HBO Real Sports/Marist Poll About Concussions In Football

[Tugg Speedman]

http://maristpoll.marist.edu/wp-content/misc/usapolls/us130715/HBO%20Real%20Sports/Complete%20October%202013%20USA%20HBO%20Real%20Sports_Marist%20Poll%20Release%20and%20Tables.pdf

Roughly one in three Americans said they're less likely to allow their children to play football due to what they know about football-related head injuries and long-term brain damage, according to a poll released on Wednesday.

For the HBO Real Sports/Marist poll, 1,204 adults were surveyed by telephone about their views on the potential safety risks involved with youth football. Thirty-nine percent of the survey respondents had children under the age of 18, including 23 percent with a son 18 years or younger. Nineteen percent had a child who had been seriously injured while playing a team sport.

When asked about their level of knowledge regarding "the connection between concussions from playing football and long-term brain injury," 55 percent of the respondents said they knew "a good amount" or "a great deal," with an additional 31 percent saying they knew "a little." Only 14 percent knew "nothing at all," which should encourage youth-safety advocates preaching the importance of educating the public about sports-related concussions.

According to the survey, 13 percent of U.S. adults wouldn't let their sons participate in football, while 85 percent would. (The remaining 2 percent are unsure.) This varied based upon region, with adults in the Northeast least likely to allow their sons play football (81 percent would allow it; 18 percent wouldn't) and adults in the South the most likely (86 percent would, 12 percent wouldn't).

Thirty-three percent of adults said that the information coming out about the link between concussions and long-term brain damage made them less likely to allow their sons to play football. Once more, adults in the Northeast and West were more swayed by such information (38 percent and 37 percent, respectively, were less likely to allow their sons to play) than those in the South and Midwest (31 percent and 30 percent, respectively).

For 16 percent of Americans, the risk of long-term brain injury would be the deciding factor in whether or not to allow their son to play football, according to the survey. Fifty-six percent of adults said it would be one of the factors that influenced their decision, while the remaining 28 percent said it would play no role in their decision.

Additionally, roughly one in five adults said the risk of injury is too high to allow boys to play football, the survey found.

"What will be interesting to watch is if other sports begin to recruit those kids whose parents keep them from football," said Dr. Keith Strudler, the director of the Marist College Center for Sports Communication, in the survey. "Football's loss could be the inevitable gain of lacrosse, baseball, or even soccer."

ESPN's Henry Abbott touched upon that possibility on  Wednesday in the TrueHoop blog.

    "Basically, the biggest force in the history of sports business—the NFL—has had a kind of 'black swan' event—a permanent change nobody could have seen coming. There's a fracture, suddenly, between football, its players and its fans. The numbers are coming in, and you have to wonder if the coming decades really will bring radical reformation of the sports landscape."

At the high school level, there hasn't yet been a massive decline in the number of boys playing football.

A total of 1,086,627 boys participated in high school football during the 2012-13 school year, according to the latest annual High School Sports Participation survey from the National Federation of State High School Associations, compared to 1,095,993 boys during the prior school year.  That's a decline of fewer than 10,000 student-athletes, or less than 1 percent of the total high-school-football-playing population.

As more information spills into the public consciousness, however, it's worth keeping an eye on these youth-football participation figures to see if any major trends emerge in the coming years.

[ChicosBailBonds]

NFL is about to cut a new deal for an 8 game package that will blow you away.  That and the Sunday Ticket deal will likely be done in the next few months that will also add lots of $$$ to the coffers.  Ratings are very good, stadiums filled, people desiring it more than ever.

In one sense, I'm glad this stuff is happening now so we can stop with the BS and players can stop pretending they didn't know there was risk involved.  Give me a break.

I say the lawyers go after basketball next, then soccer, baseball, etc. 

[brandx]

NFL is about to cut a new deal for an 8 game package that will blow you away.  That and the Sunday Ticket deal will likely be done in the next few months that will also add lots of $$$ to the coffers.  Ratings are very good, stadiums filled, people desiring it more than ever.

In one sense, I'm glad this stuff is happening now so we can stop with the BS and players can stop pretending they didn't know there was risk involved.  Give me a break.

I say the lawyers go after basketball next, then soccer, baseball, etc. 

You've finally matched Willie Warrior as a one-trick pony.

Just as we don't need to hear Willie's opinions anymore on recruiting bigs, your opinion on any issue involving the "rich and powerful" vs. those lower on the economic ladder is unnecessary. The issue is always irrelevant - you will always shill for the side with the power and money.

