Lets talk coaching

[tower912]

Louisville wasn't small.   They were exceedingly fast, too.    And had experienced depth.   This is how they could pressure all over the place and play over a devastating injury.     MU isn't particularly fast and hasn't built up the experience or depth.   

[HoopsterBC]

He has a high basketball IQ.   He has never played the point before and he needs to get stronger.

Your definition and mine are truly different.  Yes, he is not a point guard, but once the offense is set, you do not need a point guard.  Just have to play the game.  Many
times Cheatham gets pass his man on the baseline and wants to take it straight to the hole.  Now if he would take the 10 footer instead of running into a big and he
then throws up some wild shot, is that high IQ, or driving thru 3 players and taking another bad shot.  In high school he could do that, in the Big East no. A perfect example would be the drive to the hoop on the break and getting it slammed into the third row,  does not know what to do there.  He really does not have great hops compared
to the other athletic players Hall had, ball fakes, maybe, up and under, something.

[tower912]

He was effective taking it to the hole early in the year.   Averaging double figures, people singing his praises as an under the radar freshman.    The other coaches are smart, too.   There is now a scouting report on him.    They know that when he beats his man that they will meet him at the rim.   I think he is a freshman who needs to broaden his game and make adjustments now that the other teams have adjusted to him.   This takes time.   You think he has a low basketball IQ.      We see the same problems, the same symptoms, but disagree with the diagnosis. 

[ATL MU Warrior]

He has a high basketball IQ.   He has never played the point before and he needs to get stronger.

He needs to learn how to use his right hand (nh).

[GooooMarquette]

He was effective taking it to the hole early in the year.   Averaging double figures, people singing his praises as an under the radar freshman.    The other coaches are smart, too.   There is now a scouting report on him.    They know that when he beats his man that they will meet him at the rim.   I think he is a freshman who needs to broaden his game and make adjustments now that the other teams have adjusted to him.   This takes time.   You think he has a low basketball IQ.      We see the same problems, the same symptoms, but disagree with the diagnosis.

I agree with this.  He has a high IQ - which to me, means he understands the game very well for a freshman.  This doesn't mean he makes the right decision all the time, but it leads me to believe he will be coachable, and will make big strides in his career.

[MU82]

Wojo is an excellent coach.  Buzz had the three amigos with a chip on their shoulders when he took over.  Crean was 15-14 his first two years before he got D. Wade.  People who say get rid of Wojo reminds me when I was in Detroit and idiots were saying to get rid of Scotty Bowman because he didn't win the Stanley Cup his first three years.

I don't think we know yet if Wojo is an excellent coach. We also do not know if he is a bad coach. We also do not know if he is a mediocre coach who is on his way toward becoming a good coach or a bad coach. The body of work simply is not broad enough yet.

Otherwise, sold post. Lots of Scoopers would have fired Al, Coach K and Wooden when they didn't win enough games their first couple seasons.

It takes time to rebuild a program, and we definitely needed rebuilding.

By this time next year, we might be able to make better judgments. By this time two years from now, we might be able to draw some actual conclusions.

And having said all of this, it doesn't really matter what a single Scooper thinks. Marquette's administration obviously really likes Wojo, and he isn't going anywhere for at least another 2-3 years.

But yes, I know, this is a fan board and we have to talk about something. Might as well be the coach's "leash"!

[silverback]

Really, there's only one question that matters this year?

Is the team's lack of consistent development a lack of effective coaching and teaching – or is it simply a byproduct of youth and chemistry?

We won't know the answer until next year.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

I vote for the latter.  Wojo's got plenty of coaching experience at Duke as assistant.
We don't  have the hops or the muscle to rebound and it kills us.

[Lennys Tap]

Otherwise, sold post. Lots of Scoopers would have fired Al, Coach K and Wooden when they didn't win enough games their first couple seasons.

Wrong on Al. He inherited a 6-21 team and in year 2 was 14-12, 112% better than his predecessor. Wrong on John Wooden. He was 46-14 (.767) his first two years at UCLA.

