Finish the job, Bud

[DegenerateDish]

I give Rodgers kudos for addressing this today.

[4everwarriors]

Hope he's clean or the crap's gonna ooze outta all his orifices, hey?

[wadesworld]

If Rodgers owes that guy his salary, Braun owes the world his life.

Anything less than a lifetime ban is lenient. This is damaging to the game along the lines of Pete Rose, if not moreso because baseball is a game of hallowed numbers more than any other. Braun, like Bonds, Palmiero, McGwire, and Sosa before him are spitting on the actions and memories of all the men that came before them. They are spitting on the integrity of the game. Baseball won't ban him like they will A-Rod, but they should because that is the only true deterrent that will truly compel future players not to follow suit.

As they won't suspend him, what they should do is mandate that anyone with a positive test has their contract amended to pay them the league minimum. That way it doesn't penalize the team and also doesn't let the player get rewarded by having a contract voided but being able to sign with a new team for more money. Lifetime ban or league minimum. Of course, we'll see neither.

Talk about overreaction.  Half of professional baseball would be forever out of baseball if you had it your way.  Unfortunately it's part of the game.  The only difference between Braun and the large majority of the elite players in baseball (at least hitters) is that Braun got caught and lied about it.  Should Braun have used PEDs?  No.  Am I proud of him for using them?  No.  Am I shocked?  No.  (In fact I would've been more surprised if he had never used PEDs at some point in his life than if he had.  But I will say I was surprised at the timing of him testing positive.)  Do I think he's one of a HUGE number of players in professional baseball who has, at some point, used PEDs?  Absolutely.  If you and everyone else here who are talking about banning players who use PEDs and making them repay all of their earnings think their favorite teams are free of PED use...well, I guess ignorance is bliss.

And give the MVP Award to Kemp and saying Kemp deserves it?  I would bet my salary   that Kemp has used PEDs at some point in his life.  No doubt in my mind.  In fact, since the turn of the century the only MVP winners that I feel like MAY be clean would be Posey, Verlander, Pedroia, Rollins, and Ichiro.  That's 5 awards out of 24 (obviously there were repeat winners in there).  The other 19 I would be well beyond shocked if those players were clean.

I give Rodgers kudos for addressing this today.

I respect your football opinion more than anyone else on this forum (not saying much though, but I really do respect yours), but I'm not sure why Rodgers's tweet was a big deal at all.  He stood up for a friend who used PEDs but obviously told him he didn't use them.  If it was a murder case, rape case, something where somebody was seriously effected then I could understand where that may be better left alone.  But an athlete using PEDs?  I understand there are health risks, but this is an absolute non-story to me.  If this is the worst thing Aaron Rodgers has done in his lifetime, we should put him up for Sainthood now.

[🏀]

I respect your football opinion more than anyone else on this forum (not saying much though, but I really do respect yours), but I'm not sure why Rodgers's tweet was a big deal at all.  He stood up for a friend who used PEDs but obviously told him he didn't use them.  If it was a murder case, rape case, something where somebody was seriously effected then I could understand where that may be better left alone.  But an athlete using PEDs?  I understand there are health risks, but this is an absolute non-story to me.  If this is the worst thing Aaron Rodgers has done in his lifetime, we should put him up for Sainthood now.

I didn't think it was a big deal for Rodgers' either, but a lot of people did. He did defend Braun to the highest extent possible. He said what needed to be said and handled it well. Rodgers' came out well.

[DegenerateDish]

Thanks Wadesworld, that was kind of you.

The thing that bugged me about Rodgers tweets were that they were out of character for Rodgers and just flat out dumb. And I love watching Rodgers play, for what it's worth, Jennings comments today annoyed me. If Jennings thought that stuff, he should have said it while in GB.

Anyway, Braun got off on a technicality the first time around. I'm all for having your buddy's back, all for it. It was the level to witch Rodgers took it made no sense. For a guy who doesn't take too many stances (nothing wrong with that at all, I don't blame him), it was out of character and over the top. It made no sense to me to support some one that strongly when he got off on a legal loophole.

100% agree Rodgers did nothing really wrong, clearly he didn't. I give him a lot of credit for his comments today, he could have backed away from it or hid behind "no comment".

Look forward to some 2013-14 football talk. Pay attention to camps and preseason games, they can tell you a lot about teams and individual players, even though those games might seem meaningless.

