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Author Topic: Vander Summer League  (Read 49147 times)

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #100 on: June 05, 2016, 06:07:56 PM »
"They get multiple opportunities because they were drafted."

No. They get multiple opportunities because they are considered more talented. No NBA GM is thinking "I was going to invite this guy in. But he wasn't drafted. So I'll invite this other guy instead who was drafted and cut by another team."

Vander has had plenty of chances and opportunities. He has been in three organizations and played in the NBA for two teams. Being drafted wouldn't have helped him any more.

Do not agree with this and neither do the scouts I talk to.  If a team is willing to draft a player, especially in a higher round, they have put a ton of money, resources, etc in evaluations.  Other teams have also.  Those opportunities come because scouts have thought highly enough to leverage a pick.  It becomes currency.  Even if the player stumbles, that currency exists because someone or perhaps multiple teams thought highly enough of them to make that pick.  Much easier to go back and justify a second or third look on a drafts kid than an unstaffed one, because so much work and s precious pick by a team has been used.

Right about now is when the failed logic of using all undrafted players vs 2nd round draft picks will emerge....denominators fellas....denominators.


MU82

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #101 on: June 05, 2016, 07:08:22 PM »
Now, MU82, I have stated that i'm leaning on expert opinions, not just mine.  People that do this for a living.  But I also agree with you that we will never know.  That goes both ways!

I never claimed anything else.

Although my opinion is more "expert" than yours - ha!
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jesmu84

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #102 on: June 05, 2016, 09:50:24 PM »
I'm not sure how you get to your second paragraph in all honesty.  Yes, the assumption is that he would continue to improve.  Drafting is a lot on potential, right.  If he continued to improve, the experts believed he would, those same experts believed he would be drafted and in the first round by some.  What he has done since I'd irrelevant to whether he would have been drafted. 

Lots of guys are drafted that don't pan out long term.  But that's the point, they still got drafted.  Many of them with multiple opportunities because they were drafted.

One thing for certain, if he was drafted in the first round as a number of these experts predicted, that's guaranteed money.

The experts were predicting he would get drafted based on the assumption that he would be better after senior year than junior year.

Where vander is right now, talent-wise, I don't believe he would be drafted. If his talent now isn't good enough to get drafted, then he never would have had enough talent to get drafted after senior year, IMO.

MerrittsMustache

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #103 on: June 06, 2016, 08:37:19 AM »
Do not agree with this and neither do the scouts I talk to.  If a team is willing to draft a player, especially in a higher round, they have put a ton of money, resources, etc in evaluations.  Other teams have also.  Those opportunities come because scouts have thought highly enough to leverage a pick.  It becomes currency.  Even if the player stumbles, that currency exists because someone or perhaps multiple teams thought highly enough of them to make that pick.  Much easier to go back and justify a second or third look on a drafts kid than an unstaffed one, because so much work and s precious pick by a team has been used.

Right about now is when the failed logic of using all undrafted players vs 2nd round draft picks will emerge....denominators fellas....denominators.

1) The NBA Draft is two rounds. There are ONLY "early rounds." It may hold true that drafted players in other sports have better odds of getting second chances but it's also worth noting that a 3rd Rd NFL pick who gets cut, likely was viewed as having "3rd Round Talent" which contributes to him getting another chance. That's a result of a team thinking they can bring out his potential, not because they're too lazy to gather research on an undrafted player.

2) NBA scouts have scouting reports on WAY more than just the 60 players who get drafted. Even Draft Express goes over 100 players deep for each draft. NBA teams go much deeper than that. Even knowing that most of those players won't sniff the NBA (Junior Cadougan had an NBA workout, FFS!) they're still going to do their due diligence. To suggest that NBA teams prefer drafted players because of another team's resources allocated to that player is asinine.

3) There are roughly 1,200 D1 basketball players eligible for the NBA Draft every season. Maybe 5-6% of those players have an actual chance of being drafted. There are 30 2nd Round picks each season. How many undrafted players in each draft class have a legit chance to make an NBA roster? It's likely not much more than 30, if it's even that high. Sure, if you look at the big picture, the denominator is 30-40 times bigger, but when you look at it realistically, it's not all that different.

« Last Edit: June 06, 2016, 08:39:06 AM by MerrittsMustache »

4everwarriors

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #104 on: June 06, 2016, 09:22:00 AM »
Total crapshoot, hey?



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rocket surgeon

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #105 on: June 10, 2016, 05:51:38 PM »
Total crapshoot, hey?



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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #106 on: June 10, 2016, 05:54:25 PM »
da scooper's flags at half mast, heiner hey?

Is this out of respect or because people stopped taking their pills again. 

GoldenDieners32

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #107 on: June 16, 2016, 11:17:36 AM »
I saw a couple of his games live on TV. He has improved so much since last time he played Marquette. A NBA team needs to give him a chance. He had a great season.

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brewcity77

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #108 on: June 16, 2016, 11:32:32 AM »
I saw a couple of his games live on TV. He has improved so much since last time he played Marquette. A NBA team needs to give him a chance. He had a great season.

26.3 ppg
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3.4 apg
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As the NBA owns the D-League, I'm confident all the GMs are fully aware of Blue. Whenever they are looking to fill a last roster spot with a 10-day contract, I'm sure they are starting with the guys in the D-League. That he didn't get a chance in the midst of that season may be more telling as to his NBA prospects than anything else. Probably time for Blue to look into Europe and focus on making the best paycheck he can, because as much as I'd like to see him playing in the league...well, the ship may not have sailed just yet, but they have started untying the bowlines.
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Herman Cain

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #109 on: June 26, 2016, 10:46:48 PM »
Winning is overrated. The only time it is really important is in surgery and war.
                       ---Al McGuire

GoldenDieners32

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #110 on: June 28, 2016, 01:26:23 PM »
Looks like Vander may be playing for the Mavericks in the summer league.

http://sportsday.dallasnews.com/dallas-mavericks/mavericks/2016/06/26/sefko-mavs-summer-league-players-may-make-much-impact-important-another-way
I think he could make the Mavs considering DWill is opting out of his contract.

