MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: ryegge on March 07, 2020, 09:54:02 PM
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Let me start by saying I am a huge Markus Howard fan and will miss watching him score
That being said, after watching all these Bis East games today, there are four or five guys I want taking that last shot rather then Markus.
Take this last game of the night with Butler/Xavier, I would want Baldwin or Marshall for the game winner or tie. And it came down to those two in the last 10 seconds with Baldwin getting the win.
Thoughts Marquette fans??
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My thought is who I’d want taking the last shot of a game is very low on my list of requirements for a POY.
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What??
Really??
So your POY candidate isn’t the guy with the ball in his hands to win the game??
Okay, whatever!!
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What??
Really??
So your POY candidate isn’t the guy with the ball in his hands to win the game??
Okay, whatever!!
Yeah, probably not the guy getting triple teamed and then hedged. Wouldn’t be a great play.
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It's the situations that lead up to a final shot attempt that make it frustrating.
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What??
Really??
So your POY candidate isn’t the guy with the ball in his hands to win the game??
Okay, whatever!!
Not what he said. But if you think Baldwin is BEPOY have fun with that.
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What??
Really??
So your POY candidate isn’t the guy with the ball in his hands to win the game??
Okay, whatever!!
Robert Horry was taking the last shots on numerous championship teams including teams with Koby/Shaq and Duncan/Parker/Ginobli. I personally wouldn’t consider Horry to be the best players on those teams, but that’s just my opinion.
I’d rather have had LBJ making the play to get an open shot for Ray Allen or Wade on those Heat teams. To me, LBJ was still the best player on those teams.
Who you want taking a last shot doesn’t mean they’re the best player on a team or in a league.
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And I didn’t say Baldwin for POY
We shall see the POY results soon. Unfortunately it will not be Markus.
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Imagine thinking Naji Marshall should be POY before Markus. Or that you’d rather have a 31% shooter from 3 pull it over one of the best scorers in NCAA history.
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It's the situations that lead up to a final shot attempt that make it frustrating.
Maybe the coach should draw up a different play (this coming from a Projoer)
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Maybe the coach should draw up a different play (this coming from a Projoer)
I would like to see that too...but remember that Wojo will ALWAYS have to assume that the other team will be on Markus like a blanket, and he has to remember that the guys around him aren't always the greatest passers.
It would have been nice to see what Markus could have done with a PG who can consistently find open guys in shooting rhythm - a guy like Junior or even Derrick. They had their limitations in raw physical ability, but they were solid ballhandlers and passers. Wojo has tried to find those guys, but Chartouny and McEwen have struggled to spread the ball around without turning it over.
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I would like to see that too...but remember that Wojo will ALWAYS have to assume that the other team will be on Markus like a blanket, and he has to remember that the guys around him aren't always the greatest passers.
It would have been nice to see what Markus could have done with a PG who can consistently find open guys in shooting rhythm - a guy like Junior or even Derrick. They had their limitations in raw physical ability, but they were solid ballhandlers and passers. Wojo has tried to find those guys, but Chartouny and McEwen have struggled to spread the ball around without turning it over.
Derrick couldn't find an open shooter if you gave him a compass and a map. I was hoping Koby would be the guy you were asking for. A big PG who could cover the opponent's best guard and who could find the open man while having to be respected himself is exactly what Markus needs as a running mate. Those guys are not easy to find.
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I am expecting POY to not come from a team who lost to everybody at the end of the season.
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I am expecting POY to not come from a team who lost to everybody at the end of the season.
You mean not again?
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I am expecting POY to not come from a team who lost to everybody at the end of the season.
Hall finished the year 5-5 in last 10.
Marquette finished the year 4-6 in last 10.
Whichever guy gets it, his team was mediocre to end the season.
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Hall finished the year 5-5 in last 10.
Marquette finished the year 4-6 in last 10.
Whichever guy gets it, his team was mediocre to end the season.
Hall abused us on our home court save for a very late run...
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Hall abused us on our home court save for a very late run...
And Howard was fantastic in that game. Did everything he could.
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And Howard was fantastic in that game. Did everything he could.
He shot really well, yes.
My post though you quoted was in response that their teams finishing 10 were comparable.
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Derrick couldn't find an open shooter if you gave him a compass and a map. I was hoping Koby would be the guy you were asking for. A big PG who could cover the opponent's best guard and who could find the open man while having to be respected himself is exactly what Markus needs as a running mate. Those guys are not easy to find.
You might want to notify all the websites that list stats showing otherwise. In addition to a very respectable 366 career assists (despite starting only 2 seasons), Derrick had a nearly 3:1 assist:TO ratio. He would have been EXACTLY what Markus needed - a guy who could bring the ball up court without turning it over, and then dish it to Markus.
I get that he didn't have the flashy "wow" factor that people want in a PG, and he was a lousy shooter. But your comment about his ability to find an open shooter is simply wrong.
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He shot really well, yes.
