MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: jesmu84 on November 04, 2020, 07:40:30 PM
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Thoughts?
"Instead of treating drug users as criminals, Oregon will now offer them addiction services funded by marijuana tax revenue, which is more than $100 million a year in the state.
Only small amounts of drugs are decriminalized, such as less than 1 gram of heroin or MDMA; 2 grams of cocaine or methamphetamine; 12 grams of psilocybin mushrooms; and 40 doses of LSD, oxycodone or methadone.
Criminal penalties for possession of these amounts are replaced with a fine of up to $100, which can be waived if the user is evaluated at Addiction Recovery Centers.
Crimes that are associated with drug use, such as manufacturing drugs, selling drugs and driving under the influence, are still criminal offenses."
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its an ovbious step in right direction
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I think it is a good idea. I doubt it does anything to increase illegal drug use, and our policies of giving someone a criminal record and imprisonment have clearly not worked.
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Sleepy Joe’s scary America already coming to fruition before he’s even elected.
I’m for it.
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Give it a shot
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12 ounces of shrooms or 40 hits of LSD are “small amounts?”
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12 ounces of shrooms or 40 hits of LSD are “small amounts?”
Depends on the band you're seeing. Greatful dead? Absolutely small amounts. Dave matthews? Probably a little too much.
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The wife and I just finished watching Designated Survivor. They weave in a lot of real life stories (including real video) and information into the show.
One of the last episodes Kiefer Sutherland's character was going to introduce legislation like Portugal who doesn't send anyone to jail for drugs. They treat the user and it reduced addiction by like 60%.
It sounds a lot like the Oregon deal.
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12 ounces of shrooms or 40 hits of LSD are “small amounts?”
Sounds like your average college Thursday night.
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I went back and forth on this one. Voted no in the end. I’m fine with decriminalizing certain drugs but not hard drugs like cocaine, heroin, and crack. That was my deciding factor in opposing it. I’m for the rehab piece, I’d rather see that alone.
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Are you kidding me?
This is a really bad idea.
I get why people can argue for marijuana decriminalization. I don't agree with it and I certainly don't agree with Illinois' efforts to steer it to politically connected individuals, but I understand the other side.
But decriminalizing cocaine, heroin, PCP, meth, etc., in small doses? The impact of this stuff on society is horrible. And endorsing it by making it legal is downright disgusting. What are we going to do when law enforcement comes across it among folks under 18 years of age. "Well, my parents are doing it," some kid might say, "so why can't I?"
Next thing you know, they'll be starting a "Free el Chapo" movement in Eugene!
Brother Billy is right in the sense we need to support rehab.
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All drugs should be decriminalized, legalized, and taxed. Substance abuse is a medical issue, not a legal one. Sending people to jail for drug abuse/possession, as well as sending people to jail for selling things that are in huge demand and widely available, is pretty stupid. It's clogging our courts and prisons and costing us money where it should be generating tax revenue.
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All drugs should be decriminalized, legalized, and taxed. Substance abuse is a medical issue, not a legal one. Sending people to jail for drug abuse/possession, as well as sending people to jail for selling things that are in huge demand and widely available, is pretty stupid. It's clogging our courts and prisons and costing us money where it should be generating tax revenue.
^This
People get into heroin because they're addicted to pills and can't get them. We need a much better way of dealing with our drug problem other than locking people up. It is a waste of money and financially cripples them and the US taxpayer.
All research and drug policy shows that treatment should be increased, law enforcement decreased, while abolishing mandatory minimum sentences!
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Are you kidding me?
This is a really bad idea.
I get why people can argue for marijuana decriminalization. I don't agree with it and I certainly don't agree with Illinois' efforts to steer it to politically connected individuals, but I understand the other side.
But decriminalizing cocaine, heroin, PCP, meth, etc., in small doses? The impact of this stuff on society is horrible. And endorsing it by making it legal is downright disgusting. What are we going to do when law enforcement comes across it among folks under 18 years of age. "Well, my parents are doing it," some kid might say, "so why can't I?"
Next thing you know, they'll be starting a "Free el Chapo" movement in Eugene!
Brother Billy is right in the sense we need to support rehab.
Decriminalization and legalization are 2 different things.
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For more information on success or failure of this type of legislation, please research Portugal.
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All drugs should be decriminalized, legalized, and taxed. Substance abuse is a medical issue, not a legal one. Sending people to jail for drug abuse/possession, as well as sending people to jail for selling things that are in huge demand and widely available, is pretty stupid. It's clogging our courts and prisons and costing us money where it should be generating tax revenue.
I don't know if I agree with legalization/state-sanctioned selling of hard drugs.
That's a tough line to cross.
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All drugs should be decriminalized, legalized, and taxed. Substance abuse is a medical issue, not a legal one. Sending people to jail for drug abuse/possession, as well as sending people to jail for selling things that are in huge demand and widely available, is pretty stupid. It's clogging our courts and prisons and costing us money where it should be generating tax revenue.
^^ Not this^^. Seeing how we botched the opioid crisis, I dont really feel our government would do a good job of legalizing highly addictive drugs like cocaine. Not sure it would stop the cartels from selling a cheaper version of state/federal cocaine.
