Some love for MU from Sports Illustrated

[HutchwasClutch]

No. 2 on list of head coaching openings this offseason.   Seems a fair assessment to me.  I think an argument could be made we're a better job than Missouri or vice versa, but definitely some strong respect toward what's been built here by players, coaches, fans, administration over the years.  I don't think a credible case could be made for anyone else being a better job. 

Only surprise to me is Houston no. 3.  I get they are in the heart of big time recruiting territory, but the state of Texas has so many high level D-1 programs.  After that, I don't really get what makes them so strong, questionable conference, weak history since the early 80's.   Fellow AAC member South Florida seems to have more upside to me. 

Think a case could have been made for Washington St cracking the list at least too.

http://college-basketball.si.com/2014/04/21/open-ncaa-coaching-jobs-missouri-marquette-houston/

[dgies9156]

Which begs the question, if we're so good, why oh why did the Hillbilly leave?

Guess even though Jed Clampett was in Beverly Hills, he longed for the simple backward life of the Ozarks.

Same for the Hillbilly. Good program, good school, too good for the Hillbilly.

[ThatDude]

Mizzou is NOT a better job than Marquette

[Anti-Dentite]

No. 2 on list of head coaching openings this offseason.   Seems a fair assessment to me.  I think an argument could be made we're a better job than Missouri or vice versa, but definitely some strong respect toward what's been built here by players, coaches, fans, administration over the years.  I don't think a credible case could be made for anyone else being a better job. 

Only surprise to me is Houston no. 3.  I get they are in the heart of big time recruiting territory, but the state of Texas has so many high level D-1 programs.  After that, I don't really get what makes them so strong, questionable conference, weak history since the early 80's.   Fellow AAC member South Florida seems to have more upside to me. 

Think a case could have been made for Washington St cracking the list at least too.

http://college-basketball.si.com/2014/04/21/open-ncaa-coaching-jobs-missouri-marquette-houston/

Phi Slamma Jamma, 'nuf said. Lot of people want them to be good again but the reality is they get more respect than they deserve at this point.

[HutchwasClutch]

Phi Slamma Jamma, 'nuf said. Lot of people want them to be good again but the reality is they get more respect than they deserve at this point.

Exactly, didn't Tom Penders very briefly have them on the upswing again a few years ago- did he maybe even take them to an NCAA appearance?

[Anti-Dentite]

Exactly, didn't Tom Penders very briefly have them on the upswing again a few years ago- did he maybe even take them to an NCAA appearance?

I seem to recollect that, made the tournament a couple times maybe.

[HutchwasClutch]

Mizzou is NOT a better job than Marquette

In the old Big East, I agree with you.  In the new Big East, debatable.  I think the new Big East will prove to be a strong conference, but there's legitimate question marks right now.   Conference affiliation isn't everything in comparing programs, but it's right up there among the top x-factors.  The SEC while generally very weak this year, still made up half the Final Four.  Hard to ignore that.  No doubt that gets recruits attention.

[Tugg Speedman]

I did not see VT on the list

[Aughnanure]

Mizzou is NOT a better job than Marquette

This. I'm from the KC area and just no way at all. They've never been able to lockdown St. Louis and Missouri overall, never made a Final Four, and their basketball legacy is almost entirely tied to KU. There is A LOT of worry that the SEC is going to kill the desire for hoops there as attendance apparently was way down this year and it's not looking up anymore.

[HutchwasClutch]

This. I'm from the KC area and just no way at all. They've never been able to lockdown St. Louis and Missouri overall, never made a Final Four, and their basketball legacy is almost entirely tied to KU. There is A LOT of worry that the SEC is going to kill the desire for hoops there as attendance apparently was way down this year and it's not looking up anymore.

Interesting take.  One thing about the SEC, football will always be king. 

[HutchwasClutch]

I did not see VT on the list

#7- ahead of BC, which I don't agree with. 

