Vote for your starting PG

[bilsu]

I think Cadougan was very important to Gardner. Cadougan could drive and he often dumped off a good pass to Gardner on his drive. I have not seen Derrick do that. Cadougan was a better outside shooter, but usually we did not want him shooting the ball. By the end of the season I think their free throw percentages will be fairly similar and Derrick has made a great improvement over the 9 game period in being able to score off his drives. Derrick has less tournovers and is a better defender. Derrick needs to be able to drop passes off to Gardner or Wilson on his drives. Derrick is getting a lot of blame but he is teamed with Thomas and Anderson instead of Blue and Lockett and that is a big difference.

[humanlung]

Magic Johnson.  Go big or go home.

This is a bullsh!t thread.

[mu03eng]

I disagree completely. Look at how Derrick played on our West Coast trip. He was excellent, driving the lane, getting to and converting at the line, getting the ball to guys in position to score, and not turning the ball over. He does not make this team 4 on 5. That's the SG position.

Derrick's not great, but he's shown flashes, and as a first-year starter, there were always going to be bumps. He plays within himself and makes sure the system keeps going. He does what is required of the position. He's not a shooter but he gets the ball to the shooters. He wasn't a driver but he has become one because the team needed him to. He is a defender and a guy who makes sure you retain possession.

Wisky was a step back for him, but anyone that can't see he's much improved over last year is watching the game with blinders on (and I realize there are a lot of those out there). I have far more issue with Jake getting 26 minutes and one shot attempt in that game.

Derrick's job seems to be to play a controlled game offensively, drive the lane when it's there, not turn the ball over, and defend. He has done all that. I have much more issue with Jamil and Todd not being able to assert themselves regularly, Jake not being able to consistently hit open shots, and Gardner not able to get to the line as much or convert when he does. If they start doing their jobs, I have a feeling people would have far less issue with Derrick and how he's doing his.

jinx

[mu03eng]

Oh since we have this nonsensical poll, why isn't John Stockton an option?

[MerrittsMustache]

Oh since we have this nonsensical poll, why isn't John Stockton an option?

Stockton didn't make any 3's during his time at Gonzaga! MU's PG needs to be able to spread the floor.


(I really hope teal isn't necessary)

[WarriorFan]

Pops Sims

[mu03eng]

Stockton didn't make any 3's during his time at Gonzaga! MU's PG needs to be able to spread the floor.


(I really hope teal isn't necessary)

plus the shorts....so, yeah.

[CTWarrior]

Derrick's job seems to be to play a controlled game offensively, drive the lane when it's there, not turn the ball over, and defend. He has done all that.

That job description is the problem!  That is the job description of a 5-10 minute a game back-up PG.  A PG's primary job is to direct the offense.  He does not do that or even attempt to do that.  Jake Thomas is a 3 point shooter who can't get off a shot because the man guarding him NEVER HAS TO LEAVE HIM to double elsewhere because Derrick Wilson's man can always do that.  Cutters don't have to be guarded tightly because our PG WILL NOT pass them the ball, partially because the passing lanes aren't there because his man is sagging off of him so much and partially because he won't make a pass if there is a 3% chance it will be intercepted.  

Finally, I have always respected your opinion on basketball brew, but I really have to stop replying to your posts because I feel dirty every time I say something bad about a college kid and your defenses of Derrick Wilson drive me nuts.

[mu03eng]

I think Cadougan was very important to Gardner. Cadougan could drive and he often dumped off a good pass to Gardner on his drive. I have not seen Derrick do that. Cadougan was a better outside shooter, but usually we did not want him shooting the ball. By the end of the season I think their free throw percentages will be fairly similar and Derrick has made a great improvement over the 9 game period in being able to score off his drives. Derrick has less tournovers and is a better defender. Derrick needs to be able to drop passes off to Gardner or Wilson on his drives. Derrick is getting a lot of blame but he is teamed with Thomas and Anderson instead of Blue and Lockett and that is a big difference.

