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Author Topic: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.  (Read 48880 times)

MU82

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #100 on: April 20, 2014, 12:03:24 AM »
Being a freshman, Hill will play about six minutes a game and grow sick of Buzz's crap about two-thirds through the season.

Unless he plays 19-20 minutes, as freshmen Vander Blue and Todd Mayo did.
“It’s not how white men fight.” - Tucker Carlson

MU82

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #101 on: April 20, 2014, 12:07:03 AM »
I know we went around and around on last season...think it all proved itself out as far as what was going on.  I'm not going to change your mind, you aren't going to change mine.  At the end of the day...you have to perform on the basketball court to earn minutes.  I'm not sure what you see in Derrick, and can't see in Dawson to not think Dawson deserved more minutes...or JJJ for that matter.  I saw two guys in JJJ and Dawson who have far more potential than did Derrick and Jake....and they got scraps...all the while the team scuffled to a 17-15 mark missing the freaking NIT..after being picked to win Big East.

Here's the deal:  I'll wager you that MU will be better than 17-15 next season...and this is with full knowledge that we lost our best big man since Robert Jackson, Jamil Wilson, Otule, and of course Jake (which will prove to be addition by subtraction)...  We'll be small up front.  Will likely only have Cohen as a freshman on the team.  ZERO reason for the team to be better next season than what it was last season...yet I"m completely banking on Wojo to play the guys who give him the best chance to win max minutes....and the team will exceed 17-15.

I don't know if Dawson and JJJ "deserved" more minutes or not. But I'm pretty sure Derrick and Jake didn't "deserve" the minutes they got.

I certainly would have played Dawson and JJJ -- and obviously Deonte -- more because what we had wasn't working very well.
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TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #102 on: April 20, 2014, 03:20:55 AM »
How is it a classy move if it's not genuine? Then it's a slimeball move...why even bother if you don't mean it. I bet Brent wrote the letter for him and told him to pass it off as his own.

You have never had to make a decision that you knew would hurt someone? In case you haven't, it sucks. But sometimes you have to do what is best for you even if others will be disappointed in that decision. I don't know about you, but when I hurt or disappoint someone, I apologize, even if I know I made the right decision.

The fact that you would call this kid a slimeball, disingenuous, and accuse someone else of making the apology for him just because he apologized for disappointing us....that is unbelievably petty and small.

Hill had to make a decision. The school, or the coach. He valued both. He decided the coach was more important. That doesn't mean he didn't value the school. Hill took weeks to make this decision.
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TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #103 on: April 20, 2014, 03:28:24 AM »
The guy is on his knees in front of Buzz with mouth agape.

You may never call people names but you find interesting ways to tear people down when they don't agree with you. Aren't you the one who always complains about people resorting to name calling when they can't prove a point?

Sad thing is, I agree with you. When posters devolve into name callers it taints good discussion. It's a lazy move by a small man to try and make himself look superior on the internet.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2014, 03:32:31 AM by TAMU Eagle »
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TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #104 on: April 20, 2014, 03:30:59 AM »
Not true. Simply not true. But considering you offer this as an excuse to defend Buzz, nice try.

Trust me, there is. Not as stinky as Buzz's. But no coach is completly clean. Everyone of them commits recruiting violations. Some are Monarch level and some are Calipari level. But they all do it.
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Wojo'sMojo

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #105 on: April 20, 2014, 08:37:15 AM »
You have never had to make a decision that you knew would hurt someone? In case you haven't, it sucks. But sometimes you have to do what is best for you even if others will be disappointed in that decision. I don't know about you, but when I hurt or disappoint someone, I apologize, even if I know I made the right decision.

The fact that you would call this kid a slimeball, disingenuous, and accuse someone else of making the apology for him just because he apologized for disappointing us....that is unbelievably petty and small.

Hill had to make a decision. The school, or the coach. He valued both. He decided the coach was more important. That doesn't mean he didn't value the school. Hill took weeks to make this decision.