[ChicosBailBonds]

As they won't suspend him, what they should do is mandate that anyone with a positive test has their contract amended to pay them the league minimum. That way it doesn't penalize the team and also doesn't let the player get rewarded by having a contract voided but being able to sign with a new team for more money. Lifetime ban or league minimum. Of course, we'll see neither.

I'd go a different way.  A player caught, for every win his team had that win is taken away.  It becomes a forfeit.  Some players are now advocating this as well.  Love the idea.  Now it brings it massive peer pressure from the teammates to police their own so that one ahole doesn't ruin it for the other 24 guys.

[wadesworld]

I'd go a different way.  A player caught, for every win his team had that win is taken away.  It becomes a forfeit.  Some players are now advocating this as well.  Love the idea.  Now it brings it massive peer pressure from the teammates to police their own so that one ahole doesn't ruin it for the other 24 guys.

Would you start with a clean slate in the 2014 season and say anyone caught from this point on...or would you go back since the "steroid era" began? Because if you're going back I suppose you can't prove every team has/had at least 1 (many) guy who has used a PED, you'd really have to just whipe out the last 15-20 seasons.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Would you start with a clean slate in the 2014 season and say anyone caught from this point on...or would you go back since the "steroid era" began? Because if you're going back I suppose you can't prove every team has/had at least 1 (many) guy who has used a PED, you'd really have to just whipe out the last 15-20 seasons.

Yes, clean slate

[wadesworld]

Yes, clean slate

Gotcha.  That'd be interesting.  I'd be interested to know how often players get tested.  I feel like if you do something like that or make players pay back their salaries, you can't do drug tests randomly.  Even as it is I still don't think it should be "random."

[forgetful]

Gotcha.  That'd be interesting.  I'd be interested to know how often players get tested.  I feel like if you do something like that or make players pay back their salaries, you can't do drug tests randomly.  Even as it is I still don't think it should be "random."

Random or not, they are all juicing.  To test positive for steroid use your testosterone to epitestosterone level has to be greater than 4:1 (normal is 1:1), this is due to natural variances (spikes).  Almost all players are boosting their natural level from 1:1 to closer to 3:1 to provide minor gains...there are a variety of ways to achieve this without testing positive.

Further, athletes take test/epi mixtures to boost the overall testosterone levels while maintaining a 1:1 ratio, thereby avoiding a positive test, but still getting the gains.  The way around this is to do isotope testing, which is not done in professional sports unless an initial test exceeds the 4:1 ratio.  The reason the more expensive isotope test won't be put in place....people are cheating and who wants to see baseball without the homeruns.

Getting all up in arms over Braun is ridiculous, as he is doing what everyone else is doing to be able to make it to the league.  He didn't even get caught, and never admitted to doping.  He just said mistakes were made and his lawyers advised him to just take the suspension.  Still not an admittance of guilt.  Is he doping...yes they all are.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Random or not, they are all juicing.  To test positive for steroid use your testosterone to epitestosterone level has to be greater than 4:1 (normal is 1:1), this is due to natural variances (spikes).  Almost all players are boosting their natural level from 1:1 to closer to 3:1 to provide minor gains...there are a variety of ways to achieve this without testing positive.

Further, athletes take test/epi mixtures to boost the overall testosterone levels while maintaining a 1:1 ratio, thereby avoiding a positive test, but still getting the gains.  The way around this is to do isotope testing, which is not done in professional sports unless an initial test exceeds the 4:1 ratio.  The reason the more expensive isotope test won't be put in place....people are cheating and who wants to see baseball without the homeruns.

Getting all up in arms over Braun is ridiculous, as he is doing what everyone else is doing to be able to make it to the league.  He didn't even get caught, and never admitted to doping.  He just said mistakes were made and his lawyers advised him to just take the suspension.  Still not an admittance of guilt.  Is he doping...yes they all are.

No, not all of them are.  There are literally guys that won't take a thing...not amino acids, nothing.  There are certainly guys like you mention, but you are painting way too broad a brush. 

[Hards Alumni]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-league-stew/jack-clark-accuses-albert-pujols-justin-verlander-ped-171518294.html

[wadesworld]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-league-stew/jack-clark-accuses-albert-pujols-justin-verlander-ped-171518294.html

I recall hearing "I would bet my life on it" coming up in another denial of PED use in the MLB...