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Author Topic: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships  (Read 11628 times)

muwar2003

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Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« on: July 27, 2015, 09:50:01 PM »
It seems we can't fill 13 scholarship spots.  We need a rebounder and can't seem to find one.  It is always someone else who gets the guy.   Why????  We have the facilities, play in the building with a pro team, put guys in the pros,  have a good support network.


bilsu

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2015, 09:53:02 PM »
Wojo said he would not just hand out scholarships. The player has to be able to contribute. I think that makes a lot of sense.

Dr. Blackheart

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #2 on: July 27, 2015, 09:54:43 PM »
Wojo has never been south of the Cheddar-Korbel Line, an'ia?   #ipass

wadesworld

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2015, 10:09:03 PM »
We have 6 scholarship newcomers this season.  I think that's more than enough.  He will fill all 13 when it doesn't mean bringing in 7 new players.
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tompopsicle

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2015, 10:41:58 PM »
Trust the process.

keefe

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2015, 01:07:29 AM »
Trust the process.

Your Scoop alias is...disturbing...


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Tugg Speedman

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2015, 06:32:36 AM »
It seems we can't fill 13 scholarship spots.  We need a rebounder and can't seem to find one.  It is always someone else who gets the guy.   Why????  We have the facilities, play in the building with a pro team, put guys in the pros,  have a good support network.

Carefully here ... when I suggested Wojo misjudged on graduate transfers Miller and/or Lee everyone here lost their mind.

But to your larger point.  If no one gets hurt, it is not an issue.  If players get hurt, sick (hopefully not transfer) and we are again down to 7 or 6 players last season, put this on Wojo for not filling out the roster.

We R Final Four

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2015, 07:17:45 AM »
I must have missed what you said about Miller and Lee--can you please bring that up 10,000 more times please so we can fully understand your position on the topic.  ::)

TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2015, 07:54:53 AM »
It seems we can't fill 13 scholarship spots.  We need a rebounder and can't seem to find one.  It is always someone else who gets the guy.   Why????

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2015, 08:57:22 AM »
We can't fill 13 scholarships because we aren't the ones that get to decide who gets those offers.


Why Wojo doesn't want to fill 13 scholarships is a different question.

chapman

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #10 on: July 28, 2015, 09:06:03 AM »
But to your larger point.  If no one gets hurt, it is not an issue.  If players get hurt, sick (hopefully not transfer) and we are again down to 7 or 6 players last season, put this on Wojo for not filling out the roster.

Agree.  We start at 10, and any one of a hundred combinations of injuries, illnesses, transfers, academics, etc. will have us right back to six or seven.  Never, ever self-impose scholarship penalties on the program for nothing more than failing to recruit a full roster.  Hopefully this is just part of the re-build and it's the last year we see it.

jsglow

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2015, 09:11:54 AM »
I think Wojo had a couple of potential transfers in mind but had reached his intended limit with '15 Frosh.  That now leaves the door open for '16 kids.  Something suggests to me that the risk of a mid year transfer is minimal this winter so we'll dress 10 scholarship guys and 3 walk-on players for each game.  Our only real shortcoming (apart from experience, etc.) is an extra big man.  Luke, Matt and Henry need to stay healthy.  It's a calculated risk. 

I too would prefer not to 'self-impose' but I'll predict that 12 months from now we'll have either 12 or 13 scholly players ready to roll.  Wojo seemingly has no desire to short circuit that long term process via unworthy bodies.  He was very fortunate last year when a quality guy like Carlino decided to join us for a year to provide some initial cover.

brewcity77

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #12 on: July 28, 2015, 09:18:31 AM »
Wojo said he would not just hand out scholarships. The player has to be able to contribute. I think that makes a lot of sense.

I agree. That said, I do feel that Wojo put too many eggs in the Miller/Lee basket. He expected to be able to get at least one if not both of them. When he failed, there didn't seem to be enough legwork done to bring in other targets. Leaving three scholarships open, especially when you haven't seen what 60% of your scholarship players will do at this level for your team, is a very risky proposition.

