No more circus...

[Tugg Speedman]

I disagree that it doesn't translate to a total ban once we're being totally honest about the costs/benefits - at least in the form we have shows and many zoos now.  It just comes down to what we as a society are willing to accept as "humane" in exchange for our viewing pleasure.  In the past, not actively striking or torturing an animal qualified as humane.  Monkeys smoked and elephants were separated from their families and chained by the legs, but so long as there was no physical injury, we deemed that humane.

Now we're realizing the complex social structures, and the needs for space and autonomy for elephants that have an average home range of 75 square miles and family units of up to a dozen animals. They commemorate the deaths of family members and pass the mirror test. Dolphins have a home range of appx 50 square miles and pods of up to 40.  There just is no way to reasonably approximate that in a captive environment that still allows humans sufficient access to turn a profit. 

The list goes on and on - big cats wearing tracks around their enclosures from pacing all day, primates showing signs of psychological degradation and distress in captivity. We know that sh*t ain't right, and I welcome the public finding the experience less fun (and in turn making those operations less profitable) because of it.

Accepted that a domesticated lifestyle is different than the lifestyle in the wild.   But why does that make a domesticated lifestyle bad?  It can be but it can change so it is not.

Should we ban dogs as household pets?  All dogs are descendants of wolves so the  family dog asleep on the floor in the family room is not living a lifestyle anywhere close to what it would in the wild.  Is everyone with a dog (or house cat as you note above) participating in animal abuse?

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Yea, I wouldnt lump in zoo's with circuses and Sea World. Of course there are going to be zoos that are not as well equipped due to lack of space or whatever the reason may be.

However, zoos are vital to the conservation of some animals that are not fit to be in the wild, are endangered because of deforestation or poaching. Also gives a good platform to research animals.

[MUBurrow]

Accepted that a domesticated lifestyle is different than the lifestyle in the wild.   But why does that make a domesticated lifestyle bad?  It can be but it can change so it is not.

I certainly agree with this. The problem is that the way captivity has to change is not conducive to turning a profit in the way zoos and aquariums have historically driven attendance.  Dramatically larger enclosures and less human accessibility drive up costs while reducing public appeal. 

And to Chitown's point, I didn't mean to blanketly demonize all accredited zoos & aquariums. Some do great work, and the accessibility to animals from an early age is how many get passionate about their cause. But at the same time, a lot of the claimed benefits of breeding programs are overstated when it comes to anything below the top zoos and the most endangered species, and a vast majority of zoos simply don't have the infrastructure to provide for large or migratory animals in the way we're coming to understand is necessary.  Animals like elephants, big cats and large bears are far too common in zoos.  Their needs are so intensive that only the most well-funded and esteemed honestly have the $$ or ability to do it right.

[MU82]

Obama!

He ruined everything.

[rocket surgeon]

Obama!

He ruined everything.

that's it!! shut er down!  eh eh ehn'a?