[Aughnanure]

In the old Big East, I agree with you.  In the new Big East, debatable.  I think the new Big East will prove to be a strong conference, but there's legitimate question marks right now.   Conference affiliation isn't everything in comparing programs, but it's right up there among the top x-factors.  The SEC while generally very weak this year, still made up half the Final Four.  Hard to ignore that.  No doubt that gets recruits attention.

But really outside UK, UF, and Vandy there just isn't much interest in the SEC overall for hoops. Could argue Tennessee and Arkansas (been a long time since Richardson now), but football still overshadows everything. Word is Mizzou is already feeling a dearth of excitement since they moved to the football obsessed conference. Maybe the fans have been burnt out a lot over football excitement and visiting new campuses, but not having Kansas on the schedule is slowly going to hurt their desire for hoops. Beating KU drove so much of their motivation.

[Groin_pull]

Time after time I keep reading how not having an AD is hurting MU.

Can it be that damn hard to find someone to fill the position? Jeeeez.

[Tums Festival]

Time after time I keep reading how not having an AD is hurting MU.

Can it be that damn hard to find someone to fill the position? Jeeeez.

I wish people would stop saying we have no A.D. We do have an A.D., albeit short term, but the guy's been at Marquette for over 20 years. The office isn't empty.

[MUSF]

Marquette #2

Virginia Tech #7

I wonder if the ranks will change after Wojo and Buzz have been on the job for a few years?

http://college-basketball.si.com/2014/04/21/open-ncaa-coaching-jobs-missouri-marquette-houston/?eref=sihp

[MUSF]

Sorry, I missed the other thread.

[MUSF]

In the old Big East, I agree with you.  In the new Big East, debatable.  I think the new Big East will prove to be a strong conference, but there's legitimate question marks right now.   Conference affiliation isn't everything in comparing programs, but it's right up there among the top x-factors.  The SEC while generally very weak this year, still made up half the Final Four.  Hard to ignore that.  No doubt that gets recruits attention.

Didn't we just hire away one of their assistants? I wonder what he thinks?

[Sunbelt15]

And the Big East is a winnable league every year. [/quote]

Subliminal for "weak league".

[avid1010]

Time after time I keep reading how not having an AD is hurting MU.

Can it be that damn hard to find someone to fill the position? Jeeeez.

sure could...which would tell you the BoT and Pres don't feel it's that big of a deal.  obviously wojo didn't mind...not sure if it cost us a higher priority candidate or not.  time will tell with the success of the two new bball coaches.

[Tugg Speedman]

sure could...which would tell you the BoT and Pres don't feel it's that big of a deal.  obviously wojo didn't mind...not sure if it cost us a higher priority candidate or not.  time will tell with the success of the two new bball coaches.

MU wanted the new President in place first so he can help hire the AD (and Provost, director of admissions, B-School Dean, etc.).  We should have many of these filled before school starts in the fall.

And no it's not that big a deal.  The reporter needed a "con" for the MU job and is like all reporters he is very lazy.  So after a 30 second google search he noted that Brent mentioned.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Mizzou is NOT a better job than Marquette

I think this article would support that statement.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10818446/central-missouri-kim-anderson-finalists-missouri-tigers-job

[GGGG]

#7- ahead of BC, which I don't agree with.  

VT is a better job than BC.  And if you look at their last few coaching searches, and the quality of candidates they both attracted, I think coaches agree.

[GGGG]

I think this article would support that statement.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10818446/central-missouri-kim-anderson-finalists-missouri-tigers-job

Kim Anderson is a good coach.  This is pretty much like UW hiring Bo Ryan - former assistant who found a great deal of success at lower levels and hoping it translates to D1.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Kim Anderson is a good coach.  This is pretty much like UW hiring Bo Ryan - former assistant who found a great deal of success at lower levels and hoping it translates to D1.

You see Bo Ryan - I see Mike Deane.  Who knows, what will happen it is a risk right?  I would say the fan-base would not be thrilled with going from Mike Anderson to Kim Anderson in short period of years.

[GooooMarquette]

Didn't we just hire away one of their assistants? I wonder what he thinks?

And didn't we hire Chew from Mizzou too?  Two Mizzou assistants in three years to Marquette.

