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Author Topic: NJIT thoughts  (Read 20581 times)

brandx

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #50 on: November 25, 2014, 10:28:12 AM »
I commend you on speaking the truth about yourself.  McCarthy is deemed one of the best coaches in coaching circles.  Great player development, no team issues that blow up in the media, no one late to practice etc.  Green Bay even takes in players who have had trouble with the law and they end up being staying out of trouble in Green Bay.  He has one of the best records in football among many other accolades. 

Your analysis is flimsy and holds no merit.  Learn how to make a coherent argument rather than rambling on.  Push yourself ........ because if you were on McCarthy's team he'd push you to make you better. 

Calm down, Ellisium.

It was my mistake - I quoted the wrong guy. I meant to quote MattyV who attacked McCarthy. I was defending McCarthy.

paddyquakes

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #51 on: November 25, 2014, 10:42:06 AM »
Sorry to be dumb but I watched my first game last night. Will we play man the whole season you think ? I like man D but we don't seem physical enough.
As for Wojo, it seems that guys have the green light. Again I like it but we seem rushed on O and may not get to the rim against big teams.
As for next year, Wojo's first class is amazing and if he was at all inmvolved with recruitiong Jabari Parker to Duke, he will likely have more solid recruiting years ahead. I hope.

brewcity77

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #52 on: November 25, 2014, 11:11:18 AM »
Sorry to be dumb but I watched my first game last night. Will we play man the whole season you think ? I like man D but we don't seem physical enough.
As for Wojo, it seems that guys have the green light. Again I like it but we seem rushed on O and may not get to the rim against big teams.
As for next year, Wojo's first class is amazing and if he was at all inmvolved with recruitiong Jabari Parker to Duke, he will likely have more solid recruiting years ahead. I hope.

Right now, man might still suit us best. I just can't see this team playing zone. They don't have the length to keep guys out of the lane, and when drivers do get through, there are no rim protectors. The reason zones like Syracuse and this year's Ohio State are so effective is because they have long, athletic players and at least 1-2 really big guys down low to make you pay when you do drive. If we played zone right now, it would usually consist of Juan and Taylor down, with Jajuan and Burton the most likely guys to relieve them. Matt, Derrick, and Duane would be the primary perimeter guys. Not a ton of lateral quickness to shut down lanes and not a lot of height to trouble shooters trying to fire over the zone.

While it's only one guy, Fischer could really help with a zone. If he can be a reliable interior presence with Juan or Steve alongside for rebounding, you actually have a little something. That would allow either Juan or Steve, Jajuan, and Burton to help out on the perimeter. That at least would allow Wojo to regularly put 1-2 guys on the perimeter that are 6'5" or so. Still not ideal, but far better than what we'd have now.

I don't think it's something we'd use all game long, but when Luke is back, I could definitely see it being effective as a change-up option. It would also massively help mask some of the defensive liabilities, especially for Jajuan, who I believe played zone at Southwind.
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WarhawkWarrior

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #53 on: November 25, 2014, 11:14:01 AM »
Recruiting may get difficult with a 2 and 20 record.  Maybe we need to switch to zone and periodically bring out man to man when we can learn to play it.  I have never seen more layups than we gave up in the last two games.  Very fortunately, NJIT couldn't finish them.  I will go to every game regardless, I am a fan.  Lots has to change for us to win any game in the Big East.  
Remain hopeful.

21rooster

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #54 on: November 25, 2014, 11:43:17 AM »
I think our expectations are skewed because of the last coaching transition, but there is a key difference: Indiana versus Virginia Tech.  Crean left four starting seniors behind because he had the opportunity to coach at an elite program.  Buzz seemingly left for Virginia Tech because he had one returning senior starter (one that would not start on most other teams), and he was facing a fading star with back-to-back poor seasons.  When Crean left, Buzz walked into a team that could coach itself, so rookie mistakes were covered up.  For Wojo, every rookie deficiency is magnified because the talent, experience, prior development or discipline is lacking for his players.  I believe Wojo will learn, similar to Buzz...it just won't be as pretty this year because he's left cleaning up the mess that was left behind.  Given the recruiting class that Wojo has assembled for next year, a little patience doesn't seem like too much to ask. 

