Masters 2018

[tower912]

For those who don't know Pat Reed's history and don't feel like googling it......
One year at UGA.  Then transferred to Augusta State.    Underage drinking (admitted).   Rumors of allegations of stealing from teammates.   Rumors of allegations of posting lower scores than what he shot during qualifying for team events.    Rumors of allegations of possibly cheating (hitting the wrong ball).    Rumors of being so estranged from his Augusta St teammates that they were rooting against him in match play even if it cost them the tourney.
Estranged from parents.   Ostensibly because they did not support his marriage, thinking he was too young and there was too great an age difference between him and his bride (she is 4 years older)      That rift has not healed and has deepened with time.
No friends on the PGA tour.   Known to swear over open mic's.    As recently as last week, made a snarky remark caught on a cellphone about not getting a favorable drop that he would have gotten if his name was Jordan Spieth.

[4everwarriors]

Weird question for the guys who have been there.  Did you see any squirrels?  Someone that called in on The Dan Lebatard Show said that Augusta National "got rid" of any squirrels on the course.  Michael Collins (ESPN golf reporter) said that he asked a member and was told a story about how the type of trees on the course are too soft of wood and squirrels don't like them.  Seems fishy.  Just curious.

Der wuz a squirrly lookin' dude on #18. Pretty sure it wuz F*ckin', doe, hey?

[rocket surgeon]

You have proof, right?

I laughed at your depiction of the media "cover-ups" of Jordan, Barkley and Woods.

They have been among the most scrutinized athletes ever. Jordan would go out after games and gamble, and it would be reported and he would be criticized ... and then, tired and hung-over, he would go out and score 40 in a playoff game.

Barkley's bar brawls went public, stories broken by the aggressive media.

Same with Tiger.

Did every situation involving each of them get reported? Of course not. The same is true of Brady, Sinatra and Trump, too.

Tiger might have used steroids. I just did some quick googling; all of the results were mad speculation. You seem to be accepting it as a fact. Cool. Reed might do steroids, too.

so tiger's doc gets stopped at canadian border with juice and tiger suddenly goes off the grid to surgery for back issues or sumpin.  barkeley and jordan got a pass compared to some.  still had to laugh however, 'bout charlie's big adventure in Az. 2008 new years eve-DUI and bj.  was going back for seconds as she had given him the best one he ever had.  gotta love charlie. he's always good for a chuckle

 http://www.tmz.com/2009/01/01/barkley-all-i-really-wanted-was-oral-sex/

[rocket surgeon]

For those who don't know Pat Reed's history and don't feel like googling it......
One year at UGA.  Then transferred to Augusta State.    Underage drinking (admitted).   Rumors of allegations of stealing from teammates.   Rumors of allegations of posting lower scores than what he shot during qualifying for team events.    Rumors of allegations of possibly cheating (hitting the wrong ball).    Rumors of being so estranged from his Augusta St teammates that they were rooting against him in match play even if it cost them the tourney.
Estranged from parents.   Ostensibly because they did not support his marriage, thinking he was too young and there was too great an age difference between him and his bride (she is 4 years older)      That rift has not healed and has deepened with time.
No friends on the PGA tour.   Known to swear over open mic's.    As recently as last week, made a snarky remark caught on a cellphone about not getting a favorable drop that he would have gotten if his name was Jordan Spieth.

what?  he swore over an open mic?  say it ain't so...not like it wasn't a big f" ing deal err anything, eyyn'aaa?

[MU82]

so tiger's doc gets stopped at canadian border with juice and tiger suddenly goes off the grid to surgery for back issues or sumpin.  barkeley and jordan got a pass compared to some.

Exactly. Zero proof on Tiger's roids.

Exactly. Barkley and Jordan got a pass compared to some, got covered more compared to others. Welcome to life.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Rocket, you're reaching Wades levels of steroid accusations. Tiger isn't a perfect dude by any stretch, sleeping with god knows how many women when he was married with kids obviously isn't spectacular behavior. But there has been no proof connecting Tiger with roids.

