[Cracked Sidewalks] The Charm Offensive

[CrackedSidewalksSays]

The Charm Offensive

Written by: noreply@blogger.com (NY Warrior)



After embracing a quiet, guarded public persona during his first few months on the job (which was incredibly refreshing given the media whoring we'd seen in previous years) Buzz Williams is emerging, ever so smartly and measured, in the media.  After nearly wrapping up the bulk of what looks to be a solid-to-very-good 2009 recruiting class, and in advance of the vital open recruiting season, Marquette fans (and others) are getting to know their head coach.

First we had the Buzz BBQ, a spectacular success by all accounts. +1

Next we had an article from a media outlet that we're not comfortable mentioning  given their bassackwards and unclear demands of new media.  Still, Colin Fly is a fine reporter and a few days ago he re-introduced Buzz Williams to the masses on the backs of the  program's greatest current strength, the Three Amigos.  +1

Now, we have the Holy Grail of sorts--- a big, fat feature on the Marquette program and Buzz Williams on ESPN.com.   The Adam Rittenberg article is a home run.  Williams is positioned as a decent, down-home fellow who worked his tail off to make his own breaks.  More importantly, coach Williams comes across as a player's coach (if there can be such a thing at the college level) and the accolades from Billy Gillispie and Jerel McNeal reaffirm the potential upside of the hire.  +1

While the media firehose we'd been drinking from in the past nine years has slowed considerably, one gets the sense that the coverage now is much more about the Marquette program than the coach himself.   Blatant self-interest (self promotion?) has its limitations -- and a well executed media strategy on behalf of the basketball program, rather than the coach, is bound to pay dividends.

http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2008/07/charm-offensive.html

[Shack]

I tend to disagree with the strategy, if indeed it is a strategy.  I think the current players like that approach but you need a face of the program to sell it to new recruits.  TC landed  top recruits because of the name Tom Crean (and probably D Wade) and not just the name Marquette.   And I would grade Buzz's first recruiting class as above average.  E. Williams and Maymon are very good gets, the rest seem like projects.   Just my opinion….

[MUCam]

I never understood questioning Crean's shameless (and I agree, at times it was shameless) self-promotion. Marquette definitely prospered in the national media under Crean's PR scheme. I remember a flight about ten years ago wherein MU basketball came up in a discussion between myself and another passenger.* Basically, the tone of the discussion from this individual was one of "what happened to MU...they were so great under McGuire." That perception - the lost program perception - no longer exists today. Just about everyone knows what MU basketball currently is, even if the knowledge is as petty as knowing MU as the team with "the cool uniforms." Much of that is attributable to Crean and the way he promoted himself and the university. Without Crean, I doubt we get the ESPN Gameday people at the Bradley Center. Without Crean, I doubt we get the MU - Converse link (despite the obvious Wade connection). Without Crean, I doubt we achieve much of the limelight we have received over the last few years, if even by virtue of articles primarily focused on our ex-coach.

Much of the MU reaped benefits of Crean's PR machine may have been incidental to the initial intentions of Crean's PR scheme, but it was beneficial. To question Crean's PR efforts is to overlook all the publicity MU received as a result. Crean may have been a used car salesman, but I'll tell you one thing - a lot of people bought used cars from him.

I am happy to see MU and Buzz continue to seek the media spotlight. We may all hate McDonald's commercials, but there is a reason they continue to exist. If you have a product you want to sell, you have to market it, market it and market it. Throw in some good PR, and you are ready for your sales. One of the things I feared most about the coaching change was the drop-off in marketing/PR that might be expected from a new coach. So far, I think that fear has proven unfounded.

* As an aside, I am adamantly against in-plane conversations.

[ToddPacker]

Buycks is not a project.  Fulce and Butler will contribute next year, again, not projects.  Fulce is reportedly going to provide more off the bench this year than Fitz did last year, so I would imagine he is really, really not a project. The only projects seem to be Otule and McMorrow, but MU is not really in a position to recruit 4 or 5 star 7' guys, so we need to start somewhere.  At least we'll have some size to prevent guys like the Lopez bros. from just turning and shooting right over our guys.

