MU recruiting gone stale?

[Blackhat]

I thought Buzz would be able to get a commit from that truly elite recruit every couple years or at least maintain us with some elite southern talent but it seems we aren't getting as much play.   This last spot for '10 is crucial and we need a stud big in the worst way.   While Syracuse,etc. stock up on great bigs Buzz needs to keep pace if we are going to take the next step. 

[GOMU1104]

Relax, Buzz is in on some good players. Just let things play out.

I think the 3rd scholarship needs to go to someone with guard skills, a combo guard.

[bma725]

I thought Buzz would be able to get a commit from that truly elite recruit every couple years or at least maintain us with some elite southern talent but it seems we aren't getting as much play.   This last spot for '10 is crucial and we need a stud big in the worst way.   While Syracuse,etc. stock up on great bigs Buzz needs to keep pace if we are going to take the next step. 

Syracuse is stocking up on bigs while not having a single PG on the roster this year or one committed for next year, and I believe they are out of scholarships for 2010.  They've got their own problems.

We're still in play and getting mentioned for official visits with guys like Jelan Kendrick, James Johnson, Carson Derosiers and a lot of other top talent.  With the second elite camp coming, it wouldn't be a shock to see a commitment soon.

[bilsu]

A lot of recruits are just starting their official visits.

[TJ]

I thought Buzz would be able to get a commit from that truly elite recruit every couple years or at least maintain us with some elite southern talent

How did you get that impression?  He hasn't done it yet, so what makes you think he will be able to do it every couple years?  That's no knock on him - he's done a great job recruiting so far in his year and a half on the job.  In fact, when was the last time anyone at Marquette brought in a truly elite recruit every couple years?  You're expecting something that hasn't happened in a very long time to all of a sudden start happening regularly in Buzz's second year on the job.

[Blackhat]

I thought he'd be in on a lot of the top 10 Texas talent/big boys and the whole reason to hire Buzz was an expectation that he was an elite recruiter.


Going into the future with Mbao and Otule at C just seems like a lot of the status quo imo.   

[MUUWUWM]

Typical delusional thinking from some.

MU isn't a destination...come from TX to WI is not what alot of kids think. Takes some time.

[bma725]

I thought he'd be in on a lot of the top 10 Texas talent/big boys and the whole reason to hire Buzz was an expectation that he was an elite recruiter.


Going into the future with Mbao and Otule at C just seems like a lot of the status quo imo.   

You may not have noticed, but 2010 isn't exactly a great year for Texas recruiting especially when you look at what is available and what MU needs.

The top guy, Perry Jones committed to Baylor back in 2007.  We went after Daniel Alexander but he didn't want to leave the state despite some of those around him trying to push him to MU.  Cameron Clark and Julian Washburn are 6'6 small forwards that can't play the 4 and can't play the 2.  MU already has 5 guys that overlap that position for at least a portion of a 2010 kids career.  Phil Pressey eliminated MU awhile ago because he doesn't want to go to a school where he can't start right away.

That leaves only Rickey Scott and Michael Cobbins, and MU is heavily involved with both of them.

[MR.HAYWARD]

let's also not forget the recruiting landscape has changed...the early contact period has been eliminated...getting verbals from kids in June or July has got to go down going forward as most coaches simply have not seen the kids until july.  We have two commits already which is more than probably 90% of our compeitors.  Addtioanlly two top 100 kids just this week said they were visiting MU and were havily considering MU in Pinkston and Golden.

[mviale]

I feel like out program is falling apart.

[NCMUFan]

Everyone here is a great MU fan.  One just raised a question.

[thatman32]

I feel like out program is falling apart.

I guess we can always try to find the next Karon Bradley or Kevin Mendard will that make you feel better? 

[Blackhat]

Thanks for the info BMA.  Admittedly my expectations for Buzz's recruiting are pretty high, for all 5 positions. 

[77ncaachamps]

I guess we can always try to find the next Karon Bradley or Kevin Mendard will that make you feel better? 

