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« Last post by MUBurrow on Today at 10:46:50 AM »
Just wanna voice appreciation for a really good conversation here with lots of thoughtful posts.
My take on the celibacy issue is that it is not a direct link to pedophilia, but it creates a self-selection problem in the priesthood. The vow of celibacy creates, from day one, a preoccupation with and unrealistic expectation of spurning one's sexual predilictions. That makes it a potential solution for all kinds of men who are otherwise sexually isolated, confused, and/or ashamed. The priesthood throws all of those men together in a culture of secrecy and shame without any psychiatric or practical support and then inserts them into positions of absolute trust in schools and communities. If I were TRYING to create an environment of sexual abuse and betrayal of trust, I don't know if I could design it better.
Removing the vow of celibacy is a step toward creating a more healthy conversation around sexuality in the clergy. IMHO it would also help lead to women in higher positions of church authority, which is also a must to help solve this problem.
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« Last post by Pakuni on Today at 10:43:04 AM »
Good point. I think the bigger issue with the celibacy rule is recruitment of priests. The pool of candidates would increase substantially, I would think. And the Church could be flexible: right now diocesan priests do not take a vow of poverty. Order priests do (Franciscans, for example)(the jury is still out on Jesuits). Offer non celibacy as an option. Keep it if that’s your particular culture given the order.
The downside of allowing priests to marry/have families is how do you support them. The Catholic Church itself is extraordinarily wealthy because of what it owns, but parishes by and large are not. Now you're asking congregations not only to support a couple of single male priests living together, but families in individual homes. That's going to be a pretty substantial financial burden that doesn't exist today.
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« Last post by Goose on Today at 10:33:38 AM »
Over the past several years I have become more involved with my Catholic faith than any time in my lifetime. Born and raised Catholic and attended Catholic schools from K-5 until my last day MU, but never was overly active in my faith. A ton of reasons caused me not to be active and most were good excuses in my mind for not being active. I have few regrets on why I was not involved and chalked up to not being ready to fully commit.
That said, I have worked extremely hard to separate my feelings of the leadership and my belief in God. To be honest, virtually every aspect of the leadership makes me sick and sad. I struggle to understand their behavior and the handling of the mess they have made. Furthermore, I cannot find myself praying for them and supporting them financially. I can live to be 100 years old and will never understand the mess they made and how it happened.
Sadly, while I understand my belief is a personal relationship I have with God, I do struggle not feeling part of an overall community. I go pray everyday, try and go to Mass every week, but feel like it just God and me. I am very happy that I have truly have God in my life, I feel like a bigger part is missing in my life.
I guess to sum it up, I am beyond disgusted with what has happened with the leadership and the lives that been ruined. I cannot understand how someone in a trusted position can be so evil, especially representing God's word. I am proud on my faith and will continue to try and build on it, but the leadership will never be trusted again by me.
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« Last post by MU82 on Today at 10:28:52 AM »
I talked to Mom Hauser after the WIAA basketball this year. She could not have been nicer and raved about their time at
MU. I tossed out a line and she refused to take the bait. Complete high road.
Also, she said it kills her to have Sam on the C’s vs. the Bucks “I’ve been a Bucks fan since I was this big”.
Thanks for the insight, T.L. All that is good to hear. Time often heals old wounds.
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I was unaware there's a link between celibacy and pedophilia
Good point. I think the bigger issue with the celibacy rule is recruitment of priests. The pool of candidates would increase substantially, I would think. And the Church could be flexible: right now diocesan priests do not take a vow of poverty. Order priests do (Franciscans, for example)(the jury is still out on Jesuits). Offer non celibacy as an option. Keep it if that’s your particular culture given the order.
