Big East Non Conference Results

[MUBigDance]

excuse me...interrupting the Cain/Brew thread...

just wanted to note the upside down nature of the Big East Standings on the left of the Scoop page...I know its not meaningful this early...but the optics of it catch my eye...V,X,SH at the bottom and DP,SJ,GT at the top!.

I am concerned though for the BE reputation. Don't want us to lose our "place" amongst the power conferences. A couple of down years for a BBall only conference could get us that less-than-major moniker (unfair as it might be). Nova's past keeps that a bay...but how many years does that last?

I know each year collectively has its own SOS...but in general:
BE Non-Conference Record:
17-18: 112-32 78%
16-17: 107-38 74%
15-16: 105-39 73%
14-15: 104-40 72%

18-19 Current: 28-11 72% - so sort of ok....we'll see.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

excuse me...interrupting the Cain/Brew thread...

just wanted to note the upside down nature of the Big East Standings on the left of the Scoop page...I know its not meaningful this early...but the optics of it catch my eye...V,X,SH at the bottom and DP,SJ,GT at the top!.

I am concerned though for the BE reputation. Don't want us to lose our "place" amongst the power conferences. A couple of down years for a BBall only conference could get us that less-than-major moniker (unfair as it might be). Nova's past keeps that a bay...but how many years does that last?

I know each year collectively has its own SOS...but in general:
BE Non-Conference Record:
17-18: 112-32 78%
16-17: 107-38 74%
15-16: 105-39 73%
14-15: 104-40 72%

18-19 Current: 28-11 72% - so sort of ok....we'll see.

The Big East is still at worst the 5th best conference in a down year.  They've easily been the 2nd or 3rd best over the past half decade since the re-org. 

I am far from worried long term, but this may be a year where the league gets 4-5 bids instead of 6-7. 

[Herman Cain]

excuse me...interrupting the Cain/Brew thread...

just wanted to note the upside down nature of the Big East Standings on the left of the Scoop page...I know its not meaningful this early...but the optics of it catch my eye...V,X,SH at the bottom and DP,SJ,GT at the top!.

I am concerned though for the BE reputation. Don't want us to lose our "place" amongst the power conferences. A couple of down years for a BBall only conference could get us that less-than-major moniker (unfair as it might be). Nova's past keeps that a bay...but how many years does that last?

I know each year collectively has its own SOS...but in general:
BE Non-Conference Record:
17-18: 112-32 78%
16-17: 107-38 74%
15-16: 105-39 73%
14-15: 104-40 72%

18-19 Current: 28-11 72% - so sort of ok....we'll see.

The Big East has benefited in recent years from the solid non conference performance from Butler and Xavier against top level opponents and to a lesser extent Creighton and Providence. Lets see how many teams can get to double digit wins by the start of conference play. That optic is always good, and then if the league is truly bunched up there will end up being quite a few 20 win teams in conference which should bode well.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

So 18-19 is currently within 2% of 3 of the last 4 years?, and only trailing the best yr in the history of the new big east conference by 6%, so ur worried?
Relax francis.  As was stated even in its worst year the BE is a top 6 conference and will receives all the accolades and advantages that go with that.

[Goose]

The BE has benefited from Butler and Creighton defying the odds much longer than I expected. I do not have high hopes for them to continue at the level they have since new BE was formed. BE needs MU, SJU, GU and DePaul to step up their games. If not, BE will struggle moving forward. Honestly, it has held up much better than I expected.

[GGGG]

Why do you believe that DePaul is going to step up instead of Butler?  Butler has been better than DePaul consistently for the past 20 years.

[Goose]

Sultan
I question if DePaul will step it up and take it to the next level. Butler has completely shocked me over the past 3-4 years at the level they remained at post BS. I do not think they have the staying power to remain at that level, or even close to that level.

[GGGG]

Butler's been a consistent NCAA tournament team since the late 90s.  I'm not sure they are going to get to back to back Final Fours, but there's no real reason that they can't continue with regular births with occasional deep runs.

[Goose]

Sultan
Once programs like Butler and Creighton miss for a couple of years, it gets very difficult to get back. Look at MU over past six years. I would not bet on either of them being top 50 programs year in and year out.

[Oldgym]

Sultan
Once programs like Butler and Creighton miss for a couple of years, it gets very difficult to get back. Look at MU over past six years. I would not bet on either of them being top 50 programs year in and year out.

And that logic does/does not apply to every other Big East program?  If not, which ones are exempt?

[GGGG]

Sultan
Once programs like Butler and Creighton miss for a couple of years, it gets very difficult to get back. Look at MU over past six years. I would not bet on either of them being top 50 programs year in and year out.

They why are you assuming programs like DePaul and St. Johns can? 

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Didn't Nova have a few lean years in the early 2010s pre NBE?