Feeding Gardner last year was just as difficult as this year, difference being we don't have a Vander to slash and score.  I don't know how many times Gardner has been in a position in the blocks early in the shot clock and no one on the team seems to have an ability or desire to feed him the ball.  I think that is part of his frustration.  Look at the Wisconsin game, at least 3 times he got the ball in the post with 6 or less seconds on the shot clock and he had to force up a shot.  That won't cut it no matter who the point guard is.

[mu03eng]

A PG's primary job is to direct the offense.  

In some offenses absolutely, in Buzz's, no

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

That job description is the problem!  That is the job description of a 5-10 minute a game back-up PG.  A PG's primary job is to direct the offense.  

That's not entirely fair.

We all like having a PG who directs the offense and scores some because it's easy to watch and it's what we are used to.

But, that doesn't mean it's required for success.

Ron Harper wasn't directing the offense for the Bulls.

Now obviously that's the NBA, and that's Mike Jordan, but you get the idea.

Having a PG who directs the offense and scores isn't necessary for a good team. It's just what we are used to watching.

[MerrittsMustache]

That job description is the problem!  That is the job description of a 5-10 minute a game back-up PG.  A PG's primary job is to direct the offense.  He does not do that or even attempt to do that.  Jake Thomas is a 3 point shooter who can't get off a shot because the man guarding him NEVER HAS TO LEAVE HIM to double elsewhere because Derrick Wilson's man can always do that.  Cutters don't have to be guarded tightly because our PG WILL NOT pass them the ball, partially because the passing lanes aren't there because his man is sagging off of him so much and partially because he won't make a pass if there is a 3% chance it will be intercepted.  

Finally, I have always respected your opinion on basketball brew, but I really have to stop replying to your posts because I feel dirty every time I say something bad about a college kid and your defenses of Derrick Wilson drive me nuts.

He's averaging more assists than Junior did last season, which must be a statistical oddity considering he doesn't even attempt to run the offense.

[brewcity77]

That job description is the problem!  That is the job description of a 5-10 minute a game back-up PG.  A PG's primary job is to direct the offense.  He does not do that or even attempt to do that.  Jake Thomas is a 3 point shooter who can't get off a shot because the man guarding him NEVER HAS TO LEAVE HIM to double elsewhere because Derrick Wilson's man can always do that.  Cutters don't have to be guarded tightly because our PG WILL NOT pass them the ball, partially because the passing lanes aren't there because his man is sagging off of him so much and partially because he won't make a pass if there is a 3% chance it will be intercepted.  

Finally, I have always respected your opinion on basketball brew, but I really have to stop replying to your posts because I feel dirty every time I say something bad about a college kid and your defenses of Derrick Wilson drive me nuts.

He's what we've got. As eng pointed out, anyone can initiate this offense. I really don't think the problem is Derrick. The problem isn't even Jake. It's the two of them together. I'd love to see Todd in there more, but he has to earn it, and I respect that. The freshmen have to show they can do the work on the defensive end. You're starting to see a bit of that with Johnson and Burton, but for every block or steal there's a missed gamble or a blow-by given up.

Had Vander come back, my guess is he would have largely split time at the point with Derrick. But he didn't. So Buzz adjusted the team to fit what players he did have, just like he did when he slowed the attack down massively in 2009-10 and just like he did when he put the priority on converting inside the arc and getting to the line last year when we couldn't hit a three as a team to save our lives. Sometimes these adjustments are painful. But it's what he has to do to make sure the team is the best they can be come March. So there are bumps along the way. Is that anything new?

All we've done is substitute the name of the underachieving whipping boy. From Buycks to Blue to Trent to Derrick. Yet one thing all of those guys had in common was success by March. Maybe I'm just more patient than the rest.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Write in vote: Tony Smith

Agree

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

Hypothetically speaking, Ners is a douche bag.

What a pathetic fan you are.

[GooooMarquette]

I disagree completely. Look at how Derrick played on our West Coast trip. He was excellent, driving the lane, getting to and converting at the line, getting the ball to guys in position to score, and not turning the ball over. He does not make this team 4 on 5. That's the SG position.

Bingo!  Derrick is far from perfect, but he is not the weakest link in the starting lineup....