[statnik]

Wojo is an excellent coach.  Buzz had the three amigos with a chip on their shoulders when he took over.  Crean was 15-14 his first two years before he got D. Wade.  People who say get rid of Wojo reminds me when I was in Detroit and idiots were saying to get rid of Scotty Bowman because he didn't win the Stanley Cup his first three years.

What about him and his teams he has led so far screams 'excellent coach' to you?  At best, I'd say the jury's still out, but I don't get what leads people to believe he's clearly a good/great coach other than pure homerism.

[Hards Alumni]

Really, there's only one question that matters this year?

Is the team's lack of consistent development a lack of effective coaching and teaching – or is it simply a byproduct of youth and chemistry?

We won't know the answer until next year.

What worries me is that no one is getting better. 

Wojo was an assistant coach for 15 years.  That's a lot of time to learn how to develop players.

Also, I feel like I say this every year (4 years running)... we have no shooters on our team.  Teams pack the lane and let us jack 3s and bad 2s... or they wait for us at the rim where we have a lot of problems finishing, outside of Luke and HE, of course.

[MU82]

Wrong on Al. He inherited a 6-21 team and in year 2 was 14-12, 112% better than his predecessor. Wrong on John Wooden. He was 46-14 (.767) his first two years at UCLA.

Spin it however you'd like, but Al was 22-30 his first two seasons. If you are trying to claim that Wojo inherited a team on the cusp of greatness, you are off-base IMHO. You are allowed to think otherwise. All of this stuff is opinion.

Yes, I was wrong on Wooden. I must have been thinking about somebody else. Having said that and having just looked up the numbers ... after consistently producing fine seasons at UCLA, including 21+ wins in years 7, 8 and 9, he averaged only 15 wins over the next three seasons. That would have been Scoopageddon here, and he would have been put on a "leash" probably during his first sub-par season.

Dean Smith's win totals his first 5 seasons at UNC: 66-47 with zero NCAA or NIT bids.

After a 19-win first season with the previous regime's recruits, here were Jim Calhoun's records his next six years at Northeastern: 12-11, 12-12, 12-13, 12-14, 14-12 and 13-13. He eventually righted the ship and left for UConn, where in his first three seasons he went 47-46 with zero NCAA bids.

Calipari was 27-32 his first two seasons at UMass, his first head-coaching job. In his first five seasons at Memphis, he managed a total of one NCAA tournament win.

After two OK seasons at Boston U, Rick Pitino went 13-14 in Season 3.

Shall I go on?

Nah, but I'll finish with this ...

Many here have fond memories of Kevin O'Neill, who has either failed spectacularly every place he has coached or has cut and run just as he has started building anything.

Maybe Wojo is no K.O. ... and frankly, for the long-term health of the program, I hope he isn't.

[WarriorPride68]

Calipari and K also get the best talent in the country.

I would love to see where MU ranks amongst highest ranked prospects in the country, we have a ton of high ranked kids:

PG - Cheatham - #76 Natl comp
SG - Duane - #59 Natl comp
SF - JJJ - #32 Natl comp
PF - Fish - #88 Natl comp
C - Henry - #9 Natl comp

Average starter HS ranking - 52.8

Sandy - #74 Natl comp
Heldt - #136 Natl comp
Traci - #126 Natl comp

Only Sacar & Wally are outside the top 150 per "247" national comp

---- DePaul has 2 players in top 150. One is Billy Garrett (#88), coaches son. And the other is a transfer Myke Henry (#63). Now that is an empty house compared to here

[GooooMarquette]

What worries me is that no one is getting better. 

Of the returning players, I totally agree that Sandy has not improved.

On the other hand, JJJ and Luke look better to me.

[MerrittsMustache]

Of the returning players, I totally agree that Sandy has not improved.

On the other hand, JJJ and Luke look better to me.