Didn't call the kid a slimeball, called it a slimeball move if he wasn't sincere with his letter. Thought it then and still think it now. I can't stand people being fake, so I don't think you put out a letter unless you mean it. Maybe he really does mean what he said. I personally don't think he did and find it funny that 36 hours after posting it he was committed to Va Tech. My opinion doesn't mean jack squat, just sharing it on a message board. I will agree with you that my comment about Buzz writing the letter for him was very petty and not very well thought out.

HoyaPotter

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #106 on: April 20, 2014, 09:39:54 AM »
You may never call people names but you find interesting ways to tear people down when they don't agree with you. Aren't you the one who always complains about people resorting to name calling when they can't prove a point?

Sad thing is, I agree with you. When posters devolve into name callers it taints good discussion. It's a lazy move by a small man to try and make himself look superior on the internet.

Aren't you name calling as well when you call him a small lazy man?

MU82

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #107 on: April 20, 2014, 12:13:57 PM »
You may never call people names but you find interesting ways to tear people down when they don't agree with you. Aren't you the one who always complains about people resorting to name calling when they can't prove a point?

Sad thing is, I agree with you. When posters devolve into name callers it taints good discussion. It's a lazy move by a small man to try and make himself look superior on the internet.

TAMU, why bother with willie? He is a joyless mope who defines "fan" as "one who tears down the team he supposedly likes." I put him on ignore and it has made my Scoop experience much more pleasing.
“It’s not how white men fight.” - Tucker Carlson

TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #108 on: April 20, 2014, 12:22:30 PM »
TAMU, why bother with willie? He is a joyless mope who defines "fan" as "one who tears down the team he supposedly likes." I put him on ignore and it has made my Scoop experience much more pleasing.

I do because when he focuses on real posts he has some good stuff....it's very few and far between
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TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #109 on: April 20, 2014, 12:23:28 PM »
Aren't you name calling as well when you call him a small lazy man?

I didn't call Willie a name. I implied it. Which by WW standards seems to be ok.
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willie warrior

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #110 on: April 20, 2014, 12:56:32 PM »
You may never call people names but you find interesting ways to tear people down when they don't agree with you. Aren't you the one who always complains about people resorting to name calling when they can't prove a point?

Sad thing is, I agree with you. When posters devolve into name callers it taints good discussion. It's a lazy move by a small man to try and make himself look superior on the internet.
trying to look superior on the internet is what you do eagle. maybe if you would lay off your weak defense of  Bozo, you would do better. Example: Implying that every coach that takes a job tries to get other players they had recruited to their prior school is pure speculation by you, and simply is not true. Not saying that some do not do it, because they do, but some also have ethics, much more than your boy El Bozo, who you jump to defend at every opportunity. We can make a truce: You love Buzz all you want, while others, including myself think he is a phony slimeball douche. Wear the blinders and continue to dream. Buzz was unethical while at MU and continued it when he left. Just the facts Ma'am.
I thought you were dead. Willie lives rent free in Reekers mind.

slingkong

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #111 on: April 22, 2014, 01:12:57 PM »
Ners, we have done this many times.   In my opinion.   From watching the games.   I saw one player on the team that deserved more minutes.   Burton.   I never saw what you did in Dawson.   I saw JJJ make too many moves that I would have pulled junior high girls for making.    I completely got what the rotations with the exception of Burton.   Buzz leaving has not changed my opinion of the faults of the 13-14 team.  That team lost a lot of close games that MU won in the previous 5 years.    Buzz's coaching style didn't change.   His rotation and reliance on upperclassmen didn't change.   His scouting and game planning didn't change.    I never once saw a single moment, substitution, play call, that, in that moment, made me think that Buzz wasn't trying or was phoning it in.    You can do message board circle jerk all you want to create this conspiracy theory, but in the end, Dawson and JJJ didn't deserve more minutes.  

