MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: TAMU, Knower of Ball on September 06, 2022, 04:41:58 PM
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Not sure what happened to the video conference but twitter broke the news:
https://twitter.com/TiptonEdits/status/1567266441946071042
Welcome Mr. Norman!
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Not sure what happened to the video conference but twitter broke the news:
https://twitter.com/TiptonEdits/status/1567266441946071042
Welcome Mr. Norman!
Thanks, Wizard Boy
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Welcome Tre! This is a fantastic get for Shaka and MU!
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https://twitter.com/MarquetteMBB/status/1567266602722156546
Another RGV video by #mubb
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Excellent!
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https://www.on3.com/news/marquette-shaka-smart-land-commitment-from-tre-norman/
Norman has a message for Marquette fans.
“Be ready for a culture change. We are going to be doing big things. It’s going to be a whole different vibe. It’s not going to be Milwaukee and the Bucks, it’s going to be Milwaukee and Marquette.”
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topper to an exciting class! Very well done, Shaka!
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Tremendous win for MU. Tre is going to be a top tier guard in the Big East. Excellent day for Shaka and the MU Community.
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Alright! Been a while since we had a Bay stater. Can’t remember who was the last one.
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Alright! Been a while since we had a Bay stater. Can’t remember who was the last one.
Probably Zack McCall?
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I love versatile, athletic guards with size.
Welcome to MU!
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K
A
B
O
O
M
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Let's go now!
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I love versatile, athletic guards with size.
Welcome to MU!
And sounds like he has that junkyard dog mentality in his own words. Love it.
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I guess we’re now The Harvard of the Midwest!
Another nice get for Shaka. Congrats!
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Great news! Sounds like Shaka and the ACs really built a great relationship with this fast riser.
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Thanks, Wizard Boy
I prefer the Wizard of West Town for his moniker
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Alright! Been a while since we had a Bay stater. Can’t remember who was the last one.
Probably Zack McCall?
MU Overload says that Norman is only the third player from MA that we have ever landed. The other two are Zack McCall and Vic Lazzaretti (2 year player in the 80s who transferred to Loyola Marymount)
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https://www.on3.com/news/marquette-shaka-smart-land-commitment-from-tre-norman/
Like his attitude! Thanks for posting the article.
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https://www.on3.com/news/marquette-shaka-smart-land-commitment-from-tre-norman/
Awesome get for Shaka and a great day for MU basketball. Tre's quotes in the linked article are GOLD. He sounds like an absolute winner, who will continue to ascend. I really like this recruiting class - Think all 3 of these guys are on the rise, and have the athleticism needed to excel in high major basketball.
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MU Overload says that Norman is only the third player from MA that we have ever landed. The other two are Zack McCall and Vic Lazzaretti (2 year player in the 80s who transferred to Loyola Marymount)
I don’t have the hometowns of all players entered yet so there may be others that just haven’t been entered yet.
I’m glad someone uses that function though!
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Shaka is building a very strong foundation. The Wizard of Scoop, who is the gold standard, preached culture and foundation for past year and I love what Shaka is building. Always great to land a target recruit.
By the way, Vic Laz was from Nebraska if memory serves me. I believe he was teammate of Kerry Trotter.
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Welcome Tre!
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MU Overload says that Norman is only the third player from MA that we have ever landed. The other two are Zack McCall and Vic Lazzaretti (2 year player in the 80s who transferred to Loyola Marymount)
Lazar and Todd graduated from nD Prep in Fitchburg MA. That's all I can remember.
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https://www.on3.com/news/marquette-shaka-smart-land-commitment-from-tre-norman/
Yeah, I'm not sure Milwaukee's gonna forget about Giannis to cheer on Tre, but I do love his attitude!
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Looks like the Lazzaretti family moved to Massachusetts while Vic was at Creighton Prep, so Andover was the family address while he went to Marquette kind of like Pat Foley being from Birmingham, MI.
https://www.andovertownsman.com/sports/2016-andover-punchard-hall-of-fame-biographies/article_672b5ffb-87a9-5a44-876e-22b40679193c.html
Two NY natives who played at prep schools in Massachusetts were Larry McNeill and Roney Eford.
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MU Overload says that Norman is only the third player from MA that we have ever landed. The other two are Zack McCall and Vic Lazzaretti (2 year player in the 80s who transferred to Loyola Marymount)
Vic played at Creighton Prep. Maybe he transferred from out east.
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Now the million dollar question:
Who leaves after the year? And what if no one willingly wants to leave?
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Shaka is building a very strong foundation. The Wizard of Scoop, who is the gold standard, preached culture and foundation for past year and I love what Shaka is building. Always great to land a target recruit.
By the way, Vic Laz was from Nebraska if memory serves me. I believe he was teammate of Kerry Trotter.
100% correct, Goose, hey?
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Now the million dollar question:
Who leaves after the year? And what if no one willingly wants to leave?
It will work out. Worry about it 7 months from now.
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Shaka is building a very strong foundation. The Wizard of Scoop, who is the gold standard, preached culture and foundation for past year and I love what Shaka is building. Always great to land a target recruit.
By the way, Vic Laz was from Nebraska if memory serves me. I believe he was teammate of Kerry Trotter.
Right on, Goose. Norman is a dude. And most importantly, screams culture fit. Looks a lot like the Nova guards that eat us alive.
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Lazar and Todd graduated from nD Prep in Fitchburg MA. That's all I can remember.
true, but both were not from there (Lazar from Buffalo, Todd from Chicago).
