Outcoached

[raul]

I like Buzz but I think he was outcoached tonight. The players were outhustled as well. About as bad a beatdown as the OSU game.

[BenCat12]

I think what is so frustrating is I don't feel it is an X's and O's problem as much as a stubbornness on personnel.  It just looks so easy for teams to defend us with any combination of Derrick, Jake, Juan or Todd in the game.  I wouldn't mind Derrick being the point with JaJuan, Deonte and Jamil because those three can create their own shot.  However most of the minutes go to guys who can't create for themselves or others......frustrating. 

[willie warrior]

I think what is so frustrating is I don't feel it is an X's and O's problem as much as a stubbornness on personnel.  It just looks so easy for teams to defend us with any combination of Derrick, Jake, Juan or Todd in the game.  I wouldn't mind Derrick being the point with JaJuan, Deonte and Jamil because those three can create their own shot.  However most of the minutes go to guys who can't create for themselves or others......frustrating. 

In Buzz we trust.

[GGGG]

I think what is so frustrating is I don't feel it is an X's and O's problem as much as a stubbornness on personnel.  It just looks so easy for teams to defend us with any combination of Derrick, Jake, Juan or Todd in the game.  I wouldn't mind Derrick being the point with JaJuan, Deonte and Jamil because those three can create their own shot.  However most of the minutes go to guys who can't create for themselves or others......frustrating. 

There is talent without experience...and experience that isn't really all that talented.  JJJ and Burton are going to be fine, but they need time.  Our three most experienced back court players simply aren't all that good.  Buzz has limited options IMO.

[madtownwarrior]

You mean starting a non-productive starting 5 and then playing a zillion different combinations the rest of the game is not a good strategy?

[Goose]

Have said it before but I believe it comes down to Buzz being stubborn. Playing guys with limited skills will not get it done. Buzz is a different type of guy and you have to accept both the good and bad side of his style. My only concern is a repeat of our post FF season with TC. Reaching the E8 last year reset the bar of expectations and if we fall too far this season it makes it tougher in the future.

[Tugg Speedman]

Have said it before but I believe it comes down to Buzz being stubborn. Playing guys with limited skills will not get it done. Buzz is a different type of guy and you have to accept both the good and bad side of his style. My only concern is a repeat of our post FF season with TC. Reaching the E8 last year reset the bar of expectations and if we fall too far this season it makes it tougher in the future.

So you think this year's problem is who starts?

[Goose]

I could care less if Buzz started Flood. It comes down to playing the guys with best chance to compete and playing them in right combinations.

[Ellenson Guerrero]

So you think this year's problem is who starts?

The starting line-up is symbolic of Buzz's dogmatic approach to giving minutes to the "hardest workers" and not necessarily the players who give us the best chance to win.

[GGGG]

I have come to the conclusion that we simply don't have the combination of experience and talent in the backcourt to win consistently this year.  It really doesn't matter who starts...that isn't going to change.

[GGGG]

The starting line-up is symbolic of Buzz's dogmatic approach to giving minutes to the "hardest workers" and not necessarily the players who give us the best chance to win.

Mayo and JJJ were pretty much just as poor as the starters last night.

[We R Final Four]

I could care less if Buzz started Flood.

I believe we are 5-0 when Flood plays.  Imagine if he started.....hello Final Four!

[wildbillsb]

I believe we are 5-0 when Flood plays.  Imagine if he started.....hello Final Four!

Excellente, Senor!  +10!

[GooooMarquette]

You mean starting a non-productive starting 5 and then playing a zillion different combinations the rest of the game is not a good strategy?

Our non-productive 5 had 10 points and 5 boards in 21 minutes last night.

If the rest of the team was that non-productive, it would have been a close game.

Overall this season, CO is fourth in the team in minutes played...and fourth in scoring, second in rebounding.  Chris is FAR from the problem.

[tower912]

I thought the defensive scheme Buzz ran was very effective.   Creighton just made MU pay every time a rotation was less than perfect.   Held a high scoring team to 67.    There aren't miracles sitting on the bench.  He is getting more minutes for Deonte and JJJ.   Dawson isn't ready.    Creighton hit 3's.   MU didn't.   Ballgame. 

[4everwarriors]

Simply put, ya need some cats who can score the basketball. Don't care what their positions are, but right now, there just aren't any scorers on this team with whom you can win in conference.