[Wojo'sMojo]

VT is a better job than BC.  And if you look at their last few coaching searches, and the quality of candidates they both attracted, I think coaches agree.

Do you think this because your boy Brent went there? BC has made the tourney 7 times since 2000. Va tech made it once. In fact in their entire history Va Tech has only made it 8 times, compared with 18 for BC. Just because Brent wanted Va Tech, doesn't mean coaches agree.

[GGGG]

Do you think this because your boy Brent went there? BC has made the tourney 7 times since 2000. Va tech made it once. In fact in their entire history Va Tech has only made it 8 times, compared with 18 for BC. Just because Brent wanted Va Tech, doesn't mean coaches agree.

Seth Greenburg v. Chris Mooney too.

VT is a large public university that spends a bunch of money on athletics.  BC is a private school with programs that fight for more limited resources.  Neither is a stellar program, but I think VT has a ton more potential to succeed than BC does.

And I really am not sure why you keep referring to Buzz as "my boy."  I defended his coaching decisions but five minutes after I found out that he left, I pretty much moved on.  I have said this for the past few years, but Marquette is bigger than any one coach and has survived much darker times than Buzz leaving.

Finally, I have no f*cking clue who you really are.  Apparently people are already jumping on the Wojo bandwagon but I have no idea if he is actually a decent coach.  We will see.

[GGGG]

You see Bo Ryan - I see Mike Deane.  Who knows, what will happen it is a risk right?  I would say the fan-base would not be thrilled with going from Mike Anderson to Kim Anderson in short period of years.

It very well could end up being Deane.  Nothing is guaranteed.  But hiring a successful lower level coach has worked before.  (John Belein is another example.) 

[bilsu]

And didn't we hire Chew from Mizzou too?  Two Mizzou assistants in three years to Marquette.

I think Illinois hired him from Missouri and then Buzz stole him from Illinois.

[Wojo'sMojo]

Seth Greenburg v. Chris Mooney too.

VT is a large public university that spends a bunch of money on athletics.  BC is a private school with programs that fight for more limited resources.  Neither is a stellar program, but I think VT has a ton more potential to succeed than BC does.

And I really am not sure why you keep referring to Buzz as "my boy."  I defended his coaching decisions but five minutes after I found out that he left, I pretty much moved on.  I have said this for the past few years, but Marquette is bigger than any one coach and has survived much darker times than Buzz leaving.

Finally, I have no f*cking clue who you really are.  Apparently people are already jumping on the Wojo bandwagon but I have no idea if he is actually a decent coach.  We will see.

It can have all the potential in the world. The fact is since 2000, BC has made the tourney more than Va Tech has in it's entire history.

[GGGG]

It can have all the potential in the world. The fact is since 2000, BC has made the tourney more than Va Tech has in it's entire history.

When judging what is a better job, potential means a hell of a lot more than history.

[Wojo'sMojo]

When judging what is a better job, potential means a hell of a lot more than history.

How so? It's been proven that you can win at BC, Va Tech not so much. I'm not just going by history, but recent history. I think you feel just because Brent went there, there is all this untapped potential and you're basing this off of him. They are both bottom tier ACC teams, but at least BC has some history of success.

Also, I remember you saying potential is worth nothing until you prove and fulfill it. Stated numerous times in regards to our PG situation last year. Now that Brent took this job, potential means everything?

[Groin_pull]

VT is a better job than BC.  And if you look at their last few coaching searches, and the quality of candidates they both attracted, I think coaches agree.

Only in the wacky world of college sports would a job in a sh*thole like Blacksburg be preferable to Boston.

[GGGG]

How so? It's been proven that you can win at BC, Va Tech not so much. I'm not just going by history, but recent history. I think you feel just because Brent went there, there is all this untapped potential and you're basing this off of him. They are both bottom tier ACC teams, but at least BC has some history of success.

Also, I remember you saying potential is worth nothing until you prove and fulfill it. Stated numerous times in regards to our PG situation last year. Now that Brent took this job, potential means everything?

