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Author Topic: Matt Carlino  (Read 91630 times)

wildbill sb

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #100 on: April 24, 2014, 10:21:47 AM »
Spare me the off-season reads.......Please!
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NersEllenson

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #101 on: April 24, 2014, 10:22:58 AM »

I think most of the work that gets players better happens in the off season...skill development...pick up games...strength and conditioning...

Now of course they do also gain some experience playing in games, but is that experience so great that it is worth sacrificing games that they could win otherwise?  Nope.


I can agree that individual improvement for players happens in the statement I bolded above - yet they have to be able to translate that improvement on the court during real games...and nothing is a better benchmark for what a player will be...than how he shows in games.

As for the non-bolded part of your sentence - that position was held by many last year - that playing Dawson or JJJ more could have made things much worse and cost us games.  The reality was, it would not have, and both JJJ and Dawson would have gotten valuable experience and been able to help implement the changes they needed to make to their games during the off season to improve in areas of weakness..which they would have learned from playing in games.  I definitely feel Dominic, Jerel and Wes getting to play max minutes as freshman helped them go on to have really good careers at MU.

Was just a sad year last year, seeing the team miss the NIT..while having talented freshman largely sitting on the bench for 30+ minutes per game...and not getting ample game experience.
"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

wadesworld

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #102 on: April 24, 2014, 10:59:18 AM »
LOL - Wades...the general content of your posts and basketball acumen is usually well off target.  You cannot replicate game experience in practice.  Generally practice during the season is comprised of half court shell work, scouting report, implementation of scouting report, out of bounds plays, defensive concepts - as under Buzz the defensive concepts changed game to game based on scouting report.  Rarely do teams run 5 on 5 up and down in practice at the college level.  There is not a lot of "player development" as you cite during practice during the season.  Off season, yes.

So, to answer your question:  Playing with the same guys during GAMES helps develop cohesion and efficiency...and better results for the player/team.  The best coaches play their 5 best guys together consistently and for long stretches, and have a very distinct substitution pattern...and usually go 8-9 deep max.  Everyone knows their role.  Knows what to expect.  Last year under Buzz...it was a complete crap show...other than for Derrick and Jake...which was the height of comical - giving the most minutes to your two most limited players.

Players develop during practice.  They are not altering their shooting form, developing a mid-range game, improving their ball handling, etc. in the middle of games.  I'm sorry that you do not understand this, but you do not understand how player development works if you think they do.  It's pretty simple.  There is no fundamental work done on players during a game.  I know many high, high level coaches who will not coach a single word regarding fundamentals or developing skills to players during a game.  They want their players to just go out there and play the game and only think about the scouting report, not about fundamentals.  Player development is all done in practice and during off season workouts, not during games.  Again, sorry you don't understand that, but apparently your decorated high school career didn't teach you that.

I don't know why you are bringing up substitution patterns.  Never once did I say anything about Bert's substitution patterns.  I was addressing player development.  If you need a dumbed down definition, I was addressing when, where, and how a player fundamentally develops individual skills necessary to use on a basketball court.  Could the chemistry between key players be better in 2015-2016 if all of the same players play all of the minutes in 2014-2015?  Of course it could.  But is that worth not taking in a kid who can help the program win games in 2014-2015?  Absolutely not.  That is what the Grambling State's of the world are for.  You get 10 of those opponents before you need really good team chemistry to start the new year/Big East season.  Last year's problem was not "team cohesion," it was a lack of fundamentally skill developed players (or, talented basketball players) on the roster.  Guys like Duane, Dawson, and JJJ will have plenty of game experience by the time they need it in 2015-2016 even if Carlino comes in and plays 40 minutes/game.  If they are talented basketball players, they will have no problem finding chemistry by the conference season.  If they aren't talented basketball players, they will never find the chemistry to win games.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2014, 11:07:33 AM by wadesworld »
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NersEllenson

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #103 on: April 24, 2014, 11:22:05 AM »
Players develop during practice.  They are not altering their shooting form, developing a mid-range game, improving their ball handling, etc. in the middle of games.  I'm sorry that you do not understand this, but you do not understand how player development works if you think they do.  It's pretty simple.  There is no fundamental work done on players during a game.  I know many high, high level coaches who will not coach a single word regarding fundamentals or developing skills to players during a game.  They want their players to just go out there and play the game and only think about the scouting report, not about fundamentals.  Player development is all done in practice and during off season workouts, not during games.  Again, sorry you don't understand that, but apparently your decorated high school career didn't teach you that.

