WSJ: John Calipari: NCAA Is Crumbling Like the Soviet Union

[ChicosBailBonds]

Perhaps I should have stated "accelerators of the retail sector".  

I'm 100% for tech infrastructure.  It's a shame that corporate America is sitting on excess of 1.8 trillion dollars in cash.  This is dead money that's not doing anything.  Think of the R+D opportunities that are being wasted as well as all the jobs that could be created!!!  

Why are they sitting on it....that's your answer

[TJ]

So you're advocating for the 2 wrongs make a right model?  

I'm not sure I buy the "NCAA HAS TO DO SOMETHING" argument either.  That's half of what keeps getting this country in a mess.  You "fix" something without knowing the unintended consequences and you create an even bigger issue.  Nothing is ever fixed, but people feel all warm and fuzzy in their bellies at night for a few weeks feeling like they did something...that is until those that were "helped" say it isn't enough and want more.

To me, the solution is simple.  These are the rules, deal with them.  If you don't like the rules, go somewhere else.  If enough of the best players say they won't play, then the NBA can change the NBDL rules to allow them to come in one year earlier.  They can get their $3K to $5K per month, not even per academic year.   Put the onus on the NBA to stop freeloading off the NCAA.  Kids that want the college experience, will go to college.  Kids that don't care about school, go somewhere else.

Where?

Your suggestion is that we wait until a large number of the best players decide to sit out a year in protest until the NBADL changes its rules to allow them to play one year earlier, is that what I'm reading?

[TJ]

I think you are missing the point behind why Calipari and others are saying that the NCAA has to do something. It's not simply a matter of making it better, it's about survival. People don't like the rules and they will start going somewhere else if the rules are not adapted. Over the past couple years we have seen athletes successfully challenge the rules on individual likeness, expanded influence of the BCS, the movement to unionize, and a push by people like Mark Cuban to expand developmental leagues to undercut the NCAA. This isn't simply a matter of change for the sake of change.

I don't necessarily have enough knowledge of the NCAA to say whether or not I agree with all of Calipari's proposed solutions, but I agree with the general premise that the NCAA appears to be on the verge of collapse. I certainly don't think it's in the NCAA's best interest to stubbornly cling to the status quo. Some changes are probably necessary if they hope to survive.

But it's working so well for the music industry.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Where?

Your suggestion is that we wait until a large number of the best players decide to sit out a year in protest until the NBADL changes its rules to allow them to play one year earlier, is that what I'm reading?

If a player doesn't like it, go to Europe, sit out a year, go to the NBDL.   The NCAA has its rules, those are the rules, created by its members.  Life isn't always fair, there isn't always another option, that's the way it goes.  

The minimum age requirement for the NBDL is 18 years old.  Most freshmen in college are 18 years old...that's an option for most players from an age perspective.  Problem is, that there are only so many slots.  That's too bad.  Mark Cuban wants to push the NBDL harder to eliminate the hypocrisy of the one and done.  Good, they should do it.  Let the league create its own minor league system and not be beholden to the NCAA while also forcing the NCAA to be something it is not.

[TJ]

That always works out great.  I can hear it now  "but but but it costs so much more to go to school at St. John's than Nebraska, so I deserve a larger increase".  Quite frankly, they would be exactly correct in that argument.  Our tax system, SS payouts, etc should work the same way, but they don't.

As for the "actual cost" to attend college, I can't wait to see that itemized list and especially the discretionary items which are just that...discretionary but will now all of a sudden be deemed necessary and part of the actual cost.
 

Chicos, no one is saying that change will be easy or that they have all the answers at this point.  But your only response to this issue seems to be stomping your feet and putting your fingers in your ears.  Change is coming, whether you like it or not - the O'Bannon case and the Northwestern players union are just the start of it.  The NCAA could try to get out ahead of it and make positive reforms that attempt to satisfy all parties or they can dig into their position even further and have to deal with changes thrust upon them.

[TJ]

Athletes CAN work summer jobs

?  When did this start?  I know they could not as of a few years ago.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Chicos, no one is saying that change will be easy or that they have all the answers at this point.  But your only response to this issue seems to be stomping your feet and putting your fingers in your ears.  Change is coming, whether you like it or not - the O'Bannon case and the Northwestern players union are just the start of it.  The NCAA could try to get out ahead of it and make positive reforms that attempt to satisfy all parties or they can dig into their position even further and have to deal with changes thrust upon them.