Because potential mean a higher ceiling.  Boston College is a crappy program.  VT is just as crappy a program but has the ability to be better.

And it is a nice try to tie this to last year's PG situation.  But of course deciding what player to play is nothing like judging what program has more potential. 

[MU82]

Whether or not Marquette is better than Mizzou (I think it is, but I am admittedly biased), both share an interesting detail this offseason:

Each saw its coach leave for what only can be described as an inferior job.

That happens very rarely in college basketball, yet it happened twice in a month. Ca-ray-zee!

[Wojo'sMojo]

Because potential mean a higher ceiling.  Boston College is a crappy program.  VT is just as crappy a program but has the ability to be better.

And it is a nice try to tie this to last year's PG situation.  But of course deciding what player to play is nothing like judging what program has more potential. 

Potential is potential no matter what scenario you apply it to. You didn't want to hear about potential for our PG situation, but it's the end all be all for picking a school to coach? You can twist your narrative any way you want. BC has proven to be a better job recently and in 5 years it will still be a better job. By the way, glad your back  

[GGGG]

Potential is potential no matter what scenario you apply it to. You didn't want to hear about potential for our PG situation, but it's the end all be all for picking a school to coach?

I am not twisting a narrative.  You are failing basic logic by comparing apples and oranges.

Picking a school to coach is much more like deciding what player to offer a scholarship.  More a strategic decision than a tactical one.

[MUSF]

Potential is potential no matter what scenario you apply it to.

This is just not true. The value of potential is absolutely tied to scenario in which it is being applied. Your Derrick example was at best, and apples to oranges comparison.

[Wojo'sMojo]

This is just not true. The value of potential is absolutely tied to scenario in which it is being applied. Your Derrick example was at best, and apples to oranges comparison.

All last season Dawson showed more potential, bigger rewards than Derrick. Now Va Tech supposedly has more potential, bigger rewards than BC (which I disagree.) Sultan claimed potential doesn't mean anything on the basketball court, but it applies to deciding what school has the better basketball program when history states otherwise? I think it is a fine analogy. One is you know more of what you're getting, the other has more perceived upside. Potential is used in both cases, but when it came to our PG situation potential was dismissed and now it's the most important thing. Potential needs to be developed to realize the rewards and Dawson's potential was summarily dismissed by Sultan...Now the word potential is thrown around about Va Tech and it's a better job than BC, when history states otherwise.

[Dawson Rental]

Time after time I keep reading how not having an AD is hurting MU.

Can it be that damn hard to find someone to fill the position? Jeeeez.

There's genuine disagreement within the athletic department over which candidate would be easiest for an old curmudgeon like yourself to constantly criticize. 

BTW, Cords has stated that he's staying for a year.  And since Wojo was hired while Cords was AD, its hard to see the author's mentioning the lack of a AD as a problem as being anything more than his taking Buzz's BS at face value.

[MUSF]

All last season Dawson showed more potential, bigger rewards than Derrick. Now Va Tech supposedly has more potential, bigger rewards than BC (which I disagree.) Sultan claimed potential doesn't mean anything on the basketball court, but it applies to deciding what school has the better basketball program when history states otherwise?

Potential doesn't mean anything on the basketball court if you are trying to win now. Presumably coaches will play the lineup they believe gives them the best opportunity to win. Potential is developed in practice and off season work.

Potential is exceedingly more important in evaluating the relative strength of a coaching job, or any job really. Any coach selecting a job is going to weigh the chance for future success above past performance.

[Dawson Rental]

How so? It's been proven that you can win at BC, Va Tech not so much. I'm not just going by history, but recent history. I think you feel just because Brent went there, there is all this untapped potential and you're basing this off of him. They are both bottom tier ACC teams, but at least BC has some history of success.

Also, I remember you saying potential is worth nothing until you prove and fulfill it. Stated numerous times in regards to our PG situation last year. Now that Brent took this job, potential means everything?

"I think you feel just because Brent went there, there is all this untapped potential and you're basing this off of him."

