Dave Brandon

[Chicos' Buzz Scandal Countdown]

Not sure if anyone is following the nosedive at Michigan, but an interesting development.

http://mgoblog.com/content/david-brandon-i-suggest-you-find-new-team

This is absolutely incredible behavior; this guy (and Hoke) shouldn't make it through the end of the season

[tower912]

What happens when the wrong hires are made.    CEO of a company that was more successful after he left.   Football coach who was a .500 coach at mid-majors, but because he was an assistant under a previous coach, he was a 'Michigan Man.'     Such arrogance.    Such stupidity.    Reaping what they have sown.   

[GGGG]

And possibly breaking FOIA laws in the process.

[Pakuni]

Not sure if anyone is following the nosedive at Michigan, but an interesting development.

http://mgoblog.com/content/david-brandon-i-suggest-you-find-new-team

This is absolutely incredible behavior; this guy (and Hoke) shouldn't make it through the end of the season

Hoke is only in his fourth year at Michigan. I think they need to give him at least one more year to know whether he's a good fit.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Hoke is only in his fourth year at Michigan. I think they need to give him at least one more year to know whether he's a good fit.

2-8-1
4-7
1-10
7-5
6-6


They decided to hang on to him (Bill McCartney), and he won a national title 4 years later.  Sometimes you have to wait, but usually it is the inverse.  Someone comes out a house on fire with someone else's guys and by year 5 they are exposed. 

11-14
20-8
19-9
14-11
9-17

He would go on to win three NCAA basketball titles after that 5 year start....still strolling the sidelines for Duke.


Do I think Hoke should be gone....yes.  I never understood how a career .500 guy in the MAC got hired in the first place.  His stint at SDSU was with someone else's players.  However, are there examples of coaches that struggled in years 4 and 5 and ended up being fantastic in the end?  Yes

[GGGG]

Hoke got the job for a couple reasons.  He was a "Michigan Man" who didn't run a goofy offense and was moderately successful as a head coach.

If they would have stuck with RichRod, I have no doubt that he would have been just as good in 2011 and Michigan would have been in a much better position right now.  I mean, if they don't get a Harbaugh, they might really be screwed with how they treated RR.

[Tums Festival]

Hoke is only in his fourth year at Michigan. I think they need to give him at least one more year to know whether he's a good fit.

Ann Arbor would implode if Hoke isn't fired after this season. And RichRod was never a good fit for Michigan. The only success he (and Hoke) had was due to Denard Robinson.

[Lennys Tap]

2-8-1
4-7
1-10
7-5
6-6


They decided to hang on to him (Bill McCartney), and he won a national title 4 years later.  Sometimes you have to wait, but usually it is the inverse.  Someone comes out a house on fire with someone else's guys and by year 5 they are exposed. 

11-14
20-8
19-9
14-11
9-17

He would go on to win three NCAA basketball titles after that 5 year start....still strolling the sidelines for Duke.


Do I think Hoke should be gone....yes.  I never understood how a career .500 guy in the MAC got hired in the first place.  His stint at SDSU was with someone else's players.  However, are there examples of coaches that struggled in years 4 and 5 and ended up being fantastic in the end?  Yes

So it sounds like you're saying the "5 year rule" (which you either made up or borrowed from someone else) is just another arbitrary and oft times wrong way of looking at things. I agree. Sometimes you know in one year. Sometimes you don't in five, which renders any "rule" on the subject basically meaningless.

[ChicosBailBonds]

So it sounds like you're saying the "5 year rule" (which you either made up or borrowed from someone else) is just another arbitrary and oft times wrong way of looking at things. I agree. Sometimes you know in one year. Sometimes you don't in five, which renders any "rule" on the subject basically meaningless.

It's not settled science, if that's what you mean.       I've clarified for years what it means to me, it's my own determination and the examples I've given over the years is to show how many people fall in love with a coach out of the gate before any classes have matriculated of his.  Call it the Bruiser Flint phenomena if you like.  It is easier to identify if a coach is in over his head vs telling if a coach is riding the talent of the previous guy's recruits.  I prefer to wait 4 or 5 years, because it allows for a full class or two of his recruits to cycle through, that's why I've always used that number and have stated so many times.  This should not be news to you with the number of times you respond to me.   Remember that search button....

