Scholarship table
Tony Gwynn hit .415/.476/.521 in 107 plate appearences against Greg Maddux. Without a striking out a single time.
He should have known better at 18 years old.
I've thought about this a lot and haven't really come to a conclusion, but keep coming back to the idea of human imperfection and wanting to encourage self-improvement. If Hader once was prejudiced, but has since improved himself, does he deserve to be forever tainted? Or is some manner of reform/rehabilitation acceptable?
You would hope that his parents would have been teaching him all along that racist, homophobic comments are wrong. 18 year olds are idiots. Most people grow out of it. Some never do.
At what point does being "a stupid kid" and "not knowing any better" no longer apply? Age 18? 20? 25?
Is there a set age that we should set it at?Kids develop at different times.
So if he posted these things at age 22, would you say that he just hasn't developed/matured yet? Would he still be a stupid kid who didn't know any better?
No.
What about if he was 19? (See where we're going with this?)
No, I don't see where you're going with this.He was in high school. I don't know about you, but I matured quite a bit after I got out of high school. I'd guess most people do? But apparently I might be in the minority thinking that.
What does it matter? Hader wasn't 18 or 20 or 25. He was 17. Let's deal with reality instead of stretching hypotheticals to justify whatever point it is you're trying to make.Hader's tweets, as offensive as they were, were juvenile ramblings. He wasn't posting white supremacist manifestos or marching on a college town with a tiki torch. Let's not make more of this that it deserves because he plays for a different team than the one you cheer for.
So, at age 17, it's fine for him to post racial slurs online but at age 22, it's not. Going back to my original question, how do we decide when a person reaches the point where the "young and dumb" excuse no longer flies? For you, it's apparently sometime between age 18 and 22. For me, I think that a 17yo should know better than to post wildly offensive comments online. Ah, the old "it could have been worse" defense. So if you had a 17yo, you'd be OK with him/her posting those same things online? After all, it's just "juvenile ramblings." It's not like your kid killed someone, right? Hader's team has absolutely nothing to do with it. In fact, this incident is part of a larger issue that's not specific to Hader. Kids do stupid things but simply being a kid doesn't make it acceptable to do those things. The kid in tower's story should absolutely be labeled for the rest of his life because he did something incredibly stupid to warrant that label. That's how it works. One awful mistake, whether you're 16 or 60, can have a hugely negative effect on the rest of your life. People need to recognize that. I just have a hard time getting on-board with "young and dumb" being an out for awful behavior. Now...get off my lawn!
TAMUI do know, Newsie is right on you knowing ball.
Ah, the old "it could have been worse" defense. So if you had a 17yo, you'd be OK with him/her posting those same things online? After all, it's just "juvenile ramblings." It's not like your kid killed someone, right?
Hader's team has absolutely nothing to do with it.
In fact, this incident is part of a larger issue that's not specific to Hader. Kids do stupid things but simply being a kid doesn't make it acceptable to do those things. The kid in tower's story should absolutely be labeled for the rest of his life because he did something incredibly stupid to warrant that label. That's how it works. One awful mistake, whether you're 16 or 60, can have a hugely negative effect on the rest of your life. People need to recognize that.
I just have a problem with people shrugging it off as if he did nothing wrong simply because he was 17.
So, at age 17, it's fine for him to post racial slurs online but at age 22, it's not. Going back to my original question, how do we decide when a person reaches the point where the "young and dumb" excuse no longer flies? For you, it's apparently sometime between age 18 and 22. For me, I think that a 17yo should know better than to post wildly offensive comments online. Ah, the old "it could have been worse" defense. So if you had a 17yo, you'd be OK with him/her posting those same things online? After all, it's just "juvenile ramblings." It's not like your kid killed someone, right? Hader's team has absolutely nothing to do with it. In fact, this incident is part of a larger issue that's not specific to Hader. Kids do stupid things but simply being a kid doesn't make it acceptable to do those things. The kid in tower's story should absolutely be labeled for the rest of his life because he did something incredibly stupid to warrant that label. That's how it works. One awful mistake, whether you're 16 or 60, can have a hugely negative effect on the rest of your life. People need to recognize that. I just have a hard time getting on-board with "young and dumb" being an out for awful behavior. Now...get off my lawn!EDIT: Just to clarify. I don't think Hader should be punished by MLB or the Brewers. Sending him to Sensitivity Training is the right move and I truly hope he learns from it and that he has already changed and grown as a person. I just have a problem with people shrugging it off as if he did nothing wrong simply because he was 17.
That was the ultimate standoff for umpires. Greg Maddux got an extra 6 inches on both sides of the plate and guys like Tony Gwynn and Wade Boggs traditionally got the corners called their way. Must've been confusing for umpires to call those ABs.
Every dude's gotta envy Maddux, hey?
Question for Brewers fans. I've been following Brewer minor leaguer Tim Dillard on Twitter for a year or two now. He's a great follow if aren't doing so. Anyway, I thought I'd look up his stats and I see he was drafted in 2001 and only got a handful of appearances in 2008, 09, 11, and 12. He's 34 now and his stats appear to be pretty awful but they've kept him around for 17 years. Just wondered what his story is. That's pretty impressive spending that much time living as a minor leaguer much less with a single organization.
Time for MLB expansion?Manfred lists Portland, Las Vegas, Charlotte, Nashville, Montreal and Vancouver as possibilities.https://deadspin.com/rob-manfred-says-he-wants-mlb-expansion-lists-six-pote-1827712616
1. Charlotte2. Nashville3. MontrealThe rest aren't that exciting to me.