Recruiting - Buzz that good?

[madtownwarrior]

The article by Gary Parrish seems to think so:   

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/23147374/candid-coaches-all-things-equal-who-is-basketballs-top-recruiter

[mr.MUskie]

"If he was at Duke, UNC, Kansas or Kentucky he would dominate the rest of them."

Real dig at MU.

[MU86NC]

"If he was at Duke, UNC, Kansas or Kentucky he would dominate the rest of them."

Real dig at MU.

what r u talking about?  Great compliment!  Blue bloods....

[We R Final Four]

"If he was at Duke, UNC, Kansas or Kentucky he would dominate the rest of them."

Real dig at MU.

I think more of a dig at the 2nd tiers--MSU FLA etc.  I'm sure Izzo and Donovan want to distance themselves from MU but Buzz wont let it happen.  Take note we are right on your heels boys.

[CAGASS24]

All depends who's reading it as to what it's saying.  I like it as a fan; Buzz may be fueled by it to achieve all of his goals here.  It could also lead to some anxiety about the probability of getting those done here as opposed to the aforementioned.

[GGGG]

"If he was at Duke, UNC, Kansas or Kentucky he would dominate the rest of them."

Real dig at MU.

How dare Parrish not list us as one of the top four programs in the country!!!  Bulletin board material!!!

[brewcity77]

Anyone not seeing what MUskie meant, Parrish is saying that Buzz has a cap at Marquette. That he can do well, but that if he had a major brand name school logo on his jacket he would be unstoppable. That if he took over Duke, Kansas, or UNC, he would be pulling in classes similar to or even better than what Calipari is getting at Kentucky.

For better or worse, Crean's inability to consistently recruit the highest level players and top big men at MU contributed to him leaving. Buzz has a bigger name cachet than Crean had when he left and has shown himself to be a better and more consistent recruiter at this level. Not every coach is able to translate their success as they move up tiers, but Crean has done that effectively by bringing in top recruiting classes. If Buzz gets a similar itch to the one that led to Crean leaving, he'd likely go to a school with just as much prestige as IU and Parrish seems to be saying he would use the school's name credentials even more effectively.

I hope he stays for his entire career, but there are really only 2 things I can see driving Buzz away. Bad relations with management or the feeling that he will never get over the hump of top-10 talent and national titles here at Marquette. That said, we are really fortunate to have him. There isn't another coach in the country I would rather have here and I hope he stays as long as we will have him.

[bilsu]

There is no doubt that he is a hard worker and leaves no stone unturned. However, is he a great recruiter? I had to think about that and I think that ignores or minimizes what he does as a coach. The real question is (one that I cannot answer) did he do a great job recruiting Jimmy Butler or a greater job developing him? I think Buzz really pushes his players and some players like Roseborro and TJ Taylor decide quickly that they do not want to be a part of it. The ones that stay learn to be tough players with the mentality that every possession matters. Would the same group of players recruited by a different coach had as much success? My belief is that in most cases another coach would not have been as successful with the same players.

[GGGG]

Anyone not seeing what MUskie meant, Parrish is saying that Buzz has a cap at Marquette. That he can do well, but that if he had a major brand name school logo on his jacket he would be unstoppable. That if he took over Duke, Kansas, or UNC, he would be pulling in classes similar to or even better than what Calipari is getting at Kentucky.

For better or worse, Crean's inability to consistently recruit the highest level players and top big men at MU contributed to him leaving. Buzz has a bigger name cachet than Crean had when he left and has shown himself to be a better and more consistent recruiter at this level. Not every coach is able to translate their success as they move up tiers, but Crean has done that effectively by bringing in top recruiting classes. If Buzz gets a similar itch to the one that led to Crean leaving, he'd likely go to a school with just as much prestige as IU and Parrish seems to be saying he would use the school's name credentials even more effectively.

I hope he stays for his entire career, but there are really only 2 things I can see driving Buzz away. Bad relations with management or the feeling that he will never get over the hump of top-10 talent and national titles here at Marquette. That said, we are really fortunate to have him. There isn't another coach in the country I would rather have here and I hope he stays as long as we will have him.

I understand fully what he meant.  I just don't think not including MU with those schools is a "dig" at MU.  There are literally hundreds of schools that fall in the same boat.

[frozena pizza]

Just to be clear, Parrish isn't saying anything about Buzz.  This is a poll of other coaches at all levels and he does not identify who made the quote about Buzz (which is a huge compliment btw).  Parrish's only comment is that Calipari is by far the best and should have received more of the vote.  You could probably say that Sean Miller, Scott Drew and Josh Pastner would also dominate at a top tier blue blood.

