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Author Topic: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke  (Read 23954 times)

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #50 on: January 30, 2015, 11:50:10 AM »
Lol


NavinRJohnson

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #51 on: January 30, 2015, 12:01:44 PM »
And last season those same coaches picked MU to win the Big East - so apparently they get it wrong sometimes too.


Must not have played High School ball.

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #52 on: January 30, 2015, 03:41:39 PM »
Sadly, some here simply refuse to believe talented freshman/sophomores can lead a team to victory,

Nope. I believe that firmly. I'm banking on it for next season.

What I don't believe is that these freshman/sophomores were talented enough to do it.
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forgetful

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #53 on: January 30, 2015, 05:42:12 PM »
And last season those same coaches picked MU to win the Big East - so apparently they get it wrong sometimes too.

LOL - What is idiotic is to reference our pre-season conference ranking and try to use that as a benchmark for what talent/situation a coach inherited when walking into a program.  (Not to mention what I posted above.)  To use conference pre-season ranking as a metric is ridiculous as we were an Independent in the Majerus and Dukiet years.  Then to compare our pre-season conference rank in the vaunted MCC (O'Neill's situation), or Conference USA (Crean), and how the modified Big East (Wojo) are 4 very different "conferences."

Furthermore, in the last 35 years there have been Rick Majerus, Bob Dukiet, Kevin O'Neill, Mike Deane, Tom Crean, Buzz Williams, and now Wojo.  So, we are talking about 7 seasons in total (not 35 seasons).   And lastly, the point was about what the new head coach INHERITED walking into the program.

Sadly, some here simply refuse to believe talented freshman/sophomores can lead a team to victory, even though we've seen it at MU with the Big 3 under Crean, and just saw it under Seton Hall and Willard.  The rub of course is our last coach, Buzz, and now Wojo are making their bed with the not as nearly talented upperclassmen, while giving limited time to the underclassmen.  And once again, it is proving to be the wrong coaching decision.

Everyone agrees this is possible. But it requires talented freshman/sophomores.  Ours didn't pan out.  Hence, the experts thinking last year we wouldn't drop off much.  They though Du. Wilson could come in and replace Junior and that JJJ/Burton could replace the others.  JJJ/Burton were over-rated as their games were not balanced.  So we were bottom feeders in the Big East.  This year, with a further drop off in talent, the prognosticators got it right, we would be either not improved or worse.

You are one of the only persons on the planet that thinks we should have done well.  And news flash, this is not a "world is round" situation, where you are the only one that has it right.

Preseason rankings are more often right than wrong.  The reasons they get it wrong are usually they over-estimate the talent of incoming players.  Like last year for MU.

Dawson Rental

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #54 on: January 30, 2015, 09:58:39 PM »
Look Atticus - Some here are determined to make Wojo the victim in his first year on the job, and set unbelievably low expectations for him - for whatever reason.  He inherited the 2nd best situation at MU in the last 35 years.  Buzz had it really good his first year with the Big 4.  Yet the class the cupboard was QUITE empty of talent thereafter.

Wojo lost 2 kids, one of whom was an All Big East Freshman, and Top 60 recruit.  The other a 3 star - and now we are hot and heavy on the heels of a 3 star kid in Minneapolis.  This team should have 10 players on it.

We return a senior max minute PG who is incredibly efficient with the ball, has a nice assist to turnover ratio, and great shooting percentage.  Another Top 100 senior, Juan Anderson.  A fringe Top 100 PROVEN 5th year senior brought in by Wojo - in Matt Carlino.  Thereafter we had 4 Top 60 sophomores in Duane, Burton, JJJ and Luke.  A freshman Top 100 in Sandy.

The talent and potential certainly were there to be a bigger winner than this 10-10 outfit.  Problem is, the playing time decisions haven't been good by the head coach.



Agreed.  As the Seton Hall game proved, giving JjJ 30+ minutes a game is the key to a top 25 ranking.  Holding JjJ to seven minutes was the only way for Wojo to let Seton Hall slip away with a win.
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brewcity77

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #55 on: January 31, 2015, 08:31:24 AM »
Agreed.  As the Seton Hall game proved, giving JjJ 30+ minutes a game is the key to a top 25 ranking.  Holding JjJ to seven minutes was the only way for Wojo to let Seton Hall slip away with a win.

LOL No doubt.

The problem with placing expectations based on the number of top-100 players is silly because (shock and awe) other teams have them too. Michigan State has 6 top-100 players, of which 3 were upperclassmen. Ohio State has 8 top-100 players, including numerous 5-stars. Georgetown has 8 top-100 players, including a 5-star. Xavier has 8. Other teams have guys that were highly rated.

Anyone with 1/8th of a brain can realize that ratings aren't the be-all end-all, but I don't believe at any point Wojo has had more than 6 top-100 players available to him. We can say 7/8 all we want, but Burton left before Luke was available, and Matt Carlino, while a 4-star recruit by some services, doesn't seem to be in anyone's actual top-100.
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GGGG

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #56 on: January 31, 2015, 08:43:54 AM »
LOL No doubt.

The problem with placing expectations based on the number of top-100 players is silly because (shock and awe) other teams have them too. Michigan State has 6 top-100 players, of which 3 were upperclassmen. Ohio State has 8 top-100 players, including numerous 5-stars.


Clearly Izzo and Matta are playing mind games with their players.  That is the only reason I can think of for their struggles this year.

NersEllenson

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #57 on: January 31, 2015, 11:21:05 AM »
LOL No doubt.