I saw a coach trying something he had never done before, flash cards for the defense so they would know which pick and roll defense they were in.    I saw him come up with a new offense at halftime of one game, setting double high screens for Mayo to come around.   I saw him coaching his butt off to get MU into so many OT games down the stretch that didn't go MU's way.    All you saw was Derrick Wilson.   And because that was the only tree you could focus on, you missed the entire rest of the forest.   

I  saw  things  differently  as  did  many others.        Your  opinion  is  no  more  valid  than  Ners',  just  different.      Your  circlejerk  compadres  are  just  different.      Overuse  of  spaces  doesn't  make  your  observations  any  better.

keefe

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #112 on: April 22, 2014, 01:18:34 PM »
Ok guys, im slow. What does VPI stand for?

Visible Panty Indentation.



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MU B2002

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #113 on: April 22, 2014, 01:55:02 PM »
trying to look superior on the internet is what you do eagle. maybe if you would lay off your weak defense of  Bozo, you would do better. Example: Implying that every coach that takes a job tries to get other players they had recruited to their prior school is pure speculation by you, and simply is not true. Not saying that some do not do it, because they do, but some also have ethics, much more than your boy El Bozo, who you jump to defend at every opportunity. We can make a truce: You love Buzz all you want, while others, including myself think he is a phony slimeball douche. Wear the blinders and continue to dream. Buzz was unethical while at MU and continued it when he left. Just the facts Ma'am.


Since you are interested in "just the facts", I went ahead and took out your opinions. Sorry if I missed some, but there were a lot.

"VPI"
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esotericmindguy

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #114 on: April 22, 2014, 02:12:07 PM »

I certainly would have played Dawson and JJJ -- and obviously Deonte -- more because what we had wasn't working very well.

Exactly the argument many of us made last year. The constant comeback was, "they don't work hard in practice". I don't believe that, nor do I think that is a viable argument. Play the best players.
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tower912

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #115 on: April 22, 2014, 02:29:52 PM »
Your argument assumes that Buzz didn't.   It assumes the theory that Buzz stuck to the same kind of rotation he had for the previous 5 years (primarily upperclassmen) out of spite.    It assumes that the freshmen's lack of understanding of Buzz's defensive rotations and offensive reads (too complicated?   A different debate) was easily overcome by their superior physical skill.     It assumes that because the product on the floor did not match the standards of the previous 5 years, by definition, the guys on the bench would have made things better.   
Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

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brandx

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #116 on: April 22, 2014, 03:43:47 PM »
Your argument assumes that Buzz didn't.   It assumes the theory that Buzz stuck to the same kind of rotation he had for the previous 5 years (primarily upperclassmen) out of spite.    It assumes that the freshmen's lack of understanding of Buzz's defensive rotations and offensive reads (too complicated?   A different debate) was easily overcome by their superior physical skill.     It assumes that because the product on the floor did not match the standards of the previous 5 years, by definition, the guys on the bench would have made things better.   

We don't know the reason - but there is NO Doubt that Buzz coached terrible last season. This was a pre-season Top 25 team that was projected to win the BE. They not only didn't do that, but would have been below .500 if not for the incredible cupcakes on the schedule.

Derrick Wilson aside, some of the coaching moves were astoundingly mind-boggling. Dawson - benched after his best game of the year against Georgetown; Burton - benched for the last 5 minutes in the midst of his best game. Taylor - benched, well... just benched.

All this going on while Wilson and Thomas almost never were off the floor. - regardless of how they were playing in any individual game.

Buzz was awful last year. Your defense flies with no one.

willie warrior

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #117 on: April 22, 2014, 03:47:28 PM »

Since you are interested in "just the facts", I went ahead and took out your opinions. Sorry if I missed some, but there were a lot.