To say that all players knew the brain damage risks involved is ludicrous. Nobody was talking about this until just a few years ago. The risks that players worried about were knee problems, weight issues, etc.

Furthermore, just as there are science deniers and climate change deniers, there continue to be the risk deniers among owners and coaches at all levels. I'm sure it's not that they are putting their own monetary interests over reality.

For you to casually disregard this issue is disgusting. But the first paragraph of your post explains your opinion entirely.

[keefe]

To say that all players knew the brain damage risks involved is ludicrous. Nobody was talking about this until just a few years ago. The risks that players worried about were knee problems, weight issues, etc.

This is Bullsh1t. Our son played DI football and awareness of concussions has been known and monitored for 20 years. Our son suffered a concussion in a game but it only manifested itself one quarter later when he became unintelligible in the huddle; he had played 3 series before showing any symptoms. Given the subsequent diagnosis he did not suit up for practice or games for 3 weeks. Pac X schools have actively addressed concussions for 20 years.

[ChicosBailBonds]

This is Bullsh1t. Our son played DI football and awareness of concussions has been known and monitored for 20 years. Our son suffered a concussion in a game but it only manifested itself one quarter later when he became unintelligible in the huddle; he had played 3 series before showing any symptoms. Given the subsequent diagnosis he did not suit up for practice or games for 3 weeks. Pac X schools have actively addressed concussions for 20 years.

Exactly right, but some people always have to have someone to blame.  It's always some big corporation, or big evil multinational, or whatever, that is to blame.  My God, I played 25+ years ago I remember our helmets having a sticker on them and saying football is dangerous and you can risk head, neck, etc, injuries.  We signed waivers, we had to go through a packet of information our parents had to sign on all the potential injuries.  That was 25+ years ago.  What do people think, a sport that requires pads on the legs, hips, butt, shoulders and a helmet is there to make you look good?  It's a FULL CONTACT sport.  There are risks.

It's amazing we just don't put people surrounded by pillows and everyone telecommutes....that is before these same people sue the companies for hardened arteries for sitting in their homes too much or claiming they got cancer from staring at the monitor too long.  Good grief.  Bunch of Sallies.

Brandx, if you are consistent, you would claim these organizations should go after basketball.  Soccer.  Hockey.  etc.  Why aren't you being consistent?

[tower912]

I blame......you two for hijacking every bleeping thread.   Ignore for both.   

[Silkk the Shaka]

Brandx, if you are consistent, you would claim these organizations should go after basketball.  Soccer.  Hockey.  etc.  Why aren't you being consistent?

What does basketball have to do with brain damage? What would people be "going after?" Couldn't be less relevant to the discussion.

[4everwarriors]

I'd say Crean was perpetually concussed.

[hairy worthen]

I'd say Crean was perpetually concussed.

Crean. Never concussed. Having a brain is a prerequisite.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Keefe, thanks for your real life story here about concussions and football....the actual topic of the thread.  I didn't realize my comments or your comments about the risks of concussion were hijacking a thread.  Go figure.

Keep sharing Keefe.

[Pakuni]

It's amazing we just don't put people surrounded by pillows and everyone telecommutes....that is before these same people sue the companies for hardened arteries for sitting in their homes too much or claiming they got cancer from staring at the monitor too long.  Good grief.  Bunch of Sallies.

Surely if we allow the legal system to play out, we'll soon be surrounded by pillows and the only legal sport will be chess!!!!!
Because everything is a slippery slope!!!!!


Edit: Oh, and those of you claiming we've known about football and brain injuries for "25 years" are clearly and provably wrong. Our knowledge of the long-term effects of football on the brain (CTE, ALS, Alzheimer's) is relatively new, and evolving, science. Yes, everybody knew 25 years ago that playing football could lead to injury. Nobody knew 25 years ago that those injuries could leave players suicidal, depressed, addled and with the mental functioning of an 85 year old man when they're in their later 40s and 50s.

[hairy worthen]

Good grief.  Bunch of Sallies.

I prefer "nancys"

[brandx]

Keefe, thanks for your real life story here about concussions and football....the actual topic of the thread.  I didn't realize my comments or your comments about the risks of concussion were hijacking a thread.  Go figure.

Keep sharing Keefe.