[Stretchdeltsig]

We play hard, but, if we can't make free throws and we can't make threes and we can't make short shots and we have no fast break, it will be hard to win games period.  It's hard to understand that we are such an awful shooting team.  Does Buzz make the team practice defense with no emphasis on shooting?

[jsglow]

I have come to the conclusion that we simply don't have the combination of experience and talent in the backcourt to win consistently this year.  It really doesn't matter who starts...that isn't going to change.

Yep.  Unfortunately we're forced to play with at least two young men who are more Horizon League ready than BEast ready.  We'll have to live with that.

The unfortunate thing for me is that because of Duane's injury we might not be able to see next year's backcourt develop over the course of this year.  I can enjoy watching the progress of young guys through the course of a season.  Frankly, I'm now far more interested in watching JJ and Deonte than determining if Davante can finish strong.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

Teams just pack in the paint to deny us our "paint touches" and dare us to shoot . If we can't or won't we are destined for big  deficits at the beginning of games. Seems just too easy for defenses to keep us out of our offense

[Nevada233]

Excellente, Senor!  +10!

Id throw Dawson out there also for a couple min a game. No need to burn up a scholarship year riding the bench he might as get some kind of experience be that good or bad. I mean we dont have a world beater back court anyway and off the bench Todd Mayo passes like Eli Manning.

[GGGG]

Id throw Dawson out there also for a couple min a game. No need to burn up a scholarship year riding the bench he might as well red shirt. I mean we dont have a world beater back court anyway.

Seriously are you related to John Dawson?  Because you keep hyping him, and I have seen nothing whatsoever that indicates that he can play at this level at this time.

[Nevada233]

Seriously are you related to John Dawson?  Because you keep hyping him, and I have seen nothing whatsoever that indicates that he can play at this level at this time.

No... Just would like to see the team win. Play flood then. There 5-0 with him. Correct!

[Nevada233]

Seriously are you related to John Dawson?  Because you keep hyping him, and I have seen nothing whatsoever that indicates that he can play at this level at this time.

But they sky isnt falling and its a long season. No need to overreact by anyone. Im sure itll get better!

[tower912]

Dawson isn't ready for significant minutes against good teams.  Jamil is looking better and better at the point.  Neither Todd nor JJJ showed enough last night to warrant starting over Jake.  

[GooooMarquette]

Seriously are you related to John Dawson?  Because you keep hyping him, and I have seen nothing whatsoever that indicates that he can play at this level at this time.

I agree with you on Dawson not being ready to play much...but don't see what harm he could have done in the last five minutes last night.  Maybe a 20 or 22 point loss instead of 18?

[willie warrior]

I thought the defensive scheme Buzz ran was very effective.   Creighton just made MU pay every time a rotation was less than perfect.   Held a high scoring team to 67.    There aren't miracles sitting on the bench.  He is getting more minutes for Deonte and JJJ.   Dawson isn't ready.    Creighton hit 3's.   MU didn't.   Ballgame. 

No--MU didn't defend the 3--Ballgame.

[79Warrior]

I have come to the conclusion that we simply don't have the combination of experience and talent in the backcourt to win consistently this year.  It really doesn't matter who starts...that isn't going to change.

+1. Absolutely correct. I think we are going to struggle to win 10 games in conference.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

My question about last night is why was Jamil running the point with Derrick on the floor? If Derrick isn't going to bring the ball up, why is he on the court?

[forgetful]

My question about last night is why was Jamil running the point with Derrick on the floor? If Derrick isn't going to bring the ball up, why is he on the court?

I noticed that too and wondered the same.

[chapman]

My question about last night is why was Jamil running the point with Derrick on the floor? If Derrick isn't going to bring the ball up, why is he on the court?

Definitely confused by it.  Only thing he does well is rebound...but that wasn't high on our list of needs at the time and you have Juan for that.

[willie warrior]

Definitely confused by it.  Only thing he does well is rebound...but that wasn't high on our list of needs at the time and you have Juan for that.

Better yet, why was Derrick playing on the block when Jamil was running the point? In Buzz we trust.

[WarriorFan]

I think Buzz lost track of who was on the court for a few minutes... Only explanation.

[keefe]

Better yet, why was Derrick playing on the block when Jamil was running the point? In Buzz we trust.

Well, he led the team in rebounds the previous game

[MU82]

Have said it before but I believe it comes down to Buzz being stubborn. Playing guys with limited skills will not get it done. Buzz is a different type of guy and you have to accept both the good and bad side of his style. My only concern is a repeat of our post FF season with TC. Reaching the E8 last year reset the bar of expectations and if we fall too far this season it makes it tougher in the future.

