Explosions in Kiev

[Skatastrophy]

Again, I don’t disagree, I just don’t see it happening in countries we aspire to be like.  If a country with a thriving oil industry did it in the last 20-25 years and had good outcomes, then it’s a more interesting discussion.  Otherwise it just seems to be a tool of dictatorships or other government corruption/cronyism (which is the main reasons those countries are lousy IMO)

Agreed.

Running it as a regulated industry, though, like the rest of the utilities? I'm open to it. Same with ISPs.

I'm happy with my electric/gas/water service, and I've made a lot of money investing in utility companies.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

I saw this locally now a national story

A Yale professor's list of companies staying in Russia has put the business world on notice
Bryan Pietsch
Tue, March 8, 2022, 6:49 AM·3 min read

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/yale-professors-list-companies-staying-114915451.html

Among executives, board members, analysts and others in the business world in recent days, a "who's who" list has been floating around, showing which companies have pulled out of Russia amid its attack on Ukraine - and which ones have stayed put.

The spreadsheet, compiled by Yale professor Jeffrey Sonnenfeld and his research team, has become a naughty-or-nice list of sorts, with CEOs trying their best to avoid being placed on the roster of "Companies That Remain in Russia With Significant Exposure."

Sonnenfeld, who founded the nonprofit Chief Executive Leadership Institute, said he has fielded calls from CEOs asking "why we didn't have them on the right list, and what they needed to do to either clarify or actually take a more strong stance."

On top of skyrocketing inflation and a plummeting ruble, Russians have been left with a dwindling marketplace: Prada stores have shuttered, TikTok has suspended operations in their country, and car companies including Rolls-Royce, Toyota and Volkswagen have stopped shipping vehicles to Russia. Even WWE, the wrestling entertainment company, said it would halt operations there.

The gutting of the Russian economy has shattered the image that President Vladimir Putin had created, portraying himself as an all-powerful leader with things under control, Sonnenfeld said in a phone interview with The Washington Post on Monday.

And with Russian state media echoing Putin's framing of the war as a "special military operation," Sonnenfeld added, the corporate pullouts provide a tangible message that the attack "isn't just some little military operation."

Even among those on the list of "Companies That Have Curtailed Russian Operations," some are taking a stronger position against the invasion than others, Sonnenfeld said. According to the list, BASF, a German chemical company, said it would "suspend new Russian relationships," while other companies including Apple and Chanel have closed stores or cut off supply chains. FedEx is halting all shipments to Russia, and major oil companies including ExxonMobil have said they will exit operations there, leaving billions of dollars on the table.

Although some companies could argue that exiting Russia would harm employees there who are removed from Putin's decision to invade Ukraine, Sonnenfeld said that "the idea is not to minimize the pain."

He said executives and board members should get past the idea that "somehow there's a win-win solution" and recognize that forcing an economic collapse on the Russian people is part of preventing a harsher outcome for them.

"This is one step away from open warfare," he said. "This is a last-ditch effort. You're helping those workers by not having [the West] dropping bombs and shooting them."

Among those on the list of companies keeping business as usual are major brands such as McDonald's, Starbucks and Coca-Cola. Sonnenfeld said McDonald's was the "screaming anomaly that's bewildering to all its peers," as it has remained operational in Russia even though it has control over 85% of its restaurants there, unlike companies such as Starbucks, which are hindered by franchise obligations.

A representative for McDonald's did not immediately respond to a request for comment about its operations in Russia.

Sonnenfeld said he has compiled other lists of companies' involvements in issues such as gun safety or former president Donald Trump's false claims about the 2020 election.

"We have a history of seeing the value of business leaders affirming the truth and taking a stand," he said. "CEOs need peer approval," he added, noting that they often try to avoid standing alone on issues or policies.

The cosmetics company Estée Lauder had been on the list of those maintaining operations in Russia. On Monday, it announced it would close all of the stores it owned there and stop shipping products to the country.



The Independent
Yale professor releases list of companies staying in Russia as pressure mounts on Western companies

[Hards Alumni]

For Mugs

https://twitter.com/shashj/status/1501805877812248577

[jesmu84]

Re: domestic energy production

https://youtu.be/kJOuyckvDGY

[MuggsyB]

For Mugs

https://twitter.com/shashj/status/1501805877812248577

Blinken went on several Sunday shows and stated "that's great" if the Poles give the Ukrainians MIG-29's.  This whole situation is hanging  by a thread.and has enormous geopolitical ramifications. If Ukraine can hold Kyiv, Putin may be forced to quit with his lack of equipment and his tanks being useless.  Or he may continue to go apeshjt and use vacuum and carpet bombs like Grozny, or God forbid worse.   

If it gets to that point, where he unloads bombs relentlessly and the Ukranian people are sitting ducks, we and NATO have to get involved imo.  We have to look at this through the lens that Ukraine is a precursor to further Putin aggression against the West and NATO countries.