Every Keefe post is a "real life" story. Considering he does nothing but talk about himself and his exploits, how could it be anything else?

Narcissism in action 

[Silkk the Shaka]

Surely if we allow the legal system to play out, we'll soon be surrounded by pillows and the only legal sport will be chess!!!!!
Because everything is a slippery slope!!!!!


Edit: Oh, and those of you claiming we've known about football and brain injuries for "25 years" are clearly and provably wrong. Our knowledge of the long-term effects of football on the brain (CTE, ALS, Alzheimer's) is relatively new, and evolving, science. Yes, everybody knew 25 years ago that playing football could lead to injury. Nobody knew 25 years ago that those injuries could leave players suicidal, depressed, addled and with the mental functioning of an 85 year old man when they're in their later 40s and 50s.

Precisely.

[keefe]

Every Keefe post is a "real life" story. Considering he does nothing but talk about himself and his exploits, how could it be anything else?

Narcissism in action 

Wait a minute, I thought I just looked up trivia on Wiki then repeated it here. Now I just talk about myself. The reality is some lives are just more rich with experience.

There is an irony in "Brand X" that was likely unintended and yet captures the quiet desperation rather well. 

[77ncaachamps]

I don't know if this was posted before, but Frontline did an hour long documentary on concussions that aired two weeks ago.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/league-of-denial/

Explores the book that came out; how the NFL tried to cover it up, got exposed and became "proactive"; older players who are talking about their lives after the game; and most recent deaths related to possible concussions.

[brandx]

Wait a minute, I thought I just looked up trivia on Wiki then repeated it here. Now I just talk about myself. The reality is some lives are just more rich with experience.

There is an irony in "Brand X" that was likely unintended and yet captures the quiet desperation rather well. 

That's what I was talking about. Very well written post by an intelligent guy.
 
And you were able to do it without relating it to an experience of yours.

[Tugg Speedman]

Keefe/CBB

I agree with you about football and concussions.  But it does not matter.

The long-knives are out for Football and they will not stop until they turn it into boxing (a sport that used to be far and away the most popular in the country and is not a minor sport because of its brutality.).  I've argued that in 10 to 15 years football will be as popular as the MLB while on its way to boxing.  I see no reason to change that view.

Think taobacco lawsuits.  Those took decades and they were relentless until they hallowed out that industry.  Same thing is happening with football.  When they are done with the NFL, the lawsuits will turn to the NCAA and high school until they are gutted.

Years from now we'll look at the TV contract CBB noted above as the high water mark of Football's popularity.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Surely if we allow the legal system to play out, we'll soon be surrounded by pillows and the only legal sport will be chess!!!!!
Because everything is a slippery slope!!!!!


Edit: Oh, and those of you claiming we've known about football and brain injuries for "25 years" are clearly and provably wrong. Our knowledge of the long-term effects of football on the brain (CTE, ALS, Alzheimer's) is relatively new, and evolving, science. Yes, everybody knew 25 years ago that playing football could lead to injury. Nobody knew 25 years ago that those injuries could leave players suicidal, depressed, addled and with the mental functioning of an 85 year old man when they're in their later 40s and 50s.

Why don't you read what I said.  I said 25+ years ago my helmet had a sticker on it saying football was dangerous and could cause neck and head injuries.  I didn't say anything about the more advanced diagnosis of today, but it nevertheless had those warnings.  We signed waivers, we had to take an education seminar on the risks.  This was 25 years ago.  There were risks known, even then.  Guess what, people still chose to play.  

I'm all for giving people the information, it is how it should be.  But please stop with the nonsense that people didn't know football is a dangerous sport.  It is embarrassing to read that argument...completely embarrassing.  Football has been a violent game with injurious risks since day one.  The game was almost banned in the early 1900's due to a string
of deaths.  

When I hear people say that they didn't know football was dangerous it makes my head spin.  What planet have they been on?  And for those demanding some kind of renumeration, I ask where is the consistency?  It is nowhere...of course.  Medicine tells is sports injuries lead to arthritis among other things....why aren't people demanding payment and damages for those injuries?

[Tugg Speedman]

Why don't you read what I said.  I said 25+ years ago my helmet had a sticker on it saying football was dangerous and could cause neck and head injuries.  I didn't say anything about the more advanced diagnosis of today, but it nevertheless had those warnings.  We signed waivers, we had to take an education seminar on the risks.  This was 25 years ago.  There were risks known, even then.  Guess what, people still chose to play. 