If that were the case, unions would get what they want all the time.  There are two sides to this coin, you are arguing only one side of it.  The NCAA can capitulate, they can say absolutely no, etc.  All kinds of things can happen.  My guess is something will happen, I'm just telling you what I would do.  In my experience, many of the changes that are being discussed will only make matters worse down the road, because people like to make changes for change sake cuz it makes them feel fluffy....they have no clue as to the unintended consequences it unleashes.  You give $3K, they want $10K.  You give $50K loan eligibility, they want $100K.  You give 1 airline trip per semester, they want 5 airline trips per month.  Just how it works.

School isn't for everyone, no one disagrees.  Those that don't want to go to school, don't.  Do something else. 

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

But it's working so well for the music industry.

+1000

We are quite possibly in the worst decade of music ever ....

[NCMUFan]

Calipari is one person.  What are the other 500 division 1 schools saying?  Calipari is stating what is best in his interest nothing else.  Lots of money behind Kentucky so why not state it.  If some schools split and form a professional league, so be it.  Maybe the second tier is like minor league baseball or hockey.  Why lose sleep over it.  

[77ncaachamps]

He's saying this to start stuff...

then he whisks off to the NBA, leaving the mess behind.

[LAZER]

In my experience, many of the changes that are being discussed will only make matters worse down the road, because people like to make changes for change sake cuz it makes them feel fluffy....they have no clue as to the unintended consequences it unleashes.  You give $3K, they want $10K.  You give $50K loan eligibility, they want $100K.  You give 1 airline trip per semester, they want 5 airline trips per month.  Just how it works.

School isn't for everyone, no one disagrees.  Those that don't want to go to school, don't.  Do something else. 

I agree that this could get messy and there needs to be an incredible amount of foresight in any changes they decide to make, but I don't think fear of unintended consequences is a good enough reason to not make reforms.

I have no idea what those reforms will/should be, but I think it's a pretty lousy system in place that needs some fixing.

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

Calipari is one person.  What are the other 500 division 1 schools saying?  Calipari is stating what is best in his interest nothing else.  Lots of money behind Kentucky so why not state it.  If some schools split and form a professional league, so be it.  Maybe the second tier is like minor league baseball or hockey.  Why lose sleep over it.  

True as well.  Just think if he had his Freshman class coming back.  They'd be de facto #1 and have a great chance at going undefeated.  

[Eldon]

What other comparable alternative is there to NCAA D-I basketball?  There isn't one.

In Europe, basketball takes a solid third to soccer and rugby.  How much do professional basketball coaches there make?  How much did our women's coach make?

But, what about the D-League?  Again, how much do the D-League coaches make?  How much did our women's coach make?  Women's coach.  A more competitive D-League would require more money from the NBA.  Think that will happen anytime soon?  Yea, neither do I.


As long as college graduates are willing to donate tens of thousands (or more) to their alma mater(s) and possibly even earmark the money for college athletics, bball in particular, then the quality of DI college basketball will not deteriorate. Accordingly, DI college basketball coaches will always be the best 31st-349th best basketball coaches in the world.  If you are a college basketball player, you willingly sacrifice higher pay to come learn from these guys.  I really don't see how the situation is much different than an unpaid internship--young men sacrificing present income for invaluable work experience that will ultimately lead to much higher future income (higher at least in expectation).

[ChicosBailBonds]

?  When did this start?  I know they could not as of a few years ago.

For years.

Started with Prop 62 in 1997.

Refined in 2003....NCAA Bylaw 15.2.6

Refined again in 2007.

There are limits on how much you can earn, to prevent abuses where players are paid but never show up, or paid $40 an hour to water a lawn.


This part of the problem, so much BS information out there where people believe they can't, so much focus on the corner cases, people don't even know the real answers.  When I read the other day about Shabazz saying he didn't have enough money to eat...WTF is he talking about.  He has training table every day, meal plans, etc.  You would think from his comments the guy is starving.  The hyperbole is ridiculous.

[ChicosBailBonds]

I agree that this could get messy and there needs to be an incredible amount of foresight in any changes they decide to make, but I don't think fear of unintended consequences is a good enough reason to not make reforms.

I have no idea what those reforms will/should be, but I think it's a pretty lousy system in place that needs some fixing.

What's lousy about it?  I'm just curious...and when I say lousy, can you include how it's lousy across the board for the non "stars", the kids at Cal State Chico, the benchwarmers at MU, etc.