[MUONTOP]

IMO I would rather have the guy getting on the plane and going to AAU Tourny's and getting to know the recruits than the guy getting to know the Media. Yeah you can argue that media exposure gets your name out to recruits but it also diminishes the exclusiveness of getting to know Buzz Williams.  If it is on purpose I like the direction Buzz is going whereas the program becomes the face of the program rather than a the coach becoming the face.

[detroitwarrior]

Maymon is going to turn out to be more than just a good get. He has risen to #42 in the Rivals 150 and Jamil W is #60.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I never understood questioning Crean's shameless (and I agree, at times it was shameless) self-promotion. Marquette definitely prospered in the national media under Crean's PR scheme. I remember a flight about ten years ago wherein MU basketball came up in a discussion between myself and another passenger.* Basically, the tone of the discussion from this individual was one of "what happened to MU...they were so great under McGuire." That perception - the lost program perception - no longer exists today. Just about everyone knows what MU basketball currently is, even if the knowledge is as petty as knowing MU as the team with "the cool uniforms." Much of that is attributable to Crean and the way he promoted himself and the university. Without Crean, I doubt we get the ESPN Gameday people at the Bradley Center. Without Crean, I doubt we get the MU - Converse link (despite the obvious Wade connection). Without Crean, I doubt we achieve much of the limelight we have received over the last few years, if even by virtue of articles primarily focused on our ex-coach.

Much of the MU reaped benefits of Crean's PR machine may have been incidental to the initial intentions of Crean's PR scheme, but it was beneficial. To question Crean's PR efforts is to overlook all the publicity MU received as a result. Crean may have been a used car salesman, but I'll tell you one thing - a lot of people bought used cars from him.

I am happy to see MU and Buzz continue to seek the media spotlight. We may all hate McDonald's commercials, but there is a reason they continue to exist. If you have a product you want to sell, you have to market it, market it and market it. Throw in some good PR, and you are ready for your sales. One of the things I feared most about the coaching change was the drop-off in marketing/PR that might be expected from a new coach. So far, I think that fear has proven unfounded.

* As an aside, I am adamantly against in-plane conversations.

I agree with you about Crean.

People can bitch all they want about him being a salesman... but when I started at MU in 98, we had to listen to most of the road games on the radio because they weren't on TV... and this was coming off of the "legendary NIT loss to Minn." A lot of people (including me at the time) thought MU should go back and play at the arena (boy, was I wrong).

MU wasn't even on local television. It was brutal. A lot of that had to do with talent... but let's also look that a pretty bad team got to play on ABC against UNC 2 years later. I don't know if Crean deserves all of the credit... but certainly a fair amount.

We can say all we want about KO/Deane... but let's be honest, Crean did a ton of heavy lifting to get the school's profile raised. The other guys simply didn't want to do it or couldn't do it. Not saying it's right or wrong. It's just fact. 

Now, you could also argue that maybe Crean's ego got a little too big for the school... but it's that same ego that helped put the school back on the map.

It's a catch 22.

The big personality is what you need to rebuild a program... but once that program is built up, does the ego, coach-speak and perceived cockiness start to alienate the fan base?

I don't know the answer.

[Daniel]

I just have a feeling, with our coaching staff and reported ability to develop bigs, I just think Otule will plesantly surprise us this year - if we can get some good minutes defensively (he supposedly can run the floor well foir a big guy) and maybe 2 or 3 points a game from him, it would be great.  I'm hoping. . .am I drinking too much KoolAid? lol

[RJax55]

The big personality is what you need to rebuild a program... but once that program is built up, does the ego, coach-speak and perceived cockiness start to alienate the fan base?

I would have to say that for a segment of the MU fan base the answer is definitely a "yes". During the TC tenure, I had no beef with Crean's PR machine. MU was promoted extremely well and I was always impressed by the number of articles and mentions MU received in the national press. However, a good friend of mine did a 180 on his opinion of Crean a few years ago, mainly due to this PR machine.