[Goose]

Old Gym
IMO, it probably does apply to every program, with exception of 'Nova. The BE has benefited from a white hot 'Nova program and a nice collection of top 30 teams. The top 30 teams have done a helluva of job maintaining for longer than I expected them to hang around. Sadly, GU, MU or STJ have not improved quickly enough to fill in for the Butler's and Creighton's.

Sultan
Not assuming anything about DePaul or St. John's. It was more hoping that they would rise up.

[GGGG]

I guess my thought is that it is much more likely...and I mean MUCH more likely...that Butler is going to perform where it has been rather than DePaul stepping up.

[Herman Cain]

The BE has benefited from Butler and Creighton defying the odds much longer than I expected. I do not have high hopes for them to continue at the level they have since new BE was formed. BE needs MU, SJU, GU and DePaul to step up their games. If not, BE will struggle moving forward. Honestly, it has held up much better than I expected.

Butler made it to the tournament last year and won a game. They have recruited some very solid players and are a prime destination for transfers of all types. They have a structure to their program that has been in place for many years regardless of coach .  I see nothing but a bright future for that program.

Creighton has consistently demonstrated that they can recruit at the Big East level. They also have a solid pipeline of recruits and are also a prime destination for transfers. They sell out 17,000 seats and have very deep financial sponsorship. They also have a bright future.

Yes I agree that MU , the Johnnies and Georgetown need to step it up. Ewing appears to be a very promising coach and is showing he can recruit.  His team is a lot of fun to watch this year and that counts for something. Mullin has put together an interesting team this year as well  and I think they can make a few headlines along the way.  If both these guys have a solid year at the same time they will get a lot of headlines in the tabloid papers in NY which is very good for the conference.

All DePaul has to do is move from awful to mediocre and that helps every one else in the conference. It looks like they have a good chance at making that leap. Just signed a very promising recruiting class and this years team has a chance to win 9 games in non conference and possibly up to 6 in conference.

Big East is a league driven by strong upperclassmen.  A good  number of players have departed however, the depth of the talent in the league is such that by end of season we will likely see quite a few teams hitting their stride as has been the case in years past.

[Goose]

Herman
I always laugh when people say that Butler has a program in place, regardless of coach, to continue at high level. If that is the case, how frickin stupid are the BOT, AD and others at MU? Butler has system in place that can withstand numerous coaching changes and MU falls off the planet for five years. I think you are kidding yourself that programs can withstand numerous coaching changes and maintain at high level.

[GGGG]

Herman
I always laugh when people say that Butler has a program in place, regardless of coach, to continue at high level. If that is the case, how frickin stupid are the BOT, AD and others at MU? Butler has system in place that can withstand numerous coaching changes and MU falls off the planet for five years. I think you are kidding yourself that programs can withstand numerous coaching changes and maintain at high level.

I'm not sure why you are laughing.  Butler and Xavier have been great at building a program, and promoting from within and/or hiring people back who have been part of that program.  It's exactly what Marquette should be doing.

[Goose]

Sultan

IMO, there has been some luck involved with both Butler and X. I simply do not believe that those two programs have outsmarted a slew of programs that have also seen coaching changes. Again, I believe the luck turns sooner or later.

All that said, if they do have the formula to withstand coaching changes, MU should have hired away the brass the put their formula together. It would have been well spent money.

[GGGG]

IMO, there has been some luck involved with both Butler and X. I simply do not believe that those two programs have outsmarted a slew of programs that have also seen coaching changes. Again, I believe the luck turns sooner or later.

When you see two programs, who have both sustained 20+ years of winning basketball, through multiple coaches, while largely using the same formula, it can in no way be attributed to luck. 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I am of the opinion that a school being willing to commit the resources to a basketball program is the biggest indicator of future success. Creighton and X have made that investment. I'm not sure that Butler has. I do trust Butler a lot more than DePaul and Seton Hall.

[Goose]

Sultan

Then MU has failed big time. If those two donkey's can do it, MU should have figured out that formula first. Ton of money wasted at MU to have Butler and X outsmart them

[GGGG]

Sultan

Then MU has failed big time. If those two donkey's can do it, MU should have figured out that formula first. Ton of money wasted at MU to have Butler and X outsmart them

Yeah I have made the case before that Marquette had jumped horses midstream on too many occasions.  I want Marquette to build a self-sustaining program from within.

[Goose]

Sultan
No offense, that is only part of the formula.

[GGGG]

Sultan
No offense, that is only part of the formula.

I never said it was the entire formula.

[Herman Cain]

Herman
I always laugh when people say that Butler has a program in place, regardless of coach, to continue at high level. If that is the case, how frickin stupid are the BOT, AD and others at MU? Butler has system in place that can withstand numerous coaching changes and MU falls off the planet for five years. I think you are kidding yourself that programs can withstand numerous coaching changes and maintain at high level.

Butler has. Their AD has a very good focus. They hire guys who are part of their history and culture . Xavier has done the same thing. If executed properly this approach will work as evidenced by both of those programs.