Raiders to Vegas

[Tugg Speedman]

A friend emailed this.  Interesting comments

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I remember us having the discussion a few years ago that the NFL’s popularity had probably peaked and that Junior Seau’s suicide marked an important and damaging turning point.  I think all of these franchise moves, esp from cities like Oakland (which have devoted fan bases) is going to make things work.  And the NFL seems to have forgotten that the NFL didn’t work in LA before and no reason to think that two teams will do better than one (abandoning another devoted fan base in the process and destroying some great AFC West rivalries).
 
And I like this insight from Deadspin on Las Vegas:

Let’s take an NFL team, a roster of 53 athletic young men, some as young as 21 or so. Some of them are making enormous amounts of money; the league minimum is roughly $465,000. They are active from mid-to-late July to January, or February if they’re in the playoffs. Sometimes, when injured, they have significant amounts of time away from the regimented routine of the season… now let’s put all of those young men in Sin City, surrounded by casinos, clubs, strippers, and every other temptation under the sun. What’s the worst that could happen, right?

[Pakuni]

Let’s take an NFL team, a roster of 53 athletic young men, some as young as 21 or so. Some of them are making enormous amounts of money; the league minimum is roughly $465,000. They are active from mid-to-late July to January, or February if they’re in the playoffs. Sometimes, when injured, they have significant amounts of time away from the regimented routine of the season… now let’s put all of those young men in Sin City, surrounded by casinos, clubs, strippers, and every other temptation under the sun. What’s the worst that could happen, right?

That's kind of silly.
1. There are clubs, strippers and other temptations in every NFL city (OK, maybe not Green Bay). I mean, how have the Miami Dolphins, Atlanta Falcons, Dallas Cowboys and New York Giants survived all these years?
2. Many, if not most, guys don't live year-round in the cities in which they play.
3. Most anyone who's spent more than an occasional weekend in Vegas will tell you it gets old really fast.

[Tugg Speedman]

That's kind of silly.
1. There are clubs, strippers and other temptations in every NFL city (OK, maybe not Green Bay). I mean, how have the Miami Dolphins, Atlanta Falcons, Dallas Cowboys and New York Giants survived all these years?
2. Many, if not most, guys don't live year-round in the cities in which they play.
3. Most anyone who's spent more than an occasional weekend in Vegas will tell you it gets old really fast.

Most are not young, single, hyperagressive elite athletes with below average education and millions in the bank.

This demographic would disagree with you.

[HouWarrior]

Some of the NFL owners like Jerry Jones invested in the fantasy football websites. They flopped but I was surprised at the willingness to flirt so directly with gambling.

The Vegas move puts the first major pro sport team in the gambling mecca of Vegas.

The Superbowl is the biggest betting day of the year.

Will the NFL harm its product with continued flirtations/associations with the gambling side?

Boxing became so pervasively fixed/mobbed up that few trusted its outcomes in the 40s to 60s...of course it too had violence concussion issues. Its popularity is a fraction of its former self.

Between the violence/concussions and gambling flirtations in the NFL, I too wonder whether we are seeing the early stages of this sports popularity demise

[Pakuni]

Most are not young, single, hyperagressive elite athletes with below average education and millions in the bank.

This demographic would disagree with you.

OK.
Who am I to question your deep understanding of the life and mindset of elite athletes.

[Pakuni]

Between the violence/concussions and gambling flirtations in the NFL, I too wonder whether we are seeing the early stages of this sports popularity demise

1. The NFL owes a large part of its popularity to gambling.
2. In the age of online gambling, a team's physical location is irrelevant.
3. NFL players, by and large, make too much money to be influenced by gambling interests. Like, is JJ Watt going to jeopardize his $100 million contract to make some side money by helping point shavers?

[StillAWarrior]

Most are not young, single, hyperagressive elite athletes with below average education and millions in the bank.

This demographic would disagree with you.

And you know this how?  Assuming you're correct, I would expect that most professional athletes spend their off seasons on Vegas, since they're young, single hyperaggressive elite athletes with below average education and millions in the bank.  Except they don't.  But I hear they do enjoy occasional weekends in Vegas...which was kind of the point that you seem to be arguing against.

[wadesworld]

And you know this how?  Assuming you're correct, I would expect that most professional athletes spend their off seasons on Vegas, since they're young, single hyperaggressive elite athletes with below average education and millions in the bank.  Except they don't.  But I hear they do enjoy occasional weekends in Vegas...which was kind of the point that you seem to be arguing against.

Exactly.  It's not exactly hard for someone who makes a couple million dollars a year to find affordable living in Las Vegas if they want to...yet...

[Tugg Speedman]

I will just point out that I was responding to Pakuni saying Vegas gets really old after one weekend.   