He quickly tired of the coach-speak, name dropping, pregame jumbotron speeches and fluff up articles from what he saw as Crean's lapdogs (Katz, Bilas, Seth Davis) ... And no, he isn't PRN, DKCL or 4ever. His point was that Crean had built a top 25 program, let MU's record and success speak for itself.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

He quickly tired of the coach-speak, name dropping, pregame jumbotron speeches and fluff up articles from what he saw as Crean's lapdogs (Katz, Bilas, Seth Davis) ... And no, he isn't PRN, DKCL or 4ever. His point was that Crean had built a top 25 program, let MU's record and success speak for itself.

I don't think that evaluation is unfair at all.

I just figure a tiger can't change his stripes... so if you want a tiger, don't expect him to suddenly turn blue when you get sick of orange and black. In other words, don't expect Crean to suddenly become Mr. "Aw shucks, thanks guys" after he raises MU's profile. He's going to keep going. If MU was on TV 6 nights a week, Crean would want 7. He's hyper-competitive and from all accounts a workaholic.

Also, I find it a bit ironic that some alumni who revere Al (one of the biggest showman of all time, an admitted BS'er, and he was a "slick" guy from NYC!), dismiss Crean for being too much about PR and being a used car salesman.

For the record, I'm not turning this into a Crean vs Al thread (I like them both)... I just find people's perceptions and biases interesting.

[RJax55]

I agree with you, 2002.

I just wanted to point out that there was MU fans, removed from the message boards, that became very put off by Crean's media approach.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I agree with you, 2002.

I just wanted to point out that there was MU fans, removed from the message boards, that became very put off by Crean's media approach.

Yep, there surely some. And some of there points are valid, just not all of them. 

Hell, some people hated Al as well.   

[77ncaachamps]

I agree with Crean's juggernaut of a PR campaign. It really helped place MU back on the NATIONAL radar.

However, with strengths come weaknesses. He was a great preparer but iffy game day coach. He'd recruit some stellar players but never be able to get the team (or multiple top 100 recruits in a year) to actually put MU as a serious yearly NCAA Championship contender. And it seemed HE was beginning to become the face of the MU program, not his players.

Hopefully, Buzz's machinations thus far will far outweigh any deficiencies he may possess.

[79Warrior]

The Charm Offensive

Written by: noreply@blogger.com (NY Warrior)



After embracing a quiet, guarded public persona during his first few months on the job (which was incredibly refreshing given the media whoring we'd seen in previous years) Buzz Williams is emerging, ever so smartly and measured, in the media.  After nearly wrapping up the bulk of what looks to be a solid-to-very-good 2009 recruiting class, and in advance of the vital open recruiting season, Marquette fans (and others) are getting to know their head coach.

First we had the Buzz BBQ, a spectacular success by all accounts. +1

Next we had an article from a media outlet that we're not comfortable mentioning  given their bassackwards and unclear demands of new media.  Still, Colin Fly is a fine reporter and a few days ago he re-introduced Buzz Williams to the masses on the backs of the  program's greatest current strength, the Three Amigos.  +1

Now, we have the Holy Grail of sorts--- a big, fat feature on the Marquette program and Buzz Williams on ESPN.com.   The Adam Rittenberg article is a home run.  Williams is positioned as a decent, down-home fellow who worked his tail off to make his own breaks.  More importantly, coach Williams comes across as a player's coach (if there can be such a thing at the college level) and the accolades from Billy Gillispie and Jerel McNeal reaffirm the potential upside of the hire.  +1

While the media firehose we'd been drinking from in the past nine years has slowed considerably, one gets the sense that the coverage now is much more about the Marquette program than the coach himself.   Blatant self-interest (self promotion?) has its limitations -- and a well executed media strategy on behalf of the basketball program, rather than the coach, is bound to pay dividends.

http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2008/07/charm-offensive.html

disagree completely on your Crean comments.