[brewcity77]

I understand fully what he meant.  I just don't think not including MU with those schools is a "dig" at MU.  There are literally hundreds of schools that fall in the same boat.

Wasn't at all aimed at you.

[dgies9156]

Look, Rome wasn't built in a day and neither is our reputation. We had a "good" brand name during the last 10 years, but not a great one before Buzz arrived. It takes time for anyone to build a cache at an institution.

Candidly, Tom Crean used the institution as a crutch for his own weaknesses and the failure to sustain the success he had recruiting DWade and the guys in the early 2000s. He failed to see that after Mike Deane, it really was a rebuild job here at Marquette.

My guess is that if I was at Kentucky, Duke, North Carolina or Kansas, I'd have a decent chance in the short-run of pulling in a Top 10 class. In the long run ... yeah, right! It would be even worse than us under Bob Dukiet!!!!

Even Al took time before he was "Al". His first recruiting "hit" was George Thompson, followed in succession by Dean the Dream Meminger, Ric Cobb, George Frazier, Jim Chones, Bob Lackey, Maurice Lucas etc. By the early to mid 1970s, we were a destination address on par with UCLA, North Carolina and the like. That was five to nine years after Al took over.

We will be a destination address again if we don't slaughter the golden goose. I see in Buzz what we saw in Al in the 1960s. Sustain success as a coach means sustained recruiting success. We're close to being a destination address, but we're not quite there yet!

In Buzz we trust!!!!!!!

[Goose]

I believe Buzz has ability to be the top recruiter in the country, but do not think it can happen at MU. Not being in play with Tokoto, Looney and possibly Stone shows that it is a tough sell for 5 stars, even local kids. Not really getting to bat with Looney and Tokoto was disappointing to me in a big way. Not because Buzz could not land them, but because we really had zero chance by all accounts.

I realize most on here dismissed my comment last week regarding being in kids final cut list and I stick by it. It was noted that no recruit will know if we were finalist for Looney in five years and that is correct. What I think was missed was with internet having MU name on any five star player final list is building a brand. I will say again that not being on Looney's final cut list is a negative. The more times you are in on top players the easier it gets to land one.

[BCHoopster]

I believe Buzz has ability to be the top recruiter in the country, but do not think it can happen at MU. Not being in play with Tokoto, Looney and possibly Stone shows that it is a tough sell for 5 stars, even local kids. Not really getting to bat with Looney and Tokoto was disappointing to me in a big way. Not because Buzz could not land them, but because we really had zero chance by all accounts.

I realize most on here dismissed my comment last week regarding being in kids final cut list and I stick by it. It was noted that no recruit will know if we were finalist for Looney in five years and that is correct. What I think was missed was with internet having MU name on any five star player final list is building a brand. I will say again that not being on Looney's final cut list is a negative. The more times you are in on top players the easier it gets to land one.

Any way you look at it, MU is not a Blue Blood program, now that they are in the new Big East, I am sure that will hurt and not help the program.  What is more of an issue, is that if
Buzz can not get in the door on the 3 top kids from Milwaukee, how is he going to get a 5-star from outside the city.  Of course, it only take one to do that, so time will tell.  I think Stone is a hugh recruit for many reasons, but the biggest reason it is the missing piece to the puzzle.  Ben Lammer is a nice project, but he is a few years away.

[swoopem]

Jeez he's been here for 5 years and with time he's only going to get better. I really really hope he stays here for his career because I think by the time he retires we'll have multiple National Championships with or withour top 10 recruits.

[BCHoopster]

Jeez he's been here for 5 years and with time he's only going to get better. I really really hope he stays here for his career because I think by the time he retires we'll have multiple National Championships with or withour top 10 recruits.

You must be smoking some good weed, multiple championships, are you serious.  If he was able to recruit, Stone, Looney and what he has now it might have been possible, but even
with that, you need some luck winning close games, even Al got 2 close victories to even get into the final game, against NC.  As good as Al was and his teams, he got to the championship
game twice in 10 0r 12 years.  Not easy.  Plus Al got a Top 5 kid almost every year, sometimes 2.

[Goose]

BCHoopster

Right on. It is very difficult to win one NC wihout several 5 stars on the team. It can be done, but very, very difficult. Not sniffing the local kids has to be eye opener to Buzz to some extent. I would think many on hear that Looney and Stone were likely MU guys and Looney dropped us early in process. I know I was drooling a couple of years ago about Tokoto, Looney and Stone all being Warriors.

