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* Al's Run 2015



It's that time again.

Al's Run is right around the corner.   We neglected to do this last year .. but last time we ran a Al's Run Donation Drive, we hit nearly $5000 in donations from MU Basketball Fans.  Let's hit that again.

How?  Well, duh.  Heart string tugging.  You love Marquette Basketball, Al McGuire, and you remember those huge crowds outside McCormick, waiting for the race to begin.

And you've suckled at the teat that is MUScoop for NINE years.  All done through some serious effort by rocky, spiral, SoCal, and mu_hilltopper.

So do us a solid, and pony up a few bucks.  It all goes to a great cause, Children's Hospital of Wisconsin.  Sure, some will pledge $25, $50, $500 .. but imagine if even half of MUScoopers gave $5 each.   Or $19.77, that's fine too.

CLICK HERE:     http://www.chwevents.org/goto/MUBBFans

Author Topic: Transfer epidemic  (Read 2880 times)

Hoopaloop

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Transfer epidemic
« on: April 23, 2012, 03:59:23 PM »
An epidemic is the description some coaches use for transfers in men's college basketball.  Washington Post article from the weekend.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/college-basketball-transfers-linked-play-me-now-culture/2012/04/21/gIQAOw9OYT_story_1.html

"Since you asked, since you pretend to know why I'm not posting here anymore, let me make this as clear as I can for you Ners.  You are the reason I'm not posting here anymore."   BMA725  http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=28095.msg324636#msg324636

Crean to Ann Arbor

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2012, 07:07:06 PM »
A quote from the article.

"Coaches aren’t blameless. Even Turgeon concedes that players are more likely to transfer because 'coaches today are in ‘win soon’ type deals, so I think they help push guys out the door — even though they’re not supposed to — by telling them they’re not going to play.'"

Hummm.
Oh, I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused...

Rubie Q

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2012, 10:24:33 PM »
Yes, how DARE these children look out for their own interests.

martyconlonontherun

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2012, 10:40:20 PM »
It seems more and more kids are using the graduate excuse to transfer. Wonder if the ADepartments will start having their advisors tell kids not to take as many classes? It would be a fine line between making sure they graduate but also making sure they don't graduate too soon.

Skitch

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2012, 12:37:22 AM »
It seems more and more kids are using the graduate excuse to transfer. Wonder if the ADepartments will start having their advisors tell kids not to take as many classes? It would be a fine line between making sure they graduate but also making sure they don't graduate too soon.

I think they will work to close this loophole, but for the time being, it has to be considered when deciding whether to redshirt a player.  You run the risk of losing him for that 5th year either way, might as well not redshirt to begin with.

martyconlonontherun

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2012, 01:27:54 AM »
I think they will work to close this loophole, but for the time being, it has to be considered when deciding whether to redshirt a player.  You run the risk of losing him for that 5th year either way, might as well not redshirt to begin with.
I actually have no problem with a kid leaving after graduating. I get player development and loyalty, but these aren't pro players. If they want one year to try something new and they had their stuff together in the classroom, why not let them have some fun there last year in college to see a new city or go to a powerhouse? It sucks as fans, but is our entertainment worth restricting them from having life experiences?

real chili 83

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2012, 06:38:00 AM »
Since scholarships are one year deals only, why can't it cut both ways?

The Sultan of Sunshine

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2012, 07:46:55 AM »
I actually have no problem with a kid leaving after graduating. I get player development and loyalty, but these aren't pro players. If they want one year to try something new and they had their stuff together in the classroom, why not let them have some fun there last year in college to see a new city or go to a powerhouse? It sucks as fans, but is our entertainment worth restricting them from having life experiences?


Exactly.  It should be seen as a reward for getting work done in the classroom.

MerrittsMustache

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2012, 07:57:19 AM »

Exactly.  It should be seen as a reward for getting work done in the classroom.

Totally agree. With some of the embarassing grad rates out there, players should be rewarded for graduating early and being accepted into a grad program.

Abode4life

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2012, 08:27:33 AM »
Totally agree. With some of the embarassing grad rates out there, players should be rewarded for graduating early and being accepted into a grad program.


Does anyone know how a player transferring after graduating affect the school that he transferred to's graduation rate?  I would think most kids who do that don't finish grad school in a year, and if they leave for the NBA, they aren't going to stay to finish their second degree. 

