Kolek planning to go pro
I think this problem is very easy to solve...stop hiring young, unproven Coaches, right??
What old, proven coach would leave their situation and come to Marquette?
If you mean that some coaches show they CAN'T do it before then, I agree. But showing you can raise a program to an elite level rarely happens in less than a decade.
The success of a coach IS the success of a program. If you change coaches every 5-10 years, you will most likely never reach the promised land. If you want to win year in and year out, it takes a coach installing a system and sticking with it for years. Long enough that the seniors teach the freshmen, that the culture is well established, and that the winning that attracts recruits isn't one flash-in-the-pan Final Four from the year before, but conference titles and tourney runs that come over a generation.If you mean that some coaches show they CAN'T do it before then, I agree. But showing you can raise a program to an elite level rarely happens in less than a decade.
On this board, it was 5 years to judge a coach. When the results didn’t come after Year 5, the goalposts moved and it became 10 to 15 years to judge, because you see it really is very hard to build any kind of culture or system in such a short half decade timeframe. Got it.
TAMUI do know, Newsie is right on you knowing ball.
Yes it is rare, however, in Year 5 of Tom Izzo, MSU won a national championship. Izzo elavated the program significantly.
All of the greatest coaches today were at one point young, unproven coaches.When Villanova hired Jay Wright, he hadn't won an NCAA tournament game in his first 7 seasons as a Division I head coach at Hofstra. How did the AD ever get suckered into this young, unproven coach?When Duke hired Mike Krzyzewski, he hadn't even made a single NCAA tournament in 5 seasons at Army. No way you hire this loser, right?Jim Boeheim, Tom Izzo and Roy Williams hadn't served as head coach at any level before they were hired at Syracuse, Michigan State and Kansas, respectively. Pass on all three of these pretenders, surely?
Just think of how many NC's MU would have if the "Instant Results" fools running MU at the time just would have been patient with Deane? One can only dream; what a wasted opportunity that was.I vote for tenure for all MU head coaches!
I can't speak for Brew but no goalposts have shifted for me. It is still 5 years to judge a coach. At the end of 5 years a coach has been through a whole recruiting cycle so they have had to win with their own players. This helps avoid things like Kevin Ollie. At the end of 5 years you should have a pretty good idea of whether or not your coach has the program trending up, down, or sideways. If it's up, you extend, if it's down you fire, if it's sideways you most likely fire but I could see a circumstance when you don't. In Wojo's case, he is clearly trending up so you extend.The 10-15+ years is how long you will likely have to wait if you want elite results. Just a reality that building an elite program takes time. As long as you keep trending up towards being elite the best course of action is sticking with your coach. That's how all the top programs got to where they are today. Churning through coaches every 5 years because they haven't gotten elite results right away rarely (if ever?) works.
+1I would rather hire a young unproven head coach who has upside and an unknown ceiling than an older "proven" coach whose ceiling is already known (and isn't at an elite level). Take Mike Anderson for example (I think he's an example of a "proven" high major coach that we could possibly lure away). He's been a D1 coach for 17 years now. In that time, his peaks have been a 3 seed at Mizzou (followed by a 10 seed the next year) and 5 seed at Arkansas (followed by no postseason the next year). He's been very solid all those 17 years, but I see no reason to believe that in his 18+ years that he is suddenly going to reach a new level that he never has before. St. John's IMHO made a high floor low ceiling type hire. I'd rather take a bet on a young coach with upside who may turn into the next Wright, Bennett, Beilein, or Williams if given enough time.
Mike Deane was clearly trending down at the end of 5 years. 21-12, 23-8, 22-9, 20-11, 14-15....with a bad recruiting class coming in for year 6. It was clear once he didn't have KO's players to rely on that he couldn't be successful. That plus his off the court antics made the decision easier.Patience doesn't mean a blank check. If the program is trending down or stagnating you cut your losses and look for your next coach.
I think it's much more accurate to judge the program compared to where it was five years ago - is it improving, stagnant, or worse off?
Straw man argument.If MU was a .500 team the last three years it would be an improvement over 5 years ago, correct? Would anyone be happy with that?Most adequate coaches could have improved MU from 5 years ago. MU's history, facilities and financial commitment give the MU head coach an advantage over most programs in the nation.IMO, Wojo is decent and possibly getting better, but a very strong argument could be made that last year may be Wojo's high water mark at MU. It does not appear MU is content with that because they did not throw a bunch of money or a long term extension at him. MU's administration, like most MU fans, seems to being taking a 'wait and see' approach with Wojo.
Again, for me...like with an athlete retiring, I see Coaches the same way..if you are going to get rid of them, it's better a year too early, then a year too late.
I hope it doesn't happen, but I'm going to be VERY curious to see what happens with pro Wojo supporters on this board, if this season isn't as good as last year was. That would be trending down like so many of you like to talk about. I'd bet anything he'd get a pass from a vast majority saying "it was a blip", he'll be fine, etc. He stays, And then what happens if the year after that is even worse?? Hence my point, better a year too soon then a year too late. Those two consecutive years of a downward trend, would in my opinion, be more detrimental to the program, then switching Coaches after next season IF it's worse than the previous year. I hope it doesn't happen.