Lastly, if Putin somehow chooses to back down because his army is a dumpster fire, and they don't have enough supplies, the USA and the USA alone have to lead whatever "peace" agreement takes place.  The worst that that could happen in this scenario is China being the arbiter. 

n the meantime if Putin chooses to "win"at all costs" what we have seen to this point will be a blip of horror.  The idea that the USA and Europe will watch this potential genocide in real time, and not do more to stop it is inconceivable to me. 

[Jockey]

Blinken went on several Sunday shows and stated "that's great" if the Poles give the Ukrainians MIG-29's.  This whole situation is hanging  by a thread.and has enormous geopolitical ramifications. If Ukraine can hold Kyiv, Putin may be forced to quit with his lack of equipment and his tanks being useless.  Or he may continue to go apeshjt and use vacuum and carpet bombs like Grozny, or God forbid worse.   

If it gets to that point, where he unloads bombs relentlessly and the Ukranian people are sitting ducks, we and NATO have to get involved imo.  We have to look at this through the lens that Ukraine is a precursor to further Putin aggression against the West and NATO countries.

Lastly, if Putin somehow chooses to back down because his army is a dumpster fire, and they don't have enough supplies, the USA and the USA alone have to lead whatever "peace" agreement takes place.  The worst that that could happen in this scenario is China being the arbiter. 

n the meantime if Putin chooses to "win"at all costs" what we have seen to this point will be a blip of horror.  The idea that the USA and Europe will watch this potential genocide in real time, and not do more to stop it is inconceivable to me.

Wow. You are really itching for WWIII.

[Galway Eagle]

Blinken went on several Sunday shows and stated "that's great" if the Poles give the Ukrainians MIG-29's.  This whole situation is hanging  by a thread.and has enormous geopolitical ramifications. If Ukraine can hold Kyiv, Putin may be forced to quit with his lack of equipment and his tanks being useless.  Or he may continue to go apeshjt and use vacuum and carpet bombs like Grozny, or God forbid worse.   

If it gets to that point, where he unloads bombs relentlessly and the Ukranian people are sitting ducks, we and NATO have to get involved imo.  We have to look at this through the lens that Ukraine is a precursor to further Putin aggression against the West and NATO countries.

Lastly, if Putin somehow chooses to back down because his army is a dumpster fire, and they don't have enough supplies, the USA and the USA alone have to lead whatever "peace" agreement takes place.  The worst that that could happen in this scenario is China being the arbiter. 

n the meantime if Putin chooses to "win"at all costs" what we have seen to this point will be a blip of horror.  The idea that the USA and Europe will watch this potential genocide in real time, and not do more to stop it is inconceivable to me.

Real question here, how much atrocity do you think we should sit and watch without military aid before we and our Allie's get involved and cause WW3 which would lead to massive massive casualties and probs nuclear war if I were a betting man. 

[#UnleashSean]

Wow. You are really itching for WWIII.

To be fair, what your proposing is basically what lead to WWII.

However, it seems logistically the Germans in 1939 were way ahead of Russians in 2022.

[MuggsyB]

The idea that Polish planes that would help Ukraine, which Blinken welcomed on Sunday, but two days later they are "escalatory" is worth discussion.  Why are Stingers and Javelins not "escalatory"?  We're dealing with a guy who just stated that the USA is building biological weapons within Ukraine.  Wouldn't that be "escalatory"?  If he wants WWIII right now he can certainly justify it can't he? 

[MuggsyB]

Real question here, how much atrocity do you think we should sit and watch without military aid before we and our Allie's get involved and cause WW3 which would lead to massive massive casualties and probs nuclear war if I were a betting man.

Is it conceivable he doesn't want a nuclear war or a confrontation with the United States?  Allies are involved right now and Poland wants to send those MIG-29'S.  Do you think they're more concerned about his reaction to sending planes to Ukraine now or not sending them?

[jesmu84]

The idea that Polish planes that would help Ukraine, which Blinken welcomed on Sunday, but two days later they are "escalatory" is worth discussion.  Why are Stingers and Javelins not "escalatory"?  We're dealing with a guy who just stated that the USA is building biological weapons within Ukraine.  Wouldn't that be "escalatory"?  If he wants WWIII right now he can certainly justify it can't he?

At this point, I'm less concerned with Putin wanting WW3 or nuclear war as much as you seem to want it

[🏀]

Pretty sure Muggsy is just a Russia state troll at this point.

[Jockey]

To be fair, what your proposing is basically what lead to WWII.

However, it seems logistically the Germans in 1939 were way ahead of Russians in 2022.

No it is not.

It was also a completely different world with no nukes.

[MuggsyB]

Pretty sure Muggsy is just a Russia state troll at this point.

