.

Some here have said it's my "agenda". Fine. But, this critique came with Shaka from Texas. The Big East is a round robin league. We are seeing the same pattern here. Keeping doing the same thing and expect better results? Or change? Time will tell.

#COLE

Dr. Blackheart

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #30 on: December 21, 2022, 09:59:40 AM »
How many of those games were against "lesser" teams, where Cooley should have won by more than 5? How many times did they get blown out when they shouldn't have. There's a lot of nuance being missed by just using that stat.

This stat was used to reflect one of two possession games where a coach can make a difference.

As to beating a spread, I am not a bettor but please investigate that. That may be interesting to many.

I do know overall, Shaka has a .622 winning record and Cooley has a .616. Identical unlike for "close games".

MUfan12

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2022, 10:18:54 AM »
Offense is 17th in the country in KenPom, with three games that had 5+ minute scoring droughts. They'll be fine.

Defense is the bigger limiting factor for this team. When they're not forcing turnovers it gets ugly on that end.

Shaka's trying to thread a needle with this group. They need to learn, need to do it themselves, but at what point do you intervene, particularly when you had a media timeout in there? He used his TOs at Mackey, didn't last night, same outcome.

Dr. Blackheart

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #32 on: December 21, 2022, 11:00:05 AM »
What was Tom Creans games decided by 5 or less record?
They seem to have a solid relationship…
Here it is (or as good as my quick glance allows me)
  • Crean was 45-33 at MU, a 58% winning record in close games.  66% overall at MU
  • Buzz was 30-27 by this standard (he had one year at 2-7]. 53% vs 67% overall at MU
  • Wojo was 36-27 or 57%, the same as his overall

PointWarrior

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #33 on: December 21, 2022, 11:20:21 AM »
"Cookie crumbles" is an outstanding use of words for describing Shaka ball at crunch time in close games...


If the standard for a close game is 5 points (Purdue) or OT, then Shaka went 5-3 last season in close games.

Did he suddenly forget how to coach in close games? Or is that how the cookie crumbles some times?

TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2022, 11:40:33 AM »
How many of those games were against "lesser" teams, where Cooley should have won by more than 5? How many times did they get blown out when they shouldn't have. There's a lot of nuance being missed by just using that stat.

I was wondering this too so I looked (I also included OT games even if the final margin was over 5):

22-23: 2-1 against top 75 KP teams, 1-0 against sub-top-75
21-22: 8-2, 4-0
20-21: 4-3, 2-0
19-20: 5-2, 3-1
18-19: 2-3, 2-2
17-18: 4-3, 5-0
16-17: 5-2, 0-2
15-16: 8-0, 2-2 (2 losses were to Hank Ellenson!)
14-15: 5-2, 1-0
13-14: 3-4, 6-1
12-13: 2-3, 4-4
11-12: 1-2, 2-1

Total record vs. top 75 KP teams: 49-27 (64.4%)
Total record vs. sub 75 KP teams: 29-13 (69.0%)

His record is padded slightly by being in a lot more close games against teams he shouldn't be but a 64.4% winning percentage against good teams in close games is very good. Dude knows how to win close games.
TAMU

I do know, Newsie is right on you knowing ball.


TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #35 on: December 21, 2022, 11:42:36 AM »
"Cookie crumbles" is an outstanding use of words for describing Shaka ball at crunch time in close games...

That was funny. It is also funny that after leading the fight against COLE last season, you have become the king of COLE. Be careful when fighting monsters lest you become one
TAMU

I do know, Newsie is right on you knowing ball.


PointWarrior

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #36 on: December 21, 2022, 11:47:51 AM »

agree with you TAMU, until Shaka achieves something greater than a Wojo lead team, COLE will be hard to eliminate...  I had high hopes for this team tnis year but the record in games that matter this year is not good...

That was funny. It is also funny that after leading the fight against COLE last season, you have become the king of COLE. Be careful when fighting monsters lest you become one

1SE

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #37 on: December 21, 2022, 12:07:26 PM »
In games decided by 5 points or less:

  • Ed Cooley is 71-29 or 71%
  • Shaka Smart is 64-69 or 48%

Shaka and staff need to improve their situational game. He is a system coach, is great on substitution patterns, but the situational anchor has travelled with him.  29-28 at VCU, 30-35 at Texas and 5-6 at MU. Consistently meh average for a coach who has a lifetime .654 winning percentage.

Pretty strong difference in means there.
Real Warriors Demand Excellence

MUfan12

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #38 on: December 21, 2022, 12:10:32 PM »
agree with you TAMU, until Shaka achieves something greater than a Wojo lead team, COLE will be hard to eliminate...  I had high hopes for this team tnis year but the record in games that matter this year is not good...

Apparently Marquette hasn't won a game that mattered but still sits comfortably in the top 40 of every metric.

Do you believe the sh*t you post or is this some sort of performance?