Despite his recent struggles, Sandy is definitely a better player than he was last season. Duane, Luke and JJJ are all improved as well.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Wrong on Al. He inherited a 6-21 team and in year 2 was 14-12, 112% better than his predecessor. Wrong on John Wooden. He was 46-14 (.767) his first two years at UCLA.

Those numbers are true, but that doesn't mean there wouldn't be scoopers screaming about how we aren't winning enough games. We're not exactly a rational bunch. Wojo inherited a program where Derrick Wilson and Juan Anderson were starters. That's a terrible starting position. He's already improved greatly from last season but we're still screaming about him and asking about his leash.

[GooooMarquette]

Despite his recent struggles, Sandy is definitely a better player than he was last season. Duane, Luke and JJJ are all improved as well.

Fair enough on Sandy.  I'll agree he is definitely better on defense and knowing where he should be on the court.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

What worries me is that no one is getting better. 

Wojo was an assistant coach for 15 years.  That's a lot of time to learn how to develop players.

This isn't true at all. JJJ is MUCH improved from last season. Luke is improved. Duane is improved though honestly not as much as I would have hoped. Sandy has not improved. That has been tough to see.

The other 5 are freshmen. They've had no time to improve.

There seems to be this myth that players get drastically better as the season goes on. This is simply not true. Development truly happens in the offseason. Improvement during the season is very limited and tends to be on very specific things. Most players' stats actually get worse as the season goes on because of increased competition level in the conference season.

Give this team an offseason to grow up and we will see radical improvement. We've got a great foundation. Answering the rebounding question if Henry leaves will be the biggest challenge. Figure that out, and this team will be very good.

Also, I feel like I say this every year (4 years running)... we have no shooters on our team.  Teams pack the lane and let us jack 3s and bad 2s... or they wait for us at the rim where we have a lot of problems finishing, outside of Luke and HE, of course.

Our season average for 3P% is about 1% below the national average. We are not a bad 3P shooting team. Were just not a good one. Again, another year of experience and those shooters will get even better....and if Henry leaves our 3P% would increase dramatically...wish I was kidding. Add in Hauser, Rowsey, and potentially Howard and we will be lights out next season.

Young teams are frustrating but its exciting to know that they are only going up.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I would love to see where MU ranks amongst highest ranked prospects in the country, we have a ton of high ranked kids:

PG - Cheatham - #76 Natl comp
SG - Duane - #59 Natl comp
SF - JJJ - #32 Natl comp
PF - Fish - #88 Natl comp
C - Henry - #9 Natl comp

Average starter HS ranking - 52.8

Sandy - #74 Natl comp
Heldt - #136 Natl comp
Traci - #126 Natl comp

Only Sacar & Wally are outside the top 150 per "247" national comp

---- DePaul has 2 players in top 150. One is Billy Garrett (#88), coaches son. And the other is a transfer Myke Henry (#63). Now that is an empty house compared to here

Talent is only half of the equation. You also need experience. Unfortunately, we are bottom ten in that category.

[CTWarrior]

Talent is only half of the equation.

And the right mix of guys. 

[tower912]

Correct.   Next year, MU isn't going to be in the bottom 10 of experience in all of college basketball.  (barring a mass exodus).    But if Henry leaves and the hole at the 4 isn't addressed, MU is still going to struggle in conference.    Too many big bodies for Luke and Matt to handle by themselves.     Team balance matters, too. 

[Lennys Tap]

Spin it however you'd like, but Al was 22-30 his first two seasons. If you are trying to claim that Wojo inherited a team on the cusp of greatness, you are off-base IMHO. You are allowed to think otherwise. All of this stuff is opinion.

Me spinning it? LOL. You're the spinmeister. The idea that MU fans were disappointed at any time in Al's first two years is true only in your imagination. Freshman weren't eligible when Al started coaching so in his first year he was stuck with nothing but the dumpster fire Ed Hickey left behind (a 6-21 team). So the first year was a total mulligan while we waited for Al's first recruiting class to become eligible - but even with that, there was improvement (to 8-18). In his second year (with that first recruiting class eligible) we jumped to 14-12 - and every MU fan knew that the best player on the campus (George Thompson) was eligible the next year. Marquette fan's attitudes back then were curiosity that became unbridled optimism by year two). I was one of those unbridled optimists. Maybe you've seen something in Wojo's first two years that you think warrants unbridled optimism. I haven't.