Thanks. I notice that you left in that he is a slimeball douche, which is most definitely a fact.
I thought you were dead. Willie lives rent free in Reekers mind.

willie warrior

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #118 on: April 22, 2014, 03:51:30 PM »
Your argument assumes that Buzz didn't.   It assumes the theory that Buzz stuck to the same kind of rotation he had for the previous 5 years (primarily upperclassmen) out of spite.    It assumes that the freshmen's lack of understanding of Buzz's defensive rotations and offensive reads (too complicated?   A different debate) was easily overcome by their superior physical skill.     It assumes that because the product on the floor did not match the standards of the previous 5 years, by definition, the guys on the bench would have made things better.   
They sure as hell could not have made it worse. Let's face it--Otule should have played about 10 minutes per game; same with De. Wilson. Anderson should not have seen the light of day from the bench end. The one that should have sat much more was Derrick, as he affected many games negatively.
I thought you were dead. Willie lives rent free in Reekers mind.

wadesworld

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #119 on: April 22, 2014, 03:55:30 PM »
They sure as hell could not have made it worse. Let's face it--Otule should have played about 10 minutes per game; same with De. Wilson. Anderson should not have seen the light of day from the bench end. The one that should have sat much more was Derrick, as he affected many games negatively.

And who plays the other 30 minutes per game at point if Derrick only plays 10 minutes/game?  At least Chris had somebody else ready to be on the court at his position, so you can make that argument logically.  Juan only saw 13 minutes/game, so I guess give Steve those 3 minutes?  Or give 3 more to Jamil who didn't do much while on the court (at least not when it meant something)?  So I guess you can make the claim that 10 minutes/game (7 of OTule's and 3 of Juan's) were given to the wrong guys, but who plays for Derrick?
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TAMU, Knower of Ball

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #120 on: April 22, 2014, 11:13:43 PM »

Since you are interested in "just the facts", I went ahead and took out your opinions. Sorry if I missed some, but there were a lot.



That's a fun game. I might try that myself.
TAMU

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Wojo'sMojo

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #121 on: April 22, 2014, 11:22:02 PM »
And who plays the other 30 minutes per game at point if Derrick only plays 10 minutes/game?  At least Chris had somebody else ready to be on the court at his position, so you can make that argument logically.  Juan only saw 13 minutes/game, so I guess give Steve those 3 minutes?  Or give 3 more to Jamil who didn't do much while on the court (at least not when it meant something)?  So I guess you can make the claim that 10 minutes/game (7 of OTule's and 3 of Juan's) were given to the wrong guys, but who plays for Derrick?

That's an easy answer...Dawson plays the other 30 minutes. He probably gives us 9 pts, 5 assists, and 3 rebounds a game. 75% from the line and 35% from 3. That's the guy who should've played 30 minutes a game!

wadesworld

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #122 on: April 22, 2014, 11:26:07 PM »
That's an easy answer...Dawson plays the other 30 minutes. He probably gives us 9 pts, 5 assists, and 3 rebounds a game. 75% from the line and 35% from 3. That's the guy who should've played 30 minutes a game!

There are 2 sides to a basketball court.
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Wojo'sMojo

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #123 on: April 22, 2014, 11:32:59 PM »
There are 2 sides to a basketball court.

ah yes, the mythical freshman phantom defense  ::) our defense was terrible last year no matter who was on the court. Derrick was not a great defender and could be argued wasn't even a good defender last year. Just because they're freshman, doesn't mean they don't play any defense. Stat wise, Burton was our best defender last year.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2014, 11:36:28 PM by Wojo'sMojo »

wadesworld

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Re: Hill and Pierce to VT per Evan Daniels.
« Reply #124 on: April 23, 2014, 12:33:51 AM »
ah yes, the mythical freshman phantom defense  ::) our defense was terrible last year no matter who was on the court. Derrick was not a great defender and could be argued wasn't even a good defender last year. Just because they're freshman, doesn't mean they don't play any defense. Stat wise, Burton was our best defender last year.

Yeah, he was only 2nd in the Big East in steals last year.  Awful.  Brutal defender.

Like I said, John Dawson will be a solid contributer and will be a better player than Derrick Wilson by the time he is done at Marquette, but John Dawson would not have been in the top 5 in steals, assists, and assist:turnover ratio in the Big East last year.  He had a nice game against Georgetown, and...not a whole lot else.  Respect the process, he will grow as a player.
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