TSmith34, Inc.

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #111 on: June 28, 2016, 02:17:16 PM »
I think he could make the Mavs considering DWill is opting out of his contract.
Can someone Photoshop a Mavs uniform on Derrick Wilson?
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brewcity77

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #112 on: June 28, 2016, 03:03:06 PM »
Looks like Vander may be playing for the Mavericks in the summer league.

http://sportsday.dallasnews.com/dallas-mavericks/mavericks/2016/06/26/sefko-mavs-summer-league-players-may-make-much-impact-important-another-way

Not sure who you play for in the Summer League is at all relevant. All the teams are watching those games and looking for the best players, but playing "for" one team doesn't guarantee that team will give you the closest look.

I could be wrong on that, but would love to see the numbers as far as Summer League guys that earn contracts and how many earn them with the team that they play for. More than anything, I think it's an exhibition to get rookies and fringe players into shape for the season rather than a true audition for the next level.
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jsglow

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #113 on: June 28, 2016, 06:53:04 PM »
As the NBA owns the D-League, I'm confident all the GMs are fully aware of Blue. Whenever they are looking to fill a last roster spot with a 10-day contract, I'm sure they are starting with the guys in the D-League. That he didn't get a chance in the midst of that season may be more telling as to his NBA prospects than anything else. Probably time for Blue to look into Europe and focus on making the best paycheck he can, because as much as I'd like to see him playing in the league...well, the ship may not have sailed just yet, but they have started untying the bowlines.

Not to offer Vander advice but I agree with the notion that he should give the NBA one last shot and then go try to make as much money in Europe as possible.  He's already about 23 (not sure exactly) and needs to consider how many years he can get paid (maybe 8 more?).  His talents would seem to be sufficient to accumulate a relatively significant nest egg if he doesn't wait too long.

Herman Cain

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #114 on: July 01, 2016, 01:37:33 PM »
Now that OJ Mayo is kicked out of the league, Bucks need to step up and sign Vander. Would be a very good PR move .
Winning is overrated. The only time it is really important is in surgery and war.
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TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #115 on: July 01, 2016, 02:01:50 PM »
Now that OJ Mayo is kicked out of the league, Bucks need to step up and sign Vander. Would be a very good PR move .

I don't think anyone would care for more than 5 minutes. And how would the PR look when Vander got cut because he couldn't make it on the team?
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Folks,,,

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #116 on: July 01, 2016, 02:05:39 PM »
Now that OJ Mayo is kicked out of the league, Bucks need to step up and sign Vander. Would be a very good PR move .

Uff-da.

MerrittsMustache

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #117 on: July 01, 2016, 02:06:51 PM »
Now that OJ Mayo is kicked out of the league, Bucks need to step up and sign Vander. Would be a very good PR move .

Yes, because Vander is beloved by nearly all Wisconsites  ::)


GGGG

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #118 on: July 01, 2016, 02:34:42 PM »
Now that OJ Mayo is kicked out of the league, Bucks need to step up and sign Vander. Would be a very good PR move .

This is what bad organizations do.

rocket surgeon

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #119 on: July 01, 2016, 02:37:40 PM »
Now that OJ Mayo is kicked out of the league, Bucks need to step up and sign Vander. Would be a very good PR move .

i didn't see this coming!  i thought he was the "smart" one from the mayo family.  no wonder he was no help to todd.  forgot he was the 3rd overall pick in 2008.  since the collective bargaining agreement says the NBA can't say what drug-

However, the NBA's collective bargaining agreement — which is a public document — lists the following "drugs of abuse" as prohibited substances: amphetamines and its analogs, cocaine, LSD, opiates (heroin, codeine and morphine), and PCP.

my guess would be cola-caine Ayn'A
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TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #120 on: July 01, 2016, 03:07:19 PM »
OJ blew all of Todd's tuition on blow?
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JakeBarnes

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #121 on: July 01, 2016, 03:50:09 PM »
i didn't see this coming!  i thought he was the "smart" one from the mayo family.  no wonder he was no help to todd.  forgot he was the 3rd overall pick in 2008.  since the collective bargaining agreement says the NBA can't say what drug-

However, the NBA's collective bargaining agreement — which is a public document — lists the following "drugs of abuse" as prohibited substances: amphetamines and its analogs, cocaine, LSD, opiates (heroin, codeine and morphine), and PCP.

my guess would be cola-caine Ayn'A

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Herman Cain

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #122 on: July 01, 2016, 04:38:15 PM »
I don't think anyone would care for more than 5 minutes. And how would the PR look when Vander got cut because he couldn't make it on the team?
I think the PR would be local college star makes good after long hard journey etc  People love those kind of stories. This then puts the OJ Mayo story in the rear view mirror.

I am in the pro Vander camp.
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GGGG

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #123 on: July 01, 2016, 07:44:30 PM »
The OJ Mayo story isn't reflecting poorly on the Bucks.

Herman Cain

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Re: Vander Summer League
« Reply #124 on: July 01, 2016, 08:03:51 PM »
The OJ Mayo story isn't reflecting poorly on the Bucks.
Drugs and NBA never good. I see a small crevice and want to jam the door open for Vander.
Winning is overrated. The only time it is really important is in surgery and war.
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