I don't know why you are bringing up substitution patterns.  Never once did I say anything about Bert's substitution patterns.  I was addressing player development.  If you need a dumbed down definition, I was addressing when, where, and how a player fundamentally develops individual skills necessary to use on a basketball court.  Could the chemistry between key players be better in 2015-2016 if all of the same players play all of the minutes in 2014-2015?  Of course it could.  But is that worth not taking in a kid who can help the program win games in 2014-2015?  Absolutely not.  That is what the Grambling State's of the world are for.  You get 10 of those opponents before you need really good team chemistry to start the new year/Big East season.  Last year's problem was not "team cohesion," it was a lack of fundamentally skill developed players (or, talented basketball players) on the roster.  Guys like Duane, Dawson, and JJJ will have plenty of game experience by the time they need it in 2015-2016 even if Carlino comes in and plays 40 minutes/game.  If they are talented basketball players, they will have no problem finding chemistry by the conference season.  If they aren't talented basketball players, they will never find the chemistry to win games.

Guys that get scholarships at the high major D-1 level, generally have developed the basic fundamentals to be a good basketball player.  Of course coaches don't say during games, hey Derrick - why don't you try keeping your elbow in on your jumper in the middle of a game.  Player development generally takes place in the off season..not during the season as I listed why above.

The original point I commented on was the point of Sultan's that playing Duane or Dawson more next year doesn't necessarily mean they are going to be better as juniors or seniors.  I simply disagree - the more on court, game experience they get together as a team/unit (add JJJ and Burton to Duane and Dawson) the better they are going to be in subsequent years...because they all possess a lot of talent and have the necessary skill to play the game at a high level...and the cohesion you get through playing together has a compound interest type of return...  If you feel guys only get good through practice during the regular season (or off season), and that game experience doesn't count for jack...not sure what to tell you other than that is idiotic. 
"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #104 on: April 24, 2014, 11:23:23 AM »
Players develop during practice.  They are not altering their shooting form, developing a mid-range game, improving their ball handling, etc. in the middle of games.  I'm sorry that you do not understand this, but you do not understand how player development works if you think they do.  It's pretty simple.  There is no fundamental work done on players during a game.  I know many high, high level coaches who will not coach a single word regarding fundamentals or developing skills to players during a game.  They want their players to just go out there and play the game and only think about the scouting report, not about fundamentals.  Player development is all done in practice and during off season workouts, not during games.  Again, sorry you don't understand that, but apparently your decorated high school career didn't teach you that.

I don't know why you are bringing up substitution patterns.  Never once did I say anything about Bert's substitution patterns.  I was addressing player development.  If you need a dumbed down definition, I was addressing when, where, and how a player fundamentally develops individual skills necessary to use on a basketball court.  Could the chemistry between key players be better in 2015-2016 if all of the same players play all of the minutes in 2014-2015?  Of course it could.  But is that worth not taking in a kid who can help the program win games in 2014-2015?  Absolutely not.  That is what the Grambling State's of the world are for.  You get 10 of those opponents before you need really good team chemistry to start the new year/Big East season.  Last year's problem was not "team cohesion," it was a lack of fundamentally skill developed players (or, talented basketball players) on the roster.  Guys like Duane, Dawson, and JJJ will have plenty of game experience by the time they need it in 2015-2016 even if Carlino comes in and plays 40 minutes/game.  If they are talented basketball players, they will have no problem finding chemistry by the conference season.  If they aren't talented basketball players, they will never find the chemistry to win games.

So what do you make of players who are amazing during practice and have apparently developed but are brutal during games. I'm not really taking sides on this as I think it's a combination of both development during practice and game experience that molds the player. There is no substitute in my mind for game like situations and things that happen during games that you just can't simulate in practice. There are tons of examples.