[BCHoopster]

BCHoopster

Right on. It is very difficult to win one NC wihout several 5 stars on the team. It can be done, but very, very difficult. Not sniffing the local kids has to be eye opener to Buzz to some extent. I would think many on hear that Looney and Stone were likely MU guys and Looney dropped us early in process. I know I was drooling a couple of years ago about Tokoto, Looney and Stone all being Warriors.

1976, 5 NBA players, lost to Indiana, the year they went undefeated.

Walton
lee
Whitehead
Ellis
Tatum

All played in the NBA.  Best team MU had, maybe 71 with Chones, McGuire, Memminger, Brell, Lackey, still did not win it with them, ok, bad ref against Ohio St., but that is what
can happen.

[swoopem]

You must be smoking some good weed, multiple championships, are you serious.  If he was able to recruit, Stone, Looney and what he has now it might have been possible, but even
with that, you need some luck winning close games, even Al got 2 close victories to even get into the final game, against NC.  As good as Al was and his teams, he got to the championship
game twice in 10 0r 12 years.  Not easy.  Plus Al got a Top 5 kid almost every year, sometimes 2.

You think I mess around with schwag? Also I didn't realize college basketball was going to become extinct in the next few years. We have plenty of time, Buzz is 40.

And big deal we didn't get Looney. We're still in on Stone and from what I've seen from Buzz he'll continue to recruit great players and then coach them up beyond their potential. As long as Buzz is our coach I stand by my statement.

[BubbaWilliams]

You think I mess around with schwag? Also I didn't realize college basketball was going to become extinct in the next few years. We have plenty of time, Buzz is 40.

And big deal we didn't get Looney. We're still in on Stone and from what I've seen from Buzz he'll continue to recruit great players and then coach them up beyond their potential. As long as Buzz is our coach I stand by my statement.

Amen brother!

[Norm]

BCHoopster

Right on. It is very difficult to win one NC wihout several 5 stars on the team. It can be done, but very, very difficult. Not sniffing the local kids has to be eye opener to Buzz to some extent. I would think many on hear that Looney and Stone were likely MU guys and Looney dropped us early in process. I know I was drooling a couple of years ago about Tokoto, Looney and Stone all being Warriors.

I think one thing that hurts Marquette recruiting local kids is that, unless things have changed in recent years, the school is not embraced by the metro Milwaukee area at all. There is always the undercurrent that MU is full of spoiled rich kids, even if that is not reality (there are some for sure, but not the majority). The State of Wisconsin embraces UW-Madison so thoroughly, that is is hard fro MU to cut through that. Having said that though, even UW loses in-city recruits like Wes Matthews and Vander Blue. Some kids just want to go to college in a different city that they grew up in.

[NotAnAlum]

You think I mess around with schwag? Also I didn't realize college basketball was going to become extinct in the next few years. We have plenty of time, Buzz is 40.

And big deal we didn't get Looney. We're still in on Stone and from what I've seen from Buzz he'll continue to recruit great players and then coach them up beyond their potential. As long as Buzz is our coach I stand by my statement.

If Vander hadn't listened to some stupid advice and declared this team would walk into next year ranked in the top 10.  If Wilson can step in at the point and JJJ gives them a reliable zone buster they could have easily gotten to March with only 3 or 4 losses.  that gets you #1 or #2 seed and effectively a pass to the second weekend.  Right there you have a shot at a championship with a team that has elite 8 experience.  In other words Buzz already has recruited the players that would put that goal in reach.  The rest of it is luck, getting hot at the right time etc.  Didn't Al say if you go enough eventually you'll win even if its not with your best team.  Buzz would have more shots at a blueblood but he'd have more pressure to win right away.  It is do-able here.

[Goose]

Norm

Politely disgaree on inner city Milwaukee kids thinking MU is a rich kids school. The MU/Buzz brand is definitely seen in different light in the inner city. Buzz has MU cool again and he relates to inner city kids better than anyone since Al.

[We R Final Four]

I think one thing that hurts Marquette recruiting local kids is that, unless things have changed in recent years, the school is not embraced by the metro Milwaukee area at all. There is always the undercurrent that MU is full of spoiled rich kids

........from Chicago. When Aaron Rodgers comes up on the jumbo screen and says "let's go Marquette" and that very same fan base boos him at the top of their lungs....It is easy for some in metro Milwaukee not to be in love with such people. He is the prodical son in these parts who says he watches MU all the time only to get blasted at a home game.

[BubbaWilliams]

........from Chicago. When Aaron Rodgers comes up on the jumbo screen and says "let's go Marquette" and that very same fan base boos him at the top of their lungs....It is easy for some in metro Milwaukee not to be in love with such people. He is the prodical son in these parts who says he watches MU all the time only to get blasted at a home game.

The same @$$hat who complains about his height and backed a known steroid user?