[Goose]

Danny Willitt will be the happiest guy at next years Champions Dinner. He got nudged by Reed for the guy most disliked by the group. Bobby Jones likely would not be too happy with this years champion.

[Jockey]

You have proof, right?

I laughed at your depiction of the media "cover-ups" of Jordan, Barkley and Woods.

Hmmm. Interesting WHY he picked these 3 guys, but in a discussion about golf, never mentioned John Daly, or Dustin Johnson. Are they in some strange way different from the 3 guys he mentioned?

[mu_hilltopper]

Damn, I didn't know any of Reed's baggage while I watched yesterday.  I was rooting for him because it's sad to see people choke.  But now ...

http://www.golf.com/knockdown/2018/04/08/masters-patrick-reed-estranged-family-complex-mix-emotions

[MU82]

Hmmm. Interesting WHY he picked these 3 guys, but in a discussion about golf, never mentioned John Daly, or Dustin Johnson. Are they in some strange way different from the 3 guys he mentioned?

Indeed.

[MUBurrow]

Its good to have a couple of guys that you don't want to win though, ya know? I know Tiger gets all the eyeballs, but I love watching this next batch of guys. Problem is, they're all so damn likable.  Rory, Spieth, Justin Thomas, Rickie, Rahm (seems like a good guy even though he had a tough day yesterday), Jason Day. DJ is probably more controversial, but his demons seem to be mostly his own and I think he's pretty well liked on the tour. Hard to be disappointed whenever any of those guys win and they all seem to genuinely like each other. Throwing Reed, Bubba, and a couple of other guys in there to play the villain is good for the game, too. Just not as fun the monday after one of those guys actually wins.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Tiger might have used steroids. I just did some quick googling; all of the results were mad speculation. You seem to be accepting it as a fact. Cool. Reed might do steroids, too.

I am definitely not a Tiger fan or apologist, but everything I have ever read indicates the guy was an absolute gym rat who would lift weights for three hours a day.  Sounds like obsessive workouts to me rather than steroids.

Also note that his head never suddenly grew three sizes like Bond's and Sosa's.  McGwire has obviously been busted for roids too, but his head never swelled up the way theirs did.

[tower912]

Faldo was a heel.   Vijay was a heel.   Ian Poulter was a heel at Ryder Cups.   Monty.    Hell, Jack started out as a heel compared to Arnie.   Nothing wrong with it and nothing guarantees that it is forever.    Congratulations, Patrick. 

[MUBurrow]

I am definitely not a Tiger fan or apologist, but everything I have ever read indicates the guy was an absolute gym rat who would life weights for three hours a day.  Sounds like obsessive workouts to me rather than steroids.

Also note that his head never suddenly grew three sizes like Bond's and Sosa's.  McGwire has obviously been busted for roids too, but his head never swelled up the way theirs did.

+1 here. I think there's a lot of criticism you can rightfully lob Tiger's way with respect to how he saw/treated his body and what was best for his game - but I don't think that includes chemical enhancement. 

[rocket surgeon]

Hmmm. Interesting WHY he picked these 3 guys, but in a discussion about golf, never mentioned John Daly, or Dustin Johnson. Are they in some strange way different from the 3 guys he mentioned?

seriously jockstrap?

reply #69
 " well, john daly did bring on the grip it n rip it era(among a few other things),"

[tower912]

I am definitely not a Tiger fan or apologist, but everything I have ever read indicates the guy was an absolute gym rat who would lift weights for three hours a day.  Sounds like obsessive workouts to me rather than steroids.

Also note that his head never suddenly grew three sizes like Bond's and Sosa's.  McGwire has obviously been busted for roids too, but his head never swelled up the way theirs did.

And don't forget the navy seal workouts.    Ultimately, he wore his body and his back out.      So, he paid.   

[MU82]

I am definitely not a Tiger fan or apologist, but everything I have ever read indicates the guy was an absolute gym rat who would lift weights for three hours a day.  Sounds like obsessive workouts to me rather than steroids.

Also note that his head never suddenly grew three sizes like Bond's and Sosa's.  McGwire has obviously been busted for roids too, but his head never swelled up the way theirs did.