Who was bigger, Al or MU. Many would say Al eclipsed MU big time.

[CAINMUTINY]

Crean by anyone's accounts should be viewed as a great recruiter but an abysmal bench coach.  And while he was a good PR showman, people can see past that especially HS coaches and recruits. 

Al might have been a showman but he didn't give a F*** about what other people thought and was a straight shooter, Crean doesn't have the greatest reputation in that regard. 

Crean's PR machine should also be recognized that is was powered by D Wade, and he will continue to show loyalty to MU before Crean.

People just need to realize that MU is better off w/o Crean; Wade has done more than any PR firm or Crean himself could ever have accomplished on MU's behalf.  The goal here should be to continue our support for the program and all will be well; we have a possible top 10 recruiting class for next year and play in the best basketball conf. in the country....and oh yeah we have a top 15 pre-season ranking.  Thanks Tom for all you've done but don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out.  Crean's statement "Its Indiana, Its Indiana" reminds me of what people who bought tickets on the Titanic must have said  "Its the Titanic, Its the Titanic".   

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Crean by anyone's accounts should be viewed as a great recruiter but an abysmal bench coach.  And while he was a good PR showman, people can see past that especially HS coaches and recruits. 

Al might have been a showman but he didn't give a F*** about what other people thought and was a straight shooter, Crean doesn't have the greatest reputation in that regard. 

Crean's PR machine should also be recognized that is was powered by D Wade, and he will continue to show loyalty to MU before Crean.

People just need to realize that MU is better off w/o Crean; Wade has done more than any PR firm or Crean himself could ever have accomplished on MU's behalf.  The goal here should be to continue our support for the program and all will be well; we have a possible top 10 recruiting class for next year and play in the best basketball conf. in the country....and oh yeah we have a top 15 pre-season ranking.  Thanks Tom for all you've done but don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out.  Crean's statement "Its Indiana, Its Indiana" reminds me of what people who bought tickets on the Titanic must have said  "Its the Titanic, Its the Titanic".   

I agree that Wade was the major tool for the MU hype, but Crean brought in Wade (you may not like it, but you have to give Crean some credit for that)

Also if you look at my previous post, MU hadn't been on national television in a while, and BAM in Crean's second year they get a game at UNC on ABC. This is pre-wade, pre-final 4, pre - being competitive. This was because Tom and the athletic department had high goals and they went after it. Can't give Wade credit for that one. You also can't credit wade for waking up the student section and having them get to game before the opening tip. That credit goes to Coach Crean, who used to meet with students every week to encourage them to come out to games (again, pre-wade)

Now, I'm not going to debate whether or not Crean was a good bench coach or whether you should like the guy. People have already made up their minds and there is no changing that.

But, I will say that Crean's marketing and PR abilities shouldn't be underestimated. MU has some tradition, and is a nice school. However, let's face it, in 1998, the program wasn't exactly headed to the promised land. It wasn't a dire situation, but it by no means was perfect:

Small catholic school
out of date practice facility
an NBA arena that they couldn't come close to filling
hardly any national reputation with anybody under 30
no television contract (at least not a good one anyways)
no big time shoe contract (with nike or converse)
a nickname that everybody hated and was divided on

Now, there were certainly some positives as well:
Some rich boosters that were awaiting something big... just needed to wake them up
Its a hoops only school, so basketball is king
NBA arena is big, but is still a pretty good facility
etc. etc.

All I'm saying is, whether you like him or not... whether you think he's a jerk or not, whether you think MU is better with Buzz or not... you have to admit to yourself that Tom Crean did a lot of good for Marquette University. Period.

That's it. No qualifying statements. No "but his substitutions sucked". He did a lot of good for MU. Admit it everybody.

Also, you may think he's a terrible guy, and he's going to fail at IU... but what if he doesn't? What if he wins a lot? What do you say then?

If he loses a lot, I'll have to admit that maybe he was more hype than substance. I can admit that.