Shooter McGavin

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #39 on: December 21, 2022, 02:45:58 PM »
At a young age, Shaka has coached in 33 more close games than Cooley.  Does Shaka coach his teams up or down to be in more close games?

Goose

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #40 on: December 21, 2022, 03:00:07 PM »
Point

What were your expectations for this season? Obviously they were quite lofty if you are disappointed with the progress of the team. I do not recall seeing any preseason prediction from you. As for me, they are right on pace on the 21 wins I predicted and believe they will win at least NCAA game this year. I had high expectations and they are better than I expected them to be.

PointWarrior

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #41 on: December 21, 2022, 03:32:08 PM »
My expectations were along the lines of yours Goose.  I just don't see happening after watching them stumble with late leads against Purdue and Providence and not being able to score against enough against Wisconsin (bad loss) and Miss State.  Creighton has lost six in a row so tjats not much of a quality win.  The Baylor game may be an aberration at this point.   The "cookies crumbling" taste a lot like a Wojo team. I think now 19 wins is the ceiling on this team.  We shall see...


Point

What were your expectations for this season? Obviously they were quite lofty if you are disappointed with the progress of the team. I do not recall seeing any preseason prediction from you. As for me, they are right on pace on the 21 wins I predicted and believe they will win at least NCAA game this year. I had high expectations and they are better than I expected them to be.

tower912

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #42 on: December 21, 2022, 03:51:59 PM »
My expectations were along the lines of yours Goose.  I just don't see happening after watching them stumble with late leads against Purdue and Providence and not being able to score against enough against Wisconsin (bad loss) and Miss State.  Creighton has lost six in a row so tjats not much of a quality win.  The Baylor game may be an aberration at this point.   The "cookies crumbling" taste a lot like a Wojo team. I think now 19 wins is the ceiling on this team.  We shall see...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnXL-XSyZKo&t=11s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0tjt2oI_2M
« Last Edit: December 21, 2022, 03:54:19 PM by tower912 »
Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

It is better to be fearless and cheerful than cheerless and fearful.

Goose

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #43 on: December 21, 2022, 03:53:03 PM »
Point

If you felt 21 was the number, what did you have our record in the four games lost prior to the season? I thought we were going to be 1-3 in those games and felt we would win 21.

frozena pizza

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #44 on: December 21, 2022, 04:31:58 PM »
Do you guys realize how close we are to being 13-0 and ranked in top 10 right now? At the end of the day, all a coach can do is give his team the best possible chance to get a win. I was not as over the moon about Shaka as most people when he was hired, but it's hard for me to say he hasn't met that standard. Our losses all could have gone either way, were against solid teams, and aside from Wisconsin were away from home. I'll take it and I like our chances in BE play.

GoldenEagles03

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #45 on: December 21, 2022, 04:37:11 PM »
Do you guys realize how close we are to being 13-0 and ranked in top 10 right now? At the end of the day, all a coach can do is give his team the best possible chance to get a win. I was not as over the moon about Shaka as most people when he was hired, but it's hard for me to say he hasn't met that standard. Our losses all could have gone either way, were against solid teams, and aside from Wisconsin were away from home. I'll take it and I like our chances in BE play.

Meh.

If Marquette loses the last 18 games of the season like last night they'd be 9-22.  Would we be saying, do you know how close we are to being 31-0!?!

They aren't close to being 13-0 because they are 9-4 and all 4 of their losses have come in the same fashion.  Leads late and collapse with no ability to end with the W.

Gotta find a way to be better than we have been.
VIOLENCE!

PointWarrior

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #46 on: December 21, 2022, 04:54:59 PM »
Miss St - W
Purdue - L
W is - W
Providence - L

2-2.   

The issue is not losing the games, but the inability to execute at crunch time.  In the BE, they will lose more than I expected originally cause they can't close out teams.





Point

If you felt 21 was the number, what did you have our record in the four games lost prior to the season? I thought we were going to be 1-3 in those games and felt we would win 21.

PointWarrior

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #47 on: December 21, 2022, 04:57:44 PM »

GoldenEagles03

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #48 on: December 21, 2022, 05:06:18 PM »
Miss St - W
Purdue - L
W is - W
Providence - L

2-2.   

The issue is not losing the games, but the inability to execute at crunch time.  In the BE, they will lose more than I expected originally cause they can't close out teams.

I thought 9-11 to start the season and I think 8 or 9 wins is realistic.

They arent going to blow many, if any league teams out. Gotta be able to close.

Seton Hall is bringing in a borderline Top 20 defense that is looking for it's 1st league win.  That one makes me incredibly nervous.
VIOLENCE!

tower912

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Re: Shaka's In-Game Coaching Percentile
« Reply #49 on: December 21, 2022, 05:08:24 PM »
well crap Tower, Shaka's Providence cookie crumble taste way worse than Wojo's

I hoped you would appreciate the joke.
Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

It is better to be fearless and cheerful than cheerless and fearful.