Zach McCall was from Fitchburg, MA but did not go to ND Prep. His son played with MDA in the TBT last summer too.
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true, but both were not from there (Lazar from Buffalo, Todd from Chicago).
Zach McCall was from Fitchburg, MA but did not go to ND Prep. His son played with MDA in the TBT last summer too.
So is the Massachusetts' residency definition like Scoop's definition of "alumni" now? Or the MUAD's definition of "freshman"? ;D
Btw, Todd's hometown was Huntington WVA.
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MOPEs gotta mope…
Now the million dollar question:
Who leaves after the year? And what if no one willingly wants to leave?
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MOPEs gotta mope…
Yes and no. It’s a fair question but probably one to ask after enjoying the moment. Pretty safe bet the staff has an inkling about what’s going on, though, so not overly concerned about it
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Now the million dollar question:
Who leaves after the year? And what if no one willingly wants to leave?
With 8 of our players Freshmen or Sophomores, and many playing similar types of positions, I think it’s pretty inevitable someone will leave.
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So is the Massachusetts' residency definition like Scoop's definition of "alumni" now? Or the MUAD's definition of "freshman"? ;D
Btw, Todd's hometown was Huntington WVA.
When you go to school for one academic year in a place that wouldn’t make you “from” there. Seven semesters at at MU and I would never consider myself a Wisconsinite.
When did Todd move from WV to Suburban Chicago (New Trier, right?).
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When you go to school for one academic year in a place that wouldn’t make you “from” there. Seven semesters at at MU and I would never consider myself a Wisconsinite.
When did Todd move from WV to Suburban Chicago (New Trier, right?).
#humblebrag
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#humblebrag
Lol
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I guess we’re now The Harvard of the Midwest!
Another nice get for Shaka. Congrats!
please, no
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#humblebrag
Semester aboard. No way I was graduating in seven semesters! Of course I’d go when we made the CUA tourney run.
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When you go to school for one academic year in a place that wouldn’t make you “from” there. Seven semesters at at MU and I would never consider myself a Wisconsinite.
When did Todd move from WV to Suburban Chicago (New Trier, right?).
Mayo is WV. Townsend was New Trier with Lottich (lived with him and played together). TT went to prep in New Hampshire before MU.
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Now the million dollar question:
Who leaves after the year? And what if no one willingly wants to leave?
Shakalop
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I guess we’re now The Harvard of the Midwest!
Indeed. An Harvard is still the UW-Madison of the East.
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Shakalop
I like this kid Scoop Snoop. Maybe we're back quicker than I anticipated.
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And what if no one willingly wants to leave?
Boom!! Shakalaka!
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Shakalop
In this era of college hoops, the scholarships are one year contracts. So in saying that, there’s 5 or 6 players that you can think of that might leave. Not a problem, you will see in Feb. or March one kid will not see the court!
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Shaka is building a very strong foundation. The Wizard of Scoop, who is the gold standard, preached culture and foundation for past year and I love what Shaka is building. Always great to land a target recruit.
By the way, Vic Laz was from Nebraska if memory serves me. I believe he was teammate of Kerry Trotter.
The 1982-83 and 1983-84 media guides give Andover, MA as Vic Lazzaretti’s hometown. (See attached).
When there are discrepancies in information, I always give the MU media guides the highest priority.
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Did Vic come back to MU for law school?
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Yes and no. It’s a fair question but probably one to ask after enjoying the moment. Pretty safe bet the staff has an inkling about what’s going on, though, so not overly concerned about it
This over recruiting could wind up being a good thing. What more motivation to play well does one need, not just for more playing time, you just might be the one to get cut. Also with the instant transfer rule over recruiting just might/will become the new norm. As TAMU has said were looking at 6 guys for the 24 class. Omax, Tyler and Oso all still have 3 years of eligibility counting this season. So it is certain more than one player won't be on the roster over the next two seasons, being it getting cut or a voluntary transfer or going pro.
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Over-recruiting is not the "new norm." It has gone on for years and years and years.
Years ago, Scoopers were talking about players getting Creaned and then Buzz-cut.
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Over-recruiting is not the "new norm." It has gone on for years and years and years.
Years ago, Scoopers were talking about players getting Creaned and then Buzz-cut.
Both DJ Newbill and Aaron Durley were "cut" after signing their NLIs, but I don't believe that in either instance Marquette "oversigned." Newbill was cut to make room for a Jamil transfer, and Durley just wasn't very good.
Someone can correct me if I am wrong, but I don't recall MU being oversigned in at least 15 years.
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Over-recruiting is not the "new norm." It has gone on for years and years and years.
Years ago, Scoopers were talking about players getting Creaned and then Buzz-cut.
I'll concede your point, but in today's college basketball landscape it may become a necessity and that is not a bad thing.
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Chit happens or as they say in da burbs, "items occur." Big boy basketball is big business. Sew any coach worth his weenie is gonna blast away until his best roster is in place, aina?
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Damian Saunders says 'remember me? '
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Damian Saunders says 'remember me? '
2007...so it meets my "at least 15 years" standard! ;)
Were we oversigned when Buzz had the kid from Chicago who had some "burning issue" before ending up at Kansas State?
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Were we oversigned when Buzz had the kid from Chicago who had some "burning issue" before ending up at Kansas State?
That was not a Buzz cutting. That was a Larry lancing. Newbill on the other hand
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Yeah, but as I said above, Newbill wasn't an oversigning issue. Newbill was a "we want space for a Jamil transfer" issue.