But, if he wins, can the Crean haters admit that he's a good coach? Not so sure about that one. They'll probably just say he got lucky to land some big recruits (ala wade) and he's still a crappy coach.

[CAINMUTINY]

Just for reference Crean did not discover Wade; It was Dwayne Stephens, and he should deserve credit for the signing of Wade, not Crean.

I also wouldn't read into the game into UNC to much, as we have always had a few nationally televised games (I grew up in NY and can attest that every year I had the opportunity to catch MU on TV) most years, and that is directly attributed to the business side of basketball, i.e. we were willing to accept less than another school, or were willing to give up a home game in order to have a televised game; and not because Crean is some PR guru. 

[bma725]

Just for reference Crean did not discover Wade; It was Dwayne Stephens, and he should deserve credit for the signing of Wade, not Crean.

Stephens had nothing to do with it, it was Tim Buckley.

[CAINMUTINY]

I beg to differ...but it is what it is; Just illuminating my point that Crean didn't make him a priority but his assistants that saw him drop 45 points did.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Just for reference Crean did not discover Wade; It was Dwayne Stephens, and he should deserve credit for the signing of Wade, not Crean.

I also wouldn't read into the game into UNC to much, as we have always had a few nationally televised games (I grew up in NY and can attest that every year I had the opportunity to catch MU on TV) most years, and that is directly attributed to the business side of basketball, i.e. we were willing to accept less than another school, or were willing to give up a home game in order to have a televised game; and not because Crean is some PR guru. 

Hey man, that's fine.

We can just agree to disagree.

Even if one of Crean's assistants discovered Wade (I have no idea, and I'm not going to debate this one), shouldn't Crean should get some credit for hiring the assistant?

Anyways, I just look at MU when Crean arrived... and look at MU when Crean left.

No other coach (other than AL, and he's in a league of his own) has had such a positive impact in his 9 seasons.

I realize he rubs a lot of people the wrong way. I realize he's a little arrogant. I realize that Wade is a once in a lifetime player.

BUT, Crean, Wild, MU, etc. deserve a lot of credit for building MU back up. That's it.

People can chose where the credit really goes... but I would argue that MU's workaholic former coach was the driving force behind a lot of it.

Proof?

The 2 coaches before Crean didn't have nearly the spotlight, excitement or attendance that MU had.

[Daniel]

Crean did us a lot of good.  Let's hope Buzz, in his way, can get us the national coverage, recognition, and recruits that we need to move forward.  People have different methodologies - let's see how Buzz manages this.

[Pakuni]

I beg to differ...but it is what it is; Just illuminating my point that Crean didn't make him a priority but his assistants that saw him drop 45 points did.

It was Buckley, who had seen and started to recruit Dwyane while he was an assistant at Ball State.
Regardless, your point is a bit like arguing that Columbus didn't discover America first, it was a lookout on the Pinta. 

[muwarrior87]

well if we wanna get technical, the Chinese discovered it long before Columbus, just never colonized. And the Vikings were here prior to that too.
   

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

well if we wanna get technical, the Chinese discovered it long before Columbus, just never colonized. And the Vikings were here prior to that too.
   

1421 - The Year China Discovered America  It's a good read!

[avid1010]

Al and TC went about business in completely different ways. 

Al was a New Yorker, who countlessly would say things like "if they'll give you the money, you better take it." 

TC would talk about MU and the Al legacy being so important to him, and then leave it for IU and the Bobby Knight legacy. 

Al was open, honest, committed to his players and nothing short of a class act.  He never pretended to be anything he was not, and I'm not sure I know of many people as comfortable in their own skin as Al.  I always think I can see the Al influence in Rick Majerus because he seems pretty comfortable being Rick Majerus as well.  I never got that feeling with TC.  I'm not about to judge him...just an observation.

[RawdogDX]

And it seemed HE was beginning to become the face of the MU program, not his players.