I dunno if you know that teal = sarcasm

[Ellenson Guerrero]

I thought Buzz would be able to get a commit from that truly elite recruit every couple years or at least maintain us with some elite southern talent but it seems we aren't getting as much play.   This last spot for '10 is crucial and we need a stud big in the worst way.   While Syracuse,etc. stock up on great bigs Buzz needs to keep pace if we are going to take the next step. 

If thats what you are expecting shouldn't you at least give Buzz a "couple of years" before you declare our recruiting has gone stale? I've been impressed with what Buzz (a guy with no real coaching prestige) has been able to bring in so far. With a short time frame to work with he put together a well respected class. I would give him at least until Madness until you start judging his work on 2010-11.

[pillardean]

I dunno if you know that teal = sarcasm

I think he was playing off the teal.

[Murffieus]

Buzz brought in what he hopes is an anchor class this year. The problem with that is that it scares off new recruits who are looking for immediate PT. They don't see that with the shelves fully stocked.

The problem with recruiting quality bigs is that we haven't incorporated bigs into the offense for years. We've been for the most part a perimeter orientated team-----meanwhile recruits see that and go where they do get a lot of touches. At some point it behooves Buzz to bite the bullet on this and allow the #5 to be an integral part of the offense. This is the perfect year for that as expectations are relatively low.

[ecompt]

If he centers his offense around Chris Otule, it's going to be a long season.

[Murffieus]

well reports are that otule has improved----we'll see, but as i say generally expectations are low anyways, although I don't see any reason why we can't go 9-9 in the BE-----so this year would be a very good time to bite the bullet. Best way to develop is by doing.

[Golden Avalanche]

IMO, the recruiting aspect of the MU program has been very quiet this summer except for the minor flirtation (mostly by fans) with Vander Blue. Other then that, crickets.

Though I do see that two of our former targets in Tobias Harris and Kyrie Irving seem to be in the headlines coming out of most every summer tournament.

[GOMU1104]

IMO, the recruiting aspect of the MU program has been very quiet this summer except for the minor flirtation (mostly by fans) with Vander Blue. Other then that, crickets.

Though I do see that two of our former targets in Tobias Harris and Kyrie Irving seem to be in the headlines coming out of most every summer tournament.

Marquette has been mentioned with ALOT of players throughout the summer. We will have a better idea where we stand, when we see who comes in for the Elite Camp, and then who has MU on their list of official visits.

[Murffieus]

The best recruiting method is the one that Al McGuire used------bring in two blues a year to continually fill an 8 man rotation------in addition bring in a development guy or two each year for the practice squad. That way the blues see PT visibility. The anchor class concept is feast or famine, as blues unless part of the anchor class will generally shun the interim recruiting classes because of limited immediate PT visibility.

e.g recruiting after the 2005-06 class for 3 years was sub par------this incoming class saw immediate PT and became part of the new anchor class.

[GOMU1104]

Murf, I completly agree with you, in regards to the "anchor class."  The 2005 class made it tough to continue to sign top flight guards.  However, I think the way Buzz has built the roster, they are protected against that.

SR
Hayward - F
Cubillian - SG

JR
Fulce - F
Butler - G/F
Buycks - G

SO
DJO - SG
O'Tule - C
(Clark) - F

FR
Cadougan - PG
Williams - G/F
Maymon - F
Roseboro - F
Mbao - C

2010 Class
Bowen - G
OPEN

I wouldn't consider the 2009 Class an "anchor class," as the only guaranteed starters in that class are Cadougan and Maymon. Williams/Roseboro/Mbao all have some developing to do before they are significant contributers. With the 2005 class (DJ, JM, WM)...it was a given that those 3 were going to be the starters for all 4 years...which made it difficult for TC to bring in Blue Chips behind them. 

[NCMUFan]

oops, nevermind

[muarmy81]

IMO, the recruiting aspect of the MU program has been very quiet this summer except for the minor flirtation (mostly by fans) with Vander Blue. Other then that, crickets.