But I've come across many players in multiple sports who were rest during practice and looked like an all star and oupdnt hack it when the lights came
On.

TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #105 on: April 24, 2014, 11:55:08 AM »
The answer, as it usually is when two people on this board are arguing, is that you are both right.

Wades is correct that fundamentals, basketball skills, and physical fitness are developed during practice, not games. This includes both off season and during season practices. Mostly during the offseason.

Ners is correct that certain aspects of the game cannot be developed in practice. Performing under pressure, team chemistry, basketball IQ, and other essential traits are developed during games. He is partially correct about during season practices. They do development during these practices but most of the practice is focused on how they are going to play their next opponent.

Personally, I am of the opinion that you have to earn it in practice before you get the right to play in a game. To do the opposite  often leads to ultra talented losing teams like Saint John's. You can even have meltdowns like what happened to Howland at UCLA.
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TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #106 on: April 24, 2014, 12:00:48 PM »
Getting back to the topic of Matt Carlino. Anyone hear if he and CoWojo have met yet?
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wadesworld

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #107 on: April 24, 2014, 12:02:08 PM »
So what do you make of players who are amazing during practice and have apparently developed but are brutal during games. I'm not really taking sides on this as I think it's a combination of both development during practice and game experience that molds the player. There is no substitute in my mind for game like situations and things that happen during games that you just can't simulate in practice. There are tons of examples.

But I've come across many players in multiple sports who were rest during practice and looked like an all star and oupdnt hack it when the lights came
On.

Again, yes, game experience is worth something.  Which is why you schedule cupcakes early in the season.  The Grambling State's of the world.  We get 10 of those in our first 14 games.  That is plenty of time to develop cohesion as a team by the time it is needed (the conference season).  If players can't get comfortable in games by those 10 cupcake games, then maybe they just aren't that good of a player and need to find the bench.

Guys that get scholarships at the high major D-1 level, generally have developed the basic fundamentals to be a good basketball player.  Of course coaches don't say during games, hey Derrick - why don't you try keeping your elbow in on your jumper in the middle of a game.  Player development generally takes place in the off season..not during the season as I listed why above.

The original point I commented on was the point of Sultan's that playing Duane or Dawson more next year doesn't necessarily mean they are going to be better as juniors or seniors.  I simply disagree - the more on court, game experience they get together as a team/unit (add JJJ and Burton to Duane and Dawson) the better they are going to be in subsequent years...because they all possess a lot of talent and have the necessary skill to play the game at a high level...and the cohesion you get through playing together has a compound interest type of return...  If you feel guys only get good through practice during the regular season (or off season), and that game experience doesn't count for jack...not sure what to tell you other than that is idiotic.  

Again, see above.  I have addressed the game experience above.  If game experience is where players do all their growing and is absolutely necessary to a player's development, how do you explain the Frank Kaminsky's of the world?  You know, the guy who went from 2 ppg, 1.4 rpg in 8 mpg as a freshman and 4 ppg, 1.8 rpg in 10 mpg and then jumped to 14 ppg, 6.3 rpg in 28 mpg last season?  Did UW-Madison play in some NCAA summer season (kind of like a summer and a spring baseball season for high school?) that Marquette was not invited to, and he played 40 mpg there to develop into the player he did?  What about Thomas Robinson?  2.5 ppg, 2.7 rpg in 7 mpg as a freshman and 7.6 ppg, 6.4 rpg in 14.6 mpg as a sophomore to 18 ppg, 12 rpg in 32 mpg as a junior.  Again, some secret NCAA season nobody knows about where he got 40 mpg to develop as a player?  There are millions of examples like this.  How do we explain that?  They can't develop from 1 season to another without their 40 mpg.

In fact, let's just fold our program for the next 3 years, everyone on the roster is stunting Flory's development as a player.  Let's add a demand to the demand thread that every 4 years we sign 13 new scholarship players only in the late signing period after or season has ended.  That way no upperclassmen are stunting the development of the underclassmen.  Otherwise we have to cut anybody in front of a freshman.  If only Bert would've played Mbao 40 mpg he would've been Embiid before there was an Embiid!