[Lennys Tap]

It's not settled science, if that's what you mean.        I've clarified for years what it means to me, it's my own determination and the examples I've given over the years is to show how many people fall in love with a coach out of the gate before any classes have matriculated of his.  Call it the Bruiser Flint phenomena if you like.  It is easier to identify if a coach is in over his head vs telling if a coach is riding the talent of the previous guy's recruits.  I prefer to wait 4 or 5 years, because it allows for a full class or two of his recruits to cycle through, that's why I've always used that number and have stated so many times.  This should be news to you with the number of times you respond to me.   Remember that search button....

So your theory should be called the Coach K phenomena since it would have resulted in the firing the winningest  coach in college basketball history after 4 or 5 years?

[Chicos' Buzz Scandal Countdown]

So your theory should be called the Coach K phenomena since it would have resulted in the firing the winningest  coach in college basketball history after 4 or 5 years?

I hear the jury is still out on that guy

[tower912]

Ann Arbor would implode if Hoke isn't fired after this season. And RichRod was never a good fit for Michigan. The only success he (and Hoke) had was due to Denard Robinson.

RichRod wasn't a good fit because Lloyd Carr didn't like them.   It is pretty common knowledge that Carr is still influencing things behind the seasons.    And even if he wanted to come to Michigan, Les Miles will never be coach of UM while Lloyd has any influence.    According to friends in positions of knowledge in Ann Arbor. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

So your theory should be called the Coach K phenomena since it would have resulted in the firing the winningest  coach in college basketball history after 4 or 5 years?

No, that is an example of a school being patient.  He also had that record at Army, not at Duke.  Look at McGuire's record the last few years at Belmont Abbey.  Not good.  Mike Deane had a really good record after the first 4 years.

It's the falling in love with coaches in the first few years, it's also the knee jerk reaction to fire a coach after just a few years.  That's why I use that time frame....it's a guide.  As I've said here many times, if you fall in love and want to marry the guy after the first kiss, knock your socks off.  I don't.  I want to date for some time, see how crazy they are when the chips are down.  You can do whatever you feel is right for you, I'm going to wait 4 or 5 years.

[JWags85]

Do I think Hoke should be gone....yes.  I never understood how a career .500 guy in the MAC got hired in the first place.  His stint at SDSU was with someone else's players. 

To be fair, Ball State wasn't in good shape when he got there.  They hadn't had a winning season since the mid 90s and it was during the MAC's strong period where Miami (OH), BG, Toledo, and Marshall had strong, borderline top 25 programs.  He had to rebuild, so its not fair to point at his record being an indication of mediocre performance.  Now if there was incomplete evidence at SDSU, thats a fair point.  Guys like Dave Doeren at NC State who took over a really strong NIU program for 2 years, or Darrell Hazell at Purdue who only had 2 years at Kent St, one of which was awful, are far more suspect, flash in the pan hires.

I think Michigan was a bit shell shocked cause nobody wanted the job as bad as they thought when they hired Hoke.

[GGGG]

RichRod wasn't a good fit because Lloyd Carr didn't like them.   It is pretty common knowledge that Carr is still influencing things behind the seasons.    And even if he wanted to come to Michigan, Les Miles will never be coach of UM while Lloyd has any influence.    According to friends in positions of knowledge in Ann Arbor.  

And really to say that RichRod, who was previously successful at West Virginia, and currently successful at Arizona, wasn't a "good fit" at Michigan means that Michigan is the one with the problem.

There is absolutely no reason why he couldn't have been a success there.

[tower912]

And really to say that RichRod, who was previously successful at West Virginia, and currently successful at Arizona, wasn't a "good fit" at Michigan means that Michigan is the one with the problem.

There is absolutely no reason why he couldn't have been a success there.

Exactly.   BCS contender at West Virginia.   Top 10 in just a few years at Arizona.   The problem isn't with RichRod. 