Well, I think you feel that just because you didn't like Sultan not just jumping on the Buzz is a bad coach bandwagon, so now you're just going to attack anything he says without regard for the facts.

[Dawson Rental]

Whether or not Marquette is better than Mizzou (I think it is, but I am admittedly biased), both share an interesting detail this offseason:

Each saw its coach leave for what only can be described as an inferior job.

That happens very rarely in college basketball, yet it happened twice in a month. Ca-ray-zee!

But one coach left for a program in a better conference while the other one left for a program in a lesser conference.

[Wojo'sMojo]

"I think you feel just because Brent went there, there is all this untapped potential and you're basing this off of him."

Well, I think you feel that just because you didn't like Sultan not just jumping on the Buzz is a bad coach bandwagon, so now you're just going to attack anything he says without regard for the facts.

The fact is BC made the tournament seven times since 2000, Va Tech once. That is a fact that cannot be disputed. To claim Va Tech is by far the better job is ridiculous.

[GGGG]

The fact is BC made the tournament seven times since 2000, Va Tech once. That is a fact that cannot be disputed. To claim Va Tech is by far the better job is ridiculous.

I didn't say it was "by far" the better job...just that it was the better of two crappy jobs.  And if history was what matters, Billy Donovan should have gone to Loyola instead of Florida when he left Marshall.  But he went with potential and look how that played out.

And has been repeatedly pointed out, deciding who to play in a basketball game is nowhere near an apples to apples comparison.  Different timeframes.  Different tactics.

And I finally figured out who you are...mubuzz.  Went from one fanboi name to the next one.  Very cute.

[MU82]

But one coach left for a program in a better conference while the other one left for a program in a lesser conference.

True enough.

[GooooMarquette]

But one coach left for a program in a better conference while the other one left for a program in a lesser conference.

Yes, but unless Bert is coaching the conference, that doesn't mean squat.

[keefe]

the lack of a AD as a problem as being anything more than his taking Buzz's BS at face value.

While I agree that Bert citing this as a factor is pure spin the reality is that an egomaniac would struggle with the uncertainty of who might end up as his "boss." Bert feels that he is answerable to no man so he may have struggled with the lack of an AD as Cords likely put as his primary search criteria a strong leader with sound ethical values. Bert never understood that great authority requires even greater accountability.

[keefe]

Potential doesn't mean anything on the basketball court if you are trying to win now.

Clearly not a Physics major or an engineer.

The tiara of ignorance has many joules

[GGGG]

While I agree that Bert citing this as a factor is pure spin the reality is that an egomaniac would struggle with the uncertainty of who might end up as his "boss." Bert feels that he is answerable to no man so he may have struggled with the lack of an AD as Cords likely put as his primary search criteria a strong leader with sound ethical values. Bert never understood that great authority requires even greater accountability.

I think what happened, starting under SP and LW, and continuing with Wild and Cords Part 2, is that Buzz's demands and complaints got to be a little too much.  Sometimes you have to be willing to let talent leave when the headaches get too much to deal with.

[keefe]

I think what happened, starting under SP and LW, and continuing with Wild and Cords Part 2, is that Buzz's demands and complaints got to be a little too much.  Sometimes you have to be willing to let talent leave when the headaches get too much to deal with.

While it may be argued the parting was mutual the reality is that Bert knew his time was up. His public blathering is pure spin; I submit he is too self-absorbed to realize that moving forward with quiet dignity is a far better decision than dissimulating for the latter begs inquiry.

I acknowledge Bert can win basketball games but it seems Marquette correctly asked the question, "But at what cost?" It was time for Bert to pack up the Conestoga and leave town. Marquette extended him the courtesy to leave town honorably. It is a pity, though not surprising, he could not see fit to return Marquette's gesture with the poise and grace a man of genuine character would naturally understand and respect.

[GGGG]

While it may be argued the parting was mutual the reality is that Bert knew his time was up. His public blathering is pure spin; I submit he is too self-absorbed to realize that moving forward with quiet dignity is a far better decision than dissimulating for the latter begs inquiry.

