Tokoto declares for draft

[Silkk the Shaka]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/unc-s-jp-tokoto-to-declare-for-the-2015-nba-draft-130246490-nba.html

Did not see that coming

[damuts222]

This doesn't make much sense to me, but hope it works out for him.  NC is poised for a good year next year.

[jsglow]

More evidence of drafting on potential only.  

[Anti-Dentite]

Tokoto disappeared against the rodents, glad someone found him.

[esotericmindguy]

Tokoto disappeared against the rodents, glad someone found him.

Against the rodents? He averaged 7.7 points per game in conference, he shot 43% from 2 and 61% from the line. Is his defense that good?  Strange

[ecompt]

Speaking of disappearing against the Rodents, the Harrison twins are going pro. I guess Cal is happy because he has to have at least four guys leave to make way for his next crop of AAs.

[brandx]

I still expect Tokoto to be back at UNC - but I've been wrong before.

[RubyWiscy]

but...but...but I thought he was going to transfer to Marquette after he washed out at UNC. This makes no sense.

[tower912]

No wonder Bo cooled on him.   He knew that Tokoto was one of those 1-2-3 and done players, and not one of those 4-5 year players who would still leave without a degree. 

[Golden Avalanche]

Speaking of disappearing against the Rodents, the Harrison twins are going pro. I guess Cal is happy because he has to have at least four guys leave to make way for his next crop of AAs.

That's on Cal. The Harrisons were excellent in the first half against Wisconsin and were primed to continue to exploit the weakness that is the UW backcourt. Inexplicably, Cal didn't start either Harrison in the second half. Mind boggling overcoaching from Cal.

[ChicosBailBonds]

This doesn't make much sense to me, but hope it works out for him.  NC is poised for a good year next year.

Maybe Vander's people got to him

[jsglow]

No wonder Bo cooled on him.   He knew that Tokoto was one of those 1-2-3 and done players, and not one of those 4-5 year players who would still leave without a degree. 

Oohhh.  Now your getting nasty.  Ol' Grinch had a tough week. (Evil chuckling.)

[mug644]

That's on Cal. The Harrisons were excellent in the first half against Wisconsin and were primed to continue to exploit the weakness that is the UW backcourt. Inexplicably, Cal didn't start either Harrison in the second half. Mind boggling overcoaching from Cal.

I felt the same way; the twins were THE point of attack for Kentucky in the first half. Not starting either in the second half seemed very odd coaching indeed.

[brewcity77]

That's on Cal. The Harrisons were excellent in the first half against Wisconsin and were primed to continue to exploit the weakness that is the UW backcourt. Inexplicably, Cal didn't start either Harrison in the second half. Mind boggling overcoaching from Cal.

Sounds like both are fringe second round picks. Not sure if they just want to start earning or what, but another year would be good for both them and Kentucky. They've developed into pretty darn good college players, but I'm not sure either are quite good enough to really excel at the next level.

They're those top-10 HS kids that probably didn't quite deserve their ranking and would be best suited as 4-year college kids. But of course, they won't do that. Just not the Kentucky way, I guess.

[jaygall31]

No wonder Bo cooled on him.   He knew that Tokoto was one of those 1-2-3 and done players, and not one of those 4-5 year players who would still leave without a degree. 

ahhh i love this!

[MattyWarrior]

Just another really athletic guy that can't shoot worth a damn!

[mu-rara]

Just another really athletic guy that can't shoot worth a damn!

He was all ACC defender.  Does that plus his size get him a job as a role player in the NBA?  (Maybe down the road a bit?)

[Groin_pull]

A few good workouts for NBA types and he'll end up in the first round. It's all about "upside."

[wadesworld]

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/player/_/id/146796/brandon-ingram

[Avenue Commons]

Reading the article Tokoto seems to have realistic expectations for the draft and understands that he has a lot of work cut out for him. However, for the life of me I'll never understand why he would use his senior year to brush up on the gaps in his game. I'm all for kids leaving school, at any age, for GUARANTEED payoffs. But this is a lot of risk to put up against the experiences of his senior year on the court, in the classroom, and just generally living college life.

[JWags85]

Sounds like both are fringe second round picks. Not sure if they just want to start earning or what, but another year would be good for both them and Kentucky. They've developed into pretty darn good college players, but I'm not sure either are quite good enough to really excel at the next level.