Silly.
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JakeBarnes

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #108 on: April 24, 2014, 12:17:05 PM »
Getting back to the topic of Matt Carlino. Anyone hear if he and CoWojo have met yet?

Goodman says he's visiting soon
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Spotcheck Billy

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #109 on: April 24, 2014, 12:46:17 PM »
how do you explain the Frank Kaminsky's of the world?  You know, the guy who went from 2 ppg, 1.4 rpg in 8 mpg as a freshman and 4 ppg, 1.8 rpg in 10 mpg and then jumped to 14 ppg, 6.3 rpg in 28 mpg last season? 
Silly.

that looks to me like Kaminsky just got more mpg but didn't actually increase his scoring per minute played much

NersEllenson

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #110 on: April 24, 2014, 12:55:28 PM »
Again, yes, game experience is worth something.  Which is why you schedule cupcakes early in the season.  The Grambling State's of the world.  We get 10 of those in our first 14 games.  That is plenty of time to develop cohesion as a team by the time it is needed (the conference season).  If players can't get comfortable in games by those 10 cupcake games, then maybe they just aren't that good of a player and need to find the bench.

Again, see above.  I have addressed the game experience above.  If game experience is where players do all their growing and is absolutely necessary to a player's development, how do you explain the Frank Kaminsky's of the world?  You know, the guy who went from 2 ppg, 1.4 rpg in 8 mpg as a freshman and 4 ppg, 1.8 rpg in 10 mpg and then jumped to 14 ppg, 6.3 rpg in 28 mpg last season?  Did UW-Madison play in some NCAA summer season (kind of like a summer and a spring baseball season for high school?) that Marquette was not invited to, and he played 40 mpg there to develop into the player he did?  What about Thomas Robinson?  2.5 ppg, 2.7 rpg in 7 mpg as a freshman and 7.6 ppg, 6.4 rpg in 14.6 mpg as a sophomore to 18 ppg, 12 rpg in 32 mpg as a junior.  Again, some secret NCAA season nobody knows about where he got 40 mpg to develop as a player?  There are millions of examples like this.  How do we explain that?  They can't develop from 1 season to another without their 40 mpg.

In fact, let's just fold our program for the next 3 years, everyone on the roster is stunting Flory's development as a player.  Let's add a demand to the demand thread that every 4 years we sign 13 new scholarship players only in the late signing period after or season has ended.  That way no upperclassmen are stunting the development of the underclassmen.  Otherwise we have to cut anybody in front of a freshman.  If only Bert would've played Mbao 40 mpg he would've been Embiid before there was an Embiid!

Silly.

Where we disagree is how much development work takes place in practice during the season...very little individual work is done.  Of course players should improve over their time in a program...as in Kaminsky...through all off season work, including strength and conditioning, beyond just basketball skill work.  

Most guys get better as they become upperclassmen....last year we saw ZERO improvement from Derrick all year long, and Jake showed very little.  Meanwhile, you have freshman behind them - Dawson and JJJ - who have far more upside and are way more of the future of the program than were Derrick, Jake...or now in the case of Carlino.  Sure, you can bring Carlino in for a year....and if he is a significant upgrade over where Dawson and Duane are currently...fine...but in the big picture...him as a 1-year rental...in my view if he were to get a majority of PT at PG over Duane and John...would stunt their growth...and where program could be in 2015-2106, 2016-2017.

You simply cannot replicate the value of game experience in any sport, particularly basketball and football.  I'd just rather give that experience to John and Duane than a guy like Carlino who is a 1 year player, and comes with some warts.  Not to mention the frustration it may cause for John and Duane if they potentially have to ride bench for another year....when they CHOSE to return to MU versus transfer as they easily could have done.
"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

The Equalizer

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #111 on: April 24, 2014, 12:59:55 PM »
that looks to me like Kaminsky just got more mpg but didn't actually increase his scoring per minute played much

2 points/game in 8 minutes is .25 ppm.
14 points in 28 minues is .5 ppm.

What looks to you like not actually increasing his scoring per minute is actually a 100% increase in scoring per minute.

augoman

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #112 on: April 24, 2014, 01:00:34 PM »
didn't read the whole thread, but the article in WSJ on Kaminsky made it pretty clear that he did all his improving on his time in the offseason.  Not in practice.