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2007...so it meets my "at least 15 years" standard! ;)
Time flies.
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It seems like Wojo was almost always undersigned waiting for a transfer that never occurred. Which is worse? Over signed with a reason or undersigned without one?
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In this era of college hoops, the scholarships are one year contracts. So in saying that, there’s 5 or 6 players that you can think of that might leave. Not a problem, you will see in Feb. or March one kid will not see the court!
I have no problem, if a kid decides to leave on his own.
I have a big problem, if we have to drop somebody. It makes Shaka a hypocrite, since he emphasizes, we are family.
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Both DJ Newbill and Aaron Durley were "cut" after signing their NLIs, but I don't believe that in either instance Marquette "oversigned." Newbill was cut to make room for a Jamil transfer, and Durley just wasn't very good.
Someone can correct me if I am wrong, but I don't recall MU being oversigned in at least 15 years.
Thanks for the info.
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Both DJ Newbill and Aaron Durley were "cut" after signing their NLIs, but I don't believe that in either instance Marquette "oversigned." Newbill was cut to make room for a Jamil transfer, and Durley just wasn't very good.
Someone can correct me if I am wrong, but I don't recall MU being oversigned in at least 15 years.
Buzz never let a scholarship go unused and the last one given was generally the first one gone the next year.
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I have no problem, if a kid decides to leave on his own.
I have a big problem, if we have to drop somebody. It makes Shaka a hypocrite, since he emphasizes, we are family.
I’ll give Shaka the benefit of the doubt on this. He knows something that we don’t know. Someone had to let him know this is their last season.
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I’ll give Shaka the benefit of the doubt on this. He knows something that we don’t know. Someone had to let him know this is their last season.
I have been thinking this as well. The team probably has a good idea of what is going on behind the scenes. We do not.
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I have no problem, if a kid decides to leave on his own.
I have a big problem, if we have to drop somebody. It makes Shaka a hypocrite, since he emphasizes, we are family.
I mean, I'd kick some people out of my family...
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I mean, I'd kick some people out of my family...
I think you might be the first one voted off your family island 8-)
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Nah, introverts never are, aina?
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I have no problem, if a kid decides to leave on his own.
I have a big problem, if we have to drop somebody. It makes Shaka a hypocrite, since he emphasizes, we are family.
Shaka absolutely is not a hypocrite. The work the he and his wife have done everywhere they have been has been on the highest of levels and more than legitimate. He wont take a transfer over a plyer who has worked his system for years. He was 100% told by the player that this is their last year.
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I think you might be the first one voted off your family island 8-)
No doubt. That's why I never put it up for a vote.
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No doubt. That's why I never put it up for a vote.
Same here.
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Interesting note for nolongerwanking
https://twitter.com/mikeyagmin/status/1567303891187863554?s=46&t=DM6vIecsuvJYk4IMKMXEMQ
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I’ll give Shaka the benefit of the doubt on this. He knows something that we don’t know. Someone had to let him know this is their last season.
I don't think Shaka would accept having a player on his team that is already planning his exit.
I think by the end of the season it will be obvious to at least one player that he will never get significant minutes at Marquette and Shaka and staff will help him find a new program where he will excel. If that player would rather stay at Marquette, they will help that player get his tuition covered and he will be able to stay at Marquette but not be a part of the basketball roster. Players are entitled to a shot, not to minutes.
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I don't think Shaka would accept having a player on his team that is already planning his exit.
I think by the end of the season it will be obvious to at least one player that he will never get significant minutes at Marquette and Shaka and staff will help him find a new program where he will excel. If that player would rather stay at Marquette, they will help that player get his tuition covered and he will be able to stay at Marquette but not be a part of the basketball roster. Players are entitled to a shot, not to minutes.
Shaka is probably taking a different job and doesn’t care either way
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I don't think Shaka would accept having a player on his team that is already planning his exit.
I think by the end of the season it will be obvious to at least one player that he will never get significant minutes at Marquette and Shaka and staff will help him find a new program where he will excel. If that player would rather stay at Marquette, they will help that player get his tuition covered and he will be able to stay at Marquette but not be a part of the basketball roster. Players are entitled to a shot, not to minutes.
After reading this, I am walking back my comments on this. Your take makes a lot of sense.
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It seems like Wojo was almost always undersigned waiting for a transfer that never occurred. Which is worse? Over signed with a reason or undersigned without one?
To be fair, you actually needed the scholarship available to take a mid-year transfer because the player had to spend two semesters on campus before becoming eligible. I didn't agree with that approach, but many here on the board thought holding a scholarship for a mid-year transfer was a great idea.
Now that we're in the age of insta-transfers, if a player leaves his team mid-year, he'll be eligible at his new school at the start of the next year without having to spend two semesters on campus. There's no need to hold a scholarship for a mid-year transfer.
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I don't think Shaka would accept having a player on his team that is already planning his exit.
I think by the end of the season it will be obvious to at least one player that he will never get significant minutes at Marquette and Shaka and staff will help him find a new program where he will excel. If that player would rather stay at Marquette, they will help that player get his tuition covered and he will be able to stay at Marquette but not be a part of the basketball roster. Players are entitled to a shot, not to minutes.
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Good god. If DJ Wagner called Shaka and said, “Hey Shaka. I’m planning on playing college basketball for one season before being an NBA Draft Lottery pick. I’d love to spend that season in Milwaukee playing for Marquette,” Shaka is not saying, “Thanks, but we want four year culture guys. Good luck at Kentucky or Louisville!” And if he is saying that, he should be terminated immediately.
