Bucks to unveil $500 million stadium plan just north of BC

[mu_hilltopper]

It's .. quite interesting that the Republican leadership is even entertaining the concept of breaking the "majority of the majority" concept .. by allowing a bill that needs Dem support to go forward.

[ChicosBailBonds]

I agree the argument doesn't seem to be catching on, but the opponents also seem to have their fingers in their ears with their eyes closed repeating "no, no, no, no, no".  I haven't seen anyone explain how the deal doesn't make sense financially for the state.

It is a choice argument.  Can that money be spent elsewhere, like on choo choo trains.


Look, I will be stunned if it ultimately doesn't get done.   The party of No for the last 20 years just about everywhere is the party not in power.

[brewcity77]

It is a choice argument.  Can that money be spent elsewhere, like on choo choo trains.

And that's part of the problem. A friend of mine recently pointed out that some of the UW-system schools have been spending tens and hundreds of millions in upgrades recently to their campuses, to try to put it in perspective. If we can spend (hypothetical numbers, don't remember his exacts) $50M at Stevens Point, $110M at Platteville, why can't we afford this?

Now part of it is that the money for the schools is earmarked for that. However in this case, no, that money really CAN'T be spent otherwise, because you have to factor in how this plan will work. If you put X amount of dollars into something else that would have gone into the arena, that "something else" won't bring back $10+M in revenue annually from 2017-2037 that the Bucks will guaranteed bring back. So that's $200M that the state won't get.

Can you put the money elsewhere? No. Not with the return on investment that keeping the Bucks guarantees. You can debate the merits, the growth, and all the other pros and cons to keeping the team, but you can't just put the money elsewhere and call it an equal investment, because that's not reality.

[Herman Cain]

And that's part of the problem. A friend of mine recently pointed out that some of the UW-system schools have been spending tens and hundreds of millions in upgrades recently to their campuses, to try to put it in perspective. If we can spend (hypothetical numbers, don't remember his exacts) $50M at Stevens Point, $110M at Platteville, why can't we afford this?

Now part of it is that the money for the schools is earmarked for that. However in this case, no, that money really CAN'T be spent otherwise, because you have to factor in how this plan will work. If you put X amount of dollars into something else that would have gone into the arena, that "something else" won't bring back $10+M in revenue annually from 2017-2037 that the Bucks will guaranteed bring back. So that's $200M that the state won't get.

Can you put the money elsewhere? No. Not with the return on investment that keeping the Bucks guarantees. You can debate the merits, the growth, and all the other pros and cons to keeping the team, but you can't just put the money elsewhere and call it an equal investment, because that's not reality.

A very good point. Also the reality is the money gets paid back with a return. An actual investment. And if anything actually happens with the urban redevelopment it is gravy.

[ChicosBailBonds]

And that's part of the problem. A friend of mine recently pointed out that some of the UW-system schools have been spending tens and hundreds of millions in upgrades recently to their campuses, to try to put it in perspective. If we can spend (hypothetical numbers, don't remember his exacts) $50M at Stevens Point, $110M at Platteville, why can't we afford this?

Now part of it is that the money for the schools is earmarked for that. However in this case, no, that money really CAN'T be spent otherwise, because you have to factor in how this plan will work. If you put X amount of dollars into something else that would have gone into the arena, that "something else" won't bring back $10+M in revenue annually from 2017-2037 that the Bucks will guaranteed bring back. So that's $200M that the state won't get.

Can you put the money elsewhere? No. Not with the return on investment that keeping the Bucks guarantees. You can debate the merits, the growth, and all the other pros and cons to keeping the team, but you can't just put the money elsewhere and call it an equal investment, because that's not reality.

I would suggest those that to get this done, get better messengers.  Maybe that's why Barry and Bo are coming in, because the state loves the Emperor and the Grinch.  Sign up Aaron Rodgers and it will win in a landslide.  

Right now the message, or the messengers are not getting through.  That's 90% of the battle.  Politics 101

[brewcity77]

I would suggest those that want this done get better messengers.  Maybe that's why Barry and Bo are coming in, because the state loves the Emperor and the Grinch.  Sign up Aaron Rodgers and it will win in a landslide.   

Right now the message, or the messengers are not getting through.  That's 90% of the battle.  Politics 101

I won't disagree there. The message is out there. The ads, the billboards, but it's an uphill fight against the MJS and a ton of misinformation. The odd thing about this is it's usually the right that fights big spending, but this time the right (mostly Walker) is driving it.

