MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: 4everwarriors on January 25, 2015, 11:43:44 AM
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I'm willin' to give Wojo time to put his own mark on our program. Doesn't really matter what the W-L record is in the short term. It is important, however, that he runs the entire basketball operation as he's been trained, as an assistant, to do. I'm certain he's formulated his plan, both on and off the court, as to how he wants to proceed.
Long term, we'll be just fine. Give him a few years to bring in his own players and carve out his identity. It's all good.
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I feel the same. There's a huge difference between last year and this, despite the similar records. You can see growth in the players and the coaches. The zone adjustment was major, and the players have adapted well. Sandy and Duane both look better as the season goes on and neither is afraid to take the big shot. Last year I kept thinking why won't they come together, this year I'm thinking how great they'll be when they do.
We will be dancing in 2016.
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Crean was 15-14 his first two years. O'Neal was 16-14(?), 11-17(?) and 16-13. McGuire was 8-18(?) and 14-12. The trouble most of you have is you think MU should be an NCAA team even though they were picked by everyone to finish 7th to 9th in Big East. In most cases those picks were made assuming Mayo would be on the team.
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Preach
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I'm willin' to give Wojo time to put his own mark on our program. Doesn't really matter what the W-L record is in the short term. It is important, however, that he runs the entire basketball operation as he's been trained, as an assistant, to do. I'm certain he's formulated his plan, both on and off the court, as to how he wants to proceed.
Long term, we'll be just fine. Give him a few years to bring in his own players and carve out his identity. It's all good.
I disagree. This man is being paid too much for mediocrity. And lest you forget: we are Marquette. We deserve nothing less than victory. How dare you, sir
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He has a ways to go to match his predecessor.
(https://iangotts.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/buzz-tramp-stamps.jpg)
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Crean was 15-14 his first two years. O'Neal was 16-14(?), 11-17(?) and 16-13. McGuire was 8-18(?) and 14-12. The trouble most of you have is you think MU should be an NCAA team even though they were picked by everyone to finish 7th to 9th in Big East. In most cases those picks were made assuming Mayo would be on the team.
Mike Deane is the standard I use for Wojo. Deane was 21-12 and 23-8 his first two years. With our recruiting class Wojo should be able to catch up .
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Mike Deane is the standard I use for Wojo. Deane was 21-12 and 23-8 his first two years. With our recruiting class Wojo should be able to catch up .
Other than Wojo's first recruiting class (which, we all know not all recruits live up to expectations), what's your thinking behind using Mike Deane as the benchmark?
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Mike Deane is pretty much the opposite of Wojo. Deane came to MU after 8 years as a mid-major head coach. He was a decent bench coach, but not a great recruiter.
Wojo has proven himself, for one year at least, to be a good recruiter, but has never been a head coach before but served for many years as an assistant on one of the top programs in the country.
I have no idea why anyone is using Deane as a standard for Wojo.
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Other than Wojo's first recruiting class (which, we all know not all recruits live up to expectations), what's your thinking behind using Mike Deane as the benchmark?
I think Deane proved across several programs that he was a good bench coach and achieved solid results here at Marquette (100-55). If Wojo can perform as well as Deane I will be very pleased. If he performs to the level of Buzz and Crean it will be icing on the cake. He has shown he can recruit , I am less sanguine about his coaching ability and his ability to work with players who have a different personality than him. I believe he has more than enough talent to win this year. Hopefully we can become the spoiler in the Big East conference tournament. Saturday was encouraging .
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I think Deane proved across several programs that he was a good bench coach and achieved solid results here at Marquette (100-55). If Wojo can perform as well as Deane I will be very pleased. If he performs to the level of Buzz and Crean it will be icing on the cake. He has shown he can recruit , I am less sanguine about his coaching ability and his ability to work with players who have a different personality than him. I believe he has more than enough talent to win this year. Hopefully we can become the spoiler in the Big East conference tournament. Saturday was encouraging .
Different personality? WTF?
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I have no idea why anyone is using Deane as a standard for Wojo.
+1.
For starters, Wojo doesn't wear those damn sunglasses.
... which reminds me, has anyone seen that user recently?
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Deane won early at MU because he inherited good players from O`Neill.After Kevin`s players were gone they sucked,because Deane could not recruit.He brought in guys like Bart Miller ,John Polonowski and Greg Clausen.
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Deane won early at MU because he inherited good players from O`Neill.After Kevin`s players were gone they sucked,because Deane could not recruit.He brought in guys like Bart Miller ,John Polonowski and Greg Clausen.
He also brought in guys like Brian Wardle who was a pretty good player.
Here is an interesting article when Deane was fired.
http://journaltimes.com/sports/cords-deserves-blame-for-mu-s-fall-not-deane/article_978a7cbe-8dcd-5251-9292-3c18fcd27cb0.html
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Different personality? WTF?