StCroix64

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #55 on: November 25, 2014, 12:02:31 PM »
New Team, New Coach, New System, Undersized.

It takes time.  Yes, the cupboard was pretty bare for Wojo.

Size will help, but until everyone can focus on executing fundamental defense, this team will struggle.  Lets hope coach can get this group to assimilate to his system and we can have a "marginally" good season (think NIT at this point).

brewcity77

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #56 on: November 25, 2014, 12:08:01 PM »
Recruiting may get difficult with a 2 and 20 record.  Maybe we need to switch to zone and periodically bring out man to man when we can learn to play it.  I have never seen more layups than we gave up in the last two games.  Very fortunately, NJIT couldn't finish them.  I will go to every game regardless, I am a fan.  Lots has to change for us to win any game in the Big East.  
Remain hopeful.


I still think we can win 10-15 games. 15 might be a stretch, but it's not impossible. No one wants to hear it, but UNO really was a horrible matchup for us. This team is horrible at transition defense and we played the fastest team in the country. Once they start to grasp the defense, figure out how to slow the game down, and learn what it means to be a team and not just a group of players, we will have something. Maybe not what we all want, but it will be better than this.
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MU82

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #57 on: November 25, 2014, 12:13:19 PM »
Lets not go overboard.  20 and 9 against NJIT.  Jamil had 24 and 9 at Cal-State Fullerton last year, too.  Call me when it is against a real team.  

I do not dispute that Juan Anderson plays with great heart, effort and aggression, however.  I just think the knocks against Jamil are overblown.


Fair enough about needing to see how Juan does against real opponents. I don't think the knocks against Jamil are overblown, though. IMHO, his senior season was one of the more disappointing by an individual Warrior in recent years.
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Silkk the Shaka

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #58 on: November 25, 2014, 12:33:32 PM »
I still think we can win 10-15 games. 15 might be a stretch, but it's not impossible. No one wants to hear it, but UNO really was a horrible matchup for us. This team is horrible at transition defense and we played the fastest team in the country. Once they start to grasp the defense, figure out how to slow the game down, and learn what it means to be a team and not just a group of players, we will have something. Maybe not what we all want, but it will be better than this.

Hysterical! Was NJIT a "horrible matchup" for us too? They took us down to the wire on our own court. Come on, no need to play these games. We are a young team that will be fun to watch grow. We might even jell over the three-cupcake stretch once Fischer gets added. But then again, we just might not. Right now though, we're not very good, no matter the "matchup problem." And I'm okay with that. It's a rookie HC with a young, small team. Better days are ahead. Villanova was 13-19 a few years ago. College hoops is cyclical, this is our down period. Hopefully it's brief (I think it will be), but right now it is what it is.

MerrittsMustache

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #59 on: November 25, 2014, 12:33:46 PM »
Fair enough about needing to see how Juan does against real opponents. I don't think the knocks against Jamil are overblown, though. IMHO, his senior season was one of the more disappointing by an individual Warrior in recent years.

Many MU fans had expectations that Jamil was going to follow in the footsteps of Lazar, Jimmy and Jae and become "the man" and a surefire, All-Conference performer. That's not who he was. That's not what he was capable of. His peak was as a third option, and I don't say that as an insult. He was much more Olouma Nnamaka than he was Lazar Hayward. If you were truly that disappointed in him then your expectations were set too highly.


San Diego Warrior

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #60 on: November 25, 2014, 12:38:24 PM »
I think our expectations are skewed because of the last coaching transition, but there is a key difference: Indiana versus Virginia Tech.  Crean left four starting seniors behind because he had the opportunity to coach at an elite program.  Buzz seemingly left for Virginia Tech because he had one returning senior starter (one that would not start on most other teams), and he was facing a fading star with back-to-back poor seasons.  When Crean left, Buzz walked into a team that could coach itself, so rookie mistakes were covered up.  For Wojo, every rookie deficiency is magnified because the talent, experience, prior development or discipline is lacking for his players.  I believe Wojo will learn, similar to Buzz...it just won't be as pretty this year because he's left cleaning up the mess that was left behind.  Given the recruiting class that Wojo has assembled for next year, a little patience doesn't seem like too much to ask. 