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To be fair, you actually needed the scholarship available to take a mid-year transfer because the player had to spend two semesters on campus before becoming eligible. I didn't agree with that approach, but many here on the board thought holding a scholarship for a mid-year transfer was a great idea.
Now that we're in the age of insta-transfers, if a player leaves his team mid-year, he'll be eligible at his new school at the start of the next year without having to spend two semesters on campus. There's no need to hold a scholarship for a mid-year transfer.
Agreed. I did see the argument for leaving one open, but for every Luke Fischer that became available, there were fifty freshmen or summer transfers you could've pursued that could have helped you. With immediate eligibility, there is no benefit whatsoever to holding a scholarship, mainly because there's so much less motivation for anyone to leave midseason as it won't get them eligible any sooner.
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Shaka absolutely is not a hypocrite. The work the he and his wife have done everywhere they have been has been on the highest of levels and more than legitimate. He wont take a transfer over a plyer who has worked his system for years. He was 100% told by the player that this is their last year.
Not sure I buy this.
Shaka didn't even backfill for Justin "just in case" he decided to return, and his departure was much more of a sure thing than for anyone on the current roster.
If a current player says in September they're going pro at the end of the year, you would think Shaka offers the same courtesy to that player "just in case." And if they said they're going to transfer, Shaka isn't going carry a player not 100% committed to Marquette.
I think this is simply a sign that the ballyhooed "culture of retention" was oversold by some here on the board. It doesn't exist, and everyone on the roster has to know that they need to work every day to keep their place on the roster.
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Good god. If DJ Wagner called Shaka and said, “Hey Shaka. I’m planning on playing college basketball for one season before being an NBA Draft Lottery pick. I’d love to spend that season in Milwaukee playing for Marquette,” Shaka is not saying, “Thanks, but we want four year culture guys. Good luck at Kentucky or Louisville!” And if he is saying that, he should be terminated immediately.
If that hypothetical takes place, it is important to know what Wagner is expecting regarding his role. If Shaka is uncomfortable with that, then he should say "no thanks." And no, he shouldn't lose his job otherwise. That's ridiculous. He is paid to win basketball games - not recruiting battles.
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I think this is simply a sign that the ballyhooed "culture of retention" was oversold by some here on the board. It doesn't exist, and everyone on the roster has to know that they need to work every day to keep their place on the roster.
I don't see how A is connected to B. You can have a culture of retention and oversign by 1 player.
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Not sure I buy this.
Shaka didn't even backfill for Justin "just in case" he decided to return, and his departure was much more of a sure thing than for anyone on the current roster.
If a current player says in September they're going pro at the end of the year, you would think Shaka offers the same courtesy to that player "just in case." And if they said they're going to transfer, Shaka isn't going carry a player not 100% committed to Marquette.
I think this is simply a sign that the ballyhooed "culture of retention" was oversold by some here on the board. It doesn't exist, and everyone on the roster has to know that they need to work every day to keep their place on the roster.
We will need to wait 7 months to see what happened. I believe Shaka knows that a current player is leaving. Im not going to speculate on who that player is.
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Good god. If DJ Wagner called Shaka and said, “Hey Shaka. I’m planning on playing college basketball for one season before being an NBA Draft Lottery pick. I’d love to spend that season in Milwaukee playing for Marquette,” Shaka is not saying, “Thanks, but we want four year culture guys. Good luck at Kentucky or Louisville!” And if he is saying that, he should be terminated immediately.
I don't think he was talking about one-and-done type players...
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Good god. If DJ Wagner called Shaka and said, “Hey Shaka. I’m planning on playing college basketball for one season before being an NBA Draft Lottery pick. I’d love to spend that season in Milwaukee playing for Marquette,” Shaka is not saying, “Thanks, but we want four year culture guys. Good luck at Kentucky or Louisville!” And if he is saying that, he should be terminated immediately.
Is one of our players as good as DJ Wagner? That's awesome news!
In all seriousness, it would depend on what Wagner's expectations were. If he's going to buy into his role and Shaka's culture and do everything asked of all of the other players on the team for the same amount of collective money, then by all means, sign Wagner up.
You can complain if you want, but Shaka has offered one player to date who ended up ranked in one and done territory. And that one was ranked in the back half of the top 100 when Shaka offered and we stopped being mentioned with him after he blew up. It could be a coincidence, but I don't think Shaka is going after one and dones, at least not at this point. If one called him up? Maybe that would be different but I don't think that call is coming.
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Semester aboard. No way I was graduating in seven semesters! Of course I’d go when we made the CUA tourney run.
Which ship were you on?
Please don't tell me it was an aircraft carrier!
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This whole "culture" thing is so nauseating. Like all sports at all level, winning creates good culture. And you win by accumulating talent. Sure, if there's a 2021 version of Antonio Brown, yes, many coaches will stay away from that. But beyond that, Shaka isn't passing up on talent because they don't cheer their teammates on hard enough in the weight room.
Shaka isn't avoiding recruiting one and done talent because he's not interested in guys who won't be here for four years. He's not recruiting one and done talent because he knows he can't compete with the Kentuckys of the world in this day and age.
So, let's hope he can coach them up. But let's not stick our noses up at talent and pretend we don't want it because "culture." We've turned into Badger fans since Shaka arrived.