TW believes that JjJ is being mistreated/mishandled by Wojo. He thinks because Wojo is more serious and JjJ is a "goof ball" that Wojo is unjustly benching him.
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Mike Deane is the standard I use for Wojo. Deane was 21-12 and 23-8 his first two years. With our recruiting class Wojo should be able to catch up .
I have higher aspirations. You should as well.
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+1.
For starters, Wojo doesn't wear those damn sunglasses.
... which reminds me, has anyone seen that user recently?
Deane has a medical condition
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He also brought in guys like Brian Wardle who was a pretty good player.
Here is an interesting article when Deane was fired.
http://journaltimes.com/sports/cords-deserves-blame-for-mu-s-fall-not-deane/article_978a7cbe-8dcd-5251-9292-3c18fcd27cb0.html
Interesting in what way? In how it ripped the guy who hired the guy who took us to the Final Four? And then hired the guy who took us to two Sweet Sixteens and an Elite Eight? In how it (very wrongly) predicted a return to the Dukiet era?
After year two, Deane's record got progressively worse each season until he was fired. And that's what you hope for for MU hoops? I hope the opposite - that we get better each year.
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He also brought in guys like Brian Wardle who was a pretty good player.
Here is an interesting article when Deane was fired.
http://journaltimes.com/sports/cords-deserves-blame-for-mu-s-fall-not-deane/article_978a7cbe-8dcd-5251-9292-3c18fcd27cb0.html
My goodness. Are you seriously suggesting that this article was in any way accurate? Just a couple years later, everyone knows that this guy's "hot take" was horribly, horribly wrong.
I aspire for Wojo to be more than Mike Deane. Way more.
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My goodness. Are you seriously suggesting that this article was in any way accurate? Just a couple years later, everyone knows that this guy's "hot take" was horribly, horribly wrong.
I aspire for Wojo to be more than Mike Deane. Way more.
The article was just one guys opinion, which I found interesting. I have a different opinion of Cords than the author.
I sincerely hope Wojo leads us to the promised land. In the meantime if he can reach Mike Deane level it will be great. Deane won 437 college games and understands how to coach.
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Interesting in what way? In how it ripped the guy who hired the guy who took us to the Final Four? And then hired the guy who took us to two Sweet Sixteens and an Elite Eight? In how it (very wrongly) predicted a return to the Dukiet era?
After year two, Deane's record got progressively worse each season until he was fired. And that's what you hope for for MU hoops? I hope the opposite - that we get better each year.
Believe Cottingham hired Buzz. Cords not involved. Buzz obviously didn't connect well with Cords for whatever that's worth. Hopefully Cords and Lovell got it right on Wojo. My guess is he'll end up somewhere between the success of Buzz and Crean - which is ultimately acceptable/solid at a school like MU.
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Deane has a medical condition
Same one as Bono?
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I sincerely hope Wojo leads us to the promised land. In the meantime if he can reach Mike Deane level it will be great. Deane won 437 college games and understands how to coach.
Deane went 66-29, including one NCAA tournament victory, in his first three years at Marquette, relying almost exclusively on O'Neill recruits Eford, Pieper, McCaskill, Crawford, Hutchins, Miller and Abraham.
In 1997-98, when he still had the outstanding Hutchins but otherwise had to rely on his own recruits, Deane went 20-11 overall, 8-8 in the conference, and didn't get a postseason bid. In 1998-99, when he had to rely exclusively on his own recruits, he was 14-15 and deservedly got fired.
He then went to Lamar, where his brilliant game coaching led to records of 15-16, 9-18, 15-14 and 13-14 in four seasons before he got canned. He then went 95-113 at Wagner before getting the heave-ho after going 5-26 in his seventh season.
Yes, it takes some incredible Xs-and-Os ability to accumulate 5 whole victories in a program's seventh season!
You like Deane's 437 wins? Well, how do you feel about his 332 losses?
Over a 32-game season, that .576 winning percentage translates to an annual record of 18-14.
Stop embarrassing yourself by hoping any Marquette coach displays the incredible acumen of Mike Deane.
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Same one as Bono?
Yes
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Believe Cottingham hired Buzz. Cords not involved. Buzz obviously didn't connect well with Cords for whatever that's worth. Hopefully Cords and Lovell got it right on Wojo. My guess is he'll end up somewhere between the success of Buzz and Crean - which is ultimately acceptable/solid at a school like MU.
The guy has 8 scholarship players on a team that saw quite possibly the most drastic roster turnover in recent school history. Wojo hasn't even had a non-conference season with a big man. Most teams have two. We had 0. He hasn't even brought in any recruits. And we're all sitting here predicting how successful he's going to be 5+ years down the line? Jeez. Slow times on scoop it seems.