Agree 100% with this.

MU82

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #61 on: November 25, 2014, 12:40:17 PM »
Many MU fans had expectations that Jamil was going to follow in the footsteps of Lazar, Jimmy and Jae and become "the man" and a surefire, All-Conference performer. That's not who he was. That's not what he was capable of. His peak was as a third option, and I don't say that as an insult. He was much more Olouma Nnamaka than he was Lazar Hayward. If you were truly that disappointed in him then your expectations were set too highly.



How 'bout this: I didn't think he'd be Lazar/Jimmy/Jae but I thought he'd be more than Nnamaka. Unfortunately, he was far closer to the latter.

I agree that those who expected All-Conference were setting themselves up for disappointment, but I just wanted him to play with passion and purpose, and to use the offensive skills he obviously possessed. I don't think that was unfair.
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MerrittsMustache

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #62 on: November 25, 2014, 12:50:03 PM »
How 'bout this: I didn't think he'd be Lazar/Jimmy/Jae but I thought he'd be more than Nnamaka. Unfortunately, he was far closer to the latter.

I agree that those who expected All-Conference were setting themselves up for disappointment, but I just wanted him to play with passion and purpose, and to use the offensive skills he obviously possessed. I don't think that was unfair.

He did play with passion and purpose but he just didn't possess the offensive skills that many MU fans believed he did.

Canned Goods n Ammo

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #63 on: November 25, 2014, 12:54:17 PM »
He did play with passion and purpose but he just didn't possess the offensive skills that many MU fans believed he did.


I agree with you, but I'll say this:

- Buzz kept telling everybody how good Jamil was.
- When I watched Jamil at scrimmages, he was getting directions from Buzz and translating it to the team. He was clearly the leader
- Buzz made comments that Jamil could play any position on the floor
- Jamil appeared to have supreme athletic ability
- I believe Jamil was picked for pre-season all conference (if I remember right)

So, my expectations were built up.

Ultimately, Jamil was a good college player. Nothing more, nothing less. I was hoping for all-conference, and unfortunately, it didn't happen.


brandx

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #64 on: November 25, 2014, 01:26:03 PM »
Hysterical! Was NJIT a "horrible matchup" for us too? They took us down to the wire on our own court. Come on, no need to play these games. We are a young team that will be fun to watch grow. We might even jell over the three-cupcake stretch once Fischer gets added. But then again, we just might not. Right now though, we're not very good, no matter the "matchup problem." And I'm okay with that. It's a rookie HC with a young, small team. Better days are ahead. Villanova was 13-19 a few years ago. College hoops is cyclical, this is our down period. Hopefully it's brief (I think it will be), but right now it is what it is.

Was Louisiana -Monroe a "horrible matchup" for #8 ranked Florida? You're right that we aren't a very good team right now. But matchups are important. That's why seeds 13 and 14, can beat 3 and 4 seeds in the tourney. It's not because they are better teams.

Silkk the Shaka

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #65 on: November 25, 2014, 01:40:36 PM »
Was Louisiana -Monroe a "horrible matchup" for #8 ranked Florida? You're right that we aren't a very good team right now. But matchups are important. That's why seeds 13 and 14, can beat 3 and 4 seeds in the tourney. It's not because they are better teams.

I understand how matchup problems work in the tournament. When two consecutive horrible teams that play differing styles come into your building and one beats you fairly soundly then the other takes you to the last minute, it's no longer a "matchup problem" issue. At that point you're just playing bad ball.

I'm okay with this. It's extremely early in a season with a new coach, new system, young players, and a massive height deficiency. I think we will improve throughout the season, and may even get to a fairly respectable level once Fischer comes on board. I just find it funny when people go through mental gymnastics to try to say these last two performances were anything but a young team going through a massive adjustment period that is simply not playing very well at this point. That's all.

brewcity77

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #66 on: November 25, 2014, 01:59:42 PM »
Hysterical! Was NJIT a "horrible matchup" for us too?