I can't see how there would have been any harm in going hard after a Rafael Maia, Tomasz Gielo, Anton Grady, Ike Nwamu, Adam Smith, or others as backup plans in case option A doesn't work out. I like what Wojo has done overall, but it does seem like secondary options is not a strong suit of his. If everyone stays healthy, that's fine, but one transfer and a couple injuries could have us just as short handed as we were a year ago.
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GGGG

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #13 on: July 28, 2015, 09:23:47 AM »
Carefully here ... when I suggested Wojo misjudged on graduate transfers Miller and/or Lee everyone here lost their mind.


Nobody "lost their mind" when you suggested this.  The problem is that you were taking what Big Daddy said as coming straight from the coach's mouth when in reality you have no idea what was said. 

This is what recruiting is.  You take shots at players, but sometimes it doesn't work out.

Wojo's recruiting is the least of Marquette's worries. 

GGGG

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #14 on: July 28, 2015, 09:24:33 AM »
I agree. That said, I do feel that Wojo put too many eggs in the Miller/Lee basket. He expected to be able to get at least one if not both of them. When he failed, there didn't seem to be enough legwork done to bring in other targets. Leaving three scholarships open, especially when you haven't seen what 60% of your scholarship players will do at this level for your team, is a very risky proposition.

I can't see how there would have been any harm in going hard after a Rafael Maia, Tomasz Gielo, Anton Grady, Ike Nwamu, Adam Smith, or others as backup plans in case option A doesn't work out. I like what Wojo has done overall, but it does seem like secondary options is not a strong suit of his. If everyone stays healthy, that's fine, but one transfer and a couple injuries could have us just as short handed as we were a year ago.


Either that or Wojo simply didn't think they were worthwhile players. 

Benny B

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #15 on: July 28, 2015, 09:30:26 AM »
Wojo's recruiting is the least of Marquette's worries.

This pretty much sums it up right here.
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Tugg Speedman

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #16 on: July 28, 2015, 09:32:39 AM »

Either that or Wojo simply didn't think they were worthwhile players.

Are they better than empty chairs or the best the rec center has to offer?

brewcity77

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #17 on: July 28, 2015, 09:33:05 AM »

Either that or Wojo simply didn't think they were worthwhile players.

Entirely possible, but I'm not sure that's a wise way of looking at things. You have one-year scholarships that will either go vacant or have bodies. When we suffered our injuries last year, Wojo had to reach out to the Mache twins just to have enough bodies for practice. That shouldn't be a necessity midseason.

Now maybe he's not worried about that with more walk-ons this year and Rowsey as well, giving us a minimum of 13 practice players, but last year we went into the season with 10 eligible players as well and we saw how that worked out. It's a risky proposition for a guy who's already had issues putting a full team on the floor. If you don't use these scholarships, you lose them. I find it hard to believe there wasn't anyone outside of Lee or Miller (or the few others we pursused with lukewarm interest) that could have contributed to this team one way or another.
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wadesworld

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #18 on: July 28, 2015, 09:33:53 AM »
I agree. That said, I do feel that Wojo put too many eggs in the Miller/Lee basket. He expected to be able to get at least one if not both of them. When he failed, there didn't seem to be enough legwork done to bring in other targets. Leaving three scholarships open, especially when you haven't seen what 60% of your scholarship players will do at this level for your team, is a very risky proposition.

I can't see how there would have been any harm in going hard after a Rafael Maia, Tomasz Gielo, Anton Grady, Ike Nwamu, Adam Smith, or others as backup plans in case option A doesn't work out. I like what Wojo has done overall, but it does seem like secondary options is not a strong suit of his. If everyone stays healthy, that's fine, but one transfer and a couple injuries could have us just as short handed as we were a year ago.

Anim and Carter were both "secondary options."  I expect those two to be very good players for our program.  I think Wojo's secondary options are going to be just fine for us.  It's not like the days of Trend Blackledge or Yous Mbao.
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wadesworld

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #19 on: July 28, 2015, 09:36:33 AM »
Entirely possible, but I'm not sure that's a wise way of looking at things. You have one-year scholarships that will either go vacant or have bodies. When we suffered our injuries last year, Wojo had to reach out to the Mache twins just to have enough bodies for practice. That shouldn't be a necessity midseason.