They're those top-10 HS kids that probably didn't quite deserve their ranking and would be best suited as 4-year college kids. But of course, they won't do that. Just not the Kentucky way, I guess.

Depending on the class next year, they might worry they won't get a chance to showcase.  Not saying I agree, but when you're only scoring 10 pts a game, cause your team is stacked and they don't need you to score more, scouts won't necessarily be salivating.  Maybe figured its better having some really good workouts and the buzz of the team to go off of.

[mug644]

Reading the article Tokoto seems to have realistic expectations for the draft and understands that he has a lot of work cut out for him. However, for the life of me I'll never understand why he would use his senior year to brush up on the gaps in his game. I'm all for kids leaving school, at any age, for GUARANTEED payoffs. But this is a lot of risk to put up against the experiences of his senior year on the court, in the classroom, and just generally living college life.

I took from the article that he's really willing to put in the effort that he believes will get him to the level he wants to be at, but that he seems to feel that being at UNC won't allow him the time to do that, what with being on the team and needing to go to class. I felt like he's being very realistic, knowing that he's not about to get a huge paycheck, but he'll get some paycheck and can focus on his skills 100% of the time. Struck me as quite mature.

[keefe]

What are the consequences of this decision for his dental health?

[AirPunches]

I took from the article that he's really willing to put in the effort that he believes will get him to the level he wants to be at, but that he seems to feel that being at UNC won't allow him the time to do that, what with being on the team and needing to go to class. I felt like he's being very realistic, knowing that he's not about to get a huge paycheck, but he'll get some paycheck and can focus on his skills 100% of the time. Struck me as quite mature.

It really does seem like he's matured. It's a shame he wasn't as mature when he was deciding on a school. Could you imagine what 3 years under Bo could have for him? He certainly wouldn't have the ball handling and shooting deficiencies that he has now.

[Stretchdeltsig]

Big mistake.  He's not good enough for the NBA.

[wadesworld]

Big mistake.  He's not good enough for the NBA.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/player/_/id/146796/brandon-ingram

[wadesworld]

PS I love people who claim this is a "horrible decision."  Like you know his personal situation.  Not to mention, if you know that after your senior year you'll still probably go undrafted, why waste an extra year of income?  Say you're an engineering student and after your junior year some firm says we don't care that you don't have your degree, you're good enough to get paid the same amount you would be next year after graduating.  Why don't you leave school now and come work for us?  How many people would say, "Well, even though next year I will make exactly what you're offering to give me this year, I think I'll stay in school and not make that amount of money."  That's Tokoto's situation.  He's going overseas either this year or next year.  Might as well make 1 extra year of 6 digit money rather than sitting in classes and tutor sessions and riding pine when a top 10 recruit takes your spot in the starting lineup.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

PS I love people who claim this is a "horrible decision."  Like you know his personal situation.  Not to mention, if you know that after your senior year you'll still probably go undrafted, why waste an extra year of income?  Say you're an engineering student and after your junior year some firm says we don't care that you don't have your degree, you're good enough to get paid the same amount you would be next year after graduating.  Why don't you leave school now and come work for us?  How many people would say, "Well, even though next year I will make exactly what you're offering to give me this year, I think I'll stay in school and not make that amount of money."  That's Tokoto's situation.  He's going overseas either this year or next year.  Might as well make 1 extra year of 6 digit money rather than sitting in classes and tutor sessions and riding pine when a top 10 recruit takes your spot in the starting lineup.

I get what you're saying there, but really, it'd be a pretty dumb decision for said engineering student to leave before graduating if the only stipulation was that they'd get a job a Firm X for the same amount of $ they'd get a year later.  That no degree thing is going to bite the Engineering student in the ass at some point down the line.

[source?]

I get what you're saying there, but really, it'd be a pretty dumb decision for said engineering student to leave before graduating if the only stipulation was that they'd get a job a Firm X for the same amount of $ they'd get a year later.  That no degree thing is going to bite the Engineering student in the ass at some point down the line.

True. Happened to a friend of mine, although it was at the outset of his college career. He's now 6 years into his job and lamenting the fact that those with bachelor's degrees keep getting raises while he is stuck on the same number. He's starting online classes in the fall.

Although it isn't exactly a great analogy to someone whose years of earning potential are limited to his athletic prime.

[Dawson Rental]

Just another really athletic guy that can't shoot write a paper on his own worth a damn!