I acknowledge Bert can win basketball games but it seems Marquette correctly asked the question, "But at what cost?" It was time for Bert to pack up the Conestoga and leave town. Marquette extended him the courtesy to leave town honorably. It is a pity, though not surprising, he could not see fit to return Marquette's gesture with the poise and grace a man of genuine character would naturally understand and respect.

Well stated all around.

[MUSF]

The fact is BC made the tournament seven times since 2000, Va Tech once. That is a fact that cannot be disputed. To claim Va Tech is by far the better job is ridiculous.

If tourney appearances and tourney success since 2000 are your sole metric then...

Indiana is a worse job than Butler, Memphis, Maryland, and Illinois

[MUSF]

Clearly not a Physics major or an engineer.

The tiara of ignorance has many joules

Love the irony of being schooled on ignorance by a person with a picture of a patch that reads "pork eating Crusader".

[GooooMarquette]

If tourney appearances and tourney success since 2000 are your sole metric then...

Indiana is a worse job than Butler, Memphis, Maryland, and Illinois

Although he'd never say it out loud...TC might agree with that statement right about now.

[keefe]

Love the irony of being schooled on ignorance by a person with a picture of a patch that reads "pork eating Crusader".

First, my post was a pun on potentiality.

Second, you obviously have no idea what the patch references or stands for. Encompassed in that small piece of material is a profound statement on the difference between cultural ignorance and acceptance. Understand lest you reveal profound stupidity.

[MU82]

I think what happened, starting under SP and LW, and continuing with Wild and Cords Part 2, is that Buzz's demands and complaints got to be a little too much.  Sometimes you have to be willing to let talent leave when the headaches get too much to deal with.

This is logical.

The Sun-Times used to have a columnist named Jay Mariotti. I think most folks here know of him and most probably didn't like his style. Mariotti routinely complained to management about one perceived slight or another, trashed his fellow employees, asked for more money, threatened to quit, etc. They stayed with him, and even gave into most of his demands, because he drove traffic to their newspaper and, later, their Website.

A few years ago, however, he really went off the rails. He came home prematurely from the Olympics and again threatened to quit. This time, management -- which had backed him repeatedly at every turn -- said, "OK, we accept your resignation. Have a good life."

Sometimes, an employee can consider himself more irreplaceable than he really is. We are all replaceable. Mariotti learned that, and so did Buzz.

[77ncaachamps]

And the Big East is a winnable league every year.

Subliminal for "weak league".

Read: Buzz's coaching job was weak-a$$ sauce for a "weak league."


Super ouch on UT's BKB program:
" And for just $4.8 million in men’s basketball expenses in 2012-13, which means a state school with almost 20,000 undergrads spent significantly less than DePaul ($6.3 million). But getting to the NCAA tournament regularly shouldn’t be a chore and, again, the SEC is a two-horse league at the moment."

[77ncaachamps]

Although he'd never say it out loud...TC might agree with that statement right about now.

Because he's busy stitching the "We beat #1 UK banner" to remind the Hoosier faithful of his success!

[keefe]

This is logical.

The Sun-Times used to have a columnist named Jay Mariotti. I think most folks here know of him and most probably didn't like his style. Mariotti routinely complained to management about one perceived slight or another, trashed his fellow employees, asked for more money, threatened to quit, etc. They stayed with him, and even gave into most of his demands, because he drove traffic to their newspaper and, later, their Website.

A few years ago, however, he really went off the rails. He came home prematurely from the Olympics and again threatened to quit. This time, management -- which had backed him repeatedly at every turn -- said, "OK, we accept your resignation. Have a good life."

Sometimes, an employee can consider himself more irreplaceable than he really is. We are all replaceable. Mariotti learned that, and so did Buzz.

I get the comparison to an insufferable ingrate to a point. What must not be overlooked is that Bert's departure was not simply his arrogance. The bottom line for Marquette was that Bert didn't share the University's values and standards on certain things. There are matters that must be non-negotiable and Marquette proved it is a community that must live by a set of core values.  

[MUSF]

First, my post was a pun on potentiality.