Now maybe he's not worried about that with more walk-ons this year and Rowsey as well, giving us a minimum of 13 practice players, but last year we went into the season with 10 eligible players as well and we saw how that worked out. It's a risky proposition for a guy who's already had issues putting a full team on the floor. If you don't use these scholarships, you lose them. I find it hard to believe there wasn't anyone outside of Lee or Miller (or the few others we pursused with lukewarm interest) that could have contributed to this team one way or another.

I will never understand why people would ever reference the first year of a coach's tenure who is brand new to the program when talking about how things can go south (or be great).  After the first year is over, you can completely wipe that from memory as far as a new coach to the program and how he will run the program or what happened.  Wojo had absolutely nothing to do with how the team was made up and he won't have 2 players who committed to play for one guy transferring out in the middle of a season because they don't fit in with the guy who took over the program.
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Tugg Speedman

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #20 on: July 28, 2015, 09:53:07 AM »
I will never understand why people would ever reference the first year of a coach's tenure who is brand new to the program when talking about how things can go south (or be great).  After the first year is over, you can completely wipe that from memory as far as a new coach to the program and how he will run the program or what happened.  Wojo had absolutely nothing to do with how the team was made up and he won't have 2 players who committed to play for one guy transferring out in the middle of a season because they don't fit in with the guy who took over the program.

I think you missed the point ... we have 10 players now, like last year.  Then a transfer (Burton) and a few injuries and last year we were down to 6 scholarship players at one point.  The fear is the same thing happens this year.

The comparison is about numbers, not quality.

GGGG

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #21 on: July 28, 2015, 09:57:07 AM »
Entirely possible, but I'm not sure that's a wise way of looking at things. You have one-year scholarships that will either go vacant or have bodies. When we suffered our injuries last year, Wojo had to reach out to the Mache twins just to have enough bodies for practice. That shouldn't be a necessity midseason.

Now maybe he's not worried about that with more walk-ons this year and Rowsey as well, giving us a minimum of 13 practice players, but last year we went into the season with 10 eligible players as well and we saw how that worked out. It's a risky proposition for a guy who's already had issues putting a full team on the floor. If you don't use these scholarships, you lose them. I find it hard to believe there wasn't anyone outside of Lee or Miller (or the few others we pursused with lukewarm interest) that could have contributed to this team one way or another.


I don't think bringing in marginal players (as judged by a coach) is beneficial period.  And yeah I would rather have an empty seat on the bench then to bring in a guy for one year who isn't going to be much of a contributor.  Remember that Marquette's numbers likely would have been fine had Burton and Dawson not transferred. 

And regardless, Marquette's problems last year weren't just due to lack of bodies.  It was due to lack of skill.  While this group is clearly not experienced, we have much better basketball players.

So IOW I think 13 practice players, 11 of which are scholarship players and 10 of whom can play, is just fine. 

GGGG

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #22 on: July 28, 2015, 09:57:58 AM »
I think you missed the point ... we have 10 players now, like last year.  Then a transfer (Burton) and a few injuries and last year we were down to 6 scholarship players at one point.  The fear is the same thing happens this year.

The comparison is about numbers, not quality.


I am going out on a limb and saying that we aren't going to have two players transferring halfway through the year this year.  I am rather confident that we won't have any.

jsglow

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #23 on: July 28, 2015, 10:00:41 AM »
I think you missed the point ... we have 10 players now, like last year.  Then a transfer (Burton) and a few injuries and last year we were down to 6 scholarship players at one point.  The fear is the same thing happens this year.

The comparison is about numbers, not quality.

The numbers comparison is completely invalid.  Last year at this time Wojo had exactly 2 guys he recruited in Sandy and Carlino.  This year he has 10 guys and I'm including holdovers who are now entering their second year under the new coach and didn't leave.

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Re: Why can't we fill 13 scholarships
« Reply #24 on: July 28, 2015, 10:04:42 AM »

I am going out on a limb and saying that we aren't going to have two players transferring halfway through the year this year.  I am rather confident that we won't have any.


Agreed.  It was Wojo's first year as head coach, so the players had no idea to expect.  Additionally, Wojo didn't recruit either of the guys who transferred.

Very different situation this season.