FIFY

[wadesworld]

I get what you're saying there, but really, it'd be a pretty dumb decision for said engineering student to leave before graduating if the only stipulation was that they'd get a job a Firm X for the same amount of $ they'd get a year later.  That no degree thing is going to bite the Engineering student in the ass at some point down the line.

You're right, pretty dumb comparison.  I guess what I should've compared it to is someone who got their engineering degree and has plans of working in the engineering field, has a job offer from a good but not top firm, but is only 1 year away from getting a double major with his English degree and deciding, "You know what?  I'm going to stay in school 1 more year to get my degree in English when I plan on going into Engineering anyways."

Sure, at some point a degree is going to help JP Tokoto's situation.  But I think he'll be just fine playing overseas for 10-15 years and making 6 digits for most of that time and then having to go back to school for a year or 2, or taking online classes while playing overseas.  It's really not an "awful decision" at all.  Leaving college and putting 100% focus into basketball and developing as a player rather than also having to devote time to being a student isn't what's going to hold Tokoto from making the NBA.  If he's going to make it at some point, going pro now is only going to help that.

[martyconlonontherun]

Reading the article Tokoto seems to have realistic expectations for the draft and understands that he has a lot of work cut out for him. However, for the life of me I'll never understand why he would use his senior year to brush up on the gaps in his game. I'm all for kids leaving school, at any age, for GUARANTEED payoffs. But this is a lot of risk to put up against the experiences of his senior year on the court, in the classroom, and just generally living college life.

To me, I never understood why guys wasted junior and senior years in college when the gains made in develop are overshadowed by the lost of potential in the draft process. If he fails he will make good money overseas. He most likely only has 5-year window so might as well pocket the money instead of have some TA's hand you a written paper to turn in. People have all these grand visions of senior year of college but completely disregard the chance to play in a different culture overseas in a once in a lifetime opportunity.

ETA: Also, I never understood why people think a player will develop in college against inferior players in a system they won't play in the pros. Why not play against professionals and learn from the best coaches instead of the best recruiters?

[Golden Avalanche]

Thought it was interesting Tokoto threw Roy-Boy under the bus by saying he wasn't really pushed to be a better player these last few years. The bright lights of a blue blood are hard to pass up but it seems for some kids they'd be better off at a high major that has to scrap for every bit of their success rather then rely on Darwinian practice standards as their only hope for improvement.

[Spotcheck Billy]

He was all ACC defender.  Does that plus his size get him a job as a role player in the NBA?  (Maybe down the road a bit?)

apparently no thanks to UNC and Roy Williams in this Barry Jacobs article

Tokoto, a popular media choice for the ACC’s all-defensive team, wasn’t among the options the school offered on the ballot, hinting at disfavor within the program. That might help explain one of the last great upsets of the 2015 season: the erratic, offensively challenged Tokoto announced for the draft even before Duke’s Jahlil Okafor, the ACC player of the year, and Justise Winslow, among the best forwards the league has seen in recent memory.

Read more here: http://www.newsobserver.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/article18336920.html#storylink=cpy

he gets a jab in at the Adidas unis too:

Like it or not, the game doesn’t always evolve in attractive ways. Just look at the uniforms adidas foisted on the teams it sponsors in apparent hope that resembling ungainly bumblebees will be the wave of the future. “I don’t necessarily like how they look,” Wisconsin star Frank Kaminsky, the AP player of the year, said of the uniforms, also worn by N.C State. The reluctant living mannequin added, “I don’t have a choice.”

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

We have to keep in mind, some kids don't really like school, or maybe even more specifically, the school they are at.

So, what's Tokoto going to do? Transfer? That will set him back 2 years, and he'll still have to attend class, which he might not really be into.

So, pulling a "Vander blue" and going to play minor league basketball for a couple of years and hoping to get a shot might not sound so bad. Happens to pretty much every single baseball player. If Tokoto doesn't catch on in a few seasons, he can go to Europe and carve out a nice career.

If he gets catastrophically injured, he can go back to school, graduate, and be just like the rest of us.

[Herman Cain]

This is a mistake on many levels.

First , why on earth would you give up another year at wonder setting such as Chapel Hill?

Second, he has no where near the skills required to play at the next level. He was only a good player at  the college player not very good or great. A strong defender for sure but needs work on the rest of his game.

Third, another year in college and he probably would increase his value in Europe other foreign venues who value the UNC label he was wearing.

[rocket surgeon]

great kid, i wish him luck.  hope he had a good major and didn't waste any time on those "funny classes"

[real chili 83]

Would have been THAT much better with him?