I don't think that is a fair criticism at all.
WHo is the face of Duke?  the coach
Syracuse? coach
unc? coach
madison? coach
michigan? coach
florida? coach
Memphis?  It was rose until a week ago but now, you guessed it, the coach.

i watch a bit of college basketball and wouldn't recognize some of the best players on those teams if they walked past, the coaches on the other hand...
Any coach who is around for a decade of winning always becomes the face of the program over the players, most of whom are only starters for a few years and gone in one if they are all stars.

[RedWebster]

I don't think that is a fair criticism at all.
WHo is the face of Duke?  the coach
Syracuse? coach
unc? coach
madison? coach
michigan? coach
florida? coach
Memphis?  It was rose until a week ago but now, you guessed it, the coach.

i watch a bit of college basketball and wouldn't recognize some of the best players on those teams if they walked past, the coaches on the other hand...
Any coach who is around for a decade of winning always becomes the face of the program over the players, most of whom are only starters for a few years and gone in one if they are all stars.

The coach is always the face of the program...and in our case, the university.

The face of Marquette basketball and the university is now Buzz Williams...a tobacco chewing Texan with a shaved head.

The excitement is almost unbearable.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Al and TC went about business in completely different ways. 

Al was a New Yorker, who countlessly would say things like "if they'll give you the money, you better take it." 

TC would talk about MU and the Al legacy being so important to him, and then leave it for IU and the Bobby Knight legacy. 

Al was open, honest, committed to his players and nothing short of a class act.  He never pretended to be anything he was not, and I'm not sure I know of many people as comfortable in their own skin as Al.  I always think I can see the Al influence in Rick Majerus because he seems pretty comfortable being Rick Majerus as well.  I never got that feeling with TC.  I'm not about to judge him...just an observation.

I can't say that I know Al personally (shook his hand once), but I think peoples perceptions of him are really interesting.

Obviously he was a total original and pretty much feared nothing. However, I think the whole "straight shooter" thing is an interesting take (I'm generalizing how most people view Al).

I can see how people think that, and I even agree to an extent. But, let's also remember Al himself admitted that he was first and foremost a salesman and promoter.

He tells a story (in an TV interview) about going in to interview for the MU job, and he wasn't really interested in it (said he was just going through the motions). However, once he found out he wasn't the favorite to win the job, he got mad and decided that he would win the job (Al is such a competitor). He charmed the pants off in the interview and won the job.

Anyways, my point is, Al could turn on the charm if he wanted to. I'm not calling him a liar, or dishonest at all... but let's face it... part of being a good salesman is persuading people and tell them the things they like to here.

The perception of Al by most is "He's a real straight shooter, I tell ya.", when the reality is he probably was just charming enough to cover for any sort of double talk that he had used. Again, not saying he was a "double talker" or a liar. Just saying he was good enough to know how to get out of some tight spots.

I find the perception of Al vs the perception of Crean very interesting. I know they are not alike in many ways, I just find the contrasting perceptions interesting when both coaches might have been using many of the same communication tactics.

For the record, I really like and respect what both coaches have done, and this is not a debate about who is better. I'm just commenting on the perceptions that people have about each.

A lot of people like to treat Crean like Satin and Al like the Messiah when the reality is that they are both just humans.

[dwaderoy2004]

The face of Marquette basketball and the university is now Buzz Williams...a tobacco chewing Texan with a shaved head.

man, when you put it like that, that sounds pretty awesome.  really bad-ass.

[avid1010]

I can't say that I know Al personally (shook his hand once), but I think peoples perceptions of him are really interesting.

Obviously he was a total original and pretty much feared nothing. However, I think the whole "straight shooter" thing is an interesting take (I'm generalizing how most people view Al).

I can see how people think that, and I even agree to an extent. But, let's also remember Al himself admitted that he was first and foremost a salesman and promoter.

He tells a story (in an TV interview) about going in to interview for the MU job, and he wasn't really interested in it (said he was just going through the motions). However, once he found out he wasn't the favorite to win the job, he got mad and decided that he would win the job (Al is such a competitor). He charmed the pants off in the interview and won the job.