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

I was wondering if Michigan could make a run at one of the Gruden's. Jon has a nice gig with ESPN, but how about Jay? The Redskins are a dumpster fire, notwithstanding their win over the Cowboys. And, I believe they both cut their teeth in the college ranks. They're going to need a big name hire. I'm not saying Jay Gruden's a huge name, but stealing an NFL coach might hold off the irate fan base.

They can have Marc Trestman if they want.

[JWags85]

I was wondering if Michigan could make a run at one of the Gruden's. Jon has a nice gig with ESPN, but how about Jay? The Redskins are a dumpster fire, notwithstanding their win over the Cowboys. And, I believe they both cut their teeth in the college ranks. They're going to need a big name hire. I'm not saying Jay Gruden's a huge name, but stealing an NFL coach might hold off the irate fan base.

They can have Marc Trestman if they want.

Maybe Jon Gruden, MAYBE because of his name.  But Jay Gruden has never had any experience at the collegiate level.  That hiring would possibly cause Ann Arbor to implode.

[tower912]

Ann Arbor is already imploding.   It is either Harbaugh or nothing.   Which may be tough if they fire Brandon, too.    As we know, it is difficult to hire a big name head coach with an interim AD in place. 

[Tums Festival]

RichRod wasn't a good fit because Lloyd Carr didn't like them.   It is pretty common knowledge that Carr is still influencing things behind the seasons.    And even if he wanted to come to Michigan, Les Miles will never be coach of UM while Lloyd has any influence.    According to friends in positions of knowledge in Ann Arbor. 

RichRod was a culture change when change wasn't needed. And if Bo Schembechler was still alive when Carr "retired" Jim Harbaugh would've been the one hired, not RichRod.

[tower912]

http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/index.ssf/2014/10/michigan_alumni_also_upset_wit.html#incart_more_sports

Apparently, the alumni/season ticket holders are unhappy with more than just the bad product.    Sometimes, hiring someone from the corporate world (Domino's is better off without him) who has no experience in collegiate athletics backfires. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

To be fair, Ball State wasn't in good shape when he got there.  They hadn't had a winning season since the mid 90s and it was during the MAC's strong period where Miami (OH), BG, Toledo, and Marshall had strong, borderline top 25 programs.  He had to rebuild, so its not fair to point at his record being an indication of mediocre performance.  Now if there was incomplete evidence at SDSU, thats a fair point.  Guys like Dave Doeren at NC State who took over a really strong NIU program for 2 years, or Darrell Hazell at Purdue who only had 2 years at Kent St, one of which was awful, are far more suspect, flash in the pan hires.

I think Michigan was a bit shell shocked cause nobody wanted the job as bad as they thought when they hired Hoke.

Fair enough. 

I'm not so sure Bo would have hired Harbaugh after one year at Stanford and a 4-8 record.  He might have, but Rich Rod was literally one play away from playing for the national title.  He's doing pretty well at Arizona right now, though it's still early.  Maybe it is my Ohio bias in living there for a number of years, but it sure seems like Michigan fans have been all over the place.  They couldn't wait to get rid of Carr at the end, they buried Rich Rod pretty quickly, despite each year making some strides forward...maybe not fast enough for them, they flirted with Les Miles who said no.  So on and so forth.  If they get Harbaugh, that would be a big name for them, same if they get Miles.  With as crazy hard as the SEC is nowadays, maybe he (Miles) thinks going to the Big Ten offers salvation, though he would be better off going to the other division where Wisconsin plays, which is an absolute joke.

[Chicos' Buzz Scandal Countdown]

Ann Arbor is already imploding.   It is either Harbaugh or nothing.   Which may be tough if they fire Brandon, too.    As we know, it is difficult to hire a big name head coach with an interim AD in place. 

getting rid of Brandon will do nothing but help. He insists on sitting in on film sessions with coach and team. Not sure how many top-flight coaches would be interested in that type of hands-on approach.

[GGGG]

RichRod was a culture change when change wasn't needed. And if Bo Schembechler was still alive when Carr "retired" Jim Harbaugh would've been the one hired, not RichRod.

What culture change? 

[swoopem]

This just in: Dave Brandon is resigning