I'm not saying Buzz isn't stubborn, because I don't know if he is or isn't.

But I do know the mentality of coaches, who live and die to win basketball games (or football games or whatever the sport is), so I'm trying to figure out what Buzz's motivation would be to cost his team victories simply because he chooses to be stubborn.

"Oh yeah, I'll show you! We'll play so-and-so and lose, that's what we'll do! Take that!"

That's why the whole we-suck-because-Buzz-is-stubborn argument doesn't make much sense to me.

[Gato78]

He explained this in the post game. If Derrick is up top, they sag off him. If he goes inside, the defense has to cover him and it opens things up for the other four. Makes sense to me. Also says that Buzz is dealing with what we all see--not oblivious like some of the critics.

Better yet, why was Derrick playing on the block when Jamil was running the point? In Buzz we trust.

[keefe]

I have seen nothing whatsoever that indicates that he can play at this level at this time.

Unlike the other guys?

[Nevada233]

Unlike the other guys?

+1

[raul]

MU has better talent than Creighton but it looked like we are not in their league. I cant blame any player  so I blame the coach. Its his job to put out a good team with chemistry. But it seems like the players are playing together for the first time.

[79Warrior]

MU has better talent than Creighton but it looked like we are not in their league. I cant blame any player  so I blame the coach. Its his job to put out a good team with chemistry. But it seems like the players are playing together for the first time.

What do you base the talent statement on? Just curious because Creighton looked pretty decent to me. Always amazes with folks who put down the team that just pasted us.

[tower912]

Creighton had almost everybody back from a very good team.   MU is replacing its starting backcourt and 90 mpg overall.   

[MU82]

MU has better talent than Creighton but it looked like we are not in their league. I cant blame any player  so I blame the coach. Its his job to put out a good team with chemistry. But it seems like the players are playing together for the first time.

This makes Creighton the fifth team we lost to that we supposedly are "better than," following Arizona State, San Diego State, New Mexico and Bucky. (I don't remember anybody claiming we were better than Ohio State, but somebody probably did.)

I call this Patrick Ewing Syndrome, named after the guy who kept claiming his Knicks were better than the Bulls team that beat them time after time.

We are Marquette fans, therefore we our team is better than everybody else.

Because it hurts too much to say we aren't better than Creighton et al.

[We R Final Four]

Creighton has a POY candidate and a 3-point shooting team for the ages. 
We are not a good team.
I for one did not think that we were better than Creighton(-9 easy cover)--but I get your point.

[bilsu]

I thought the defensive scheme Buzz ran was very effective.   Creighton just made MU pay every time a rotation was less than perfect.   Held a high scoring team to 67.    There aren't miracles sitting on the bench.  He is getting more minutes for Deonte and JJJ.   Dawson isn't ready.    Creighton hit 3's.   MU didn't.   Ballgame. 

I do not see defense as the problem, except for the fact that we no longer get points off of turnovers. I see the insistence on paint touches being part of the problem. We need to take good shots when the shots are available. It should not matter whether we have had a paint touch or not. The lastest insistence by Buzz for a paint touch is only going to hamper this team. Thomas and Anderson need to take the shot if they are open. When they are open under Buzz's direction they are looking to pass instead of shooting. Are Jake and Juan world class shooters? I would say no, but they are good enough that they should feel that they can take an open shot. Too many times a good shot has been passed up and we do not score anyways.

[Aughnanure]

I do not see defense as the problem, except for the fact that we no longer get points off of turnovers. I see the insistence on paint touches being part of the problem. We need to take good shots when the shots are available. It should not matter whether we have had a paint touch or not. The lastest insistence by Buzz for a paint touch is only going to hamper this team. Thomas and Anderson need to take the shot if they are open. When they are open under Buzz's direction they are looking to pass instead of shooting. Are Jake and Juan world class shooters? I would say no, but they are good enough that they should feel that they can take an open shot. Too many times a good shot has been passed up and we do not score anyways.

This (though I just have never liked Buzz's double the post strategy which always leaves an open shooter somewhere). We don't have great shooters, but we should have shooters who are good enough to make open jumpers.

But hey, rules like this worked for Hoosiers right?   