Anyways, my point is, Al could turn on the charm if he wanted to. I'm not calling him a liar, or dishonest at all... but let's face it... part of being a good salesman is persuading people and tell them the things they like to here.

The perception of Al by most is "He's a real straight shooter, I tell ya.", when the reality is he probably was just charming enough to cover for any sort of double talk that he had used. Again, not saying he was a "double talker" or a liar. Just saying he was good enough to know how to get out of some tight spots.

I find the perception of Al vs the perception of Crean very interesting. I know they are not alike in many ways, I just find the contrasting perceptions interesting when both coaches might have been using many of the same communication tactics.

For the record, I really like and respect what both coaches have done, and this is not a debate about who is better. I'm just commenting on the perceptions that people have about each.

A lot of people like to treat Crean like Satin and Al like the Messiah when the reality is that they are both just humans.

The difference is that Al would admit it.  He'd tell kids to take the money because he would.  He didn't pretend to be a great human being, and while I didn't know him well at all, he'd always mention he had skelletons in his closest the few times I did talk with him.  He seemed much more comfortable with himself than TC. 

TC was completely different.  He would never even look you in the eye; however, he ran a clean program, and I rarely disliked a player and/or TC's actions or the players actions for that matter.  I just always thought he was a bit of a Phil Mickleson.

[Tulsa Warrior]

Al was smoother and a natural on the PR and sales thing.  People didn't know or care if they were being sold.  Al got what he wanted and made you like it.  He came to Marquette in full bloom.  Crean is not a natural and has had to work on it more. (give himcredit)  He also came to Marquette as a work in progress.  FYI, if he is to succeed at IU he'll have to develop more as a coach.

The other contrast is Al was smart enough to have Hank Raymonds and Rick Majerus.  Crean has had trouble holding on to quality assistants and it wasn't just because of the different in eras.

Buzz is a question mark.  What we do know is he's a hell of a recruiter with a work ethic that surpasses Crean's. That is saying a lot.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

The difference is that Al would admit it.  He'd tell kids to take the money because he would.  He didn't pretend to be a great human being, and while I didn't know him well at all, he'd always mention he had skelletons in his closest the few times I did talk with him.  He seemed much more comfortable with himself than TC. 

TC was completely different.  He would never even look you in the eye; however, he ran a clean program, and I rarely disliked a player and/or TC's actions or the players actions for that matter.  I just always thought he was a bit of a Phil Mickleson.

I don't think your assessment is unfair... Like I said, I just find perceptions to be interesting.

Al never had to face the media or internet scrutiny that Crean does... that might make a difference in how he was perceived.

Again, not comparing the 2 of them... just comparing how people view them (ie comments about either's coaching ability don't really matter, having hank raymonds doesn't matter, etc).

[avid1010]

Right.  I find it interesting as well, and its hard to explain why I have so much respect for Al and so little for TC.  I came to this conclusion long before TC left for IU, and I really don't have a problem with 90% of what TC did while at MU.

I guess I always felt like Al was looking at the "big picture" for himself, his players and the university; while TC was very narrow as his life was STRICTLY basketball.

I guess I feel like there's a big difference in that Al was often quoted by others while TC often quoted others.  They weren't in the same league as people or coaches in my mind.  I always felt that way about Wooden and Dean Smith as well. 

[Daniel]

Al was very comfortable with, and confident in, himself. . .I don't think we have had a coach since that has exhibited the same levels.

Let's see how Buzz does - I like his focus on his character, adn I think he knows where he came from and how he got where he is today - so let's see how he does.

[muball]

I really think when people think of UW the face in the school and not the coach. Alot of people across the country know UW and where it is but not their fball or bball coaches names. When it comes to Marquette it was not umcommon for people not to know where it actually and in many cases who their coach is.  This was not uncommon when traveling.

Crean did alot of good selling to the Vitales and analyst which put MU in the spot light and that was a super thing. I also think that Cords did some significant things behind the scenes to raise MU exposure.

Now with BEast exposure winning should keep us in the National spotlight. If Buzz can improve on our record then we should be just fine.