My post though you quoted was in response that their teams finishing 10 were comparable.
Both teams scuffled to the finish. However, one's star had his best stretch of the season while the other's was miserable. The Marquette game was the only game down the stretch where Powell even played like a 1st team All BE player, much less POY.
If you're gonna give a guy a bump for having a "better" team, its worth noticing neither team finished strong. Then you look at individual performances and its no question.
Its all a moot point, I think everyone knows the Powell POY narrative was written and booked months ago, but yet again, with Hall falling apart when they all they had to do was not lose 3 of their last 5 at home, there is literally no parameter or metric where Powell has been markedly better than Markus this year, and plenty where he trails starkly
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This is insane if Powell really wins it by this much..WTF is the infatuation with Myles Powell??
Who is the Big East Player of the Year?
I polled 30 of the 40 head and assistant coaches in the league, and the response was surprisingly one-sided.
Here's more on @FS1's Inside The Big East: pic.twitter.com/RRPmHslLUi
— Evan Daniels (@EvanDaniels) March 10, 2020
25 of the 30 for Powell, 3 for Howard, 1 each for Baldwin and Alexander. Really?? WTF are the Coaches watching??
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This is insane if Powell really wins it by this much..WTF is the infatuation with Myles Powell??
Who is the Big East Player of the Year?
I polled 30 of the 40 head and assistant coaches in the league, and the response was surprisingly one-sided.
Here's more on @FS1's Inside The Big East: pic.twitter.com/RRPmHslLUi
— Evan Daniels (@EvanDaniels) March 10, 2020
25 of the 30 for Powell, 3 for Howard, 1 each for Baldwin and Alexander. Really?? WTF are the Coaches watching??
Right or wrong, agree or disagree, the label of Markus being a player who doesn’t make anyone around him better really stuck down the stretch this season. It was a frequent narrative every time his name was discussed.
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Right or wrong, agree or disagree, the label of Markus being a player who doesn’t make anyone around him better really stuck down the stretch this season. It was a frequent narrative every time his name was discussed.
Yep, unfortunate. Seton Hall is really playing well. Will be interesting to see what happens Thursday. I feel like Markus would have to lead MU to the big east tournament title to win POY at this point.
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You might want to notify all the websites that list stats showing otherwise. In addition to a very respectable 366 career assists (despite starting only 2 seasons), Derrick had a nearly 3:1 assist:TO ratio. He would have been EXACTLY what Markus needed - a guy who could bring the ball up court without turning it over, and then dish it to Markus.
I get that he didn't have the flashy "wow" factor that people want in a PG, and he was a lousy shooter. But your comment about his ability to find an open shooter is simply wrong.
As Ignatius J. Reilly would say, “Oh, my God.” There’s been a lot of talk about “knowing ball” on here lately, and if you think Derrick is “exactly” what any team needs, you simply do not know ball. In all my years of watching basketball, Derrick was the worst high major starting guard I’ve ever seen. Definitely the worst for Marquette, and it’s not even close. I’m sure he’s a great guy and this is going to sound incredibly mean, but he was a waste of space on the court. Whatever the stats that you list say about him, they don’t tell the whole story. They don’t even give the prologue.
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Let me start by saying I am a huge Markus Howard fan and will miss watching him score
That being said, after watching all these Bis East games today, there are four or five guys I want taking that last shot rather then Markus.
Take this last game of the night with Butler/Xavier, I would want Baldwin or Marshall for the game winner or tie. And it came down to those two in the last 10 seconds with Baldwin getting the win.
Thoughts Marquette fans??
I think u are an idiot
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Yep, unfortunate. Seton Hall is really playing well. Will be interesting to see what happens Thursday. I feel like Markus would have to lead MU to the big east tournament title to win POY at this point.
The award is announced before the tournament...
And this doesn’t reflect well on the coaches honestly. Do they not watch the film where Powell is horrifically inefficient and marginally effective against them?
In his last 10 games, he only led the team in scoring 5 times, but led them in TOs 6 times. And Mr “Makes the Plays to Win” only led the team I assists in one of those 5 games he did take the scoring lead. I think he had 5 and McKnight had 4 in that game.
In the long history of the BE, this will be one of the biggest jokes of a POY by a large margin. Some BS career achievement award decided before the season ever got going. Once SH started strong, the story was written.
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Right or wrong, agree or disagree, the label of Markus being a player who doesn’t make anyone around him better really stuck down the stretch this season. It was a frequent narrative every time his name was discussed.
Maybe, but I think it is much more a case of him being on an 8-10 team.
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Maybe, but I think it is much more a case of him being on an 8-10 team.
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Sure. Don't give it to Markus then. Give it to Bey or Alexander. Both are more deserving than Powell.
And yes I know this means Powell is going to torch us again on Thursday.