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« Last post by MU82 on Today at 10:22:08 AM »
Remember when America's largest state (by far) - a state with a GDP larger than all but 4 countries - was doomed because people were moving out "in droves"? California’s population grew in 2023, halting 3 years of decline, state estimateshttps://apnews.com/article/california-population-growth-pandemic-decline-0d2bfc2c0a4ced0c3c2ad934207818bc?Of course, one really needed a generous definition of "droves" to justify the doom talk ... and California's population today is larger than it was just a few years ago. And thank goodness! The taxes paid for and income generated by California corporations and residents helps carry money-sucking states like Mississippi, Arkansas, Alabama, West Virginia, etc.
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« Last post by jesmu84 on Today at 10:02:33 AM »
I was unaware there's a link between celibacy and pedophilia
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Hoping some Scoopers with a Retail/Merchandising background can answer the following:
Why have apparel options at Marshalls and TJ Maxx stores been so threadbare the last couple of years? They don't get anywhere near the same selection of brands that they used to and the quality of what they do get has declined precipitously over the last couple of years. I get that neither has ever been anything close to even mid-range, let alone upscale but you used to at least occasionally be able to score halfway decent stuff like Brooks Bros and legit Ralph Lauren Polo Shirts (not their lower end "LAUREN" line) and the like for a reasonable price. It was always hit or miss (mostly miss 75% of the time) BUT you could still find something decent once in while. No longer. Although I rarely bought clothing anyone can see at either of those places, they were great for basics like underwear and T-Shirts. They don't even get the decent brands for those anymore so it's frustrating. On the slightly higher end, the quality of merch at Saks Off 5th and Nordstrom Rack has also declined considerably. I was always aware that even back in the day, those places hardly sold anything that was ever actually on offer at a full service Saks or Nordstrom, but that was ok because you could still get decent stuff. Largely untrue today. If you take an average pair of jeans and look under the hood the quality of the rivets and zippers is garbage now as is the quality of the fabric used to make the pockets. It's very thin and not the heavy canvas they used to be routinely be made of. To get that quality today you have to go to a high end specialty brand like Tellason, APC or Japanese brands and pay well over $200.
I haven't bought any clothes in a department store in a decade and I'm in my 40s. When I look at what I buy I first choose style and fit. Then materials. A lot of the stuff at department stores and the places you mention have name brands, but that's what you're paying for. The popular brands figured this out well over twenty years ago. Quality garments can be found online easily, and then you can either find a local store... assuming you're in a big city.... or you can measure yourself and have the item delivered. I typically don't buy from anywhere that doesn't include free shipping and free returns. I recently bought a pair of Naked and Famous jeans, and I love them. I understand your frustration as a discerning clothes buyer and can relate, but we would very much be in the minority in the entire US population. Most people buy either whatever is cheapest, or they buy something with a label on it with similar quality but a higher price and assume it is better.
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I wouldn't exactly call Batemon "chiseled." He's a bit thin and needs time in the weight room.
The rest of Finkelstein's scouting report I agree with. The one thing he doesn't mention is ball handling, where I think Batemon needs a lot of work.
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I suspect historically, Catholic men with these inclinations have gone into the priesthood mistakenly believing it would cure, or at least control, these urges. And the Catholic church has done a woeful job of screening these people out before they take their vows and exposing/removing them after.
This was my godfather. Catholic priest, gay, deeply conflicted with his call to the priesthood and his homosexuality. He had a relationship with a man (I have been told his partner was of age, but in my heart, I am not certain). Like most people from my dad’s generation (who has a gay sister) it is rarely discussed and even more rarely honestly. I think abolishing celibacy is necessary, but I am a confirmed Catholic who is decidedly no longer one and didn’t raise my kids in any religion. While it may not rid the organization of pedophilia, I do think accepting sex between consenting priests/adults/partners gay or straight will relieve some of the conflict which could lead to less abuse. Remove the secrecy and the unnecessary restriction. The Catholic church must do something, not for its survival which I am not sure is a benefit, but because abuse of and rape of children is illegal, disgusting, and in their own religion’s words, evil.
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