The Equalizer

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #113 on: April 24, 2014, 01:02:05 PM »
Where we disagree is how much development work takes place in practice during the season...very little individual work is done.  Of course players should improve over their time in a program...as in Kaminsky...through all off season work, including strength and conditioning, beyond just basketball skill work.  

Most guys get better as they become upperclassmen....last year we saw ZERO improvement from Derrick all year long, and Jake showed very little.  Meanwhile, you have freshman behind them - Dawson and JJJ - who have far more upside and are way more of the future of the program than were Derrick, Jake...or now in the case of Carlino.  Sure, you can bring Carlino in for a year....and if he is a significant upgrade over where Dawson and Duane are currently...fine...but in the big picture...him as a 1-year rental...in my view if he were to get a majority of PT at PG over Duane and John...would stunt their growth...and where program could be in 2015-2106, 2016-2017.

You simply cannot replicate the value of game experience in any sport, particularly basketball and football.  I'd just rather give that experience to John and Duane than a guy like Carlino who is a 1 year player, and comes with some warts.  Not to mention the frustration it may cause for John and Duane if they potentially have to ride bench for another year....when they CHOSE to return to MU versus transfer as they easily could have done.

I think this isn't because these guys can't develop, but a result of their coaching.  I just don't think Buzz made player development a priority.  His players either came in with a high-level of skills (JUCOs, Blue), or they came and left quickly.

wadesworld

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #114 on: April 24, 2014, 01:35:49 PM »
"Would prevent the development of the young guys in the backcourt." I'm hoping the players are developing in offseason workouts, in the weight room, and in practice. Games are the fun, easy part. Games are not where players develop. Every single player will develop, regardless of whether they are on the bench or playing 30 minutes/game, if they are coached right in practice. And if they are not, they aren't going to magically develop in a 40 minute game where no player development happens, they just play the game. "But, but, but they need game experience!" That's what Grambling State and 10 of the first 14 regular season games are for. They will get their game experience when they need if, and they will develop in practice. If Carlino can help the team win games this year there is no question you take him. 1 year guy in a year that we have 3 open scholarships? It's an absolute no lose situation.

As I said when I originally chimed in on the subject, yes, off season and in the weight room (more off season work), along with practice, are where players develop.
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Spotcheck Billy

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #115 on: April 24, 2014, 02:08:28 PM »
2 points/game in 8 minutes is .25 ppm.
14 points in 28 minues is .5 ppm.

What looks to you like not actually increasing his scoring per minute is actually a 100% increase in scoring per minute.

I guess that's my fault by not posting specifically his soph and junior seasons  ::)

TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #116 on: April 24, 2014, 05:04:44 PM »
Most guys get better as they become upperclassmen....last year we saw ZERO improvement from Derrick all year long, and Jake showed very little.  Meanwhile, you have freshman behind them - Dawson and JJJ - who have far more upside and are way more of the future of the program than were Derrick, Jake...or now in the case of Carlino.  Sure, you can bring Carlino in for a year....and if he is a significant upgrade over where Dawson and Duane are currently...fine...but in the big picture...him as a 1-year rental...in my view if he were to get a majority of PT at PG over Duane and John...would stunt their growth...and where program could be in 2015-2106, 2016-2017.

First, If you didn't see improvement in Derrick and Jake, I don't know what to tell you. They were much better at the end of the season than they were at the beginning of the season.

Second, I think this is where the Kaminsky example comes in handy. He got almost no playing time as a freshman or sophomore, yet he was all conference his junior year. Despite him not having playing time, he still developed just fine. Why couldn't Duane and Dawson do that behind Carlino next season? Not saying that playing time doesn't help, but it's not like lack of playing time kills their potential.

Third, I'm not willing to sacrifice next season on the off chance that it will "stunt" Duane's and Dawson's development. You yourself said that Carlino would get a majority of the minutes next season. I assume that means that you view him as a superior PG to Derrick, Duane, and Dawson RIGHT NOW. So why wouldn't we want to improve the position that was our weakest last year? He can get the brunt of the minutes at the 1, the others will still get time behind him and will develop. Will they develop more if they get all the minutes and Carlino doesn't come? Probably. Is that worth not having a superior player at PG next season? I would say no.