Something tells me I should stop this line of thinking before I drift into political thread material.

[moomoo]

Milwaukee democrats from the Senate are now saying they will NOT vote yes

also, Carpenter is now asking for Marquette to pony up some cash.  See below link

http://www.biztimes.com/article/20150707/ENEWSLETTERS02/150709885/-1/daily_enews

I hope this doesn't get messed up by these politicians from both sides of the aisle.  Would be such a shame to a city that is good, getting better and can be great again.

[GGGG]

Milwaukee democrats from the Senate are now saying they will NOT vote yes

also, Carpenter is now asking for Marquette to pony up some cash.  See below link

http://www.biztimes.com/article/20150707/ENEWSLETTERS02/150709885/-1/daily_enews

I hope this doesn't get messed up by these politicians from both sides of the aisle.  Would be such a shame to a city that is good, getting better and can be great again.

I don't think Marquette should be paying, but I am sympathetic to Carpenter's POV.  From the article:

"But Carpenter has been critical of the proposed arena deal. He said Republicans should hold public hearings in Milwaukee on the arena financing plan. Democrats have been shut out of negotiations on the arena deal and Carpenter said that Republicans have not reached out to him to get his support.

“They don’t include other people (in the negotiations), how can they expect to get their votes?” Carpenter said."

[mu03eng]

I don't think Marquette should be paying, but I am sympathetic to Carpenter's POV.  From the article:

"But Carpenter has been critical of the proposed arena deal. He said Republicans should hold public hearings in Milwaukee on the arena financing plan. Democrats have been shut out of negotiations on the arena deal and Carpenter said that Republicans have not reached out to him to get his support.

“They don’t include other people (in the negotiations), how can they expect to get their votes?” Carpenter said."

I think a lot of this is political maneuvering by democrats.  Republicans pulled this out of the budget specifically to force the democrats to have a visible vote on the topic.  Democrats are now trying to extract some sort of price in return.  I just don't think the leverage is there and I don't think there is any way a Milwaukee-area democrat wants to be seen voting against the arena.  Maybe I'm wrong.

[GGGG]

I simply don't think that Carpenter or any other Milwaukee politician loses much support if the Bucks leave town.  They will blame the rich owners and their blackmailing of Milwaukee.  I know that Senator Harris is supporting the project however.

[DienerTime34]

I called Lena Taylor's office and got a much more positive reaction than I was expecting, considering what she has said in public. Essentially she's for an arena but would prefer a slightly different financing plan.

But it seems like if a vote were to go down tomorrow, she's probably a yes. I bet a few more respectful calls could lock it up: (608) 266-5810.

[LAMUfan]

Info on calling representatives to support the arena

http://saveourbucks.com/arena-week-now-is-the-time/

[rocket surgeon]

seattle and vegas are licking their chops

hey, seattle should be last in line as they already had their chance even though i understand it's all about who wants them the most

how about this-the las vegas $$BUCKS$$     get it? BUCKS?   now that is pretty good right there heyna??

[bradley center bat]

I don't think Marquette should be paying, but I am sympathetic to Carpenter's POV.  From the article:

"But Carpenter has been critical of the proposed arena deal. He said Republicans should hold public hearings in Milwaukee on the arena financing plan. Democrats have been shut out of negotiations on the arena deal and Carpenter said that Republicans have not reached out to him to get his support.

“They don’t include other people (in the negotiations), how can they expect to get their votes?” Carpenter said."

There were two major Democrats in the meetings. Barrett and Abele.

[JWags85]

hey, seattle should be last in line as they already had their chance even though i understand it's all about who wants them the most

Lets not confuse having their team owned and sold by a stingy asshat like Howard Schultz with having their chance and not supporting a team.

[GGGG]

There were two major Democrats in the meetings. Barrett and Abele.

Neither of whom are in the legislature, and one of whom (Abele) the Democrats don't really trust.

[jsglow]

I think 03eng is correct.  My belief is that Milwaukee Democrats are attempting to get something (anything) out of the deal.  And remember that this can work both ways.  Leadership can remind reluctant upstate Republicans of that as the horse trading continues.  Political sausage making at its best.  This gets done by a couple votes, including some democratic ones.  It looks to me to be a much easier deal than Miller Park was back in the day.