All I said was that young athletes are not bored after three days in Vegas.  The rest was you guys pretending you were me and moving the goalposts.

[wadesworld]

I will just point out that I was responding to Pakuni saying Vegas gets really old after one weekend.   

All I said was that young athletes are not bored after three days in Vegas.  The rest was you guys pretending you were me and moving the goalposts.

Lol.

[StillAWarrior]

I will just point out that I was responding to Pakuni saying Vegas gets really old after one weekend.   

All I said was that young athletes are not bored after three days in Vegas.  The rest was you guys pretending you were me and moving the goalposts.

If you're going to tell us what Pakuni said, you might at least make an effort to get it right.  Despite how you read or interpreted it, Pakuni most assuredly did not say that "Vegas gets really old after one weekend."  He said, "Most anyone who's spent more than an occasional weekend in Vegas will tell you it gets old really fast."  It's quite different.  The implication of Pakuni's statement is that an occasional weekend in Vegas is nice, but if you spend more than that, it gets old "really fast."  Perhaps that is precisely why a lot of young athletes are known to enjoy spending an occasional weekend in Vegas, but I'm not particularly aware that a bunch of them are scrambling to live there.  If you've got something actually supporting your contention that Pakuni was wrong, knock yourself out.

[Jockey]

Most are not young, single, hyperagressive elite athletes with below average education and millions in the bank.

This demographic would disagree with you.

A minimum of 3 years in college does not equal "below average education".

You are wrong as always.

[muwarrior69]

So they are going to play in Oakland until the stadium is completed in Vegas. I wonder what kind of support they will get.

[Tugg Speedman]

A minimum of 3 years in college does not equal "below average education".

You are wrong as always.

Correct, I'm always wrong and you are correct.

Think about it.

[Tugg Speedman]

If you're going to tell us what Pakuni said, you might at least make an effort to get it right.  Despite how you read or interpreted it, Pakuni most assuredly did not say that "Vegas gets really old after one weekend."  He said, "Most anyone who's spent more than an occasional weekend in Vegas will tell you it gets old really fast."  It's quite different.  The implication of Pakuni's statement is that an occasional weekend in Vegas is nice, but if you spend more than that, it gets old "really fast."  Perhaps that is precisely why a lot of young athletes are known to enjoy spending an occasional weekend in Vegas, but I'm not particularly aware that a bunch of them are scrambling to live there.  If you've got something actually supporting your contention that Pakuni was wrong, knock yourself out.

You did not really do this ... did you, 200+ words parsing what I said verse what Pakuni said.

Sad

[Pakuni]

I will just point out that I was responding to Pakuni saying Vegas gets really old after one weekend.   

All I said was that young athletes are not bored after three days in Vegas.  The rest was you guys pretending you were me and moving the goalposts.

How many young athletes share their thoughts on Vegas with you?
And what makes you think all young athletes are a hive mind?

Try this. Find some people who live in Vegas and poll them about how much of their leisure time they spend on the Strip.

[Tugg Speedman]

How many young athletes share their thoughts on Vegas with you?
And what makes you think all young athletes are a hive mind?

Try this. Find some people who live in Vegas and poll them about how much of their leisure time they spend on the Strip.

No, you're correct, everyone agrees with you.

[Spotcheck Billy]

So they are going to play in Oakland until the stadium is completed in Vegas. I wonder what kind of support they will get.

My thought also, couldn't they do like the Bears and Vikings and play at a college stadium like UNLV?

[Pakuni]

No, you're correct, everyone agrees with you.

Should I take this reply to mean zero young athletes share their thoughts on Vegas with you?

[Pakuni]

My thought also, couldn't they do like the Bears and Vikings and play at a college stadium like UNLV?

The UNLV stadium is old and would require some major upgrades. Its capacity is only about 35K.

[StillAWarrior]

You did not really do this ... did you, 200+ words parsing what I said verse what Pakuni said.

Sad

I did. What can I say; I love irony. You misrepresented what Pakuni said in a post complaining about others moving the goalposts.

[Tugg Speedman]

Should I take this reply to mean zero young athletes share their thoughts on Vegas with you?

I believe I have the same number as you. 

That's why I'm going with your contention that everyone that occasionally visits Vegas is bored with it after three days.  You apparently are an expert on this.

[Tugg Speedman]

I did. What can I say; I love irony. You misrepresented what Pakuni said in a post complaining about others moving the goalposts.

Sad that this bothers you this much.

[#UnleashSean]

Scoop gets hung up on the dumbest things.

[StillAWarrior]

Sad that this bothers you this much.

Fair enough; mine is a sad existence.  I suppose I can take some solace in the fact that I'm not the one who made an idiotic and clearly incorrect statement; got repeatedly called out for said idiocy; and then pouted about it.  Hopefully, I can summon the strength to carry on.