In defense of those who DO think Tiger has juiced, Sosa, McGwire and so many others claimed that their bodies got big because they were gym rats who would life weights for hours every day.

I'm no steroid expert, but I believe one of their benefits is that they help maximize the muscle-building effects of weightlifting. I also believe they help the body heal after vigorous workouts, thereby letting people shorten the time between workout sessions.

[nyg]

Faldo was a heel.   Vijay was a heel.   Ian Poulter was a heel at Ryder Cups.   Monty.    Hell, Jack started out as a heel compared to Arnie.   Nothing wrong with it and nothing guarantees that it is forever.    Congratulations, Patrick.

This, exactly.

Faldo at his time was most hated and still is.  Vijay has had his issues and even Seve was disliked immensely.  There's always a villain, a bad one that everybody wants to see do poorly and then root for their favorite and thats their right.

I don't see Reed as a "heel", and I see him as one of the most patriotic golfers, along with Fowler.  Reed went to the Olympics and didn't stay home for the Zika thing.  His Ryder Cup/Presidents Cup record is one of the best ever and for those who didn't see it, watch his singles match against Rory two years ago, probably the most exciting match in Ryder history and yes he beat him, just like yesterday. Is he a guy fans don't like, yes..see B-balls Macura, Grayson Allen, McNamara, etc.  Happens in every sport.

But, Reed was phenomenal over the weekend and deserved the win, he played the best, period.  The crowd wanted Jordan, the crowd wanted Rickie, but Reed persevered and deserves recognition for the win, like him or not.   

[JWags85]

This, exactly.

Faldo at his time was most hated and still is.  Vijay has had his issues and even Seve was disliked immensely.  There's always a villain, a bad one that everybody wants to see do poorly and then root for their favorite and thats their right.

I don't see Reed as a "heel", and I see him as one of the most patriotic golfers, along with Fowler.  Reed went to the Olympics and didn't stay home for the Zika thing.  His Ryder Cup/Presidents Cup record is one of the best ever and for those who didn't see it, watch his singles match against Rory two years ago, probably the most exciting match in Ryder history and yes he beat him, just like yesterday. Is he a guy fans don't like, yes..see B-balls Macura, Grayson Allen, McNamara, etc.  Happens in every sport.

But, Reed was phenomenal over the weekend and deserved the win, he played the best, period.  The crowd wanted Jordan, the crowd wanted Rickie, but Reed persevered and deserves recognition for the win, like him or not.

I kind of agree Reed isn't a heel, the more I think about it.  His blemishes from his college days are completely valid and worth of criticism.  However, many people are awful to varying degrees at that age and mature into perfectly respectable and admirable adults.  I think Reed is kind of an odd loner with an insane competitive streak, and that coupled with an arrogance about his game (which is part of the reason for his greatness) doesn't make him particularly lovable.

The family stuff I think is completely his business, and while unfortunate seeming, doesn't make him any more of a heel.  If he was a happy go lucky gregarious heavily marketed personality with the estranged family, that would be odd (cough AR12 cough).

I honestly hope he continues playing well for years, he's a good foil, personality wise, to the buddy culture of the other young guns on tour (who are also great in their own right).

[Goose]

JWags

I played competitive golf for much of my life and have a great respect for the rules. Several of the allegations regarding Reed are pretty horrible violations of the game. I have played in Jr tournaments were kids flat out cheated and I called them on it. As a fan of the game, it's history and it's crazy rules, I cannot get past some of the stuff he is accused of.

I agree, people grow and change in life and cheating on the golf course or stealing money/clubs should not be a life sentence for anyone. That said, I can say the off course stuff can be forgiven and forgot, but I struggle with the cheating on the course and the game.

As a golf fan, Reed did himself well yesterday and hats off to him. He was not the guy I wanted to win, but he deserves a very big pat on the back. I actually feel badly for him. If he finished 25th, 3/4 of the people that googled him in last 24 hours, would have not wasted the time on him. His on course success put him under a microscope.

