NCAA FB Coaching Carousel

[MUBurrow]

Mostly just started this thread to say #lolvols. Has any school messed up more coaching hires in rapid succession than Tennessee?

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

Bert Bielema may want to reconsider which schools give him a better shot to win a national title.

[mu03eng]

Mostly just started this thread to say #lolvols. Has any school messed up more coaching hires in rapid succession than Tennessee?

Actually might be a cautionary tale on letting the Twitter mob call the shots

[GGGG]

Actually might be a cautionary tale on letting the Twitter mob call the shots

Eh. He was a poor choice regardless of the PSU stuff.

[Mr. Nielsen]

He was excellent at Rutgers.

[MUBurrow]

Schiano sucks. And even if you disagree with that assessment, its hard to see how the cost-benefit analysis of his baggage vs his likelihood of success would result in you handing him a good SEC job.

[GGGG]

Excellent is an exaggeration.  He was good in a terrible conference. Really makes him no different than Butch Jones.

[nyg]

Vols need to just pay Gruden the 10 million a year and that would appease the fan base, any other candidate cannot win them over at this point.  Should be interesting in Knoxville. 

[mu03eng]

Eh. He was a poor choice regardless of the PSU stuff.

I don't disagree about Schiano being a bad coach, but that fanbase is insane and just grabbed onto anything so they could revolt. Also a pretty clear indictment on media's inability to get facts right and how that information then becomes abused by the general public

[GGGG]

I don't disagree about Schiano being a bad coach, but that fanbase is insane and just grabbed onto anything so they could revolt. Also a pretty clear indictment on media's inability to get facts right and how that information then becomes abused by the general public

The media reported the story accurately. People interpreted it wrong.

[MUBurrow]

Agreed that UT is insane, and that would be a good reason for any coach to not take that job. Schiano and Vols fans kind of deserve each other actually. When this is all said and done, I think Mike Norvell ends up with that job, which is kind of too bad because the fanbase is going to be irate, and he seems like a promising young coach.

Mullen to UF looks to clear the runway for Frost to Neb. Kind of wonder if that was a #donedeal for a couple of days now, and lead to the Mullen hire. I certainly would rather have Frost of I'm UF, but I know there's a lot of Mullen fans in SEC country too.

[Pakuni]

I don't disagree about Schiano being a bad coach, but that fanbase is insane and just grabbed onto anything so they could revolt. Also a pretty clear indictment on media's inability to get facts right and how that information then becomes abused by the general public

1. I'm not sure Schiano is a bad (college) coach. The fact he had a winning record at Rutgers, when his three predecessors and two successors have combined to go 98-150, doesn't support that.

2. What did "the media" (which obviously is a single entity and not hundreds of individual outlets with varying standards) get wrong?

[Pakuni]

Vols need to just pay Gruden the 10 million a year and that would appease the fan base, any other candidate cannot win them over at this point.  Should be interesting in Knoxville.

Gruden is getting paid as much as Saban to call one game a week on ESPN, plus his pre-draft QB camp.
Why would he want to trade that to step into the dumpster fire that is Tennessee football?

[jficke13]

Gruden is getting paid as much as Saban to call one game a week on ESPN, plus his pre-draft QB camp.
Why would he want to trade that to step into the dumpster fire that is Tennessee football?

Plus he can "Buzz - to - Texas" ESPN with every single coaching vacancy.

[Pakuni]

So, does anyone think it's a coincidence that Tennessee's most influential booster happens to be the same guy that owns the Cleveland Browns?

[mu03eng]

1. I'm not sure Schiano is a bad (college) coach. The fact he had a winning record at Rutgers, when his three predecessors and two successors have combined to go 98-150, doesn't support that.

2. What did "the media" (which obviously is a single entity and not hundreds of individual outlets with varying standards) get wrong?

Let me explain with more nuance for Item 2. Washington Post wrote a clickbate type headline when reporting the story - "Greg Schiano, Tom Bradley knew of Sandusky abuse at Penn State, documents show" and invoked "Court Documents" within the reporting to lend credence to the reporting.

The core of the story is that Mike McQueery testified (hence Court Documents) that Tom Bradley told him that Greg Schiano told Tom Bradley that Schiano saw Sandusky do something (what that something was is alluded to in the testimony but not explicitly stated). It's double hearsay at best and is not anywhere near admissible in court. Further both Schiano and Bradley have denied the claim, and the Pennsylvania AG(who was looking to, rightly, nail anyone and everyone that could be for being involved in a cover-up or enablement of Sandusky's crimes) did not bring charges or even move beyond preliminary investigations.

An analogy, I could testify in court that aliens exist because my friend Steve (a real person and scientist) was told by Bill Nye (the science guy who Steve actually knows) that he once saw an alien. The head line could then read "Aliens exist according to court documents". Is that factually accurate, sure but is it truthful or a misrepresentation?

[Pakuni]

Let me explain with more nuance for Item 2. Washington Post wrote a clickbate type headline when reporting the story - "Greg Schiano, Tom Bradley knew of Sandusky abuse at Penn State, documents show" and invoked "Court Documents" within the reporting to lend credence to the reporting.

The core of the story is that Mike McQueery testified (hence Court Documents) that Tom Bradley told him that Greg Schiano told Tom Bradley that Schiano saw Sandusky do something (what that something was is alluded to in the testimony but not explicitly stated). It's double hearsay at best and is not anywhere near admissible in court. Further both Schiano and Bradley have denied the claim, and the Pennsylvania AG(who was looking to, rightly, nail anyone and everyone that could be for being involved in a cover-up or enablement of Sandusky's crimes) did not bring charges or even move beyond preliminary investigations.

