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Author Topic: John Dawson  (Read 90980 times)

MU82

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #125 on: November 28, 2014, 09:33:23 AM »
14-33 - Translates to Vander's career shooting mark of 42.9% - so if you are going to diss Newbill for shooting 14-33, at least make sure it's worse than Vander's career.  Newbill is shooting 48.5% right now for this season.  For his career he shoots 45% from the Field.

Of course all things are not equal, and Newbill hasn't been a part of very good teams.  Yet if you are a coach, and you face a team with limited talent - but the opposition has one good player - do you not try to take away that good player?  

Did Robert Jackson not benefit from playing with D-Wade, Travis Diener, Steve Novak?  Did each of those guys also not benefit from playing with each other? Point is it is HARDER to perform when the talent around you is subpar.

The Big 10 isn't a slouch league at all, and last season Newbill averaged 17.8ppg on 45% shooting, and averages 5 rebounds per game with a 123.9 rating.  Vander's BEST year at MU he averaged 14.7ppg on 45% shooting with 3 rebounds per game - and an O-Rating of 104.2.62 assists for 36 steals for the whole year.

Hmm - A guy can be a better player, but plays on a worse team.  Doesn't make the other player "better."

Comparisons between Vander and Newbill are silly.

Vander became the go-to man for the champions of the old Big East, and his team never would have reached the Elite Eight without his clutch play. Newbill is a good player for a Big Ten bottom-feeder. Neither is an NBA player but Vander obviously had a greater impact on college basketball.
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GGGG

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #126 on: November 28, 2014, 09:46:02 AM »
Comparisons between Vander and Newbill are silly.

Vander became the go-to man for the champions of the old Big East, and his team never would have reached the Elite Eight without his clutch play. Newbill is a good player for a Big Ten bottom-feeder. Neither is an NBA player but Vander obviously had a greater impact on college basketball.


Yep.

This is just one of Ners' things.

BossplayaOtto

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #127 on: November 28, 2014, 07:34:02 PM »
You can look at the photos on go.marquette and he is in the warm-ups. As I overheard from a female near me: "Doesn't Marquette know grey warmups don't go with blue uniforms? Bad look."

This year's gray warmups are horrible. We've had many years with cool warmups but these are weak.

Nevada233

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #128 on: November 28, 2014, 10:12:24 PM »
5 DNP's in a row....

4 min for the season... I'd just leave now and at least have an appealing case to the NCAA to play without sitting out next year......


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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #129 on: November 28, 2014, 10:13:28 PM »
5 DNP's in a row....

4 min for the season... I'd just leave now and at least have an appealing case to the NCAA to play without sitting out next year......



And that appeal would be...?

NersEllenson

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #130 on: November 28, 2014, 10:17:59 PM »
And that appeal would be...?

A medical redshirt.  Suddenly Dawson will have a season ending injury.  At least that's what I'd fake if I were him.

In Travis Diener's assessment of the players:

John Dawson:  John is a great athlete, strong,  that can knock down shots.

Hmm. 
"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #131 on: November 28, 2014, 10:22:13 PM »
A medical redshirt.  Suddenly Dawson will have a season ending injury.  At least that's what I'd fake if I were him.

In Travis Diener's assessment of the players:

John Dawson:  John is a great athlete, strong,  that can knock down shots.

Hmm. 

Yeah, you do know how ridiculous you sound, right?

NersEllenson

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #132 on: November 28, 2014, 10:26:07 PM »
Yeah, you do know how ridiculous you sound, right?

LOL - You asked for a reason for an appeal...I gave you one.  And yes, I know it was ridiculous.  But, if I'm Dawson...I'd try to figure out a way to get eligible somewhere else next year.  Languishing on the bench for a whole season behind a guy like Derrick for a second year in a row would be brutal.

"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #133 on: November 28, 2014, 10:28:15 PM »
LOL - You asked for a reason for an appeal...I gave you one.  And yes, I know it was ridiculous.  But, if I'm Dawson...I'd try to figure out a way to get eligible somewhere else next year.  Languishing on the bench for a whole season behind a guy like Derrick for a second year in a row would be brutal.



Okay, as long as all agree on ridiculous. And yes, I'd be pissed too, but after two coaches someone has to start looking at himself.

jesmu84

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #134 on: November 28, 2014, 10:33:28 PM »
LOL - You asked for a reason for an appeal...I gave you one.  And yes, I know it was ridiculous.  But, if I'm Dawson...I'd try to figure out a way to get eligible somewhere else next year.  Languishing on the bench for a whole season behind a guy like Derrick for a second year in a row would be brutal.