Second, you obviously have no idea what the patch references or stands for. Encompassed in that small piece of material is a profound statement on the difference between cultural ignorance and acceptance. Understand lest you reveal profound stupidity.

I know exactly what the patch references and stands for. You may not be ignorant of the impacts such a patch can have, but the message and image that the patch conveys absolutely perpetuates ignorance that is counterproductive to accomplishing the mission associated with the uniform upon which it is affixed. The uniform isn't a medium for making profound statements.

Before you lecture me about understanding, you should probably understand a few things yourself. My comments above are based on years of first hand experience, education, and training. Don't assume you understand service more than others simply because you are the most vocal.

To everyone else on this board, I apologize for instigating this discussion and potentially hijacking the thread. I simply can't resist taking the bait sometimes.

[keefe]

I know exactly what the patch references and stands for. You may not be ignorant of the impacts such a patch can have, but the message and image that the patch conveys absolutely perpetuates ignorance that is counterproductive to accomplishing the mission associated with the uniform upon which it is affixed. The uniform isn't a medium for making profound statements.

Before you lecture me about understanding, you should probably understand a few things yourself. My comments above are based on years of first hand experience, education, and training. Don't assume you understand service more than others simply because you are the most vocal.

To everyone else on this board, I apologize for instigating this discussion and potentially hijacking the thread. I simply can't resist taking the bait sometimes.

Take it up with David Petraeus and Ray Odierno because they have the patch too. And I guarangoddamtee they have a keener appreciation than you or I.

Bottom line is you likely have zero time in the Middle East or residency in any part of the non-Western world. I love how middle class white guys love to speak on race, prejudice, and cultural insensitivity.

Tell me - how many non-European languages do you speak?  If you would like we could converse in fluent Japanese, Mandarin, Bahasa, or conversational Pashto. Let me know when you wish to compare notes.

[MUSF]

Take it up with David Petraeus and Ray Odierno because they have the patch too. And I guarangoddamtee they have a keener appreciation than you or I.

Bottom line is you likely have zero time in the Middle East or residency in any part of the non-Western world. I love how middle class white guys love to speak on race, prejudice, and cultural insensitivity.

Tell me - how many non-European languages do you speak?  If you would like we could converse in fluent Japanese, Mandarin, Bahasa, or conversational Pashto. Let me know when you wish to compare notes.

Wrong on all counts.

1. I guarantgoddamtee you that David Petraeus and GEN Odierno wouldn't be caught dead associating themselves with that image on a public message board, or displaying it publicly in any forum.

2. I have spent plenty of time in the Middle East and Central Asia. Again, I love how quick you are to assume that you have the market cornered on this.

3. I speak three non-European languages; Pashto, Dari, and Arabic, though I wouldn't consider myself completely fluent in any. I don't want to converse with you in any of them or compare notes, because I come to this website to discuss topics associated with MU bball. I don't come here to flaunt my resume and solicit adoration for my service.

I will concede one point. I am in fact, a middle class white guy.

[Sir Lawrence]

I found tranquility after enabling the "Don't show users' signatures" feature in my profile setting.  The only downside is that I don't see mine, which is, of course, legendlarry. 

[Aughnanure]

I found tranquility after enabling the "Don't show users' signatures" feature in my profile setting.  The only downside is that I don't see mine, which is, of course, legendlarry. 

Whaaaaaaaaatt??????? That exists!!!!?

[Skatastrophy]

Take it up with David Petraeus and Ray Odierno because they have the patch too. And I guarangoddamtee they have a keener appreciation than you or I.

Bottom line is you likely have zero time in the Middle East or residency in any part of the non-Western world. I love how middle class white guys love to speak on race, prejudice, and cultural insensitivity.

Tell me - how many non-European languages do you speak?  If you would like we could converse in fluent Japanese, Mandarin, Bahasa, or conversational Pashto. Let me know when you wish to compare notes.

Oh man, let's feign outrage whilst offtopic humblebragging all over the forums!