An analogy, I could testify in court that aliens exist because my friend Steve (a real person and scientist) was told by Bill Nye (the science guy who Steve actually knows) that he once saw an alien. The head line could then read "Aliens exist according to court documents". Is that factually accurate, sure but is it truthful or a misrepresentation?

So, when you say "the media" couldn't get the facts right, what you meant is that a single newspaper wrote a factually correct headline back in 2016 that you believe was misleading, atop a story that makes clear from the very first sentence that this claim comes from unsealed witness testimony.

And not to go too far off on a tangent here, but you don't really believe that the Pennsylvania AG who allowed Joe Paterno to skate really wanted to "nail anyone and everyone" who enabled Sandusky, right?

[mu03eng]

So, when you say "the media" couldn't get the facts right, what you meant is that a single newspaper wrote a factually correct headline back in 2016 that you believe was misleading, atop a story that makes clear from the very first sentence that this claim comes from unsealed witness testimony.

And not to go too far off on a tangent here, but you don't really believe that the Pennsylvania AG who allowed Joe Paterno to skate really wanted to "nail anyone and everyone" who enabled Sandusky, right?

Considering it was the Washington Post and the story was picked up by other major newspapers and AP/Reuters wholesale, I think it's fair to characterize it as the media

As far as the AG goes, you do realize there have been multiple AGs involved in the Sandusky case, yes? This included Kathleen Kane, who certainly was no "friend" of those accused in the Penn State case and was the AG of record when the McQueery testimony was offered and led the investigation into it? If you're referring to Tom Corbett who when on to be Governor who was the AG at the time of the original investigation, you are not wrong but that is not contemporary with the Schiano testimony.

[GGGG]

1. I'm not sure Schiano is a bad (college) coach. The fact he had a winning record at Rutgers, when his three predecessors and two successors have combined to go 98-150, doesn't support that.

I don't think he is a bad coach.  I think he is a good coach but is nowhere near good enough, with good enough connections, to win at Tennessee.  He's Randy Edsall, who was over his head at Maryland. 

So ignoring the PSU thing for a second, if I'm an AAC school or a low level BCS school like Virginia or Indiana, I would take a good look at him.  Tennessee?  Not a chance.  Way outside of his recruiting base.  He'd be over his head with that mayhem.

BTW, this is exactly why you hire a search firm to help you with these things.

[GGGG]

Considering it was the Washington Post and the story was picked up by other major newspapers and AP/Reuters wholesale, I think it's fair to characterize it as the media

You said this was an example of the "media's inability to get facts right."

"The media" got the facts right.  Yeah they wrote a sensational headline, but they got the facts 100% correct.

[Pakuni]

As far as the AG goes, you do realize there have been multiple AGs involved in the Sandusky case, yes? This included Kathleen Kane, who certainly was no "friend" of those accused in the Penn State case and was the AG of record when the McQueery testimony was offered and led the investigation into it? If you're referring to Tom Corbett who when on to be Governor who was the AG at the time of the original investigation, you are not wrong but that is not contemporary with the Schiano testimony.

Well, which AG were you referring to when you spoke of the one trying to nail anyone involved? As far as I can tell, none of them were all that intent on nailing everyone involved because none of them went after Sandusky's primary enabler.
But again, since you're the one who brought up the AG in the first place, shouldn't you be answering that question?

And, just fyi ... the AP, Reuters, etc., don't pick up WaPo stories wholesale, much less run their headlines verbatim. That's not how it works.

[GGGG]

So, does anyone think it's a coincidence that Tennessee's most influential booster happens to be the same guy that owns the Cleveland Browns?

So Jim Haslam, the owner of the Browns, was on the search committee that hired the athletic director.  He is also a big donor to UT athletics.  His son is the governor of Tennessee.

Apparently he has always been a fan of Schiano and wanted to hire him two years ago.

https://nflspinzone.com/2014/02/12/cleveland-browns-rumors-jimmy-haslam-liked-greg-schiano-joe-banner-didnt/

Wow.  What a sh*tshow.

[Pakuni]

I don't think he is a bad coach.  I think he is a good coach but is nowhere near good enough, with good enough connections, to win at Tennessee.  He's Randy Edsall, who was over his head at Maryland. 

So ignoring the PSU thing for a second, if I'm an AAC school or a low level BCS school like Virginia or Indiana, I would take a good look at him.  Tennessee?  Not a chance.  Way outside of his recruiting base.  He'd be over his head with that mayhem.

You may be correct about all this. But I do think the Tennessee gig has lost a lot of its luster. Chip Kelly, Dan Mullen and Mike Leach all rejected them summarily (and maybe Scott Frost also). Lane Kiffin is openly mocking them. They wouldn't have inked a deal with Schiano if there were even a glimmer of hope that they could land Gruden. The fanbase has a terrible reputation (ask Cuonzo Martin).

They may end up having to hire Tee Martin. If they were worried about Schiano being in over his head, how about a guy with zero head coaching experience and only two seasons as a coordinator?

[GGGG]

Oh Tee Martin would be the hugest of gambles.  That would be a significantly larger risk than Schiano.

[mu03eng]

Well, which AG were you referring to when you spoke of the one trying to nail anyone involved? As far as I can tell, none of them were all that intent on nailing everyone involved because none of them went after Sandusky's primary enabler.
But again, since you're the one who brought up the AG in the first place, shouldn't you be answering that question?

And, just fyi ... the AP, Reuters, etc., don't pick up WaPo stories wholesale, much less run their headlines verbatim. That's not how it works.

The answer is Kathleen Kane and Paterno was dead 3 months after the story broke so really wasn't much time to go after him.