Maybe be better than him and you won't have to have that experience.

NersEllenson

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #135 on: November 28, 2014, 10:35:23 PM »
Okay, as long as all agree on ridiculous. And yes, I'd be pissed too, but after two coaches someone has to start looking at himself.

That's a fair point.  But, there are certain types of players who are just coaches "pets."  It happens.  Derrick is the classic case:  Great kid.  Hard working.  Scrappy defender. High character.  Not turnover prone.  

Problem is those kind of guys rarely help you WIN games, when they play big* minutes.  Between Carlino and Duane I feel the PG position is in good enough hands - give the other guard minutes to JJJ/Dawson or even Cohen and see what they can give you.  They are far more the future of the program than is Derrick.
"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #136 on: November 28, 2014, 10:48:41 PM »
That's a fair point.  But, there are certain types of players who are just coaches "pets."  It happens.  Derrick is the classic case:  Great kid.  Hard working.  Scrappy defender. High character.  Not turnover prone. 

Problem is those kind of guys rarely help you WIN games, when they play big* minutes.  Between Carlino and Duane I feel the PG position is in good enough hands - give the other guard minutes to JJJ/Dawson or even Cohen and see what they can give you.  They are far more the future of the program than is Derrick.

Pets or not, everyone had a blank slate with Wojo. Derrick is the old trusty store bought sirloin sitting at home waiting for you, but does anyone really know that Dawson is that filet at Gibson's?

GooooMarquette

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #137 on: November 28, 2014, 10:52:59 PM »
give the other guard minutes to JJJ/Dawson or even Cohen and see what they can give you.  They are far more the future of the program than is Derrick.

Profound - a freshman and two sophs are more the future of the program than a senior. 

I have a hunch that Wojo is opting for Derrick because he is playing for the present.

NersEllenson

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #138 on: November 28, 2014, 10:53:27 PM »
Pets or not, everyone had a blank slate with Wojo. Derrick is the old trusty store bought sirloin sitting at home waiting for you, but does anyone really know that Dawson is that filet at Gibson's?

Hard to know when the filet never gets served in the restaurant.

All I know is the filet shoots and passes the ball considerably better, and defends nearly as well - and isn't nearing it's "throw away" date.
"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

MikeDeanesDarkGlasses

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #139 on: November 28, 2014, 10:55:04 PM »
 

I have a hunch that Wojo is opting for Derrick because he is playing for the present.
You mean we won't be resigning Derrick Wilson?  That's going to free up a lot of cap room. 

Nevada233

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #140 on: November 28, 2014, 10:58:23 PM »
LOL - You asked for a reason for an appeal...I gave you one.  And yes, I know it was ridiculous.  But, if I'm Dawson...I'd try to figure out a way to get eligible somewhere else next year.  Languishing on the bench for a whole season behind a guy like Derrick for a second year in a row would be brutal.



Right, sitting behind him for 35 Mpg is very appealing.... Said Nobody

NersEllenson

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #141 on: November 28, 2014, 10:58:45 PM »
Profound - a freshman and two sophs are more the future of the program than a senior. 

I have a hunch that Wojo is opting for Derrick because he is playing for the present.

No doubt about it.  We need that 20% FT shooting, non-existent 3 point shooting, and tonight 0 assists.  Soon teams will again sag off Derrick and his one effective move - going to his right off the dribble while closely defended - will be gone as he won't be able to get a step due to the defender sagging off of him 5 feet.  Our conference foes know his game and won't make the same mistake of guarding him honestly as has every team thus far.
"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

WayOfTheWarrior

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #142 on: November 28, 2014, 10:59:02 PM »
To shed some light on the situation, I just talked to a friend of mine who knows John and his friends (2nd hand source). I know that may sound shady to some of you but I'm fairly confident in the accuracy of the info I got.

According to my friend he is apparently on 'partial academic probation'. Not sure exactly what that means or any specifics into the matter as I did not inquire any further. That may explain why he warms up with the team but doesn't take off his warmups ever during the course of the game.

I thought it was weird that he literally had no playing time when he obviously had a good deal of experience last season and we could use some depth in the rotation. This, for me, explains the situation well.

MikeDeanesDarkGlasses

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #143 on: November 28, 2014, 11:07:10 PM »
To shed some light on the situation, I just talked to a friend of mine who knows John and his friends (2nd hand source). I know that may sound shady to some of you but I'm fairly confident in the accuracy of the info I got.