Actually...they were. I said as much before the game. We did a good job of slowing the pace of the game which (especially in the second half) allowed us to nullify their speed advantage at the guard positions. I wrote something up on Pace of Play. These last two games were the fastest teams we'll see this year.

We are a small team that is best suited to slow down the tempo, just like the 2010 team with Lazar. I don't think we're as good as that team was, but when we play teams that aren't trying to kill us in transition and our defense has time to get set, I think we'll see improvement.

Maybe it's just wishful thinking, but Nukem and I discussed on another board that this year we could legitimately lose to a cupcake. This was before the UTM game where we struggled for a bit. Losing to UNO disappointed but did not surprise me. Struggling yesterday didn't surprise me either. We would have been far better off if we had played our cupcakes in reverse order. The teams we see in December should be far smoother games than what we saw this month, and not just because our team will have the benefit of a month's experience. Those teams play slower, which will allow us to do what we want to do on both ends far easier.
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MU82

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #67 on: November 25, 2014, 02:14:55 PM »
Ultimately, Jamil was a good college player. Nothing more, nothing less. I was hoping for all-conference, and unfortunately, it didn't happen.


I believe you and I have different definitions of "good college player."

8.5 ppg on .437/.336/.708 shooting with 4.6 reb, 1.6 asst and 1.4 TO. Even as a senior, his pctges were down. (He got 11.7 ppg because he played a ton more mpg.)

To me, that adds up to "OK college player."

Damon Key was a "good college player."

Lazar Hayward was a "very good college player."

Dwyane Wade was a "great college player."

So I say, anyway. Others are allowed to disagree.
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Canned Goods n Ammo

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #68 on: November 25, 2014, 02:20:37 PM »
I believe you and I have different definitions of "good college player."

8.5 ppg on .437/.336/.708 shooting with 4.6 reb, 1.6 asst and 1.4 TO. Even as a senior, his pctges were down. (He got 11.7 ppg because he played a ton more mpg.)

To me, that adds up to "OK college player."

Damon Key was a "good college player."

Lazar Hayward was a "very good college player."

Dwyane Wade was a "great college player."

So I say, anyway. Others are allowed to disagree.

That's fair.

We don't need to get into a debate about Good vs very good vs serviceable vs ELITE!! (hellooooo ESPN).

MU82

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #69 on: November 25, 2014, 02:21:55 PM »
That's fair.

We don't need to get into a debate about Good vs very good vs serviceable vs ELITE!! (hellooooo ESPN).


Oh ... you're no fun!

In fact, I'd say you're very good -- though not quite borderline elite -- at being no fun.
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Canned Goods n Ammo

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #70 on: November 25, 2014, 02:24:01 PM »
Oh ... you're no fun!

In fact, I'd say you're very good -- though not quite borderline elite -- at being no fun.

Well, I don't have the abilities of Dr B. or Sugar, but I think Jamil's advance stats might tell a story of why he was a "good" player.

I don't know if Pts and rebounds are the be-all, end-all stats.

brandx

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #71 on: November 25, 2014, 02:35:53 PM »
I understand how matchup problems work in the tournament. When two consecutive horrible teams that play differing styles come into your building and one beats you fairly soundly then the other takes you to the last minute, it's no longer a "matchup problem" issue. At that point you're just playing bad ball.

I'm okay with this. It's extremely early in a season with a new coach, new system, young players, and a massive height deficiency. I think we will improve throughout the season, and may even get to a fairly respectable level once Fischer comes on board. I just find it funny when people go through mental gymnastics to try to say these last two performances were anything but a young team going through a massive adjustment period that is simply not playing very well at this point. That's all.

I agree with you,  Reunion. I thought Omaha was a bad matchup, but that still doesn't excuse the way we played.

Johnny B

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Re: NJIT thoughts
« Reply #72 on: November 25, 2014, 03:23:35 PM »
Wojo should burn his Defensive and offensive playbooks and go get some new ones.