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Deane went 66-29, including one NCAA tournament victory, in his first three years at Marquette, relying almost exclusively on O'Neill recruits Eford, Pieper, McCaskill, Crawford, Hutchins, Miller and Abraham.
In 1997-98, when he still had the outstanding Hutchins but otherwise had to rely on his own recruits, Deane went 20-11 overall, 8-8 in the conference, and didn't get a postseason bid. In 1998-99, when he had to rely exclusively on his own recruits, he was 14-15 and deservedly got fired.
He then went to Lamar, where his brilliant game coaching led to records of 15-16, 9-18, 15-14 and 13-14 in four seasons before he got canned. He then went 95-113 at Wagner before getting the heave-ho after going 5-26 in his seventh season.
Yes, it takes some incredible Xs-and-Os ability to accumulate 5 whole victories in a program's seventh season!
You like Deane's 437 wins? Well, how do you feel about his 332 losses?
Over a 32-game season, that .576 winning percentage translates to an annual record of 18-14.
Stop embarrassing yourself by hoping any Marquette coach displays the incredible acumen of Mike Deane.
Wojo inherited 11 strong players , he already ran off 3 . At least Deane had the common sense to work with what he had.
If Wojo can go 100-55 with 2 NCAA and 2 NIT I will be pleased.
Deane made the tournament with 3 different programs. A journeyman coach yes for sure . Doesn't take away from the performance .
Here is a funny article on Deane .
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2013/03/15/why-matt-brady-brought-mike-deane-to-jmu/
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Wojo inherited 11 strong players , he already ran off 3 . At least Deane had the common sense to work with what he had.
If Wojo can go 100-55 with 2 NCAA and 2 NIT I will be pleased.
Deane made the tournament with 3 different programs. A journeyman coach yes for sure . Doesn't take away from the performance .
Here is a funny article on Deane .
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2013/03/15/why-matt-brady-brought-mike-deane-to-jmu/
If Deane coached today I would wager more of those players would have left.....times have changed
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How many of today's players would be able to tolerate a timeout after the first basket given up and/or getting pulled from the game when giving up a basket in what would end up being a 47-42 loss?
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Reading this thread has made me dumber. Can't believe I did it. Mike Deane? Really? We are discussing Mike Deane and camparing him to Wojo? Really?
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Wojo inherited 11 strong players , he already ran off 3 . At least Deane had the common sense to work with what he had.
If Wojo can go 100-55 with 2 NCAA and 2 NIT I will be pleased.
Deane made the tournament with 3 different programs. A journeyman coach yes for sure . Doesn't take away from the performance .
Here is a funny article on Deane .
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2013/03/15/why-matt-brady-brought-mike-deane-to-jmu/
Why don't you believe people when they tell you Wojo had no say in the Mayo situation? Do you have actual, first-hand knowledge that Wojo "ran off" Burton?
Like was mentioned in the "silver lining" thread, you keep making these assumptions, that, unless the players or Wojo told you what the interactions were like, you have little idea. You would be arguing to high-heaven if others were making the assumptions you are.
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The article was just one guys opinion, which I found interesting. I have a different opinion of Cords than the author.
I sincerely hope Wojo leads us to the promised land. In the meantime if he can reach Mike Deane level it will be great. Deane won 437 college games and understands how to coach.
It wasn't "interesting." It was flat out, 100% wrong. Mike Deane wasn't a bad coach a la Dukiet. But he certainly wasn't what I would aspire any Marquette coach to become.
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Wojo inherited 11 strong players , he already ran off 3 . At least Deane had the common sense to work with what he had.
Dear God TW. Mayo ran himself off the team. Wojo did kick him off, but he wouldn't have been able to keep him even if he had wanted to (which he didn't want to). Burton tragically lost a parent. He transferred to get away from Milwaukee because of the pain. Were there other reasons in play? Possibly. But Burton never leaves the program if his mother wasn't taken from him so soon. And Dawson? Wojo didn't run him off. Wojo didn't play him because from Saturday, November 15 to Thursday, December 18 we played exclusively in close games that were decided in the last couple minutes of the game (besides getting run over by Ohio State). You don't play the literally WORST player on your roster when the game is on the line. The kid is a hard worker and was a great representative of the program. He had to transfer to the worst team in the Big South conference to find playing time.
I don't like losing any more than the next guy. But these statements you keep making are just ridiculous.
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Deane made the tournament with 3 different programs. A journeyman coach yes for sure . Doesn't take away from the performance .
Here is a funny article on Deane .
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2013/03/15/why-matt-brady-brought-mike-deane-to-jmu/
Nice article. I liked Mike Deane personally, thought he was a stand up guy. Good coach, too. Not a bad one on one recruiter either (he was in good shape with D Wade before TC arrived). But Mike's expectations for the program were lower than the alumni and the administration and that's not a good recipe for long term success. I expect more from Wojo than Mike delivered and think you're view is a decidedly minority one.