Which is exactly how Buzz likes it...most of Buzz's recent targets have been guys that few knew we were in on so i'm sure he's working the trail.

[Golden Avalanche]

Marquette has been mentioned with ALOT of players throughout the summer. We will have a better idea where we stand, when we see who comes in for the Elite Camp, and then who has MU on their list of official visits.

That's why I write its quiet. I'm beyond the point of caring when we are mentioned with a recruit. Call it "list-fatigue". After some time, you realize that just being on the list is no news at all.

Hell, at one point we were firmly on the lists of both Tobias Harris and Kyrie Irving. Most often, being mentioned is simply a tease for the fan.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

If thats what you are expecting shouldn't you at least give Buzz a "couple of years" before you declare our recruiting has gone stale? I've been impressed with what Buzz (a guy with no real coaching prestige) has been able to bring in so far. With a short time frame to work with he put together a well respected class. I would give him at least until Madness until you start judging his work on 2010-11.

+1.

I'm not sure you can proclaim him a recruiting dynamo, or a failure at this point.

He's looking really good in some areas (and carries a good rep), but the proof will obviously be on the court in the next couple of seasons.

[Skatastrophy]

I wouldn't consider the 2009 Class an "anchor class," as the only guaranteed starters in that class are Cadougan and Maymon.

Do you really thing that Cadougan will be starting, even though he's caught up in the clearinghouse without a day of practice yet?

I wouldn't be surprised if it took him a couple months to catch up to where the other guys are.

[GOMU1104]

Do you really thing that Cadougan will be starting, even though he's caught up in the clearinghouse without a day of practice yet?

I wouldn't be surprised if it took him a couple months to catch up to where the other guys are.

He may take some time this year to get into the flow, and catch up, but that shouldnt take too long. 

He will be the starting PG all 4 years.

[bma725]

He may take some time this year to get into the flow, and catch up, but that shouldnt take too long. 

He will be the starting PG all 4 years.

Shouldn't take too long?  Do you not recall how long it took Lazar to get acclimated to the game and the team, and he wasn't playing a position as important as PG. 

Unless Junior gets cleared very soon, expecting him to start this year is a bit much.

[GOMU1104]

Shouldn't take too long?  Do you not recall how long it took Lazar to get acclimated to the game and the team, and he wasn't playing a position as important as PG. 

Unless Junior gets cleared very soon, expecting him to start this year is a bit much.

Assuming he gets cleared, he will be the starter (or recieve starter minutes) if only because there aren't any other options. JC is the only true PG on the roster.  Buycks can play the PG, but what about after that?

[Skatastrophy]

Assuming he gets cleared, he will be the starter (or recieve starter minutes) if only because there aren't any other options. JC is the only true PG on the roster.  Buycks can play the PG, but what about after that?

Buycks is supposedly doing well thus far.  Cubillan can spell the PG from time to time.  DJO is also a combo-guard.

We may not have a true PG, but we have a couple guys that can get the ball up the floor so we can run our offense before Cadougan loses some weight and gets his head around our offense.

[tower912]

Of all of the recruits that Buzz has landed since he arrived at MU, how many had early indications they were coming to MU?    Who, if anybody, had the message boards babbling prior to his declaration?    I can't remember one.    Suddenly, seemingly out of nowhere, there was an announcement.    And everybody went, "huh?", "who?", "whoa", "wow", "how did Buzz manage that?"   
       So my answer to the original question is no.   Buzz is out there working and I predict there are still two relatively highly ranked recruits to be named for the '10' class.

[VegasWarrior77]

Don't we only have one schollie left for 2010?

[Skatastrophy]

Don't we only have one schollie left for 2010?

One left for this year and one left for next year.  Remember that Acker "decided not to return."

[bma725]

One left for this year and one left for next year.  Remember that Acker "decided not to return."

It's really the same scholarship though.  There were originally three available in 2010, one of them just became available earlier than normal.  The only way to use it on multiple players would be getting a one and done guy for this year.