Fourth, we are going to be tiny next season. CoWojo will most likely run three and four guard sets. Even if Carlino comes, I bet we would see plenty of the other guards.

Fifth, would your opinion change on Carlino if you found out that CoWojo was going to start Derrick over Duane/Dawson? I know you think that with a new coach that Derrick will be relegated to the bench but we don't know that for sure. A lot of coaches value experience and defense.

Bottom line, we have three open scholarships for next season. Pickings are real slim. If Wojo can land a talented, 3P shooting PG with high major experience, I think we take him.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2014, 05:07:27 PM by TAMU Eagle »
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ChitownSpaceForRent

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #117 on: April 24, 2014, 05:23:02 PM »
I know you all are high on Carlino but Id much rather have Duane and Dawson handle the point. Also for those who say Duane is going to play the 2 I was just standing next to him and no way is he 6'3" hes 6'1" at the absolute most.

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #118 on: April 24, 2014, 05:40:18 PM »
I know you all are high on Carlino but Id much rather have Duane and Dawson handle the point. Also for those who say Duane is going to play the 2 I was just standing next to him and no way is he 6'3" hes 6'1" at the absolute most.

I'm 6'2" and I was slightly taller than Duane. 6'1" sounds about right.

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #119 on: April 24, 2014, 06:12:23 PM »
First, If you didn't see improvement in Derrick and Jake, I don't know what to tell you. They were much better at the end of the season than they were at the beginning of the season.

Second, I think this is where the Kaminsky example comes in handy. He got almost no playing time as a freshman or sophomore, yet he was all conference his junior year. Despite him not having playing time, he still developed just fine. Why couldn't Duane and Dawson do that behind Carlino next season? Not saying that playing time doesn't help, but it's not like lack of playing time kills their potential.

Third, I'm not willing to sacrifice next season on the off chance that it will "stunt" Duane's and Dawson's development. You yourself said that Carlino would get a majority of the minutes next season. I assume that means that you view him as a superior PG to Derrick, Duane, and Dawson RIGHT NOW. So why wouldn't we want to improve the position that was our weakest last year? He can get the brunt of the minutes at the 1, the others will still get time behind him and will develop. Will they develop more if they get all the minutes and Carlino doesn't come? Probably. Is that worth not having a superior player at PG next season? I would say no.

Fourth, we are going to be tiny next season. CoWojo will most likely run three and four guard sets. Even if Carlino comes, I bet we would see plenty of the other guards.

Fifth, would your opinion change on Carlino if you found out that CoWojo was going to start Derrick over Duane/Dawson? I know you think that with a new coach that Derrick will be relegated to the bench but we don't know that for sure. A lot of coaches value experience and defense.

Bottom line, we have three open scholarships for next season. Pickings are real slim. If Wojo can land a talented, 3P shooting PG with high major experience, I think we take him.

Let's get a few things straight:

1) I said Derrick showed ZERO improvement..and Jake showed very little.  Derrick finished the season atrociously, and his stats didn't improve a lick during conference play in 2014 than what they were in non conference play in 2013.  Do you really want to pull stats from Derrick's last 10 games and try to show how he was "much better at the end of the season?"  And as for Jake..he improved slightly...though I'd argue it was still, very little.  Was he scoring off the bounce at the end of the year?  More 2 pt FGs at the end of the year?

2) I never said that Carlino would get a majority of the minutes next year...I said IF he did..it would stunt Dawson and Duane's growth.

3) You cite Kaminsky - that's great...players should improve in the offseason...a lot..and as they get older....yet you argued all season long that Derrick was a solid PG, improving, and not the primary cause for the teams struggles...Derrick didn't improve/blossom as a junior..he's had 3 years in the program..if he hasn't been able to become better than a 7% 3pt shooter, or 43% 3 pt shooter..with ALL that practice time....AND game time...he probably isn't going to make a drastic improvement as a senior.