I'm all for giving people the information, it is how it should be.  Bug please stop with the nonsense that people didn't know football is a dangerous sport.  It is embarrassing to read that argument...completely embarrassing.  Football has been a violent game with injurious risks since day one.  The game was almost banned in the early 1900's due to a strong of deaths. 

When I hear people say that they didn't know football was dangerous it makes my head spin.  What planet have they been on?  And for those demanding some kind of renumeration, I ask where is the consistency?  It is nowhere...of course.  Medicine tells is sports injuries lead to arthritis among other things....why aren't people demanding payment and damages for those injuries?

You have accurately described the tobacco industry's argument.  Remember that cigarettes had a warning sticker on them since 1966.

This argument worked so well that the tobacco industry has a settlement that will reach hundreds of billions over the next few decades.

So unless you have a better argument, football is going to meet the same fate as tobacco, pay tons of money and become socially unacceptable.
 

[Pakuni]

Chico's .... could you please cite on example of a former player/or attorney for a former player who's said they didn't know football  was a dangerous sport?

You're doing a fine job of constructing straw men to bowl over.

[keefe]

You have accurately described the tobacco industry's argument.  Remember that cigarettes had a warning sticker on them since 1966.

This argument worked so well that the tobacco industry has a settlement that will reach hundreds of billions over the next few decades.

So unless you have a better argument, football is going to meet the same fate as tobacco, pay tons of money and become socially unacceptable.
 

I think that is a more accurate encapsulation of our court system absolving smokers of personal responsibility. I'm not a smoker and one of the reasons is that it is one of the single most stupid things a human can do to themselves. If one smokes for decades one should not complain about having emphysema or lung cancer. And one certainly should not blame Philip Morris for their medical condition. Why the courts entertained such rubbish is akin to the idiots rioting in Seattle to protest the existence of corporations at the WTO meetings. Whatever happened to personal responsibility?

[ChicosBailBonds]

I think that is a more accurate encapsulation of our court system absolving smokers of personal responsibility. I'm not a smoker and one of the reasons is that it is one of the single most stupid things a human can do to themselves. If one smokes for decades one should not complain about having emphysema or lung cancer. And one certainly should not blame Philip Morris for their medical condition. Why the courts entertained such rubbish is akin to the idiots rioting in Seattle to protest the existence of corporations at the WTO meetings. Whatever happened to personal responsibility?

It's the USA now.  Personal responsibility....hah....how can I get another lottery check or payment of some kind.

Look, it is one thing if companies are knowingly hiding information, etc....like the tobacco industry.  But I'm sorry, anyone that began smoking in the last 30 years it is appalling that someone would get a red cent of anything unless they were in a coma within a cave in the Artic.   People know the risks, where is the personal responsibility?  Who is putting a gun to people to smoke, to play football, etc?

[keefe]

It's the USA now.  Personal responsibility....hah....how can I get another lottery check or payment of some kind.

Not all of America has abandoned personal responsibility

[ChicosBailBonds]

Pakuni

Here is the lawsuit filed in Federal court.

http://www.anapolschwartz.com/pdfs/nfl-complaint.pdf


It's a fun read and I think you will find your answers throughout.  It's amazing to me the extent Travellers, the players, etc go out of their way to highlight the various violence, marketing of violence, etc, going back to even the 1930's....amazing that the NFL knew it was a violent game and the players didn't.  Odd.  Strange.  Or that equipment was mandated throughout the development of football because of injuries and the attempt to reduce them.  

No one is suggesting CTE isn't real or isn't something important to be dealt with.  Of course it is.  My problem with all of this is that some of these players didn't know the risks everytime they went on the football field? BS.  Ridiculous, but that is what their lawsuit states.  It is preposterous.  "I knew I could be paralyzed, I knew I could break my neck, I knew I could be killed but I chose to play anyway, but now I'm suing because I didn't know having to wear a football helmet and getting hit in the head repeatedly might lead to something else, so I'm going to sue despite warnings of head, neck, knee, etc injuries that have been warned about for decades." 

If the NFL is smart along with Pop Warner, NCAA, etc, they will claim that football causes cancer, syphyllis, polio, lupus, hair loss, and every single medical condition known to man.  Just put it all out there.  You want to play, there is a risk.  Don't like the risks, don't play.

When do baseball pitchers start suing because after 15 years and thousands of pitches thrown their arm doesn't work like it used to?