The problem with placing expectations based on the number of top-100 players is silly because (shock and awe) other teams have them too. Michigan State has 6 top-100 players, of which 3 were upperclassmen. Ohio State has 8 top-100 players, including numerous 5-stars. Georgetown has 8 top-100 players, including a 5-star. Xavier has 8. Other teams have guys that were highly rated.

Anyone with 1/8th of a brain can realize that ratings aren't the be-all end-all, but I don't believe at any point Wojo has had more than 6 top-100 players available to him. We can say 7/8 all we want, but Burton left before Luke was available, and Matt Carlino, while a 4-star recruit by some services, doesn't seem to be in anyone's actual top-100.

LOL - And per Pomeroy rankings, Michigan State is 24, Ohio State 16, Xavier 20, Georgetown 31.  Marquette under Wojo?? 102 in the country.

You usual suspects can keep making all the excuses for Wojo your 1/8th brain allows for you too - just as the same usual suspects did for Buzz last season. 

And really?  Wojo didn't have Burton available to him?  He did.  Burton didn't like his role/Wojo and moved on.  JJJ will be next.  And we are scrapping the heap for 3 star recruits out of Minneapolis and likely are going to have 4 scholarships if not 5 to fill.

Everyone agrees this is possible. But it requires talented freshman/sophomores.  Ours didn't pan out.  Hence, the experts thinking last year we wouldn't drop off much.  They though Du. Wilson could come in and replace Junior and that JJJ/Burton could replace the others.  JJJ/Burton were over-rated as their games were not balanced.  So we were bottom feeders in the Big East.  This year, with a further drop off in talent, the prognosticators got it right, we would be either not improved or worse.

You are one of the only persons on the planet that thinks we should have done well.  And news flash, this is not a "world is round" situation, where you are the only one that has it right.

Preseason rankings are more often right than wrong.  The reasons they get it wrong are usually they over-estimate the talent of incoming players.  Like last year for MU.

PS - Our freshman didn't pan out last season/into this year??  Jump to conclusions much?  NONE OF THEM were given legitimate opportunity.  Crean had no choice with the Big Three because there was SO little talent in the program when they arrived.  They all got roughly 27+ minutes per game every game.  All of them got to play through their growing pains and largely knew they were getting max minutes - that's how you get max performance, and talented guys will deliver.  When you are maxing minutes of guys that are so overmatched and have no higher ceiling than a Derrick, Jake, Juan - you aint going to win.

None of JJJ, Burton, Dawson SNIFFED 27+ minutes per game last season or this season.  Buzz and Wojo had the option to give them more minutes - they chose to be loyal to highly deficient veterans - and why it should be a shock to anyone that we bricked last season and now this when we are maxing minutes of guys like Derrick, Jake Thomas, and Juan Anderson is beyond me.

The record last year, and again this year didn't/won't lie.  Greatly underperforming the talent available on the roster.
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NickelDimer

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #58 on: January 31, 2015, 11:58:17 AM »
Guess Scoop has become an infinite loop!  :o

Yep, and I used to blame Ners. But he's absolved from blame...he truly suffers from delusional thinking...to the point I feel bad for him.  But those who REFUSE to ignore his repeated arguments are the real problem.  I used to wish Ners would stfu...now I wish those who can't ignore him would
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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #59 on: January 31, 2015, 12:31:05 PM »


Or the simpler solution. They weren't as good as advertised so they played less.

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forgetful

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #60 on: January 31, 2015, 12:33:50 PM »
Ners, I'll go back to my previous offer.  Lets play 1 on 1 and then drink scotch.  I'll allow you to complain about Derrick ad nauseum.

FartyEightHours

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #61 on: January 31, 2015, 12:35:41 PM »
You can't fart out mental illness. 

A lot round here.
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g0lden3agle

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #62 on: January 31, 2015, 12:43:26 PM »
Whatever happened to the idea that we would sticky one thread for people to complain about playing time in?

Blackhat

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #63 on: January 31, 2015, 12:54:53 PM »
That is pure genius Farty.

U r dropping gems.

NersEllenson

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #64 on: January 31, 2015, 12:56:07 PM »
Yep, and I used to blame Ners. But he's absolved from blame...he truly suffers from delusional thinking...to the point I feel bad for him.  But those who REFUSE to ignore his repeated arguments are the real problem.  I used to wish Ners would stfu...now I wish those who can't ignore him would

LOL - Thanks.  I appreciate that.  You may want to reconsider the source of delusional thinking around here.  All last season so many of the usual suspects posted things would get better, Buzz's teams improve, blah, blah, blah - and I said in late November if Buzz didn't change his lineup - the team was going to be awful.  

Now, this season, the same group wants to excuse Wojo and give him a pass on this year, when they are nothing but manufactured excuses to excuse what has been a poor performance thus far with regard to on court results.  

I'll gladly credit our coaches when they are deserving, and supported Buzz a ton his first 5 years here - last season that changed.  Wojo has a nice recruiting class coming in, yet with the transfers, and perhaps another on the way, next season could be ugly - though we will greatly benefit from finally being free from Derrick Wilson running our team 35 minutes per game, and that alone should help a lot.
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BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

GGGG

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #65 on: January 31, 2015, 05:38:39 PM »
Yep, and I used to blame Ners. But he's absolved from blame...he truly suffers from delusional thinking...to the point I feel bad for him.  But those who REFUSE to ignore his repeated arguments are the real problem.  I used to wish Ners would stfu...now I wish those who can't ignore him would


It really is easy to ignore him if you try. 

NickelDimer

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Re: RE: Rasheed Sulaimon dismissed from Duke
« Reply #66 on: January 31, 2015, 06:16:37 PM »

It really is easy to ignore him if you try. 
For some it's impossible. The "ban yourself from Ners" thread is a perfect exhibit of that
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