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From bustingbrackets.com:
G Markus Howard, Marquette
Stats: 27.7 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 3.3 apg, 42/41/85 percent shooting
Howard’s scuffling teammates may cheat him out of his second consecutive Big East Player of the Year award, but he is a no-doubt unanimous first-team selection. He is pacing the league with some staggering metrics:
27.7 ppg (first, Powell is second at 21.3)
37.9 percent usage rate (first, Powell is second at 33.6)
10.2 box plus/minus (first, Reed second at 8.7)
6.9 PORPAGATU! (first, Bey second at 5.1)
115 three-point makes (first, Bey second at 76)
112.4 offensive rating (fifth, min. 18 percent usage rate)
58.8 percent true shooting (sixth, min. 18 percent usage rate)
26.4 assist rate (sixth)
Howard has bettered his 2018-19 performance when he took home the conference POY, while his chief competitor Powell has been worse. But similarly to the Oklahoma collapse in 2017-18 that prevented Trae Young from winning Big 12 Player of the Year even though his numbers (27 & 9 on 42 percent shooting) were far superior to Devonte’ Graham’s (17 & 7 on 40 percent shooting), Howard may have to settle for a first-team honor. As always, one lesson remains: don’t lose to DePaul.
G Myles Powell, Seton Hall
Stats: 21.3 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 2.8 apg, 40/31/80 percent shooting
Powell’s numbers are down across the board after his breakout junior campaign, which can be partially attributed to his injury woes throughout the season. However, as the headliner on the conference’s first-place squad, he is a surefire selection to the all-Big East first-team and the possible POY beneficiary of Marquette’s late-season implosion, no matter how unseemly that 39/26/81 percent shooting line in conference play may look on the stat sheet (among the 24 Big East players to post at least a 30 percent usage rate since 2009-10, Powell ranks just 18th in offensive rating).
Powell still deserves plenty of credit for the legacy he has built-in South Orange. When Desi Rodriguez, Angel Delgado, and Khadeen Carrington graduated in 2018, Seton Hall said goodbye to the core of one of the program’s finest classes in school history. For Powell to pick up that mantle, push the Pirates into the national spotlight, and potentially cap his senior season with a Big East title, a protected NCAA tournament seed, and a conference POY trophy is quite the accomplishment for the Trenton native.
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Sure. Don't give it to Markus then. Give it to Bey or Alexander. Both are more deserving than Powell.
And yes I know this means Powell is going to torch us again on Thursday.
Agree with this. Personally, Alexander for me.
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Yep, unfortunate. Seton Hall is really playing well. Will be interesting to see what happens Thursday. I feel like Markus would have to lead MU to the big east tournament title to win POY at this point.
This suggests you don't watch Big East basketball games.
Hall is 5-5 in their last 10 games. They blew two chances, one at home, to win an outright Championship. That is not "playing well".
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This suggests you don't watch Big East basketball games.
Hall is 5-5 in their last 10 games. They blew two chances, one at home, to win an outright Championship. That is not "playing well".
Yeah I don't really have the time to watch BE games. Fair. But they're certainly playing much better overall than MU. My point was it's not a good look for Markus compared to Powell with current conference standings.
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Powell won. No surprise. Still ridiculous.
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Historically bad.
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Powell won. No surprise. Still ridiculous.
Would love to see who voted for whom
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This is a traveshamockery.
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Powell won. No surprise. Still ridiculous.
I was attacked weeks ago when I said Powell was a lock. So, this is no surprise. It shouldn't be a surprise to any MU fan.
Is Markus a better player? Probably. He certainly is a better scorer. But a POY is never gonna come from a 2nd division team that choked down the stretch.
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As Ignatius J. Reilly would say, “Oh, my God.” There’s been a lot of talk about “knowing ball” on here lately, and if you think Derrick is “exactly” what any team needs, you simply do not know ball. In all my years of watching basketball, Derrick was the worst high major starting guard I’ve ever seen. Definitely the worst for Marquette, and it’s not even close. I’m sure he’s a great guy and this is going to sound incredibly mean, but he was a waste of space on the court. Whatever the stats that you list say about him, they don’t tell the whole story. They don’t even give the prologue.
Koby is worse
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I think u are an idiot
Interesting when you disagree with someone you start with personal attacks.
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Didn’t realize that Myles Powell was Donnie Marshals nephew. It helps to explain his stance on FS1 broadcasts regarding Markus. He was against Markus the whole way, even when we were doing well. I thought it was strange how he never thought Markus made his teammates better. I actually started to buy into how consistent he was in his opinion throughout the season. Now I know it was all bull crap. Screw that guy.
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Didn’t realize that Myles Powell was Donnie Marshals nephew. It helps to explains his stance on FS1 broadcasts regarding Markus. He was against Markus the whole way, even when we were doing well. I thought it was strange how he never thought Markus made his teammates better. I actually started to buy into how consistent he was in his opinion throughout the season. Now I know it was all bull crap. Screw that guy.
Yeah, not too objective. Would assume he is done as an analyst.
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Don’t know if you are serious but would not bank on him leaving with UCONN starting next year.