[MarquetteDano]

Wait, Calipari has an issue with an organization that has marred his career for decades?

THIS IS HUGE NEWS.   

[LAZER]

What's lousy about it?  I'm just curious...and when I say lousy, can you include how it's lousy across the board for the non "stars", the kids at Cal State Chico, the benchwarmers at MU, etc.

I'm not talking across the board, I'm talking about revenue generating sports.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

?  When did this start?  I know they could not as of a few years ago.

Oops!  Poor phrasing on my part.  I was stating they should be allowed to work summer jobs.

[ChicosBailBonds]

I'm not talking across the board, I'm talking about revenue generating sports.

And that's a fundamental problem.

But let's just for giggles keep it at revenue generating sports....let's choose basketball only and the 355 schools with 13 scholarship athletes per school.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Oops!  Poor phrasing on my part.  I was stating they should be allowed to work summer jobs.

Which they can and have been able to for some time.

[keefe]

Can't speak for Detroit, but Loyola has made some pretty significant strides with their athletic facilities in recent years, with a new 5,000+ seat arena that opened about 6-7 years ago, and then a couple years back they opened a $26 million athletics facility that's essentially their version of the AL, minus the arena.
With that and joining the MVC last year, Loyola is definitely working to improve their hoops standing. I don't think they'll ever reach the Big East level, but they're trending in the right direction. Unfortunately, I don't think Porter Moser is the guy to take them to the next level.

The King of Comparisons once more. Any insight on the racial demographics of urban vs rural campuses?

[keefe]

Perhaps I should have stated "accelerators of the retail sector".  

I'm 100% for tech infrastructure.  It's a shame that corporate America is sitting on excess of 1.8 trillion dollars in cash.  This is dead money that's not doing anything.  Think of the R+D opportunities that are being wasted as well as all the jobs that could be created!!!  

Package goods sales in the C Store Channel have long been a key barometer of economic performance. Is the trickle trickling, if you will.

[NCMUFan]

Let's say the bigger state universities break off and form their own "Super League".  Will their fan base grow?  Will their revenues grow?  I kind of doubt if they would grow significantly.  People who are currently their fans will stay their fans and my guess is people who aren't their fans will also stay that way.  Hence, their fans (customers) are not growing.  Finally, while I was fortunate to be at Marquette in the late 70's to see some great BB teams, that was not the reason I was attending Marquette.  Colleges and Universities with small sport programs are doing fine.  Is it our egos that might get bruised?

[MUSF]

I get it just fine, basically lower your standards, bend your rules or change them....it sounds like American Catholics. 

You're basically arguing that if changes aren't made, they take their ball and go elsewhere.  Fine.  Go elsewhere.


Lastly, why on earth is it so hard for people to process the most important point in all of this.  The NCAA is an ASSOCIATION.   The schools are its members, the NCAA is a body that enforces the rules, administers the champions, but it functions at the behest of its membership...the SCHOOLS. 

If the schools want to make changes, then there will be changes.  Don't blame the NCAA, blame the schools.  If the HAVES believe the HAVE NOTS are wielding too much power and diluting their votes to get legislation passed, then the HAVES will do something about it.

It is a bit ironic seeing certain people here back the HAVES.   

If changes aren't made they will take their ball and go elsewhere, it's only a matter of time. It's easy for you to say you're fine with that, but the schools that make up the NCAA stand to lose a significant amount of money. I guess we'll see if they take your love it or leave it approach.

It is not difficult for me to understand that the NCAA is an association of member schools. I'm not quite sure how you want me to look at the situation. Can I say the NCAA has to make changes, or do I have to say all of the schools that make up the NCAA have to vote to make changes within the NCAA to protect the long term viability of their association? I think the former implies the later.

Finally, stop trying to insert your "cafeteria Catholics" narrative into bball posts. I would love to argue the many ways in which you are completely off base and hypocritical when you make that argument, but I can't because it will just get the post locked. However, that doesn't stop you from throwing your commentary out there just to remind everyone where you stand. Please stop!

[T-Bone]

The only item on the list that makes sense is insurance. 

The ability to take out a 50k loan on future earnings?  Why not have them apply for grants and other established college funding?  They are low interest and put less of a burden on the student athlete should they not find employment in their chosen sport.   
There's already an established way for them to do this.  As there is for every other student.