Here's one side of that argument
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/4/20/15328384/opioid-epidemic-drug-legalization (https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/4/20/15328384/opioid-epidemic-drug-legalization)
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All drugs should be decriminalized, legalized, and taxed. Substance abuse is a medical issue, not a legal one. Sending people to jail for drug abuse/possession, as well as sending people to jail for selling things that are in huge demand and widely available, is pretty stupid. It's clogging our courts and prisons and costing us money where it should be generating tax revenue.
Thank you Milton!
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The opiod crisis is a good counterpoint for the legalization and taxing of all drugs. For me the line of what should be legalized and taxed depends on the science of what is addictive, because the logic of addiction doesn't follow a rational economic curve. If you're addicted to heroin, there is no line at which supply/demand and imposition of tax is enough to price you out. Or once the economic line reaches that high, you're going to get into deadly knock offs like fentanyl or crocodil or whatever. There is always a worse, less regulated option for the addicted, and facilitating that is a snowball that you won't get control of again. That doesn't mean that our criminalization of those drugs needs to be unduly punitive though. We should absolutely be reforming the way our criminal justice system handles addicted drug offenders, but that doesn't mean you throw the baby out with the bathwater and legalize and regulate it all.
I understand that things like alcohol and tobacco are obvious counterpoints to this, as both are addictive and legal. But just because those cats are out of the bag, I don't think that's a persuasive argument to broaden the issue, especially into substances with high likelihoods of acute overdoses.
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I am pro-decriminalization for possession. I think it make sense on many levels.
I will never be for legalization of the drugs being decriminalized by this statute.
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The opiod crisis is a good counterpoint for the legalization and taxing of all drugs. For me the line of what should be legalized and taxed depends on the science of what is addictive, because the logic of addiction doesn't follow a rational economic curve. If you're addicted to heroin, there is no line at which supply/demand and imposition of tax is enough to price you out. Or once the economic line reaches that high, you're going to get into deadly knock offs like fentanyl or crocodil or whatever. There is always a worse, less regulated option for the addicted, and facilitating that is a snowball that you won't get control of again. That doesn't mean that our criminalization of those drugs needs to be unduly punitive though. We should absolutely be reforming the way our criminal justice system handles addicted drug offenders, but that doesn't mean you throw the baby out with the bathwater and legalize and regulate it all.
Any legalization must require that there is no crime family / cartel pushing and controlling its use like the Colombian cartel or the Sackler family.
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Are you kidding me?
This is a really bad idea.
I get why people can argue for marijuana decriminalization. I don't agree with it and I certainly don't agree with Illinois' efforts to steer it to politically connected individuals, but I understand the other side.
But decriminalizing cocaine, heroin, PCP, meth, etc., in small doses? The impact of this stuff on society is horrible. And endorsing it by making it legal is downright disgusting. What are we going to do when law enforcement comes across it among folks under 18 years of age. "Well, my parents are doing it," some kid might say, "so why can't I?"
Next thing you know, they'll be starting a "Free el Chapo" movement in Eugene!
Brother Billy is right in the sense we need to support rehab.
Thank you.
I support lower penalties for possession and mandatory rehab which would give people the ability to clear their records upon completion and no repeat offenses for a certain period of time (e.g. 2 years). But as some people have noted, the biggest narcotics crisis in our country is opioids, which are prescribed legally. Besides, nobody dies from weed, people die from coke, crack, heroin, etc.
One of the cool things about vote by mail in Oregon is that we get a voter guide and can study the issues, reading the actual proposal and the pros and cons presented by groups.
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So my understanding is that the measure would require a fine and better pathways to treatment for those who are currently arrested for simple drug possession.
Again, I guess the issue is do you want to spend state resources punishing the users of the drugs, or do you want to get them treatment, and use your prison space for those who are distributing and dealing.
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If they are sincere and effective with the treatment/rehab efforts, I’m cautiously in favor. And that’s after giving it a lot of contemplative thought
Here is my thing with heroin or meth if that’s in the consideration. Unlike alcohol or pot or even coke, that’s not a gateway where people are like “I’d like to try it but it’s illegal and that’s what is stopping me.” Access to that is rampant and quite easy/accessible, regardless of legality. So contrary to popular belief, this won’t lead to more kids falling into heroin or whatnot, but it does have a much greater chance of doing something about how we treat and approach drug addiction
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If they are sincere and effective with the treatment/rehab efforts, I’m cautiously in favor. And that’s after giving it a lot of contemplative thought
Here is my thing with heroin or meth if that’s in the consideration. Unlike alcohol or pot or even coke, that’s not a gateway where people are like “I’d like to try it but it’s illegal and that’s what is stopping me.” Access to that is rampant and quite easy/accessible, regardless of legality. So contrary to popular belief, this won’t lead to more kids falling into heroin or whatnot, but it does have a much greater chance of doing something about how we treat and approach drug addiction
De-stigmatization is an important part of drug reform
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So my understanding is that the measure would require a fine and better pathways to treatment for those who are currently arrested for simple drug possession.