That patch is intentionally inflammatory and you've, quite transparently, been waiting for someone to mention it so that you could be "lured" into exactly this conversation.

Put a cork in it.

[Skatastrophy]

Whaaaaaaaaatt??????? That exists!!!!?

On this page you can disable user's avatars & their signatures.

[keefe]

1. I guarantgoddamtee you that David Petraeus and GEN Odierno wouldn't be caught dead associating themselves with that image on a public message board, or displaying it publicly in any forum.

You are wrong. When MNF-I and MNC-I both had the patch and wore it in garrison. Odierno had it on his wall in the Palace, in fact. 2007.

[Aughnanure]

On this page you can disable user's avatars & their signatures.

Today was a good day. Thank you sir.

[keefe]

3. I speak three non-European languages; Pashto, Dari, and Arabic, though I wouldn't consider myself completely fluent in any. I don't want to converse with you in any of them or compare notes, because I come to this website to discuss topics associated with MU bball. I don't come here to flaunt my resume and solicit adoration for my service.

I will concede one point. I am in fact, a middle class white guy.

So you're saying the SF reference explains the Pashto, Dari, and Arabic. I was with 17th TACPs out of Hurlburt and did the SWEG (A) Pashto course at Bank Hall. I would guess you know the course.

[MUSF]

So you're saying the SF reference explains the Pashto, Dari, and Arabic. I was with 17th TACPs out of Hurlburt and did the SWEG (A) Pashto course at Bank Hall. I would guess you know the course.

Took Arabic there not Pashto. Taught there as well, not with SWEG though.

Spent some quality time in Hurlburt as well.

BTW, I sincerely mean you know disrespect with any of my posts, but I get very frustrated with your narrative at times and I don't want people to think that it represents the military perspective. I try to keep my business out of my comments here, but I don't always succeed.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Best analogy I have heard to describe Buzz' departure was "If you keep threatening to cheat on your wife, she is eventually going to tell you to do it.

We didn't kick Buzz out. But we held the door open and didn't ask him to stay.

[keefe]

Took Arabic there not Pashto. Taught there as well, not with SWEG though.

Spent some quality time in Hurlburt as well.

BTW, I sincerely mean you know disrespect with any of my posts, but I get very frustrated with your narrative at times and I don't want people to think that it represents the military perspective. I try to keep my business out of my comments here, but I don't always succeed.

Did several TDYs to SWCS but didn't work with SF guys in the field too much since most SF is aimed at CA. As SOC JTACs we are tabbed and embedded with Rangers so all of our shootin and scootin was with them and SEALs. Spent a tour as the CAS Chief for III Corps during the Surge working for BG Mark McDonald who was the Red Leg running Fire and Effects.

My best work with SF was with TF Troy in Iraq and I got to know Ash Naylor and Mike Ceroli along the way. Solid guys with the best grasp of Psy Op I have ever had the pleasure to witness. (Used to hit golf balls over the fence behind the SF Psy Op Palace at Victory.)

Look, I get that you guys do the CA stuff so the patch isn't something you would wear into a ville outside J Bad. But no kidding, the patch was on Odierno's wall and on his Franklin Planner cover when he was MNC-I. The man loved the thing. Precisely because it is what the Tallies used to disparage us. Is Ray Odierno culturally insensitive? Hardly. But mention Mookie and he would go apesh1t.

And make no mistake: there is a huge difference between the fighter pilot community and Big Green. In the flying world we use call signs O-1 through O-5. I couldn't get Army O-4s to use my call sign or first name when I was an O-5. BG Mac's CSO was appalled at the lack of military courtesy exhibited by the small group of USAF, USN, and USMC fighter pilots assigned to the CAS team. He thought we were crude, rude, and irreverent and by Army standards we were. But our tribe is different and there is nothing wrong with that.

As for this site - now that I am back in the commercial side many of us network here for business and pleasure. If you think this is just about MU hoops then you are penalizing yourself.

BTW, are you still in? I caught 2 outside of J Bad and got sent home with a note. As you likely know, every second you are there you think of here and every second here you think of there. But Prazosin helps.