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I don't think Shaka would accept having a player on his team that is already planning his exit.
I think by the end of the season it will be obvious to at least one player that he will never get significant minutes at Marquette and Shaka and staff will help him find a new program where he will excel. If that player would rather stay at Marquette, they will help that player get his tuition covered and he will be able to stay at Marquette but not be a part of the basketball roster. Players are entitled to a shot, not to minutes.
I’m thinking about it a different way. Almost like a senior is going to leave at the end of the year because their eligibility is done, there are players that may be thinking of leaving on good terms for other reasons besides playing time. Lewis left to become a pro and was probably going to go no matter what he heard prior to the draft. Maybe Oso has let Shaka know he plans to graduate and transfer. Maybe Omax wants to go pro after the year regardless of draft status not unlike Bailey did.
I think he knows whose leaving. You could be right and he is over recruiting knowing that someone will leave over playing time. But I think your scenario or other scenarios are equally as likely.
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This thread has officially been scoop’d
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Interesting note for nolongerwanking
https://twitter.com/mikeyagmin/status/1567303891187863554?s=46&t=DM6vIecsuvJYk4IMKMXEMQ
I'm not a big fan even of round-figure stat groupings because they usually seem forced. ("He's the first player in school history to average 15 ppg, 10 rpg and 5 apg.") But 19 ... 6.5 ... 2.9? How arbitrary. That's a freakin' stat salad. Pass the balsamic.
Having said that ... just to be mentioned in the same twit with those names is a pretty nice compliment, and I'm really happy that Shaka landed such a fine all-around basketball player.
We've turned into Badger fans since Shaka arrived.
Take that back, or I'll punch you in the nuts!
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Welcome to MU Tre.
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This whole "culture" thing is so nauseating. Like all sports at all level, winning creates good culture.
You can't win without a good culture unless your talent is overwhelming.
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Shaka absolutely is not a hypocrite. The work the he and his wife have done everywhere they have been has been on the highest of levels and more than legitimate. He wont take a transfer over a plyer who has worked his system for years. He was 100% told by the player that this is their last year.
Do you actually know this? I could see Prosper telling Shaka he plans on going pro. Even if he plans to he may get injured or have a year that that does not justify turning pro.
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Do you actually know this? I could see Prosper telling Shaka he plans on going pro. Even if he plans to he may get injured or have a year that that does not justify turning pro.
It’s obvious Shaka isn’t a good person and probably a snake
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I have no problem, if a kid decides to leave on his own.
I have a big problem, if we have to drop somebody. It makes Shaka a hypocrite, since he emphasizes, we are family.
Nonsense. An important role for any leader is to assess talent and ease out those who can't cut it. Helping them find a situation where they can be successful is a homerun for both parties.
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So, let's hope he can coach them up. But let's not stick our noses up at talent and pretend we don't want it because "culture." We've turned into Badger fans since Shaka arrived.
Whose sticking their noses up? There are multiple ways to win in college basketball. Recruiting one and dones is one way, it's not the only way.
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It’s obvious Shaka isn’t a good person and probably a snake
It is not obvious. I like Shaka's attitude towards the team being a family. I have no idea , if someone is going to get cut. My comment was, if he does cut someone(and that is an unknown) then his we are family mantra is not true.
I like how he talked about Ellis in his review of this team's summer preparation. I do not remember it word for word, but he talked about how Ellis for the first time felt really wanted and how much Ellis loved Marquette. It sure would be a shame, if a player like this got his scholarship taken away.
Maybe, at my age, I am past trying to win at any cost. I want the MU program to have values and every indication is that Shaka does have values. This changes for me, if players do not matter.
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It is not obvious. I like Shaka's attitude towards the team being a family. I have no idea , if someone is going to get cut. My comment was, if he does cut someone(and that is an unknown) then his we are family mantra is not true.
I like how he talked about Ellis in his review of this team's summer preparation. I do not remember it word for word, but he talked about how Ellis for the first time felt really wanted and how much Ellis loved Marquette. It sure would be a shame, if a player like this got his scholarship taken away.
Maybe, at my age, I am past trying to win at any cost. I want the MU program to have values and every indication is that Shaka does have values. This changes for me, if players do not matter.
Is it better for the player to sit on the bench and get zero minutes of PT ... or to go to a different school, play 30+ mpg and get to really help his team?
One of a coach's main responsibilities is helping each player reach his potential and putting each in position to succeed.
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It is not obvious. I like Shaka's attitude towards the team being a family. I have no idea , if someone is going to get cut. My comment was, if he does cut someone(and that is an unknown) then his we are family mantra is not true.
I like how he talked about Ellis in his review of this team's summer preparation. I do not remember it word for word, but he talked about how Ellis for the first time felt really wanted and how much Ellis loved Marquette. It sure would be a shame, if a player like this got his scholarship taken away.
Maybe, at my age, I am past trying to win at any cost. I want the MU program to have values and every indication is that Shaka does have values. This changes for me, if players do not matter.
My understanding is that if a scholarship player were to be cut but wanted to stay at Marquette, arrangements would be made so that their tuition would be covered. Most basketball players good enough to get a scholarship at Marquette would rather transfer somewhere where they will get minutes.
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Damian Saunders says 'remember me? '
Saunders wasn't cut loose because of overrrecruiting.
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He was odd man out when DJ did not go pro. Crean chose Hazel over him. Yes, the marijuana thing was the official cause, but he was #14. So, it was as good a reason as any.