The Sultan of Sunshine

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2012, 08:53:40 AM »
Does anyone know how a player transferring after graduating affect the school that he transferred to's graduation rate?  I would think most kids who do that don't finish grad school in a year, and if they leave for the NBA, they aren't going to stay to finish their second degree. 


I think any graduate school transfer has zero negative effect on APR.  I thought I remembered reading as such when Brandon Wood moved from Valpo to MSU....can't find the article though now.

MU82

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2012, 09:36:10 AM »
It seems more and more kids are using the graduate excuse to transfer. Wonder if the ADepartments will start having their advisors tell kids not to take as many classes? It would be a fine line between making sure they graduate but also making sure they don't graduate too soon.

The graduate excuse? Yes, shame on them for doing their schoolwork, getting their degrees, giving themselves options and actually leveling the playing field a little in the coach/athlete power spectrum.
This here is Archie Bunker of 704 Hauser Street. You take your big international bankers, they want to ... whaddya call ... masticate the people of this here nation like puppets on the wing, and then when they get their guns, turn us over to the Commies.

martyconlonontherun

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2012, 09:58:45 AM »
The graduate excuse? Yes, shame on them for doing their schoolwork, getting their degrees, giving themselves options and actually leveling the playing field a little in the coach/athlete power spectrum.
Don't be so sensitive on wording. My next post says I'm in favor of the rules for the reasons you posted above.

That said, I should have used loophole instead of excuse. I feel it is a loophole because it only works if you school doesn't offer the graduate program. Most players chose the school and then find the graduate program that fits the criteria. If it was truly about graduate programs, there wouldn't be as many transfers since you can usually find a similar program at your current school. The rule isn't in place to reward graduate, just as an out for a program if it doesn't fit your educational career path.

Is there anything else you want to nitpick, or are we on the same page? Don't you agree that most players fake interest in a graduate program just so they can transfer?

ETA: My earlier question is from a realist point of view, not my personal feelings. I could see programs protecting their investments against the best interest of the kids to ensure they spend all 4 years of eligibility at the original school.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2012, 10:15:22 AM by martyconlonontherun »

The Sultan of Sunshine

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2012, 10:04:56 AM »
Don't be so sensitive on wording. My next post says I'm in favor of the rules for the reasons you posted above.

That said, I should have used loophole instead of excuse. I feel it is a loophole because it only works if you school doesn't offer the graduate program. Most players chose the school and then find the graduate program that fits the criteria. If it was truly about graduate programs, there wouldn't be as many transfers since you can usually find a similar program at your current school. The rule isn't in place to reward graduate, just as an out for a program if it doesn't fit your educational career path.

Is there anything else you want to nitpick, or are we on the same page? Don't you agree that most players fake interest in a graduate program just so they can transfer?


To be honest, the *intent* of the rule was to help athletes from non-revenue sports and allows them to still compete and attend graduate school.  However, it is being used exactly how you describe above for the revenue sport athletes.

MU82

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2012, 01:40:44 PM »
Don't be so sensitive on wording. My next post says I'm in favor of the rules for the reasons you posted above.

That said, I should have used loophole instead of excuse. I feel it is a loophole because it only works if you school doesn't offer the graduate program. Most players chose the school and then find the graduate program that fits the criteria. If it was truly about graduate programs, there wouldn't be as many transfers since you can usually find a similar program at your current school. The rule isn't in place to reward graduate, just as an out for a program if it doesn't fit your educational career path.

Is there anything else you want to nitpick, or are we on the same page? Don't you agree that most players fake interest in a graduate program just so they can transfer?

ETA: My earlier question is from a realist point of view, not my personal feelings. I could see programs protecting their investments against the best interest of the kids to ensure they spend all 4 years of eligibility at the original school.

Fair enough. BTW, wasn't being "sensitive" on wording, just literal. Oh wait ... there I go again!!
This here is Archie Bunker of 704 Hauser Street. You take your big international bankers, they want to ... whaddya call ... masticate the people of this here nation like puppets on the wing, and then when they get their guns, turn us over to the Commies.

Hoopaloop

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Re: Transfer epidemic
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2012, 10:21:11 PM »
Since scholarships are one year deals only, why can't it cut both ways?

This is no longer the case.  The NCAA passed legislation a few months ago that schools can give multi-year scholarships  Marquette voted it down (not surprisingly), but the legislation passed.
"Since you asked, since you pretend to know why I'm not posting here anymore, let me make this as clear as I can for you Ners.  You are the reason I'm not posting here anymore."   BMA725  http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=28095.msg324636#msg324636