According to my friend he is apparently on 'partial academic probation'. Not sure exactly what that means or any specifics into the matter as I did not inquire any further. That may explain why he warms up with the team but doesn't take off his warmups ever during the course of the game.

I thought it was weird that he literally had no playing time when he obviously had a good deal of experience last season and we could use some depth in the rotation. This, for me, explains the situation well.

My guess is that Wojo doesn't dick around with grades and is setting an example for the team given how dire the situation is with the lack of depth.  Rule with an iron fist Wojo !!!   

 Academic Probation - Full probation means you have to bring your cumulative gpa above 2.0 after that semester is over.  As far as partial goes ..... I'm thinking it might be that his cumulative is above 2.0 but his last semester gpa may have been below 2.0.  You're not allowed to have consecutive semesters below 2.0.  If that is the case then he must get above a 2.0 this semester to qualify for next semester. 

Help me out if I'm wrong. 

WayOfTheWarrior

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #144 on: November 28, 2014, 11:17:57 PM »
Is it possible that Wojo has his own unwritten standard for grades other than the 2.0 minimum? Could it be he is doing badly in one class and that is bringing him down? I'm not sure, but I feel like it would be common knowledge if he was officially ineligible under the standard rules.

ChitownSpaceForRent

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #145 on: November 28, 2014, 11:21:29 PM »
Could just be that Wojo really wants him to lock in before finals just to make sure he isn't on the wrong side of the grade line once they come out.

Eldon

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #146 on: November 28, 2014, 11:39:17 PM »
Wojo setting his own standards makes sense. If true, I can see the strategy--set an example/precedent of taking grades seriously now while you are somewhat playing with house money (expectations are relatively low). Though I'm not sure if this is his actual thought process, as this is somewhat of a long-term strategy and, for better or for worse, coaches are generally focused on the short-term.

Anyway, if it's grades, then I understand the lack of PT. But if it's not grades, then is he that bad in practice?  I mean, look at Jamal Ferguson. That guy NEVER played. And Jamail Jones, too, though to a lesser extent. These guys were likely that bad.

Last year, Brent had enough confidence in Dawson to play him in quite a few games, even crucial ones and in game-time situations. My point here is that Dawson is getting the Jamal Ferguson treatment, but from what we saw last year, Dawson can handle his own.

If at some point in the season we are figuratively  mathematically-eliminated from the tourney, I hope Wojo "rolls the dice" and plays Dawson.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2014, 11:42:10 PM by Eldon »

Texas Western

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #147 on: November 29, 2014, 12:03:37 AM »
I think it is straightforward . Derrick , Duane, JJJ, Carlino and Cohen are getting the guard minutes . There simply is nothing there for him until he can earn the confidence of
The coaches .  When Luke is eligible it will push him further down the list . Hopefully we can build big leads against the remaining cupcakes and he can get a few minutes to show what he can do.

Nevada233

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #148 on: November 29, 2014, 12:25:08 AM »
Wojo setting his own standards makes sense. If true, I can see the strategy--set an example/precedent of taking grades seriously now while you are somewhat playing with house money (expectations are relatively low). Though I'm not sure if this is his actual thought process, as this is somewhat of a long-term strategy and, for better or for worse, coaches are generally focused on the short-term.

Anyway, if it's grades, then I understand the lack of PT. But if it's not grades, then is he that bad in practice?  I mean, look at Jamal Ferguson. That guy NEVER played. And Jamail Jones, too, though to a lesser extent. These guys were likely that bad.

Last year, Brent had enough confidence in Dawson to play him in quite a few games, even crucial ones and in game-time situations. My point here is that Dawson is getting the Jamal Ferguson treatment, but from what we saw last year, Dawson can handle his own.

If at some point in the season we are figuratively  mathematically-eliminated from the tourney, I hope Wojo "rolls the dice" and plays Dawson.


When asked about his grades a person in the know said No, "John has never failed a class at Marquette nor is he failing any now..."  He is no where near achedemic probation... So that is certainly not the reason... Hes just getting the Jamal Fergson treatment at this point....
« Last Edit: November 29, 2014, 12:28:19 AM by Nevada233 »

TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: John Dawson
« Reply #149 on: November 29, 2014, 12:32:10 AM »
Hard to know when the filet never gets served in the restaurant.

I worked at a restaurant back in high school. Whenever the chefs created a new dish, they would have the entire wait staff try it to see if it was any good. If it wasn't, it didn't get served.

Maybe there's a parallel than can be drawn...
TAMU

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