[RJax55]

I kind of agree Reed isn't a heel, the more I think about it.  His blemishes from his college days are completely valid and worth of criticism.  However, many people are awful to varying degrees at that age and mature into perfectly respectable and admirable adults.  I think Reed is kind of an odd loner with an insane competitive streak, and that coupled with an arrogance about his game (which is part of the reason for his greatness) doesn't make him particularly lovable.

The family stuff I think is completely his business, and while unfortunate seeming, doesn't make him any more of a heel.  If he was a happy go lucky gregarious heavily marketed personality with the estranged family, that would be odd (cough AR12 cough).

I honestly hope he continues playing well for years, he's a good foil, personality wise, to the buddy culture of the other young guns on tour (who are also great in their own right).

Agree completely. Today's Patrick Reed is hardly a heel.

His big mistake (outside of the college issues) was his immaturity and arrogance after his win at Doral. He made his infamous "top 5" comment and the press then buried him. That's when the college stories and the family issues all came to light. It also gave Shane Ryan the perfect bad guy for his book. And, for a bit, I think Reed tried to embrace that heel character.

But, the last couple of years have seen a rapidly maturing Reed. I think the competition and how hard it is to win consistently on the Tour also humbled a guy that had nothing but success throughout his junior and college career. He also found a calling in the team events and I think that has earned him well-deserved respect with his peers. He may not be part of the clique, but that doesn't make him a bad guy.

[StillAWarrior]

I actually feel badly for him. If he finished 25th, 3/4 of the people that googled him in last 24 hours, would have not wasted the time on him. His on course success put him under a microscope.

I fall in this group.  I'm a casual golf fan, and don't follow too closely.  But, I've always liked the Masters and pay more attention to that than other tournaments.  And like a lot of other casual fans, my interest was higher this year due to the Tiger factor.  Anyway, I was listening to the tournament yesterday while driving.  I was rooting for Spieth, mainly because I liked the historic comeback angle.  I honestly didn't know much at all about Reed, and pretty much everything I now know came from this thread and other articles in the last 24 hours.

[Sheriff]

Faldo was a heel.   Vijay was a heel.   Ian Poulter was a heel at Ryder Cups.   Monty.    Hell, Jack started out as a heel compared to Arnie.   Nothing wrong with it and nothing guarantees that it is forever.    Congratulations, Patrick.

This.

And you can add Ben Hogan to that list.  A fellow Texan with the lousiest childhood one could imagine and huge chip permanently installed on his shoulder.  He befriended few on the tour and despised Arnold Palmer, refusing to call him anything other than "Fella." He has a bridge named after him at Augusta National.

[JWags85]

JWags

I played competitive golf for much of my life and have a great respect for the rules. Several of the allegations regarding Reed are pretty horrible violations of the game. I have played in Jr tournaments were kids flat out cheated and I called them on it. As a fan of the game, it's history and it's crazy rules, I cannot get past some of the stuff he is accused of.

I agree, people grow and change in life and cheating on the golf course or stealing money/clubs should not be a life sentence for anyone. That said, I can say the off course stuff can be forgiven and forgot, but I struggle with the cheating on the course and the game.

I hear you, and I understand, but again, it was a decade ago.  The PGA has deemed him acceptable to select for multiple Ryder Cups, he's now a major champion, it seems silly to continue to harp on mistakes and allegations that occurred when he was a freshman, a very young freshman at that, when nothing of the sort has occurred since.  Pales in comparison to someone like Vijay Singh who was kicked off a damn tour for cheating.

Not at all excusing it and the disgust and judgement of it at the time are completely valid, but it gets to be like the "Respect for the Game" in baseball at a certain point when taken too far.

[mu_hilltopper]

I actually feel badly for him. If he finished 25th, 3/4 of the people that googled him in last 24 hours, would have not wasted the time on him.

Yep.  I was reading this thread and mentioned it to my wife .. who is not a golf fan, but we did watch an hour of the Masters yesterday.  She immediately says, wow, I read some bad stuff about Reed.

So indeed .. Reed went from a golfer than maybe a few thousand people didn't like .. to having millions of new ~haters.

Poor guy, wallowing in his $2m prize today.