Embarrassing crowd

[RawdogDX]

This would have never happened if Crean was still here.

[Norm]

I haven't seen the entire student section full this season. Lower, yes, upper, not once. Maybe offer the student seats to recent grads. Between college and finally getting up the money to afford season tickets took a few years, and I imagine quite a few local grads would love the opportunity to get those seats at a discounted rate.

The upper bowl student section was filled for he Cincinnati game. I had the luxury of sitting in the Miller box that game and went and got my cousin, who is a freshman this year, to come sit with us at halftime. He was siting two rows from the top of the Bradley Center and the sections on either side of him were full too. It helps that the game was actually played on a Saturday afternoon instead of a Tues or Wed night.

[nathanziarek]

I don't understand these posts. Don't we end most years pretty high on the attendance list nationally? And don't we do that in a smaller town (27th in the country) with a smaller enrollment than other schools?

Marquette has a great and passionate fan base. What those disgusted by our turnout want is for Marquette to, really, single handedly buck the trend of live sporting event attendance.

We're already doing better than 95% of other schools. I guess we could do a little better, but asking for Marquette fans to be so completely unlike all other fans all over the country is kind of silly.

* * *

As for reducing the student section to sell more tickets: the day the stadium is full to capacity except for the student section, I'll agree. Until then, there are plenty of seats for folks to buy.

[brewcity77]

The upper bowl student section was filled for he Cincinnati game. I had the luxury of sitting in the Miller box that game and went and got my cousin, who is a freshman this year, to come sit with us at halftime. He was siting two rows from the top of the Bradley Center and the sections on either side of him were full too. It helps that the game was actually played on a Saturday afternoon instead of a Tues or Wed night.

Entirely possible. That was one of two games (Louisville the other) that I wasn't able to attend this year. I'm optimistic that we'll be full up again for Georgetown, and am actually a bit disappointed they lost to Seton Hall the other night. While I know that it's good for us in terms of getting the double-bye, I was hoping that game would be contested between two top-ten teams.

It will still be one of the three biggest games in the country on the final day, along with UNC/Duke and Louisville/Syracuse, but if we're both in the top-ten, that'd just be monstrous.

[LeftyWarrior]

While I would not go as far as saying the crowd was embarassing last night, the student section was smaller than I expected.  MU is a top ten team and there were only two home games left.  Rutgers is a not-so-sexy opponent, but I was still surprised at the relatively small number of students. 

MU has to stop saying it is the best student section in the country before tip off and then shining spot lights on thousands of empty seats.  It actually makes me laugh.

I am not blaming just the students.  The MU marketing department does not seem as aggressive as in past years.  When was the last time there was a bobblehead giveaway?  I am not suggesting bobbleheads are the answer, but only that it is an indication of how the marketing efforts have declined. 

I am excited for a great crowd against Georgetown to send Jae and DJO out in style.

[muwarrior69]

I live 20 miles from the RAC where Rutgers play their games. They would die for half that attendance at a game.

[Golden Avalanche]

I don't understand these posts. Don't we end most years pretty high on the attendance list nationally? And don't we do that in a smaller town (27th in the country) with a smaller enrollment than other schools?

Marquette has a great and passionate fan base. What those disgusted by our turnout want is for Marquette to, really, single handedly buck the trend of live sporting event attendance.

We're already doing better than 95% of other schools. I guess we could do a little better, but asking for Marquette fans to be so completely unlike all other fans all over the country is kind of silly.

* * *

As for reducing the student section to sell more tickets: the day the stadium is full to capacity except for the student section, I'll agree. Until then, there are plenty of seats for folks to buy.

Marquette does that because of the number of tickets sold; not the number of actual people who show up.

The part that strikes me funny still, and has for the last two to three seasons, it certainly seems MU is selling tickets to these games, and that being the case, why would people who've already spent their money on a ticket then waste that money by not showing up?

[jsglow]

With the 'late arrivers', the students filled the lower bowl with the exception of the seats behind the band.  There were some in the upper deck.

One of the challenges MU has is that tickets are rarely scarce.  Obviously the big Saturday games are packed at it is entirely possible that Georgetown will be an all time record crowd.  But a Tuesday or Wednesday evening is generally going to draw 14,000+ in this economic climate.  And again, it was way worse 10-15 years ago.  MU does quite well.

The interesting numbers are the total of season tickets sold each year.

[The Lens]

If you watch a Georgetown or Nova game (and definitely St John's @ MSG) they have similar "issues".  NBA arenas are a blessing and a curse.  On March 3rd it will be a blessing.