Again, I guess the issue is do you want to spend state resources punishing the users of the drugs, or do you want to get them treatment, and use your prison space for those who are distributing and dealing.
you don't send them to jail, you give them a way to clear their record through successful rehab and non-recidivism.
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I am pro-decriminalization for possession. I think it make sense on many levels.
I will never be for legalization of the drugs being decriminalized by this statute.
+1
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So my understanding is that the measure would require a fine and better pathways to treatment for those who are currently arrested for simple drug possession.
Again, I guess the issue is do you want to spend state resources punishing the users of the drugs, or do you want to get them treatment, and use your prison space for those who are distributing and dealing.
....and what if they are users; do they get a free pass? Honest Judge I only gave my 20 or so buddies about a gram of heroin and 2 grams of coke each so we, including myself, could all party after doing 6 surgeries each last Friday.
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Sleepy Joe’s scary America already coming to fruition before he’s even elected.
I’m for it.
....Hunter is moving to Oregon.
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....Hunter is moving to Oregon.
I see we are down to making fun of people who used to have a drug problem!
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I see we are down to making fun of people who used to have a drug problem!
Actually I was making fun of OREGON.
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back to this
https://disa.com/map-of-marijuana-legality-by-state
Wisconsin is one of 7 states where marijuana is completely illegal. And when you ask yourself what Wisconsin has in common with the other 6, the answer is... nothing.
Maybe one of the silver linings of Covid is the Tavern League losing membership and becoming irrelevant.
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back to this
https://disa.com/map-of-marijuana-legality-by-state
Wisconsin is one of 7 states where marijuana is completely illegal. And when you ask yourself what Wisconsin has in common with the other 6, the answer is... nothing.
Maybe one of the silver linings of Covid is the Tavern League losing membership and becoming irrelevant.
It's past time to fully legalize it. Give states the option on whether to allow sales or not. But no longer illegal on a federal level.
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back to this
https://disa.com/map-of-marijuana-legality-by-state
Wisconsin is one of 7 states where marijuana is completely illegal. And when you ask yourself what Wisconsin has in common with the other 6, the answer is... nothing.
Maybe one of the silver linings of Covid is the Tavern League losing membership and becoming irrelevant.
Is the tavern league against weed being legal?
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Is the tavern league against weed being legal?
Anything that gives a whiff of keeping people out of bars is something they oppose. Mask mandates, marijuana, and 9pm cessation of liquor sales in many municipalities are due to the Tavern League.
Not to mention the lax drunk driving laws.
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Anything that gives a whiff of keeping people out of bars is something they oppose. Mask mandates, marijuana, and 9pm cessation of liquor sales in many municipalities are due to the Tavern League.
Not to mention the lax drunk driving laws.
Interesting. Knew they had their hands in a lot of things like the drink driving laws. Didn't know it went to masks weed and liquor sales. Thanks
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Interesting. Knew they had their hands in a lot of things like the drink driving laws. Didn't know it went to masks weed and liquor sales. Thanks
They’re the most powerful lobbying group in Madison. You can buy package beer at taverns after 9pm (at a ridiculous markup) but not stores because if them.
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Vos is on record that he is for medical.
Fitz was the holdup, and hes now in Congress. Hopefully the new majority leader is more open, but he is a conservative from Oostbug, the most Republican town in the state. Not holding out too much hope.
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back to this
https://disa.com/map-of-marijuana-legality-by-state
Wisconsin is one of 7 states where marijuana is completely illegal. And when you ask yourself what Wisconsin has in common with the other 6, the answer is... nothing.
Maybe one of the silver linings of Covid is the Tavern League losing membership and becoming irrelevant.
It really is amazing that states as conservative as South Dakota, Montana and Alaska have fully legalized marijuana, yet Wisconsin hasn’t even taken the first step by allowing it for medical reasons.
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It's past time to fully legalize it. Give states the option on whether to allow sales or not. But no longer illegal on a federal level.
some in the industry here in CO want it kept federally illegal because it keeps it favorable to small business. Once totally legal, the likes of Pfizer or others could research and mass produce a scientifically reliable, cheap product
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some in the industry here in CO want it kept federally illegal because it keeps it favorable to small business. Once totally legal, the likes of Pfizer or others could research and mass produce a scientifically reliable, cheap product
It's cheap to make regardless. Where the money long-term will be, is in artisan breeds with unique characteristics.
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It's cheap to make regardless. Where the money long-term will be, is in artisan breeds with unique characteristics.
true. They'll have to differentiate much like microbreweries have.
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weed laws are just woefully pathetic but whatever. being against medcinal is even worse. imagine telling some twrmianlly ill guy you cant smoke a little weed cuz its bad. just sick.dont give pelple what they want. mommy knows best govmerment. can som1 tell me which goofy ass branch of wisconsin gov is the reason for this. this is a disgrace
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It's cheap to make regardless. Where the money long-term will be, is in artisan breeds with unique characteristics.
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I go for the free range, locally sourced m humanely raised strains myself. Got to be gluten free too.
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I go for the free range, locally sourced m humanely raised strains myself. Got to be gluten free too.
Organic and grain-free too, I hope....