So you're still wrong on Al and Wooden in spite of your spinning. And if you can name 10 coaches who struggled early but eventually succeeded, I can probably name 100 who struggled early and failed. I like Wojo and hope for the best - but any MU fan who isn't a little concerned isn't paying attention.

[MUfan12]

I like Wojo and hope for the best - but any MU fan who isn't a little concerned isn't paying attention.

What concerns me is there's no identity to this team. We've heard for years how tough Marquette guys are. The pros wear it as a badge of honor. I don't see that in this group. Traci is the one guy that plays with an edge.

Maybe that will come as guys get older. Say what you will about Brent, but you knew his guys were gonna be tough SOBs that competed. This group lets a few bad trips down the floor derail them.

[HoopsterBC]

I don't think we know yet if Wojo is an excellent coach. We also do not know if he is a bad coach. We also do not know if he is a mediocre coach who is on his way toward becoming a good coach or a bad coach. The body of work simply is not broad enough yet.

Otherwise, sold post. Lots of Scoopers would have fired Al, Coach K and Wooden when they didn't win enough games their first couple seasons.

It takes time to rebuild a program, and we definitely needed rebuilding.

By this time next year, we might be able to make better judgments. By this time two years from now, we might be able to draw some actual conclusions.

And having said all of this, it doesn't really matter what a single Scooper thinks. Marquette's administration obviously really likes Wojo, and he isn't going anywhere for at least another 2-3 years.

But yes, I know, this is a fan board and we have to talk about something. Might as well be the coach's "leash"!

When it comes to basketball IQ, it is how you change your game when the scouting report says:  All left hand, does not use his right on lay-ups or dribbling,
has two shots, a lay-up or 3 point shot.  Does not jump real well, plays below the rim, has nice size for a guard. 

Sort of like Luke yesterday, finally took a 15 foot shot from the free-throw line, always wide open.  Knocks that down, becomes a better offensive player.  In that run
by Hall, Luke turned the ball over twice and missed 2 lefty hooks, that is all it takes, game changing.

[MerrittsMustache]

What concerns me is there's no identity to this team. We've heard for years how tough Marquette guys are. The pros wear it as a badge of honor. I don't see that in this group. Traci is the one guy that plays with an edge.

Maybe that will come as guys get older. Say what you will about Brent, but you knew his guys were gonna be tough SOBs that competed. This group lets a few bad trips down the floor derail them.

I've shared similar thoughts on here about this team having no clear-cut strength (strength, identity same difference). There's nothing that opponents know MU is going to bring night in and night out - whether that's toughness or pressure D or outside shooting or rebounding or a run-and-gun style or whatever the case may be. MU just doesn't have that right now.

My other concern is that there haven't been a whole lot of in-season adjustments. The strategy doesn't look much different now than it did in November and the team's weaknesses (rebounding and unforced TOs) haven't been effectively reduced.

Last night, in game 23 of the season, there were still times when a shot would go up and guys in close proximity to the basket would stand and watch. That's unacceptable.

Another example, Henry is shooting the same number of 3s in BE play as he was in non-conf play and he's shooting the same lowly percentage (~28%). He's got the most talent offensively on this team but his outside shot isn't there. Time to try something different - get him on the block, get him to the FT line, get him moving towards the basket, pick-and-roll, pick-and-pop, etc.

The one obvious adjustment that has been made is getting JJJ the ball with some space to drive. That's JJJ's game and it's good to see him put in that position more regularly.

That said, I'm not ready to give up on Wojo or start wondering about his "leash" but, as I've stated before, I'd really like to see a grizzled, experienced coach added to the staff.