[WellsstreetWanderer]

We got pasted by a team whose shooters took open shots and sagged because we do not .
This red light, green light thing ain't working with this squad. Time to come up with something else because Chris and Devante can't perform double teamed all the time

[humanlung]

In my opinion, this team simply doesn't have the heart of recent MU teams.  It seems like there's a lack of hustle and tenacity and an over-abundance of "attitude" (and you can interpret that word in a number of ways with this group of players).

Perhaps if there were stronger Senior leadership this might not be the case but there isn't anyone on this team who can call out teammates for laziness or too much crying when things don't go well.  Can you see anyone standing up to Jae in the locker room after being called out?  Jimmy B?  Lazar?  Wes/Jerel?

We will be fine.  Next year.  As someone who went to MU for three years of Bob Dukiet, I can tell you that this year could be a hell of a lot worse.  Granted, it's not what we have come to expect under Buzz but, sometimes, crappy seasons happen.  This is one of them.     

[wyoMUfan]

I totally agree - my initial thoughts at the 1st TV timeout were "without a glue guy a-la DJO,Cadougan,Butler, Crowder, (even Vander)" we don't seem to respond well to gut check moments. Past Buzz teams have been good at responding to deficits, this team not so much.

I'd like to see Jamil fill this role, but I think you can't just inspire with words but action. Cadougan would always make that drive and crazy layup, or DJO would impose his will and stuff one. Jamil's 16 foot jumpers don't exactly rally the troops.

Don't get me started on the disappearing act Davante has decided to pull in recent games. He has the ability to be that war cry when we are down but just doesn't seem to be effective over the recent span.

In my opinion, this team simply doesn't have the heart of recent MU teams.  It seems like there's a lack of hustle and tenacity and an over-abundance of "attitude" (and you can interpret that word in a number of ways with this group of players).

Perhaps if there were stronger Senior leadership this might not be the case but there isn't anyone on this team who can call out teammates for laziness or too much crying when things don't go well.  Can you see anyone standing up to Jae in the locker room after being called out?  Jimmy B?  Lazar?  Wes/Jerel?

We will be fine.  Next year.  As someone who went to MU for three years of Bob Dukiet, I can tell you that this year could be a hell of a lot worse.  Granted, it's not what we have come to expect under Buzz but, sometimes, crappy seasons happen.  This is one of them.     

[4th and State]

I totally agree - my initial thoughts at the 1st TV timeout were "without a glue guy a-la DJO,Cadougan,Butler, Crowder, (even Vander)" we don't seem to respond well to gut check moments. Past Buzz teams have been good at responding to deficits, this team not so much.

I'd like to see Jamil fill this role, but I think you can't just inspire with words but action. Cadougan would always make that drive and crazy layup, or DJO would impose his will and stuff one. Jamil's 16 foot jumpers don't exactly rally the troops.

Don't get me started on the disappearing act Davante has decided to pull in recent games. He has the ability to be that war cry when we are down but just doesn't seem to be effective over the recent span.

Those guys you listed above were studs more than they were glue guys.  That's basically what this team is missing.  A guy when we need to get a basket we go to him.  Non-existent this year.

[Les Nessman]

For some reason, I see Deonte taking on a leadership role next season. Once he understands defensive positioning and is a little more mature, I think he will become even more confident and aggressive since he won't have to worry about whether he's gonna get burned on the defensive end right after he throws down on someone.

[CTWarrior]

He explained this in the post game. If Derrick is up top, they sag off him. If he goes inside, the defense has to cover him and it opens things up for the other four. Makes sense to me. Also says that Buzz is dealing with what we all see--not oblivious like some of the critics.

I figured that was why he put Derrick there when I watched the game.  But I must admit, it still doesn't make much sense.  Why have him in the game if that is what you are going to do with him?  Sure you have to guard him when he is under the basket.  But you'd have to guard anybody standing there and there are other guys on the team (basically everyone else except Thomas or maybe Dawson) who would be bigger threats to score from the low blocks.  The only explanation I can think of is that Buzz thinks so highly of his defense that he will live with punting one position on offense.

[MerrittsMustache]

I figured that was why he put Derrick there when I watched the game.  But I must admit, it still doesn't make much sense.  Why have him in the game if that is what you are going to do with him?  Sure you have to guard him when he is under the basket.  But you'd have to guard anybody standing there and there are other guys on the team (basically everyone else except Thomas or maybe Dawson) who would be bigger threats to score from the low blocks.  The only explanation I can think of is that Buzz thinks so highly of his defense that he will live with punting one position on offense.

That's got to be the case. Have you seen Burton and JJJ on D?