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Yes
For real? I always thought it was just him being a d-bag. I remember the coach from the Dolphins had some condition that required him to wear tinted glasses.
And I also remember back in the day there was a player from Cincy that wore glasses when he played. As a kid I thought that was so cool, "this dude is lighting it up (pun intended) while rockin sunglasses!! SUNGLASSES!"
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And I also remember back in the day there was a player from Cincy that wore glasses when he played. As a kid I thought that was so cool, "this dude is lighting it up (pun intended) while rockin sunglasses!! SUNGLASSES!"
Ah yeah. Damon Flint.
Those were some battles with Huggy's teams. Fun times.
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Dear God TW. Mayo ran himself off the team. Wojo did kick him off, but he wouldn't have been able to keep him even if he had wanted to (which he didn't want to). Burton tragically lost a parent. He transferred to get away from Milwaukee because of the pain. Were there other reasons in play? Possibly. But Burton never leaves the program if his mother wasn't taken from him so soon. And Dawson? Wojo didn't run him off. Wojo didn't play him because from Saturday, November 15 to Thursday, December 18 we played exclusively in close games that were decided in the last couple minutes of the game (besides getting run over by Ohio State). You don't play the literally WORST player on your roster when the game is on the line. The kid is a hard worker and was a great representative of the program. He had to transfer to the worst team in the Big South conference to find playing time.
I don't like losing any more than the next guy. But these statements you keep making are just ridiculous.
Thank God Buzz didn't totally screw us last year by trusting Dawson in the Overtime win at GTown on the road. Clearly the stage and moment were WAY too big for the kid. Meanwhile the team is losing to the likes of UNO, and eeking out home win against NJIT, and even though we have an elite guard defender in Derrick - somehow Wojo is forced to change to zone defense, as our guards (primarily Derrick and Carlino) can't shut off blow by penetration. LOL. But he can't dare risk playing a kid like Dawson. Okay Wojo.
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Thank God Buzz didn't totally screw us last year by trusting Dawson in the Overtime win at GTown on the road. Clearly the stage and moment were WAY too big for the kid. Meanwhile the team is losing to the likes of UNO, and eeking out home win against NJIT, and even though we have an elite guard defender in Derrick - somehow Wojo is forced to change to zone defense, as our guards (primarily Derrick and Carlino) can't shut off blow by penetration. LOL. But he can't dare risk playing a kid like Dawson. Okay Wojo.
If you think Derrick is the reason we switched to a zone defense, you truly have no clue about the game of basketball, and apparently your years of high school basketball were wasted on you because you managed to come away from the experience without learning a damn thing about the game.
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Why don't you believe people when they tell you Wojo had no say in the Mayo situation? Do you have actual, first-hand knowledge that Wojo "ran off" Burton?
Like was mentioned in the "silver lining" thread, you keep making these assumptions, that, unless the players or Wojo told you what the interactions were like, you have little idea. You would be arguing to high-heaven if others were making the assumptions you are.
Whatever happened to Mayo was Mayo's problem. Don't believe that Wojo had no say in Mayo's outcome. He is the HC. He was probably given opportunity to say whether he wanted him or not. Obviously he chose not to. Burton, I do not believe was "run off", although probably saw his PT limited because of Wojo's style of play, and players there and coming in. Now Dawson was run off. Just like Buzz ran people off.
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I got an idea. Why don't we just move to the A10?
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Thank God Buzz didn't totally screw us last year by trusting Dawson in the Overtime win at GTown on the road. Clearly the stage and moment were WAY too big for the kid. Meanwhile the team is losing to the likes of UNO, and eeking out home win against NJIT, and even though we have an elite guard defender in Derrick - somehow Wojo is forced to change to zone defense, as our guards (primarily Derrick and Carlino) can't shut off blow by penetration. LOL. But he can't dare risk playing a kid like Dawson. Okay Wojo.
Does this mean you admit Dawson was the worst player on the roster last season? ;D
As you are a fan of saying, context matters. Dawson was one of two PGs on the roster last season, playing him was a necessary evil. This season, we have Derrick, Carlino, and Duane to play the point. He had a good game against Georgetown no doubt. But he never had a single performance even close to it ever again. I'll use another one of your favorite sayings, even a blind squirrel sometimes finds a nut. One game doesn't make a projection for a career. I guess Notre Dame should have started Rudy all four years because of those last few minutes his senior year?
Everyone not named Derrick Wilson or Juan Anderson was struggling with the man to man defense, Taylor and Carlino being the worst offenders.
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even though we have an elite guard defender in Derrick - somehow Wojo is forced to change to zone defense, as our guards (primarily Derrick and Carlino) can't shut off blow by penetration. LOL. But he can't dare risk playing a kid like Dawson. Okay Wojo.
EVERY. FRIGGIN.THREAD
Seriously Mods?