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

This is a mistake on many levels.

First , why on earth would you give up another year at wonder setting such as Chapel Hill?

Second, he has no where near the skills required to play at the next level. He was only a good player at  the college player not very good or great. A strong defender for sure but needs work on the rest of his game.

Third, another year in college and he probably would increase his value in Europe other foreign venues who value the UNC label he was wearing.

By that logic, no baseball player should ever sign with a big league club unless they get a life changing signing bonus. They should all go to college for 4 years in the hopes that they increase their draft stock.

The truth is, some kids aren't really into going to school. It's not easy. They practice a lot. They have to study, and they have to put in extra court time on their own.

WE might think Chapel Hill is great, but JP might not. It's a personal decision.

[Mobot]

This is a mistake on many levels.

First , why on earth would you give up another year at wonder setting such as Chapel Hill?

Second, he has no where near the skills required to play at the next level. He was only a good player at  the college player not very good or great. A strong defender for sure but needs work on the rest of his game.

Third, another year in college and he probably would increase his value in Europe other foreign venues who value the UNC label he was wearing.

He can vacation in Chapel Hill after his playing days are over.  He has a 9 year window of prime athleticism and if he doesn't feel that he is improving at NC, then he needs to move on.  I see him as being similar to Dwight Buycks... the talent and athleticism are there, he needs time to work on his skills.

[4everwarriors]

Who here really thought Buycks had Association talent when he was at MU?

[brewcity77]

Who here really thought Buycks had Association talent when he was at MU?

At least one guy thought he did...

I wonder what Buycks would have done if he could have been our primary two this year instead of playing out of position at the one. He has plenty of athleticism, quickness, and a solid outside shot. I know some (cough, willie warrior, cough) would instantly shoot this down, but it wouldn't shock me if he could get to the D-League and eventually get a cup of coffee in the NBA. He definitely tailed off majorly later in the season, but with a refined game, I could see him getting to the end of someone's bench in a few years.

[Mobot]

He can vacation in Chapel Hill after his playing days are over.  He has a 9 year window of prime athleticism and if he doesn't feel that he is improving at NC, then he needs to move on.  I see him as being similar to Dwight Buycks... the talent and athleticism are there, he needs time to work on his skills.

Who here really thought Buycks had Association talent when he was at MU?

I predicted it three years in advance and you doubted me... http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21489.msg232520#msg232520

BOLD PREDICTION:  Dwight Buycks will make an NBA roster within the next 4 years.  

Where can we get some of that action?

[MUHoopsFan2]

Great move for him...UNC limits him.

BIG TIME NBA TALENT...or athleticsim. Wish Bucks take him in second round. He can defend. That is a start...he can score in transition that is another skill.

Who cares about the shot right now? Off the chart athletic talent. He made the right choice.

Will win a Slam Dunk Contest at least twice in NBDL or NBA in the next 3 years. I love his game.

Some team will get a hidden gem.

[BossplayaOtto]

At least one guy thought he did...

It certainly was a good prediction, but since Buycks made it to the association as a point guard, his time playing the one in college likely enhanced his progression.

[GGGG]

Great move for him...UNC limits him.

BIG TIME NBA TALENT...or athleticsim. Wish Bucks take him in second round. He can defend. That is a start...he can score in transition that is another skill.

Who cares about the shot right now? Off the chart athletic talent. He made the right choice.

Will win a Slam Dunk Contest at least twice in NBDL or NBA in the next 3 years. I love his game.

Some team will get a hidden gem.

I think he could develop into a fine player, but he doesn't have off the chart athleticism for an NBA player.  He is tall and long, and as you mention he can certainly defend and score in transition though.  And you are right, he wasn't getting any better at UNC.

[brandx]

Great move for him...UNC limits him.

BIG TIME NBA TALENT...or athleticsim. Wish Bucks take him in second round. He can defend. That is a start...he can score in transition that is another skill.

Who cares about the shot right now? Off the chart athletic talent. He made the right choice.

Will win a Slam Dunk Contest at least twice in NBDL or NBA in the next 3 years. I love his game.

Some team will get a hidden gem.

Bucks already have a much better version of Tokoto on their team. Long, athletic defender who can't shoot a lick - MCW.

[wadesworld]

Bucks already have a much better version of Tokoto on their team. Long, athletic defender who can't shoot a lick - MCW.

And Giannis.