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It is not obvious. I like Shaka's attitude towards the team being a family. I have no idea , if someone is going to get cut. My comment was, if he does cut someone(and that is an unknown) then his we are family mantra is not true.
I like how he talked about Ellis in his review of this team's summer preparation. I do not remember it word for word, but he talked about how Ellis for the first time felt really wanted and how much Ellis loved Marquette. It sure would be a shame, if a player like this got his scholarship taken away.
Maybe, at my age, I am past trying to win at any cost. I want the MU program to have values and every indication is that Shaka does have values. This changes for me, if players do not matter.
I've been on Scoop many years. And this might be the 20th time that bilsu has threatened to no longer be a fan of Marquette basketball because of <insert reason here.>
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I've been on Scoop many years. And this might be the 20th time that bilsu has threatened to no longer be a fan of Marquette basketball because of <insert reason here.>
I did not threaten to no longer be an MU fan.
As far as signing a more talented player the last two McDonald all-americans we (Wojo) signed did tto even get us to the NCAA tournament. Team chemistry matters.
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I think you are reaching here, sultan. Bilsu isn't going anywhere. No need to pick this fight.
This signing is good enough news to silence the trolls.
r
Yes, in 7 months something will have to give. I am of the opinion that it will work itself out.
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Heard Shaka is going to adopt one of the players.
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It is not obvious. I like Shaka's attitude towards the team being a family. I have no idea , if someone is going to get cut. My comment was, if he does cut someone(and that is an unknown) then his we are family mantra is not true.
I like how he talked about Ellis in his review of this team's summer preparation. I do not remember it word for word, but he talked about how Ellis for the first time felt really wanted and how much Ellis loved Marquette. It sure would be a shame, if a player like this got his scholarship taken away.
Maybe, at my age, I am past trying to win at any cost. I want the MU program to have values and every indication is that Shaka does have values. This changes for me, if players do not matter.
Shaka is not cutting Ellis. Stop making up scenarios that just aren’t true.
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I think you are reaching here, sultan. Bilsu isn't going anywhere. No need to pick this fight.
This signing is good enough news to silence the trolls.
r
Yes, in 7 months something will have to give. I am of the opinion that it will work itself out.
Agreed. Of course it will work itself out. It’s probably already worked out. If it’s not, the least talented player will be gently pushed out the door. Or the most talented player will go pro. Or the smartest player will transfer to Stanford, Harvard, etc.
Sounds like a great get by Shaka. Really like his attitude.
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Heard Shaka is going to adopt one of the players.
Tre Smart has a nice ring to it.
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Tre Smart has a nice ring to it.
Oso Smart FTW.
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Oso Smart FTW.
Oso is shopping NIL deals in Texas 👀
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Oso Smart FTW.
Ha! Very nice!
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Why just one? What's the limit on player adoptions by head coaches?
Heard Shaka is going to adopt one of the players.
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Oh my God! We have 14 players and 13 scholarships. What are we going to do? I'll tell you. I'll sit down with that guy playing last chair trumpet in the band and ask him to accept the fact that he's isn't going to get any playing time. And he'd be better off coming off the bench in Madison. My friend was a freshman point guard on the 2003 team and when Wes Matthews came in he knew he wasn't going to be in the situation he expected when he joined the team. He left. Did he get Creaned? Yes. But he understood that teams are built on talent. He never held a grudge. And why would he? Sports and life are all about competition. Nothing is guaranteed. Not even a scholarship to MU. I will help you move on but I can't be expected to wring my hands and keep you on the team when I'm trying to build a team that needs better players. And you don't have the talent to help us do that. Now that I've said this I have to apologize to my friend Brandon Bell for suggesting that he played last chair trumpet. He'll forgive me. He knows he wasn't as good as his brother Charlie. But he will always cherish that year. And the final four. It was priceless.
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Why just one? What's the limit on player adoptions by head coaches?
Shaka and his twelve apostles
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Shaka and his twelve apostles
The Shaka Smart Home for Kids Who Play Basketball Good and Who Wanna Learn to do Other Stuff Good Too.
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He was odd man out when DJ did not go pro. Crean chose Hazel over him. Yes, the marijuana thing was the official cause, but he was #14. So, it was as good a reason as any.
No, weed wasn’t it. SAT issue. Crean wanted Saunders over Hazel but Saunders made TC’s choice easy.
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You guys are wrong about this. The last guy is not getting cut. Don’t get me wrong….there may be a player unhappy at the end of this year and decide to go elsewhere. That is not the scholarship that is available to Tre now.
One of the top 8 players this year will not be back next year. He told Shaka his intentions.
Save this thread for the spring.
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Oh my God! We have 14 players and 13 scholarships. What are we going to do? I'll tell you. I'll sit down with that guy playing last chair trumpet in the band and ask him to accept the fact that he's isn't going to get any playing time. And he'd be better off coming off the bench in Madison. My friend was a freshman point guard on the 2003 team and when Wes Matthews came in he knew he wasn't going to be in the situation he expected when he joined the team. He left. Did he get Creaned? Yes. But he understood that teams are built on talent. He never held a grudge. And why would he? Sports and life are all about competition. Nothing is guaranteed. Not even a scholarship to MU. I will help you move on but I can't be expected to wring my hands and keep you on the team when I'm trying to build a team that needs better players. And you don't have the talent to help us do that. Now that I've said this I have to apologize to my friend Brandon Bell for suggesting that he played last chair trumpet. He'll forgive me. He knows he wasn't as good as his brother Charlie. But he will always cherish that year. And the final four. It was priceless.