[Norm]

If you watch a Georgetown or Nova game (and definitely St John's @ MSG) they have similar "issues".  NBA arenas are a blessing and a curse.  On March 3rd it will be a blessing.

Yep. Georgetown rarely has many peopel in the upper bowl (save for when Syracuse comes to DC), and their student sections are just the immediate sections behind both baskets. Granted, they have to haul across town to play in the Verizon Center, but Marquette games generally have a better crowd and atmosphere than Georgetown games.

[BrewCity83]

I live 20 miles from the RAC where Rutgers play their games. They would die for half that attendance at a game.

Rutgers doesn't have a top-10 team, but they have an enrollment of over 50,000.

[MerrittsMustache]

I haven't read through this whole thread so I apologize if someone else mentioned this.

Marquette having a very good team has become the norm. Students are used to MU being good so when they play a team that isn't a big name, it's not a big deal. Similarly, for the first 3 basketball seasons I was a student at MU (98-99 thru 00-01), the big draw was the opponent. If MU was playing a highly ranked team, the student section would be packed. If not, you could show up at tipoff and sit in the first 10 rows. When MU had Wade, it was an exciting event to go to MU games because they were actually that highly-ranked team worth seeing. The current students don't remember MU being anything more than a perennial NCAA Tournament team so, much like the norm to students around my age was an NIT team who was only worth watching when they played a big-time opponent, the norm to students today is a perennially ranked team who isn't worth watching if they're going to blow out a conference bottom-dweller.

We look at it and say, "How could the students not want to come see a Marquette team that's this good?!" while the students say, "Marquette is always good. Why would we want to go see them beat up Rutgers?"

For better or worse, that's how it goes. Personally, I'd much rather have it the way it is now than the way it was 10-12 years ago.

[Spotcheck Billy]

Who cares if they call it the best student section in the country and posters here disagree? Only the people in attendence hear that anyway, it never goes out on a broadcast.

What has bothered me all season is whoever runs the scoreboard is terrible at updating player substitutions! Every game I've been at so far has seen players subbing in but often when you look up to see who player 55 that just scored/blocked a shot/fouled etc. is for the visiting team they aren't even listed on the scoreboard even if they've been on the floor 5 minutes. I don't recall ever noticing this happen in previous seasons.

[RyanConroy]

I haven't seen the entire student section full this season. Lower, yes, upper, not once. Maybe offer the student seats to recent grads. Between college and finally getting up the money to afford season tickets took a few years, and I imagine quite a few local grads would love the opportunity to get those seats at a discounted rate.

Then you should get your eyes checked, it was full to the rafters versus Cincinnati. I said this at the time, too. Students had their backs against the upper deck wall that Saturday.

Everybody points fingers at the students and wants to sell parts of the student section to other fans. Well, considering the rest of the Bradley Center's attendance was as weak as the student's, I don't think that makes much sense.

EDIT: Didn't see this had been settled on the third page.

[Skatastrophy]

Then you should get your eyes checked, it was full to the rafters versus Cincinnati. I said this at the time, too. Students had their backs against the upper deck wall that Saturday.

Everybody points fingers at the students and wants to sell parts of the student section to other fans. Well, considering the rest of the Bradley Center's attendance was as weak as the student's, I don't think that makes much sense.

The rest of the BC was pretty packed.  Upper deck was probably 75% full.

The students didn't bother to show up.

[RyanConroy]

The rest of the BC was pretty packed.  Upper deck was probably 75% full.

The students didn't bother to show up.

You are absolutely incorrect. Not sure what you were looking at, but the student section was 100% full. Do you guys scan the audience with 20 minutes until tip and then never look up again or something?

[jmayer1]

Marquette does that because of the number of tickets sold; not the number of actual people who show up.

That's how everybody reports attendance numbers so your point, or lack thereof, is moot.

[Skatastrophy]

You are absolutely incorrect. Not sure what you were looking at, but the student section was 100% full. Do you guys scan the audience with 20 minutes until tip and then never look up again or something?

Last night.  I don't really care about your wayback machine.

[Hoopaloop]

No wonder we didn't make this list.   http://www.facebook.com/ilovecollegehoops?sk=app_148595948584796

i can't stand the jerks who can't get to their seat for the start of the game/2nd half.  don't worry, we'll all get blocked out from watching the game while you take your sweet @ss time, waving to people who really don't care to see you, checking your cell phone, and finally making your way through your isle was everyone has to stand to let you through.  wish they would block people at the entrance until a dead ball. 