[tower912]

O-V-E-R-S-I-G-N-I-N-G

[pbiflyer]

You may not have noticed, but 2010 isn't exactly a great year for Texas recruiting especially when you look at what is available and what MU needs.

The top guy, Perry Jones committed to Baylor back in 2007.  We went after Daniel Alexander but he didn't want to leave the state despite some of those around him trying to push him to MU.  Cameron Clark and Julian Washburn are 6'6 small forwards that can't play the 4 and can't play the 2.  MU already has 5 guys that overlap that position for at least a portion of a 2010 kids career.  Phil Pressey eliminated MU awhile ago because he doesn't want to go to a school where he can't start right away.

That leaves only Rickey Scott and Michael Cobbins, and MU is heavily involved with both of them.

What gives you the right to come to a bulletin board and have the audacity to spew FACTS??????? 

[radome]

I'm not sure that Adams would've helped us but something like this might have been a nice fix without costing us in the future.

Centenary's Adams transferring to Pitt, eligible immediately
Aug. 10, 2009
CBSSports.com wire reports 

PITTSBURGH -- Chase Adams, a point guard at Centenary who was the defensive player of the year last season in the Summit League, is transferring to Pittsburgh for his senior season and will be eligible immediately.

Adams doesn't have to sit out a season because Centenary is dropping from NCAA Division I to Division III.

The 5-foot-10 Adams averaged 14 points and shot 39 percent from 3-point range last season. He supplies depth at a position where the Panthers must replace Levance Fields, a three-year starter who helped lead the Panthers to an NCAA regional final last season.

Ashton Gibbs, a shooting guard, is expected to move to point guard. The only other Pitt player at the position is redshirt freshman Travon Woodall.

 

[VegasWarrior77]

Wouldn't Adams be comparable to Acker?

[radome]

Wouldn't Adams be comparable to Acker?

I think so.  I am more interested in the concept than the player.  Hopefully, Buzz, et al. are all over looking for a fill.  I think that we would be looking for a practice player or walk on so that the future begins to develop.

Interesting USA Today article (in the recent news section).  Very critical of Buzz for *not* developing other players around the starting five + Butler.  Not sure what to think of it.  We didn't have depth to use last year but I can understand why Buzz would be reluctant to pull a "Adams" and take PT away from the new guys.

[lurch91]

Which is exactly how Buzz likes it...most of Buzz's recent targets have been guys that few knew we were in on so i'm sure he's working the trail.

I think it's been said before, that Buzz plays his hand close to the vest, while the former coach would intentional seed rumors it seems.

[wyoMUfan]

I would ignore the USA today post. its obviously yesterdays news.
acker isn't playing anymore duh.

[GGGG]

I think so.  I am more interested in the concept than the player.  Hopefully, Buzz, et al. are all over looking for a fill.  I think that we would be looking for a practice player or walk on so that the future begins to develop.

Interesting USA Today article (in the recent news section).  Very critical of Buzz for *not* developing other players around the starting five + Butler.  Not sure what to think of it.  We didn't have depth to use last year but I can understand why Buzz would be reluctant to pull a "Adams" and take PT away from the new guys.

What other players should have been developed?  Fulce?  Hurt.  Otule?  Well...OK I think Buzz was actually headed down that path until it was shown that he was completely in over his head.  Hazel?  See Otule.  Cubillan or Acker?  Known commodities. 

You don't develop players during a season where you are senior dominated and expected to excel.  If DJ doesn't get hurt, they are for sure in the Sweet 16 and have a legit shot at the Final Four.  You don't sacrifice that to develop players that hurt you significantly when they are on the floor.

[thanooj]

Marquette has been mentioned with ALOT of players throughout the summer. We will have a better idea where we stand, when we see who comes in for the Elite Camp, and then who has MU on their list of official visits.

So in another thread a local recruit being pursued by many schools including UNC said he will be playing at our elite camp.  What do you all make of that?  Is it a good thing?  Or is it a non - factor in recruiting.