Brandon Bell came in the fall of 2003 with Mason and ManChild
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Oh my God! We have 14 players and 13 scholarships. What are we going to do? I'll tell you. I'll sit down with that guy playing last chair trumpet in the band and ask him to accept the fact that he's isn't going to get any playing time. And he'd be better off coming off the bench in Madison. My friend was a freshman point guard on the 2003 team and when Wes Matthews came in he knew he wasn't going to be in the situation he expected when he joined the team. He left. Did he get Creaned? Yes. But he understood that teams are built on talent. He never held a grudge. And why would he? Sports and life are all about competition. Nothing is guaranteed. Not even a scholarship to MU. I will help you move on but I can't be expected to wring my hands and keep you on the team when I'm trying to build a team that needs better players. And you don't have the talent to help us do that. Now that I've said this I have to apologize to my friend Brandon Bell for suggesting that he played last chair trumpet. He'll forgive me. He knows he wasn't as good as his brother Charlie. But he will always cherish that year. And the final four. It was priceless.
Ha, I also hung out with Brandon a handful of times. Super nice, chill dude.
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Wuz dat aisle 2 or aisle 3 at Pick & Save, hey?
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My understanding is that if a scholarship player were to be cut but wanted to stay at Marquette, arrangements would be made so that their tuition would be covered. Most basketball players good enough to get a scholarship at Marquette would rather transfer somewhere where they will get minutes.
So if they stayed at MU, tuition was covered but not on scholarship and could not play basketball or any other sport for that matter while getting their undergraduate degree do those years count against their eligibility to play later at MU or some other school to get their graduate degree?
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This whole "culture" thing is so nauseating. Like all sports at all level, winning creates good culture. And you win by accumulating talent. Sure, if there's a 2021 version of Antonio Brown, yes, many coaches will stay away from that. But beyond that, Shaka isn't passing up on talent because they don't cheer their teammates on hard enough in the weight room.
Shaka isn't avoiding recruiting one and done talent because he's not interested in guys who won't be here for four years. He's not recruiting one and done talent because he knows he can't compete with the Kentuckys of the world in this day and age.
So, let's hope he can coach them up. But let's not stick our noses up at talent and pretend we don't want it because "culture." We've turned into Badger fans since Shaka arrived.
You need to read the Army Crew team Harvard case study. Or... just watch memphis' MBB last few seasons.
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So if they stayed at MU, tuition was covered but not on scholarship and could not play basketball or any other sport for that matter while getting their undergraduate degree do those years count against their eligibility to play later at MU or some other school to get their graduate degree?
If they don't play, they retain their eligibility. But they would likely transfer if they have eligibility remaining.
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So if they stayed at MU, tuition was covered but not on scholarship and could not play basketball or any other sport for that matter while getting their undergraduate degree do those years count against their eligibility to play later at MU or some other school to get their graduate degree?
I don't know. I think you have thought more about this than anyone associated with college basketball. The reality is that 999 out of 1000 basketball players would transfer to another university in that situation because they want to play basketball.
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Instagram video of his announcement and other pics/videos.... hopefully the link works.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CiL5ExDDgZi/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
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I don't know. I think you have thought more about this than anyone associated with college basketball. The reality is that 999 out of 1000 basketball players would transfer to another university in that situation because they want to play basketball.
...even the ones at Harvard?
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...even the ones at Harvard?
Ivy League schools don't offer athletic scholarships
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Ivy League schools don't offer athletic scholarships
Are they doing NILs? Curious
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This is for the most part simply wrong. Let's go through it:
This whole "culture" thing is so nauseating. Like all sports at all level, winning creates good culture. And you win by accumulating talent.
Hard disagree. Sure, you have to find talent and winning helps, but we've seen example after example of teams that failed when they tried to add talent too quickly and then elevated the program when they focused on development over talent. Baylor lost for four straight years under Drew, then became an occasional tourney team while going after the Perry Jones/Quincy Miller types. Eventually, he moved away from the top, top talent and went back to developing in the Culture of Joy, which turned them into one of the elite programs and national title winners. Villanova did the same when Jay chased Yarou and Wayns, only to realize he did better with the 50-150 ranked kids than the truly elite ones.
Once you establish culture with long-term recruits, adding the occasional stud, whether a Kendall Brown or Keyonte George at Baylor, or an Omari Spellman or Jalen Brunson at Villanova, works well, but you need the culture first. See also: Memphis.
Sure, if there's a 2021 version of Antonio Brown, yes, many coaches will stay away from that. But beyond that, Shaka isn't passing up on talent because they don't cheer their teammates on hard enough in the weight room.
Shaka isn't avoiding recruiting one and done talent because he's not interested in guys who won't be here for four years. He's not recruiting one and done talent because he knows he can't compete with the Kentuckys of the world in this day and age.
Jarrett Allen, Mo Bamba, and Greg Brown were all top-20, All-Americans that Shaka recruited in a five year span. He had three straight top-10 recruiting classes from 2016-18, followed by #17 in 2019 and a lower ranked class in 2020 but because he only brought in one player, #9 overall Greg Brown. He has the ability to get those types. Not at a Kentucky or Duke consistency level, but he has shown he can get top talent, while also showing that he doesn't win at the highest level when he's running his program through those guys.
So, let's hope he can coach them up. But let's not stick our noses up at talent and pretend we don't want it because "culture." We've turned into Badger fans since Shaka arrived.