+1   At Blackhawks games they hold the patrons back until stoppage on the ice, then you can go to your seats.

MU undergrad is 8,000  Student section of the lower bowl seats 2,000.  Total size of the student section is 3,600.  If the lower bowl is full, that is 25% of the undergrad population.  I wrote this already.  

So, let's compare this to what many think is the best student section in the country.  They have 6,000 undergrads and play in an arena on campus.  They also get to sit between the end lines, not behind the basket.

So yes, MU is the best student section in the country.  Try going to going to weekday night games against bottom feeders at other schools and tell me who is better.

Why are you only looking at undergraduate population.  MU is not close to the best student section in the country.  Not close.  At times we are very good, but this year has been disappointing for all the reasons mentioned.  We aren't a top 10 team very often and not predicted to be this year.  The team is playing great.  The Duke example you give is different in a number of ways.  They truly are this good every year so they have a built in factor that there is nothing new.  Michigan's student attendance this year has been extremely impressive.  MSU's is always great.  

The top student section in the country doesn't care about day of the week or who the opponent is.  They go to see their team, all other factors be damned.  Tickets are cheap.  It's a 1 mile walk to the BC or take a shuttle.  

This would have never happened if Crean was still here.

Difficult to say, but part of the disappointment is that it happened far less frequently in the past then it is today, despite a really good team. There is a disconnect somewhere with the students and the athletic \ basketball department.  I don't know if it is apathy or lack of trying by the marketing guys.  Wish we could get it fixed as the students play an important role.

I don't understand these posts. Don't we end most years pretty high on the attendance list nationally? And don't we do that in a smaller town (27th in the country) with a smaller enrollment than other schools?

Yes we do.  There is also the listed number or attendance and the people that show up in the stands to cheer, which are often two different things.  Some of the frustration people are venting is the latter, not the former.

I live 20 miles from the RAC where Rutgers play their games. They would die for half that attendance at a game.

Marquette is not Rutgers.  We're a top 10 team.  I'm sure Illinois State and Bethune Cookman would die for our attendance.  

[Niv Berkowitz]

I haven't read through this whole thread so I apologize if someone else mentioned this.

Marquette having a very good team has become the norm. Students are used to MU being good so when they play a team that isn't a big name, it's not a big deal. Similarly, for the first 3 basketball seasons I was a student at MU (98-99 thru 00-01), the big draw was the opponent. If MU was playing a highly ranked team, the student section would be packed. If not, you could show up at tipoff and sit in the first 10 rows. When MU had Wade, it was an exciting event to go to MU games because they were actually that highly-ranked team worth seeing. The current students don't remember MU being anything more than a perennial NCAA Tournament team so, much like the norm to students around my age was an NIT team who was only worth watching when they played a big-time opponent, the norm to students today is a perennially ranked team who isn't worth watching if they're going to blow out a conference bottom-dweller.

We look at it and say, "How could the students not want to come see a Marquette team that's this good?!" while the students say, "Marquette is always good. Why would we want to go see them beat up Rutgers?"

For better or worse, that's how it goes. Personally, I'd much rather have it the way it is now than the way it was 10-12 years ago.

As someone who used to bash the students all the time, it's not all their fault. They, like casual MU fans, become complacent with success. That's not a knock, it's just human nature. Call it spoiled or whatever you want. But when you are an underdog team and don't have high expectations placed on you and you are successful the crowd/fans get more rowdy (see year one of James/Matthews/McNeal or the season following their departure). There was a buzz about the team because they were the scrappy underdog. This year that's not the case.

Like Merritt says, students and most MU fans expect them to beat Rutgers. So, why pay money to go see MU beat a crappy Rutgers team on a weeknight? It might suck but that's life.

And I know it's been mentioned, but if MU played in an arena that sat 12,000 - 15,000, every game would be packed. Playing in the BC has its plusses and minuses. Drawing 15,000 to a weeknight game doesn't seem like a big deal when it seems so cavernous in there and the place seats 19,000.

At this point...what r ya gonna do? Even if the student section is packed in the lower bowl and they are cheering, you don't really hear them much or at least they don't drive the crowd noise as much in such a huge arena.

[Golden Avalanche]

That's how everybody reports attendance numbers so your point, or lack thereof, is moot.

No crap.

And, that wasn't my point.

[The Equalizer]

There is a good direct comparision we can make, that holds most of the variable constant. We played Rutgers at home two years ago in a mid-week game while students were in session.  