[hairy worthen]

I think 03eng is correct.  My belief is that Milwaukee Democrats are attempting to get something (anything) out of the deal.  And remember that this can work both ways.  Leadership can remind reluctant upstate Republicans of that as the horse trading continues.  Political sausage making at its best.  This gets done by a couple votes, including some democratic ones.  It looks to me to be a much easier deal than Miller Park was back in the day.

I hope you are correct, but not so sure yet. The Gov. and Republican leadership need to do the sausage making pretty soon. It would put Walker in a bad light for his presidential run if he can't even push through legislation in his own state.

[mu_hilltopper]

[VegasWarrior77]

seattle and vegas are licking their chops

hey, seattle should be last in line as they already had their chance even though i understand it's all about who wants them the most

how about this-the las vegas $$BUCKS$$     get it? BUCKS?   now that is pretty good right there heyna??

The Bucks won't be moving here.  Rich owners are using Las Vegas/Seattle as a bargaining chip.  We have a good chance to get an NHL expansion hockey team....

[jsglow]

I hope you are correct, but not so sure yet. The Gov. and Republican leadership need to do the sausage making pretty soon. It would put Walker in a bad light for his presidential run if he can't even push through legislation in his own state.

Step one was the budget.  That got done last night in the Senate. 

I agree with your comments about Walker and his presidential run.  I suspect the arena deal gets done just prior to Monday's campaign announcement.  Ed Goeas knows what he's doing.  Photo op with Senator Kohl, Buck's ownership, Barry and Bo, Wojo, key members of both political parties.  Remember his theme is the 'Conservative who can actual get things done'.

Walker's got significant political leverage.  He's a top tier Republican presidential candidate.  In the end he gets enough Republican votes for this but it's really good politics if he adds some Democrats.  But he will get this through.

[mu_hilltopper]

Curious what others think, but .. I'd imagine Walker isn't exactly a beloved guy if you asked a bunch of Republican legislators.   What I mean is that .. if you were an out-state Republican and he came to you and said "hey, I know you're completely against this, but I'm running for president and I want you to switch your vote because I'm awesome and the country needs me."  .. I don't think that would be persuasive.  "Really?  I should go against my principals/constituents just for you personally?"

[GGGG]

Curious what others think, but .. I'd imagine Walker isn't exactly a beloved guy if you asked a bunch of Republican legislators.   What I mean is that .. if you were an out-state Republican and he came to you and said "hey, I know you're completely against this, but I'm running for president and I want you to switch your vote because I'm awesome and the country needs me."  .. I don't think that would be persuasive.  "Really?  I should go against my principals/constituents just for you personally?"

There are members of the Republican party that are irritated with Walker.  There are numerous parts of this budget proposal a number aren't comfortable with and know that much of it is about him running for President.  However, he is powerful and has access to resources that could help them.  Those who are sitting on the fence will be persuaded if he asks them personally for their support.

[jsglow]

There are members of the Republican party that are irritated with Walker.  There are numerous parts of this budget proposal a number aren't comfortable with and know that much of it is about him running for President.  However, he is powerful and has access to resources that could help them.  Those who are sitting on the fence will be persuaded if he asks them personally for their support.

Exactly.  Walker's got a reasonable shot to be the next President.  That's power both from the carrot and stick perspective.  Look, even Chris Abele might like to go to Washington.

That's why I'm actually confident.  Walker wants the bump.  The timing of this is perfect.  Arena deal, Presidential announcement, first debate all within 3 weeks.  Like I said, Ed Goeas is a pro's pro.  And we'll never really hear what the gov had to give to get this done.  But that's what the conversations are all about this week.

[mu03eng]

Curious what others think, but .. I'd imagine Walker isn't exactly a beloved guy if you asked a bunch of Republican legislators.   What I mean is that .. if you were an out-state Republican and he came to you and said "hey, I know you're completely against this, but I'm running for president and I want you to switch your vote because I'm awesome and the country needs me."  .. I don't think that would be persuasive.  "Really?  I should go against my principals/constituents just for you personally?"

Keep in mind this isn't totally Walker vs republicans.....this is Walker vs republicans of different flavors who are also against each other.  The arena is wrapped up in a lot of other politics as well, namely prevailing wage.  There are a lot of frayed relationships amongst the various republicans and it spills over into the arena debate.  By my understanding, Walker has been relatively removed from a lot of the current back and forth, mostly because he's not around for it