I certainly don't think we don't want talent. But it is obvious that Shaka's approach is to build a culture first. I don't think it's an accident that our offers and recruits in 2021, 2022, and 2023 were to players outside the top-50, aside from local kids. And when guys blew up (Justin Edwards, for instance) we pulled out. I also don't think it's an accident that in 2024, we are going after a number of fringe five-stars. You build the culture and once the 21, 22, and 23 kids are sophomores, juniors, and seniors, you fill in the holes with top talent.
In the later years, Wojo tried to do the same. Get a core of guys like Howard, Theo, Sacar, and the Hausers, then try to fill in the holes with the Grimes/Mannion/Carton types. He missed some of those big swings, but in recent years that's been the winning formula for a number of programs. 2022 Kansas (Agbaji, Braun, Harris), 2021 Baylor (Teague, Flagler, Butler, Mayer), 2019 Virginia (Hunter, Clark), and 2018 Nova (Paschall, DiVincenzo, Bridges, Booth) all mined for sub-50 gold to form their core and once they established their culture, put the best talent they could around that.
Eschewing the top talent until you have your culture established isn't a revolutionary strategy Shaka came up with, it's pretty much the exact format every national title winner since 2016 Villanova has followed. It remains to be seen if Shaka will find that level of success with this. He did build a mid-major juggernaut at VCU but never got the top-tier recruiting to that level and the F4 run was still a bit of a fluke. He had some good teams at Texas and got top talent, but never was able to continually establish his team at a commensurate level to his VCU teams relative to the A10/CAA.
What he's doing here over the long term looks to be a hybrid of the two that follows a model like Wright, Drew, and Bennett have used. We'll see if it works, but honestly, if the choice is between one year of an immensely talented player he's not confident will elevate the culture and a three to four year player who's more of a project but has longer term upside, I think he takes the latter every time, at least for these first few years.
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Man, if I were a member of Norman's family, I would be so excited for him reading through this thread.
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I am excited to have Tre at MU. I love versatile guards with size and winning attitudes
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Instagram video of his announcement and other pics/videos.... hopefully the link works.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CiL5ExDDgZi/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
Love Tre. Not only can he ball, and any kid who is repping Playboy Apparel at their Commitment Party is someone we want in our organization.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KdeNj2YRk4
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Ivy League schools don't offer athletic scholarships
...but do they lose their eligibility when they play for an IVY since they are not on scholarship.
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...but do they lose their eligibility when they play for an IVY since they are not on scholarship.
No. Eligibility and receiving a scholarship aren't really linked. Walk-ons lose eligibility if they play during the year.
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Man, if I were a member of Norman's family, I would be so excited for him reading through this thread.
Caveat emptor.
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Man, if I were a member of Norman's family, I would be so excited for him reading through this thread.
Indeed. Great representation on here.
Or Shaka for that matter…..some on here think he was being disingenuous and a fraud the second Tre signed…..and he’s got pink slips for players before the season starts.
SMH
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Very happy Tre is coming to Marquette! I leave the basketball business to Shaka and staff who probably know more than we do :)
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Are they doing NILs? Curious
I know some Cornell wrestlers who have deals
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Very happy Tre is coming to Marquette! I leave the basketball business to Shaka and staff who probably know more than we do :)
I think you underestimate the average Scooper's opinion of themself.
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I think you underestimate the average Scooper's opinion of themself.
The collective Scooper hive mind could out coach Coach K the last 3 years of his career.
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I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if this is doubled up, but I believe I saw something from AE that mentioned they don't actually have room for Norman at this point in time.
Somebody or somebodies are going to have to be on the way out.
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I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if this is doubled up, but I believe I saw something from AE that mentioned they don't actually have room for Norman at this point in time.
Somebody or somebodies are going to have to be on the way out.
I would hate to be the guards that have to go up against Mitchell, Ross, Norman, Lowery, and Jones. They are going to wear guys out defensively. I love that we are getting back to this roster structure.
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I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if this is doubled up, but I believe I saw something from AE that mentioned they don't actually have room for Norman at this point in time.
Somebody or somebodies are going to have to be on the way out.
Correct, one over as things currently stand in 23-24.
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I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if this is doubled up, but I believe I saw something from AE that mentioned they don't actually have room for Norman at this point in time.
Somebody or somebodies are going to have to be on the way out.
I don’t think that’s accurate
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I don’t think that’s accurate
Been a bit tuned out but found this thread to ask this exact question. According to the scholarship table, we have 14 for next year. Not exactly sure how or if any remnants of covid rules impact scholarship count but thought you could only have 13?
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Been a bit tuned out but found this thread to ask this exact question. According to the scholarship table, we have 14 for next year. Not exactly sure how or if any remnants of covid rules impact scholarship count but thought you could only have 13?
Correct. Someone will probably be leaving either for pros or for greener pastures. May have even told coach early this year that this would be their last year.
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My understanding is that if a scholarship player were to be cut but wanted to stay at Marquette, arrangements would be made so that their tuition would be covered. Most basketball players good enough to get a scholarship at Marquette would rather transfer somewhere where they will get minutes.
Only if they leave due to medical retirement or a coaching change. Otherwise, they count against the scholarship limits.
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Are they doing NILs? Curious
No schools do NILs, aina? They do decide if they wish to permit their student-athletes to engage in NIL activity.
Ivy League did adjust their existing rules last summer so that SA’s v could do NIL activities.