4) I personally don't think Carlino is a better PG/player than what Duane/John would be next year...but if he comes...it should be an interesting competition.  Just don't think it is a wise move on Wojo's part to bring a guy in for 1 year, when two kids at the same position just committed to stay with the program/you as the head coach..only to see a 4th PG brought into the mix.  Kids want to play..and play lots of minutes.  Duane will be chomping at the bit, as will Dawson. 

"I'm not sure Cadougan would fix the problems on this team. I'm not even convinced he would be better for this team than DeWil is."

BrewCity77, December 8, 2013

nyg

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #120 on: April 25, 2014, 06:40:51 AM »
https://twitter.com/GoodmanESPN

Per Goodman, Carlino to make visit to MU in few weeks. 


Goose

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #121 on: April 25, 2014, 07:16:40 AM »
Pretty sure Matt would come here if Wojo wanted him. Would have to think that Wojo knows better than us on what we need next year.

TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #122 on: April 25, 2014, 09:44:56 AM »
Let's get a few things straight:

1) I said Derrick showed ZERO improvement..and Jake showed very little.  Derrick finished the season atrociously, and his stats didn't improve a lick during conference play in 2014 than what they were in non conference play in 2013.  Do you really want to pull stats from Derrick's last 10 games and try to show how he was "much better at the end of the season?"

Ners, you are letting your blind hate frustration for Derrick cloud you. You want stats? Here you go.

Derrick Wilson first 16 games: 4.6 ppg, 4.2 rpg, 3.8 apg, 1.0 spg, 1.3 tpg
Derrick Wilson last 16 games: 5.5 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 4.6 apg, 1.6 spg, 1.7 tpg

His ppg went up almost an entire point, same with his assists, and his steals went up over a half a spg! His rebounds and turnovers lessened slightly but that's negligible to the improvement. The turnovers also make sense because he was being more aggressive in the second half.

Not only did his numbers improve, but they improved despite tougher competition.

Average RPI of teams from the first 16 games: 152 (Depaul's RPI is 151 for perspective)
Average RPI of teams from the last 16 games: 72.1

So did Derrick become a stud as the season went on? No. Did he improve? Abso-frickin-lutely. So drop the hyperbole and try to see things from an objective stand point.
TAMU

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Nukem2

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #123 on: April 25, 2014, 09:49:14 AM »
Ners, you are letting your blind hate frustration for Derrick cloud you. You want stats? Here you go.

Derrick Wilson first 16 games: 4.6 ppg, 4.2 rpg, 3.8 apg, 1.0 spg, 1.3 tpg
Derrick Wilson last 16 games: 5.5 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 4.6 apg, 1.6 spg, 1.7 tpg

His ppg went up almost an entire point, same with his assists, and his steals went up over a half a spg! His rebounds and turnovers lessened slightly but that's negligible to the improvement. The turnovers also make sense because he was being more aggressive in the second half.

Not only did his numbers improve, but they improved despite tougher competition.

Average RPI of teams from the first 16 games: 152 (Depaul's RPI is 151 for perspective)
Average RPI of teams from the last 16 games: 72.1

So did Derrick become a stud as the season went on? No. Did he improve? Abso-frickin-lutely. So drop the hyperbole and try to see things from an objective stand point.
Sure, he "improved".  But teams increasingly did not bother guarding him.  So, his teammates became less effective and they did not improve.  A Catch-22 here.

GGGG

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Re: Matt Carlino
« Reply #124 on: April 25, 2014, 09:53:23 AM »
I can agree that individual improvement for players happens in the statement I bolded above - yet they have to be able to translate that improvement on the court during real games...and nothing is a better benchmark for what a player will be...than how he shows in games.

As for the non-bolded part of your sentence - that position was held by many last year - that playing Dawson or JJJ more could have made things much worse and cost us games.  The reality was, it would not have, and both JJJ and Dawson would have gotten valuable experience and been able to help implement the changes they needed to make to their games during the off season to improve in areas of weakness..which they would have learned from playing in games.  I definitely feel Dominic, Jerel and Wes getting to play max minutes as freshman helped them go on to have really good careers at MU.


I think that if Dominic, Jerel and Wes wouldn't have played as freshmen, they would have still largely been the same players as they turned out to be by the time they were seniors.  

I also think not playing much last year will not have much lasting impact on Dawson and JJJ.

 

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