This is absolute nonsense.  The fact is many here are refusing to look at the situation with clarity and why it has world order implications.  FIrst of all Poland is a member of NATO, correct?  We initially said we had no problem with Poland sending them MIG-29'S but apparently the fact that they would do it from our base in Germany would start WW3.  But if they find a way to send them from Poland directly that wouldn't start WW3 and be an attack on a NATO member?  This is totally nonsensical.

Worse, if you're Zelenskyy, why in the world would you trust NATO or the USA at this point?  In fact, he may be forced to cut some kind of deal with Putin to save countless lives and abandon a democratic future.  In the mean time who benefits the most from this entire situation?  Do we really want a stronger China/Russia/ probably Iran alliance with zero fear that the USA/NATO will do didly squat if they attack sovereign countries?  We are projecting weakness and from a longer term perspective it's a horrible idea and a threat to the Western World imo.

[🏀]

This is absolute nonsense.  The fact is many here are refusing to look at the situation with clarity and why it has world order implications.  FIrst of all Poland is a member of NATO, correct?  We initially said we had no problem with Poland sending them MIG-29'S but apparently the fact that they would do it from our base in Germany would start WW3.  But if they find a way to send them from Poland directly that wouldn't start WW3 and be an attack on a NATO member?  This is totally nonsensical.

Worse, if you're Zelenskyy, why in the world would you trust NATO or the USA at this point?  In fact, he may be forced to cut some kind of deal with Putin to save countless lives and abandon a democratic future.  In the mean time who benefits the most from this entire situation?  Do we really want a stronger China/Russia/ probably Iran alliance with zero fear that the USA/NATO will do didly squat if they attack sovereign countries?  We are projecting weakness and from a longer term perspective it's a horrible idea and a threat to the Western World imo.

How do you sleep at night?

[MuggsyB]

How do you sleep at night?

I've been an insomniac my whole life.

[JWags85]

Muggsy, any thoughts on the Russia's supposed plans to use skilled, trained walruses armed with remote explosives to set a perimeter and secure the Baltic Sea for further footholds?

[MuggsyB]

Muggsy, any thoughts on the Russia's supposed plans to use skilled, trained walruses armed with remote explosives to set a perimeter and secure the Baltic Sea for further footholds?

Walruses have sunk Russian Navy boats in the past.

I would imagine they are highly stressed and disgusted.  Despite their size they are calm, cool, and collective.

[jesmu84]

Muggsy has same opinion of this situation as MUBB - ATTACK! ATTACK! ATTACK!

at least he's consistent

[Galway Eagle]

Muggsy has same opinion of this situation as MUBB - ATTACK! ATTACK! ATTACK!

at least he's consistent

Go medieval on them!

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Go medieval on them!

Would supplying Ukraine with trebuchets be considered an escalation?

[jesmu84]

I've seen a lot of anger online over gas prices. Then further anger over US reaching out to oil countries asking for increased supply. This is after us/global oil companies refused to increase supply.

I haven't seen much anger at the companies themselves. Why is this?

[Uncle Rico]

I've seen a lot of anger online over gas prices. Then further anger over US reaching out to oil countries asking for increased supply. This is after us/global oil companies refused to increase supply.

I haven't seen much anger at the companies themselves. Why is this?

We value profits over people

[Hards Alumni]

Blinken went on several Sunday shows and stated "that's great" if the Poles give the Ukrainians MIG-29's.  This whole situation is hanging  by a thread.and has enormous geopolitical ramifications. If Ukraine can hold Kyiv, Putin may be forced to quit with his lack of equipment and his tanks being useless.  Or he may continue to go apeshjt and use vacuum and carpet bombs like Grozny, or God forbid worse.   

If it gets to that point, where he unloads bombs relentlessly and the Ukranian people are sitting ducks, we and NATO have to get involved imo.  We have to look at this through the lens that Ukraine is a precursor to further Putin aggression against the West and NATO countries.

Lastly, if Putin somehow chooses to back down because his army is a dumpster fire, and they don't have enough supplies, the USA and the USA alone have to lead whatever "peace" agreement takes place.  The worst that that could happen in this scenario is China being the arbiter. 

n the meantime if Putin chooses to "win"at all costs" what we have seen to this point will be a blip of horror.  The idea that the USA and Europe will watch this potential genocide in real time, and not do more to stop it is inconceivable to me.

Mig29s are trash.  They won't alter the current battlefield in any meaningful way.  At this point, I feel like Zelensky is trying to draw in help any way he can.  I understand his position because he is only trying to save his country, but doing anything he suggests simply because it is righteous is simultaneously very dangerous.

[Hards Alumni]

The idea that Polish planes that would help Ukraine, which Blinken welcomed on Sunday, but two days later they are "escalatory" is worth discussion.  Why are Stingers and Javelins not "escalatory"?  We're dealing with a guy who just stated that the USA is building biological weapons within Ukraine.  Wouldn't that be "escalatory"?  If he wants WWIII right now he can certainly justify it can't he?

That statement from Putin was for his people.  The international community does not believe him.