Between 2010 and last night, there was a decline of nearly 2,000 fans, or 11.8%

2010 (last time Rutgers was in town):
RU Record:  9-10, 0-8 in conference
MU Record:  Unranked, 12-8 overall, 3-5 in conference (first home game after road losses to DePaul, SU)
Game date:  Tuesday, January 26
Attendance:  16,793

2012:
Record:  12-16, 4-11 in conference
MU Record:  Ranked #10, 22-5, 12-3 in conference (10-1 record in last 10 games)
Game Date:  Wednesday February 22
Attendance:  14,807


Its not our coach is (Buzz for both games)
Its not the opponent (Rutgers for both games)
Its not due to a weekday game (mid-week for both games)
It's not due to the quality of the opponent (Rutgers sucked both games)
It's not due to student break (classes in session both games)
It's not due to the weather (no storms yesterday--maybe in 2010, but that would reduce att. for 2010)
It's not due to disappointment in MU's season to date (we're much better than 2010)
Its not the economy (Unemployment has improved since 2010)

I guess that leaves the argument that Tuesday games draw better than Wednesday.

Either that, or Rutgers coach (and former MU assistant) Fred Hill is a much bigger draw than current Rutgers coach (and former MU assistant Mike Rice)

I don't know what the answer is to the decline in attendance--but I don't think it can't easily be dismissed with any of the usual explanations.

[🏀]

MU undergrad is 8,000  Student section of the lower bowl seats 2,000.  Total size of the student section is 3,600.  If the lower bowl is full, that is 25% of the undergrad population.  I wrote this already.  

So, let's compare this to what many think is the best student section in the country.  They have 6,000 undergrads and play in an arena on campus.  They also get to sit between the end lines, not behind the basket.

So yes, MU is the best student section in the country.  Try going to going to weekday night games against bottom feeders at other schools and tell me who is better.

Bahahahaha! No one on this board thinks they're the best. Students weren't the best when I was there, before I was there or since I left. Even though it's an opinion, there's no way you can sell that to yourself.

You're numbers are little hazy. I know the majority of statistics are made up, but just doing an eye test if the student section is 3,600 seats, then the lower bowl doesn't hold over half of the capacity.

If you want some actual numbers, here we go.

Marquette has 11,599 students that can buy students tickets, not just the 8,000 undergrad that you posted.

The total size of the student section is not 3,600 seats, but 4,100 seats. The lower bowl, not including the band is approximately 1,100.

I'm sure we've gone over these numbers before.

Anyway, it's not too much to expect 9.5% of the available body of students to show up and fill the lower bowl for Rutgers. It wasn't an issue for lesser opponents this season, and hasn't been an issue for even lesser conference foes after the Final Four dark days. Filling the lower bowl should be the standard for every game, except maybe an exhibition.

[MerrittsMustache]

There is a good direct comparision we can make, that holds most of the variable constant. We played Rutgers at home two years ago in a mid-week game while students were in session.  

Between 2010 and last night, there was a decline of nearly 2,000 fans, or 11.8%

2010 (last time Rutgers was in town):
RU Record:  9-10, 0-8 in conference
MU Record:  Unranked, 12-8 overall, 3-5 in conference (first home game after road losses to DePaul, SU)
Game date:  Tuesday, January 26
Attendance:  16,793

2012:
Record:  12-16, 4-11 in conference
MU Record:  Ranked #10, 22-5, 12-3 in conference (10-1 record in last 10 games)
Game Date:  Wednesday February 22
Attendance:  14,807


Its not our coach is (Buzz for both games)
Its not the opponent (Rutgers for both games)
Its not due to a weekday game (mid-week for both games)
It's not due to the quality of the opponent (Rutgers sucked both games)
It's not due to student break (classes in session both games)
It's not due to the weather (no storms yesterday--maybe in 2010, but that would reduce att. for 2010)
It's not due to disappointment in MU's season to date (we're much better than 2010)
Its not the economy (Unemployment has improved since 2010)

I guess that leaves the argument that Tuesday games draw better than Wednesday.

Either that, or Rutgers coach (and former MU assistant) Fred Hill is a much bigger draw than current Rutgers coach (and former MU assistant Mike Rice)

I don't know what the answer is to the decline in attendance--but I don't think it can't easily be dismissed with any of the usual explanations.

Have ticket prices gone up significantly since 2010?

[brewcity77]

Then you should get your eyes checked, it was full to the rafters versus Cincinnati. I said this at the time, too. Students had their backs against the upper deck wall that Saturday.

EDIT: Didn't see this had been settled on the third page.

Guessing you saw that I wasn't there for Cincy