[CTWarrior]

He's averaging more assists than Junior did last season, which must be a statistical oddity considering he doesn't even attempt to run the offense.

That's because of the 10 against Grambling.  Basically, 3 times a game he passes the ball to someone on the perimeter who make a quick move and scores.

[CTWarrior]

He's what we've got. As eng pointed out, anyone can initiate this offense. I really don't think the problem is Derrick. The problem isn't even Jake. It's the two of them together.

That the two of them playing offense together compounds each's shortcomings is something I totally agree with.

[Dreadman24]

Neither

[mu03eng]

That's because of the 10 against Grambling.  Basically, 3 times a game he passes the ball to someone on the perimeter who make a quick move and scores.

Ummmm, so then what offense is he not initiating?  Are we only counting alley ops and/or Gardner buckets?

[mu03eng]

That the two of them playing offense together compounds each's shortcomings is something I totally agree with.

And the 2 guard issue is both worse(impact) and more correctable than Derrick at the point.

[CTWarrior]

Ummmm, so then what offense is he not initiating?  Are we only counting alley ops and/or Gardner buckets?

I think a PG should be a threat to score, and should be able to get the ball to others on the floor in good position to do something positive.  The fact that Derrick Wilson dribbles the ball up the court on roughly 100% of our possession for 32 minutes a game and 3 times a game one of his 100 perimeter to perimeter passes is turned into a score on a jump shot or a nice move doesn't impress me all that much.

[hairy worthen]

He's what we've got. As eng pointed out, anyone can initiate this offense. I really don't think the problem is Derrick. The problem isn't even Jake. It's the two of them together. I'd love to see Todd in there more, but he has to earn it, and I respect that. The freshmen have to show they can do the work on the defensive end. You're starting to see a bit of that with Johnson and Burton, but for every block or steal there's a missed gamble or a blow-by given up.

Had Vander come back, my guess is he would have largely split time at the point with Derrick. But he didn't. So Buzz adjusted the team to fit what players he did have, just like he did when he slowed the attack down massively in 2009-10 and just like he did when he put the priority on converting inside the arc and getting to the line last year when we couldn't hit a three as a team to save our lives. Sometimes these adjustments are painful. But it's what he has to do to make sure the team is the best they can be come March. So there are bumps along the way. Is that anything new?

All we've done is substitute the name of the underachieving whipping boy. From Buycks to Blue to Trent to Derrick. Yet one thing all of those guys had in common was success by March. Maybe I'm just more patient than the rest.

You can win with a point guard like Derrick, but you can’t have a 2 guard that can’t score to go with him. That’s 2 guys on the perimeter that can’t score which allows defenses to collapse on the guys that can score.

 Jake Thomas is a nice situational player maybe to draw the defense out, but I don’t see him as a consistent scorer at this level. 

[mu03eng]

I think a PG should be a threat to score, and should be able to get the ball to others on the floor in good position to do something positive.  The fact that Derrick Wilson dribbles the ball up the court on roughly 100% of our possession for 32 minutes a game and 3 times a game one of his 100 perimeter to perimeter passes is turned into a score on a jump shot or a nice move doesn't impress me all that much.

Right, which is all well and good but that's not Buzz's offensive strategy.  His offense is set-up to allow anyone to initiate the offense and the PG becomes just another ball handler and scoring threat.  Wilson is a scoring threat as long as the 2 guard is ALSO a scoring threat.  So really with Wilson and an effective JJJ or Mayo we are 5 on 5, with Wilson and Jake we are playing 3 on 5.

[CTWarrior]

You can win with a point guard like Derrick, but you can’t have a 2 guard that can’t score to go with him. That’s 2 guys on the perimeter that can’t score which allows defenses to collapse on the guys that can score.

 Jake Thomas is a nice situational player maybe to draw the defense out, but I don’t see him as a consistent scorer at this level. 

Here's the thing.  Watch Jake Thomas' guy.  He doesn't collapse on the guys who can score all that much.  JT is neutralized by having a guy guard him everywhere he goes.  It's not that hard to do, but you still have to do it.  He does provide breathing room for the interior guys.